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RE: Bring Back Agility

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7/16/2015 21:21:50   
overdead
Member

Sigh. If someone has 1700 HP with the diminishing returns implemented, he will have less stats for primary damage than it is now. If now you can have 1700 HP and 600 damage, with diminishing returns, having 1700 HP can give you a max of 550 damage (just for example) because you spent too many stat points in HP.

I did not understand your last post. You wanted me to replicate the build for what? You're just being annoying. Go back to the real discussion. And no one is supporting you just so you know.

< Message edited by overdead -- 7/16/2015 21:24:54 >
AQ AQW Epic  Post #: 26
7/16/2015 23:11:03   
shadow.bane
Member

^ lol , once people understand we see about that ;) .
AQW Epic  Post #: 27
7/17/2015 3:32:26   
Mother1
Member

I sorry but I can support this for the soul purpose that Agility was a band aid fix at best that never addressed the real problem. The staff even admitted years ago that Agility was just that. Reapplying a band aid fix to a wound that needs stitches just for from what I am seeing a very small amount of players (high ranked players who can actually get this IIRC) that will affect everyone is a horrid idea.

I could understand if the masses were able to do this, however it is as I pointed out high ranked players who can get the extra stats to pull this off since they have the ranks and stats to pull said feat off.

Epic  Post #: 28
7/17/2015 8:12:58   
King Bling
Member

Not supported, seeing that the more health you have the less strength or defenses it is, the best stat one can have with max ranks, +6 and +2 and doggy powers lended altogether are around
1600
600
300+15
300+15

Any increase decrease in these stats and it becomes useless, because 560 primary damage hardly does 100 damage on strike.

quote:

ctually, I checked and it's possible if those are maximum values. And if you have full legendary resis and def.. Plus max primary ranks.


quote:

maximum values


Nope by 400, I meant the minimum value, so the maximum could go to around 468 or 476.

Ill tell my exact stats here,

1500
496-523 primary
400-474 defns
400-450 resis

But practically these build wouldnt work since strike would do hardly 30-50 damage.




< Message edited by King Bling -- 7/17/2015 8:20:50 >
Post #: 29
7/17/2015 14:31:44   
shadow.bane
Member

^ bling i wasn't suggesting diminishing returns , i was just suggesting something that is similar to agility in a way , @exploding penguin is the one who suggested diminishing returns lol .
AQW Epic  Post #: 30
7/17/2015 15:21:13   
nowras
Member

@overdead prob the people who are not supporting it are people that dont have experience in ED

they are new players or omega players the only people who understand this actually are delta/gamma/beta/alpha players who have experience

why omega players dont have experience? its because they came in a phase that balance was ruined in it balance was alright before omega and u can watch my video here to see that agility didnt really wreck high hp builds it only gave them a slight nerf while dimnishing returns are gonna wreck hp builds

< Message edited by nowras -- 7/19/2015 12:26:14 >
AQW Epic  Post #: 31
7/17/2015 16:26:30   
shadow.bane
Member

^ exactly said @nowras :) .
AQW Epic  Post #: 32
7/18/2015 16:52:07   
  Exploding Penguin
Moderator


 Apparently I'm not a player from previous phases then, since you are kind of treating me like I don't know what I'm talking about.

From what I understand you don't like my diminishing returns suggestion and favor yours more because you want to maintain the regular chances of random events such as blocks, deflects, and crits while reducing the durability of people who invest lots of points into HP, whereas my suggestion reduces the chances of these random events from happening if someone wishes to pursue very high HP numbers. Fair enough. I am personally not a fan of random events heavily influencing battles in a strategy turn-based pvp mmo and I think pursuing high HP should be met with the drawback of reducing not only the reliable defensive measures (defense/resistance) but also the unreliable ones (blocks/deflections). It only took around 5-6 of your responses before your reasoning was finally revealed though which made the whole situation a LOT more complicated than it needed to be.

I am not saying agility was a band-aid fix like some people are but I think there is a better way to tackle the problem of people who mindlessly invest in HP to become very hard to deal with.

To sum up the differences in our suggestions, your agility suggestion reduces the durability of high HP builds while maintaining their current block/deflect/crit chances. Mine reduces the durability of high HP builds while also reducing current block/deflect/crit chances IF someone wants to still have lots of HP, but in order to compensate for that field medic gains more efficiency. A field medic on a character with lower max HP but more defenses is clearly more effective than on a character with higher max HP but lower defenses. At this point it is up to the balance team to decide which suggestion would be better unless they come up with their own solution or just entirely ignore the problem at hand.



Epic  Post #: 33
7/18/2015 23:27:59   
shadow.bane
Member

^ no one will accept losing points from str/dex/tech/supp in favor to add health point enough said .
AQW Epic  Post #: 34
7/19/2015 1:35:25   
  Exploding Penguin
Moderator


 Apparently I'm a no one. Because I accept it. But IIRC basically anybody who isn't a level 40 is a no one on the balance forums.

What people are doing right now is just going 45/45/45/45 in all stats and then putting everything into HP. This is the maximized possible benefits from stats since that's about the point before diminishing returns kick in and health currently has no diminishing returns. Add diminishing returns to health and the 1400 HP 45/45/45/45 builds can be expected to drop some points in health. The numbers would have to be tested to see just how impactful it should be in order to be fair.

I don't understand why you think people insist on having very high health and will go to the feats of dropping points and destroying the integrity of their focus build in order to keep that same number of health.
Epic  Post #: 35
7/19/2015 1:36:37   
overdead
Member

King bling, I was talking about bane's example, not yours.
AQ AQW Epic  Post #: 36
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