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RE: =ED= Balance Discussion XI

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9/2/2012 19:32:32   
The Astral Fury
Member

Agian theres never BEEN balance and never will be stop focusing on balancing the classes just wait untill your class is OP they will make it OP eventually becasue once a class is OP they nerf it and then it becomes terrible and then you have to spend or waste varuim on the next OP class thats also how they make you spend Varuim so much you have to buy more.
DF AQW  Post #: 76
9/2/2012 19:46:15   
Hun Kingq
Member

What, no one asked for a screen shot of this tech mage abusing tech and of the damage. You guys failed to metion what weapons that player had. I just tried it with the weapons I have with 50 health and the weapons requirements I could only get it up to 187: 50-60 tech.

AT 93 tech Plasma Cannon potential damage is 58-64 energy damage at Max. I looked at a mercs bunker buster potential damage at max with 76: 26-32 tech, his potential damage was 60-66 physical damage.

Before the nerf these skills was not evenly matched or balanced it took more tech to get the same damage as bunker buster and with lower support the mercs were getting critical damage more often.

With the nerf to Plasma cannon has created a huge balnce problem between two similar unlinked skills and the staff will not say why they did that.

If the want balance between Plasma Cannon and Bunker Buster then at the same tech the potential damage should be equal and maybe we will see critical damage equal often.

Another thing to bring balance is make it where if a player has health above 94 than the damage on them should be increased, less likely to block and deflect, less likely to get critical chance, which I seen too often with their low support.

DEX, Tech, and Support is not working like they should an I am glad to see others start seeing the same thing and maybe someone can come up with a solution to fix the problem since the staff is failing to do so.
Epic  Post #: 77
9/2/2012 20:23:56   
Stabilis
Member

Your wishes are my commands:

270 Technology...

115!

104!
AQ Epic  Post #: 78
9/2/2012 20:58:40   
Death Jr
Member

for tlm we should make atom smasher and frenzy usable with a sword
Post #: 79
9/2/2012 22:24:10   
Hun Kingq
Member

Depressed Void, For me I don't need screen shots because I know with Beta weapons a player can get any stat higher than any player out there even with high health and energy. Because of those players with Beta/Alpha weapons able to do that because there is no requirements on those weapons and getting above normal damage. Next thing we know the whole class is getting punished with nerfs.

The staff used the excuse that these are legacy weapons they won't get requirements they also stated that old weapons won't get a buff. Alpha and Beta weapons got four buffs: Increase in damage not once but twice, no requirements, and each weapon got 10 enhancement slots.

These are high level players using level 25 weapons not for the power but to abuse stats and the staff tells us they are trying to stop stat abuse and balance things out but here we have Beta and Alpha weapons with no requirements creating a balance issue and stat abuse issue among weapons but nothing is done about it.

I will tweet those screen shots to all the staff just to see what they have to say.

Trans, I know and everyone knows support affects criticals it is quite clear you don't not read my posts but just want to attack me in such an disrespectful manner as others do and if players writes what happen in battles I take their word for it and don't attack them demanding screen shots and just recently someone posted a player have very high tech and 100+ damage but you or others did not demand screen shots or attacked that person.

Reki_AQW tweeted a strength Blood Mage with lower support got Critical damage on him not once but three times in one match, explain that?

Players with lower support then I do gets Critical damage on me more then I do on players with low support explain that.

When I had high dex my support was still higher then the average player so why didn't I get critical damage on them?

When I lowered dex and increased support where it was higher than majority of players I seen critical damage maybe once or twice, explain that?

All those things they did for Alpha and Beta weapons even the founders armor where all buffs. What is increase in damage, not once but twice, a buff.
What is giving 10 enhancement slots without requirements, a buff.

Not all weapons were brought up to standards and if they do it for one set then they need to bring all sets up to standards.

Post edited, due to another comment being deleted. ~Mecha


< Message edited by Mecha Mario -- 9/3/2012 21:50:57 >
Epic  Post #: 80
9/2/2012 22:29:57   
Ranloth
Banned


 Every skill is useless on high Res/Def, it's quite obvious. Hence why you attack with weapons and build up your Rage so you ignore like half of their Res/Def. Didn't you know that.

Good to know, Support affects rate of your Criticals, not Dex hence why you didn't see them often.

We want screenshots if you wish to discuss things with community, this is Forum. If you wish to discuss it with staff ONLY then there's PMs, Twitter or Facebook. Forum or rather GD is for discussion and you are supposed to speak with community, especially in GD.

Damage buff to Betas was once due to revamp of weapons which is NOT a buff since ALL weapons got a buff for sake of proper balance on weapons. Enhancements were BEFORE the policy was made and requirements weren't on Betas since they were released. There may be requirements on them, Ashari already thought it'd be best solution but she's busy with her stuff as it is (studying, etc.) and Rabble is picking up on Balance instead along with rest of the Team.
AQ Epic  Post #: 81
9/2/2012 23:13:42   
Bunshichi
Member

Well Hun Kingq I've seen quite a few of your posts around here where you describe a situation that you ran into and you never give a screenshot I mean not even one from my knowledge. There are many people out here who exaggerate things not saying you do but providing a screenshot will quite doubters and get a bit more attention. I don't see whats so hard about capturing a screenshot unless you don't know how to do one then I can see.
As frequent as a poster as you are providing screenshots often enough will atleast build some credibility towards the numbers you post. Maybe you would not be asked nearly everytime you post to show a screenshot because you'd have a history at providing some proof.

< Message edited by Bunshichi -- 9/2/2012 23:32:31 >
MQ AQW Epic  Post #: 82
9/3/2012 0:41:25   
Hun Kingq
Member

Bunshichi, When I go into battle I am there for the battle, not a photo op, not filming a movie but for the battle to try to win the match for the team. When something happens and numbers are involved I remember those numbers and even put it on note pad and if something needs to be addressed pertaining to balance then I post it. If another player says something happens I don't ask for screenshots because in this game anything is possible. When I post I have dex at 200+ use Plasma Rain and get low damage still I should not have to supply a screen shot because anyone with the same type of weapons and armor can do the same dex build and see for themselves. When I wrote Plasma Bolt at level 1 got 60+ damage on me with my high tech build and reported what type of weapons that player had I was called a liar it is not possible but now you seen screen shots of a build with super tech what do you and other players have to say about it now. If you demand something from one then you have to equally demand something from others and if you don't then it is discrimination.

Just imagine if that was a Cyber Hunter with that high tech and max emp, do you think anyone will have any energy in 2vs2 after he emps both players.

Everyone complains about fireball, just imagine a Blood Mage doing that with strength how damaging fireball will be.

Just imagine a merc or a tact merc with Beta weapons very high support and max Artillery strike, how quickly you think the match will be over?

Think about any skill with stats as high as they could go the above normal damage they could do.

I even saw a tech mage that had all beta weapons with the highest support I have ever seen with max malfunction, what does malfunction improve with? I will let you answer.

Just imagine you met these players match after match and lost each time how would that make you feel so put yourself in the shoes of the 30 through 35s that can't afford the varium gear or even the ones that can afford the gear that looses to those players.

Those are the reasons why I say when it comes to balance nothing should be exempt especially weapons.
Epic  Post #: 83
9/3/2012 1:38:21   
D.v.D.
Member

1.specify which beta weapon.
2. Max artillery strike build isn't as effective as before,unusable without combining with another damage skill and going fully offensive
3. Beta weapons have no req at the cost of weapon damage

And is it really that hard to take a screen shot? Here's what the print screen button looks like on keyboards press it, open MS paint Ctrl V


WILL CONTINUE after sleep

Post edited. There is no need to troll. ~Mecha

< Message edited by Mecha Mario -- 9/3/2012 22:34:38 >
AQ Epic  Post #: 84
9/3/2012 2:13:23   
Bunshichi
Member

quote:

Just imagine if that was a Cyber Hunter with that high tech and max emp, do you think anyone will have any energy in 2vs2 after he emps both players.


I'll take it your referring to the schreenshot with 44hp he'll be dead and not much use in the battle. I haven't always been varium back in beta I was a mage then merc after being hacked then got varium around lvl 29. I still managed to have a decent 2 vs 2 record but I didn'tmind because it was just a game. I made builds that would benefit my partner or me in one on one situations in a 2 vs 2. Can't really put myself in their shoes considering their are more higher lvls, enhancements, large abundance of varium users, and I mainly did 2 vs 2 now but if your a non varium user you can't expect to have a great great record.

quote:

If you demand something from one then you have to equally demand something from others and if you don't then it is discrimination.


Well judging from all the posts I've ever seen from you I've seen people ask you and you still don't. As I said before its most likely a credibility thing. Im my honest opinion you get to defensive. If your the smartest person in a math class and your teacher wanted you to show your work and you tell her you did it in your head are you gonna argue about that? closest thing I can come up with.
MQ AQW Epic  Post #: 85
9/3/2012 7:40:52   
Calogero
Member

You keep saying the same thing over and over again but to this day forward we have yet to see
a single screenshot of evidence...

You can PM those numbers to whoever you want, without proof they mean nothing.

You start posting Screenshots/Proof, and We'll start taking you serious

v His balance critics, not his suggestions

< Message edited by Calogero -- 9/3/2012 8:10:20 >

_____________________________

Having a Signature is too mainstream
AQ DF MQ AQW Epic  Post #: 86
9/3/2012 8:04:56   
Arcanis
Member

We will?
AQ MQ AQW Epic  Post #: 87
9/3/2012 14:25:18   
abhi09
Member
 

 hi all,
i'd been duelling since beta times when non paid members were able to compete fairly well.. definitely the game has grown by leaps and bounds in last 3 yrs but in this franatic pace , are we missing out on all those free members who made this game a success it is today ( of course develepors et al deserve a bigger credit).. i''m a free member and was always doing decent well but with time the gap is jus too much to bridge..i'm afraid a day mit come when all free members like might decide to bid adeiu.. i hope this is not falling on deaf ears..paying to get varium ( to give unfair advantage) is a bit like bribing in my opinion.. ( do not take offence pls)
well, this is just my opinion . ( everyone has right to form one)..
keep duelling.


i started a new thread but it was deleted by moderator and he asked me to post my views here.

< Message edited by abhi09 -- 9/3/2012 14:26:54 >
Post #: 88
9/3/2012 14:48:49   
AIT
Banned
quote:

mercs were getting critical damage more often.


Bunker Buster and Plasma Cannon both have a 25% increased chance to crit. Now shut up, or make a balance post that actually is true and stop trying to make BM (more?) OP. 'Nuff said.

< Message edited by AIT -- 9/3/2012 14:53:56 >
Post #: 89
9/3/2012 14:54:01   
Luna_moonraider
Member

quote:

Just imagine if that was a Cyber Hunter with that high tech and max emp, do you think anyone will have any energy in 2vs2 after he emps both players.

Everyone complains about fireball, just imagine a Blood Mage doing that with strength how damaging fireball will be.

Just imagine a merc or a tact merc with Beta weapons very high support and max Artillery strike, how quickly you think the match will be over?

Think about any skill with stats as high as they could go the above normal damage they could do.

I even saw a tech mage that had all beta weapons with the highest support I have ever seen with max malfunction, what does malfunction improve with? I will let you answer.

Just imagine you met these players match after match and lost each time how would that make you feel so put yourself in the shoes of the 30 through 35s that can't afford the varium gear or even the ones that can afford the gear that looses to those players.



1) duh but there are things which are called as energy boosters if u know that these type of ch are in 2v2 always be prepared rather than go around crying "i dont have energy"
2) i dont get this point
3) i been using a full abuse support build since beta. if u use a support build u will need a good zooka and beta zooka does not look like a good zooka to me. and mind u battle dont just end quickly it depends on luck/how often u land a crit. and also once a tlm/merc have used thier arty and zooka they are left with nothing much but inti,fc/bc they cant do much until their rage zooka.
4) that is the bloody point of the skill improving with a stat
5) malf has a str requirement now so what is the point of using FULL beta weps since u will need to invest some points in str. u did say full beta weps so basically the zooka is weak and not as strong as egg/bunny/Easter zookas
6) to get out of gear hell/lack of weapon hell one must do npc every hour or farm during war. it is so simple to farm now compared to last time as a non var trust me i know i been a non var since beta.



_____________________________
AQW Epic  Post #: 90
9/3/2012 17:52:25   
AQWPlayer
Member

quote:

Bunshichi, When I go into battle I am there for the battle, not a photo op, not filming a movie but for the battle to try to win the match for the team. When something happens and numbers are involved I remember those numbers and even put it on note pad and if something needs to be addressed pertaining to balance then I post it. If another player says something happens I don't ask for screenshots because in this game anything is possible. When I post I have dex at 200+ use Plasma Rain and get low damage still I should not have to supply a screen shot because anyone with the same type of weapons and armor can do the same dex build and see for themselves. When I wrote Plasma Bolt at level 1 got 60+ damage on me with my high tech build and reported what type of weapons that player had I was called a liar it is not possible but now you seen screen shots of a build with super tech what do you and other players have to say about it now. If you demand something from one then you have to equally demand something from others and if you don't then it is discrimination.

Just imagine you met these players match after match and lost each time how would that make you feel so put yourself in the shoes of the 30 through 35s that can't afford the varium gear or even the ones that can afford the gear that looses to those players.

Those are the reasons why I say when it comes to balance nothing should be exempt especially weapons.

Stop trolling him guys. We all know he means things like that happen once in thousands of battles.
And I can certainly know what a lvl 30 constantly losing would do...much like what I and many others have done.
AQW  Post #: 91
9/3/2012 19:50:27   
Hun Kingq
Member

AIT, Today in 2vs2 with my support higher than others I only got Critical once with Plasma
Cannon and nothing but low damage just because both skills have the extra 25% chance does not mean
anything, they are two different skills, if you do not know that, for all we know there is fault
in the program especially if it was copied.

Luna_moonraider, in you word "duh" I carry two energy boosters and players here know that when
they saw me in 2vs2. two boosters with only 25 energy does not help if the emp you 3 or 4 times just
to be nasty individuals and even at 7 energy they still emp me, 7 what can I do with 7 points of energy?
At the screen shot of a players with all Beta weapons and support of 153 max malfunction with 37 strength
with reducing the player tech by 60 points, Aux is a Beta Bazooka a level 25 weapon with 34 damage. So his Aux
looks like this 31-38 +34, for a level 25 weapon having 9 points more damage is pretty good but these players
don't use Beta for the damage but because they have no requirements and they can abuse stats with those weapons
than any other weapons, do you not realize that?

Plasma Cannon is a sad and pitiful skill unless you put majority of stat points in tech and even that the skill
is still weak you can say too weak especially for the lower levels, that is what the community wanted and what the staff
wanted.

Something was truly out of whack today with the game.

Low damage, no blocks , no deflections, barely any critical damage except for players with low support, Tech, and Dex. Lower levels
having increase damage with low strength.

On top of everything else I got connection Lost after connection lost even got kicked out by admin for retraining.

Maybe to get balance they could start with reprogramming the stats because there is something seriously wrong.

Post edited. There is no need to troll anyone. ~Mecha

< Message edited by Mecha Mario -- 9/3/2012 22:27:15 >
Epic  Post #: 92
9/3/2012 20:01:49   
Ranloth
Banned


 But 25% is 25%. Only because it happened once then it does NOT mean Bunker has any advantage. Probability affects it, so 75% chance you won't get it and 25% you will. Since it's 1/4, it will be less often and you may just have a bad day. You said Bunker has 100% crit once. AIT tested it and had no Crits or rare ones whilst I also provided a screeny some time ago with no Crits. Something you should consider doing.

quote:

Plasma Cannon is a sad and pitiful skill unless you put majority of stat points in tech and even that the skill
is still weak you can say too weak especially for the lower levels, that is what the community wanted and what the staff
wanted.

Yeah, and Bunker is MUUUUUCH better and much more OP because of +4 more damage right? And lack of BL which goes together with either. Mercs can do it easily with that +4 more damage and get a decent use but you as BM who may have same Tech as a Merc find it UP despite getting HP back on it as well? It ignores 20% resistance on top of it making it great on Tanks as well since you'll ignore more Res. Not mentioning Crits which will nail it.
quote:

Low damage, no blocks , no deflections, barely any critical damage except for players with low support, Tech, and Dex. Lower levels
having increase damage with low strength.

Probability. Having low stat doesn't mean you cannot get it, it means you have much lower chances but not non-existant. Probability was taught as soon as Elementary school and it's easy to get hang of it so yeah.
quote:

On top of everything else I got connection Lost after connection lost even got kicked out by admin for retraining.

That's a bug or used to be. If you paid attention before, I believe Titan or Rabble have posted that it's a bug not Admins kicking individuals. Besides you should report that in Bugs section not Balance thread.
quote:

Maybe to get balance they could start with reprogramming the stats because there is something seriously wrong.

Or you don't know how probability works.. <_<

Post edited. ~Mecha

< Message edited by Mecha Mario -- 9/3/2012 22:29:10 >
AQ Epic  Post #: 93
9/3/2012 20:10:02   
Mr. Black OP
Member

@hun
I met the high support player you are talking about, he had around 50 something health and I killed him on my 2nd turn.
Epic  Post #: 94
9/3/2012 20:31:08   
Steel Slayer
Member

Lol, I saw this guy too, he was on my team though. 60 point malf from him, it was crazy. I think he might have been the same guy kingpowerlord and I saw the other day with a 100 damage Plasma bolt. Looks to me like he's trying to see how far he can push stat abuse just for kicks. One thing on Bunker and Plasma cannon though, if you look at the skill, it doesnt say 25% INCREASED crit chance, it just says "25% chance for critical strike". That wording would seem to indicate a SET crit chance, unaffected by support. Trans is right though, I've had days where Bunker wouldnt crit at all, I've also seen it crit 5 times ina row. Luck of the draw I guess.
Epic  Post #: 95
9/3/2012 20:57:08   
TRizZzCENTRINO
Member

@ hung kingq seriously anyone with a clear mind knows that with this much stat u need to sacrifice ur energy hp and other skills. so over stat abuse cound b a benefit to other balanced players. and please everytime i read ur post i wish i was a mod and can delete it since u always post alot, over exaggerates and none of ur post ever contains a proof. i always will give proof in any way i can. bcus i want the balance team to fix the game properly by giving the exact information, but u, u just thought up a person with 153 support and thinks he is overpowered, that makes it difficult for anyone reading ur post. im not being mean, but just giving my personal opinion. i think everyone here thinks the same.
still making my signature.
MQ AQW Epic  Post #: 96
9/3/2012 21:31:09   
D.v.D.
Member

http://i45.tinypic.com/2qd49wy.jpg
Not bad, considering that other 3 times Hun did 39, 52 (crit), and 56(crit) Did not get screen shot of other three because I forgot where the screen shot button was.

Also, the 52 was hit on a level 35 Var tank ch with an energy armor and plasma armor , AROUND a total of 35-40 res
AQ Epic  Post #: 97
9/3/2012 22:01:02   
Hun Kingq
Member

D.v.D., what kind of staff I had that gave me that extra damage on critical? So all day long I only went Critical 4 times out of 50 matches. Vast majority of time of players of the same level I get low damage are you going tell them what damage I got on you since everyone thinks I am a liar.

To all others when those players stop playing around and start being serious they can have high health high energy and two to three stats as high or higher than any player of their level when will you see that. When they do that next thing we know the data shows a skill too powerful then you know what happens a nerf to balance things out and then the whole class get punished because of a few individuals.
Epic  Post #: 98
9/4/2012 7:38:14   
DestruRaGe
Member

Heres the thing. Cyber Hunters shouldn't have plasma armor. They are evolution of BH which is not a heavy tank class!
Tactical Mercs should have their passive shield cause they are meant to be heavy tanks like Merc. Just look at TLM now and CH.
Cybers are too strong while TLM are fine! What you should do is take plasma armor away from cybers, make static charge stronger
and in place of passive shield give them technician. Trust me thats what should be done.


< Message edited by DestruRaGe -- 9/4/2012 7:39:31 >

_____________________________
Epic  Post #: 99
9/4/2012 9:17:28   
Bunshichi
Member

quote:

make static charge stronger and in place of passive shield give them technician. Trust me thats what should be done.


Ok, so they gain back more energy and on top of that they use technician to make an even stronger emp I would not like to see that happen.
MQ AQW Epic  Post #: 100
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