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RE: So what does it take to take the title of Hero of Lore?

 
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4/20/2017 20:37:56   
Greyor_42
Member

@dragon_monster we don't have just 6. we have five prime element orbs, a shard of the ultimate orb, and 8 bacon orbs(and possibly the ultimate bacon orb).

< Message edited by Greyor_42 -- 4/20/2017 20:38:16 >
DF  Post #: 76
4/20/2017 20:38:12   
FriendOfAFriend
Member

quote:

We can always give her the bacon orb and the shard of the ultimate orb and find her a dragon and an amulet.


Why stop there? Give her OUR dragon, we'll become her soul ally, we'll even give her our Plot Shield :D
Post #: 77
4/20/2017 20:40:06   
Greyor_42
Member

@friendofafriend

quote:

Why stop there? Give her OUR dragon, we'll become her soul ally, we'll even give her our Plot Shield :D


i'm down with that. i'd totally be falwynn's soul ally.
DF  Post #: 78
4/20/2017 20:52:22   
dragon_monster
Member

Now if it was 4-5 with book 2 6 years because I can not find and the staff also stated we can count if we count the number of holidays we had. We have 6 frotsvales, moogloweens and hero heart days in those books so he was 16 at the end so 4 years younger if I am generos. Still not significant. We are 80 and he is 76 big difference is not.

quote:

we don't have just 6. we have five prime element orbs, a shard of the ultimate orb, and 8 bacon orbs(and possibly the ultimate bacon orb). ]


Really now it was the same orb we took 8 times it did not empowered us 8 times. You touch something 8 times you do not get empowered 8 times just once.

quote:


Why stop there? Give her OUR dragon, we'll become her soul ally, we'll even give her our Plot Shield :D


Sure why not if she want too.
AQ DF MQ  Post #: 79
4/20/2017 20:53:53   
MarchingToApril
Member

@^^: Or, y'know, let's not have the Hero die to become Falwynn's Soul-Ally and instead go send them off to the nearest therapist. Hire an army of therapists, in fact. After all, the title of Hero of Falconreach is synonymous with "Needs-a-Therapist."

Heh.

< Message edited by MarchingToApril -- 4/20/2017 20:54:18 >
Post #: 80
4/20/2017 21:17:56   
Greyor_42
Member

@dragon_monster

quote:

Really now it was the same orb we took 8 times it did not empowered us 8 times. You touch something 8 times you do not get empowered 8 times just once.



technically, because we kept going back 5 minutes to grab one, each time we grabbed a bacon orb, it was the first time the bacon orb cam in contact with us, thus it was able to empower us each time, because temporal paradoxes. it's the ultimate bacon orb that's really the debatable one.

quote:

Now if it was 4-5 with book 2 6 years because I can not find and the staff also stated we can count if we count the number of holidays we had. We have 6 frotsvales, moogloweens and hero heart days in those books so he was 16 at the end so 4 years younger if I am generos. Still not significant. We are 80 and he is 76 big difference is not.



that's actually pretty accurate sounding, i'll give you that. however, a small-ish age difference doesn't make ash insignificant.
DF  Post #: 81
4/20/2017 21:27:39   
dragon_monster
Member

You have to remember I was generous when I said we meet him when he was 10 we fought a dragon with him one named Gorgoth it can be even a smaller difference. And 4 years old its to little for adults as you will not see any significant difference in physical capability.
Do you see how much potential that boy had not only in skill but heart and all went to waste. So much potential and he wasted it all.

< Message edited by dragon_monster -- 4/20/2017 21:29:35 >
AQ DF MQ  Post #: 82
4/20/2017 21:37:48   
Greyor_42
Member

@dragon_monster


how can you say it went to waste? he's easily one of the greatest warriors in the history of lore, and still in his prime. just because he hasn't REACHED his full potential yet doesn't mean it's wasted. give him a few years, and he'll be better than even ARTIX. you know, the guy who could solo 5 million undead and still be unsatisfied?
DF  Post #: 83
4/20/2017 21:43:26   
Silver Sky Magician
Member


quote:

Do you see how much potential that boy had not only in skill but heart and all went to waste. So much potential and he wasted it all.


OMG this is hands down the funniest thing I've read on these forums...possibly ever. Not taking sides here but the genuine deadpan disappointment is just absolutely hilarious.
Epic  Post #: 84
4/20/2017 22:05:07   
dragon_monster
Member

quote:

how can you say it went to waste? he's easily one of the greatest warriors in the history of lore, and still in his prime. just because he hasn't REACHED his full potential yet doesn't mean it's wasted. give him a few years, and he'll be better than even ARTIX. you know, the guy who could solo 5 million undead and still be unsatisfied?


How many years he is now in his middle 20's how long does it take to unleash your full potential. By the time the hero was his age he mastered 10 classes or became proficient in them. Time is ticking and the hero will not stop improving and will have bigger and bigger shoes to fill. Granted in book 3 he did not improve a lot at all besides in soulweaving not anything new so Ash can catch up because the hero is moving slower.
AQ DF MQ  Post #: 85
4/20/2017 22:13:07   
Greyor_42
Member

@dragon_monster

quote:

How many years he is now in his middle 20's how long does it take to unleash your full potential. By the time the hero was his age he mastered 10 classes or became proficient in them.


21 isn't mid 20's. also, potential and growth rate, while related, are different things. it's also illogical to compare ANYONE'S growth rate with the hero's, because the hero is just ridiculous. and like i said, give him a FEW years, and he'll have surpassed artix. and who knows how much more powerful he'll become after that. you really need to stop putting the good guys down, you know? there's alot more to them than you give them credit for.
DF  Post #: 86
4/20/2017 22:24:48   
dragon_monster
Member

Yeah 20-21 and add more years after we where unfrozen in book 3 which is about 5 so that will bring him to about 25 or 26 mid 20's. To his credit he has an impressive defense skill but he does lack in endurance both physical and psychic unlike Artix who does not. That is because Artix also improved remember he was once controlled by Drakonnan but now Caitiff could not even affect him.
That is the problem Artix also improves. Hard to surpass someone when the bar keeps getting higher. You know what Ash says when we first meet him besides being happy to see us? Lore itself has missed you which is also proof on how high of an scale the hero is.
AQ DF MQ  Post #: 87
4/20/2017 22:34:29   
Greyor_42
Member

@dragon_monster

artix didn't go through any special training to make himself invulnerable to mental manipulation. haven't you noticed a trend where people who are subject to mind control once are completely immune to later attempts once they break out? that's ALL it had to do with it. and how do you know that ash lacks physical endurance?

sure, artix has been improving, but ash has been improving FASTER. that's why i can confidently say that he'll surpass artix in only a few years. and remember, artix is OLDER than the hero. he's going to peak out before ash does.
DF  Post #: 88
4/20/2017 22:48:22   
dragon_monster
Member

Yeah true older he did not had the "luxury" of being in ice for 5 years.
Look at the quest after we finished the war he is exhausted there. Look at Artix who started slaying undead before the hero he is not at all. But even if being mind controlled or attempted mind control was made and your broke out and made you immune its still a ability Ash does not have. But its not true look at the general mind controlled by Wargoth she was again mind controlled after she was freed. What I think happens the former mind controlled beings knowing how it is to be controlled meaning the process have developed ways to counter it to block it but it takes time.

< Message edited by dragon_monster -- 4/20/2017 22:49:24 >
AQ DF MQ  Post #: 89
4/20/2017 23:02:49   
Greyor_42
Member

@dragon_monster

well, ash actually WASN'T mind-controlled. yes, his mental fortitude was taxed, but he remained in control the whole time, which is actually MORE than what either the hero or artix could do the first time they were subject to mind control which means he actually has GREATER mental endurance than the others naturally. especially the hero, who was subject to the exact same kind, since it was done using the same method as kathool. besides, this means that he's now COMPLETELY immune. and before you bring up the general that wargoth took over, remember that she wasn't human, thus her brain probably isn't wired the same way. it's quite clear that HUMANS who get mind controlled tend to develop an immunity to it, not a "counter-measure" like you were saying. remember the hero didn't even NOTICE the mind control until everyone who WAS affected started acting odd because of it.

also, artix being older than the hero has nothing to do with the hero being frozen. artix was ALWAYS older, even back in book 1. back when we first when to amityvale, artix had already been a paladin for YEARS. and like i said, ash is STILL in his prime. he's already almost as good as artix, he still has plenty of room to grow, and so far, he's been growing FASTER than artix.

as for your "proof" that artix has more physical endurance, it's INCREDIBLY situational. notice that the time that ash was showing signs of fatigue was when he was fighting off the mind control(which he was doing SUCCESSFULLY, might i add). this is important, because this means he was working with both his mind AND body at the same time. believe it or not, but mental work is JUST as fatiguing as physical wor, sometimes even MORE. now put the two together. it's only NATURAL that his stamina would wear out faster than someone who's only been fighting with their body.

< Message edited by Greyor_42 -- 4/20/2017 23:06:47 >
DF  Post #: 90
4/20/2017 23:09:08   
FriendOfAFriend
Member

quote:

he's easily one of the greatest warriors in the history of lore


Where are you getting that Ash is one of the best?
Post #: 91
4/20/2017 23:18:33   
Greyor_42
Member

@friendofafriend

well, at least on the side of good, he is definitely one of the best. i also never said WHERE on that list he would be(aside from my statement that he's pretty close in power to artix at this point).
DF  Post #: 92
4/20/2017 23:20:21   
FriendOfAFriend
Member

Ash hasn't done anything to be one of the best in the HISTORY of Lore.

He can be one of the strongest (which is also probs wrong), but greatest? Greatest is us, Saving the world 58402 times. Greatest is Artix, Lore's best Undead Slayer. Greatest is Warlic, going toe to toe with the elemental avatars. Really, Ash hasn't done enough to be worthy to be put on the list, imo.
Post #: 93
4/20/2017 23:21:11   
dragon_monster
Member

Except that the time Ash fought the mind control and only that Artix also fought with us against an very tough opponent.
By the way we where mind controlled by Kathool who was so good that it made Caitff go crazy who is also psychic even before Kathool you know with the former inkeeper that I forget her name.
Also it took Kathool a lot of time to control us and even then we manged to break it just before we did a stupid thing to break it of and show Aquela we where suffering and cured us of his assault. Ash did not had that much time of mind assault.
Either way no matter how we became immune to mind control we are and Ash is not probably is now but he was not mind controlled only taxed so unknown. Also 3 millions undead do you think so much slaughter is done without a ton of endurance?

< Message edited by dragon_monster -- 4/20/2017 23:23:04 >
AQ DF MQ  Post #: 94
4/20/2017 23:35:47   
Greyor_42
Member

@dragon_monster

and my whole statement on "mental fatigue is JUST as taxing, if not MORE so, than physical fatigue". went right over your head..... and ash was suffering from BOTH, which is even MORE draining. artix only suffered from PHYSICAL fatigue.


i didn't take kathool as long as you seem to think it did to take control of us, and we didn't even really resist until that point in the quest just before aquella released us. and the fact that ash's mind was invaded in GENERAL probably helped bolster his already impressive mental defenses to the point where he might as well be immune.


@friendofafriend

all right, i probably should have worded it a bit differently. but yeah he IS one of the strongest heroes in lore. the key there being ONE OF. bear in mind that the list of heroes in lore IS pretty big, but it's safe to say that the NOTABLE ones( as in the ones we interact with the most) that are still alive(and a couple who have passed away) are who can be considered the "best"(strongest, whatever. you know what i mean).
DF  Post #: 95
4/21/2017 0:24:53   
dragon_monster
Member

Even Ednai resisted Caitiff which should tell a lot considering he fell against minions in a war with 2 other guardians. She casted a white enough web until she found someone weak enough to control some she could not even like Artix or the Hero.
You know the hero sleeped in the guardian tower got mind attacked by Kathool then got attacked even at the Locker and still the will to fight him. This is how you get immunity you cover the holes in your mental wall now that you know what they are and you gain the ability to ignore the whispers.

We are talking about Artix here if you can take millions of undead by yourself you have monstrous endurance Ash has a lot until he gets there. Also look at Artix's face this is how a true warrior should look like you are an teenager before puberty. Ash has an long way until he reached Artix and way more if ever until the Hero.


AQ DF MQ  Post #: 96
4/21/2017 0:45:16   
Greyor_42
Member

@dragon_monster

quote:

This is how you get immunity you cover the holes in your mental wall now that you know what they are and you gain the ability to ignore the whispers


...what you described isn't immunity. it's a COUNTER-MEASURE. like i said, the hero didn't ignore caitiff's whispers, he didn't even HEAR them. he didn't even realize that there were any whispers until he saw the people who were actually AFFECTED.


quote:

We are talking about Artix here if you can take millions of undead by yourself you have monstrous endurance Ash has a lot until he gets there


well, since you haven't seen him really go on for long periods of time when he ISN'T getting mind assaulted, you have no way of truly knowing that fur sure. for all we know, he could be almost there.


quote:

Also look at Artix's face this is how a true warrior should look like you are an teenager before puberty


.......sooooo, look like you haven't gone through puberty yet? in that case, ash was a true warrior back in book 2.........
DF  Post #: 97
4/21/2017 0:57:40   
dragon_monster
Member

Well he had the something to fight a dragon so yes he was a true warrior he had mojo in him a lot of mojo. Also he fought Death itself also so that is what a true warrior does faces death.

quote:

hat you described isn't immunity. it's a COUNTER-MEASURE. like i said, the hero didn't ignore caitiff's whispers, he didn't even HEAR them. he didn't even realize that there were any whispers until he saw the people who were actually AFFECTED.


Think like this you have a wall and that wall has holes and bad things get trough it. The hero had that experience so now he fixed the holes so not bad thing got trough it that is why he never heard the wispers.
AQ DF MQ  Post #: 98
4/21/2017 1:03:31   
FriendOfAFriend
Member

quote:

that is what a true warrior does faces death.


You're wrong though
Post #: 99
4/21/2017 1:08:29   
Greyor_42
Member

@dragon_monster

quote:

Think like this you have a wall and that wall has holes and bad things get trough it. The hero had that experience so now he fixed the holes so not bad thing got trough it that is why he never heard the wispers.


no, it's actually more like the human immune system. you get sick from something enough times, you body eventually develops an immunity to that kind of sickness on its own. the hero never really put any thought into it. there weren't any "holes that he fixed so that things wouldn't get through". if that were the case, he WOULD have noticed the whispers banging against this proverbial wall trying to get in. he didn't. so it's more along the lines that his body and subconscious naturally adapted themselves to make him deaf to those whispers, like an ever-evolving immune system.
DF  Post #: 100
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