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RE: =AQW= Reevaluating the Rarity of Certain Items

 
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4/20/2017 12:12:21   
Aura Knight
Member

Many of the items that are made for the game are pretty great. Unfortunately, not all are things we'd want or need. Armors, aside from ones which come with bonuses, are essentially useless. Yes, many would prefer to look nice, but it's not necessary. If more things were permanent content instead of available for a limited time, players can enjoy those things even long past the day they've been created. And maybe artists won't feel discouraged that so few players bought the items they worked so hard on because if they're permanent, anyone can have a chance at them. It must be annoying for artists to constantly have to make items only to realize they'll go rare and only a few players actually buy them. Seems like an insult to their talents. No wonder some artists quit.
AQ DF AQW  Post #: 51
4/20/2017 16:35:20   
Meloette Wells
Member

I considered comparing bardric's armor to the original set (it literally just two additional gold pieces), before going off on an tangent about how the dragonfable's calendar class dc sink discussion. Frankly, I think these two comments get to thebheart of that Much faster than I would've.

The idea of re-releasing the calendar classes was because Tomix put alot of work into making those things that barely anyone get to use anymore. It would've been at a marked up price compared to the originals mind you, but it still would've allowed people to enjoy the hard work Tomix put into making those classes. (Seriously, if you haven't seen some of then, check some like Time Killer or Avatar of Time.)

There also been talked of making "variants" of rare items. In the calendar class discussion, people generally agreed that the new dc versions of the calendar classes should be edits or recolors like how AQW handled the calendar class for this. They also generally agreed that the original calendar owners should get the varients for free as well.

With Bardric's armor since the edits done to them was really minimum, one could argue if someone had the wolfhound badge, the thing that gives the armor, then they could get a free version of the bardric set. I mainly suggest this for Bardric's wolfhound armor because of the package's $60 price tag (with stated to be valued at $180 in that design noted, if anyone didn't bother to check the links)

Edit1: corrected mobile typos, quotes can come later.
Edit2:
quote:


Fantasy Hero Package
Turn your fantasy into reality with the Fantasy Heroes Package Pass! Get everything listed below for only $59.95a value of $180.00!


source

< Message edited by Meloette Wells -- 4/20/2017 17:16:09 >
AQ DF MQ AQW  Post #: 52
4/20/2017 21:00:57   
Aura Knight
Member

It would seem the focus of rares in this thread has to do with ones we can buy in a shop, but what of the ones that are monster drops? As I'm sure many of us have experienced before, it's no fun being at the mercy of RNG. You can try to get something for a long time and still not succeed. What if the thing you wish to get is just a drop? How does it feel to try for something for hours, possibly days, or even longer and still fail? There's something not right about that.

I wish they'd reconsider making monster drops permanent rares because of such possible situations. Seasonal rarities I'm okay with. If you fail to get something one year, it matters little since you can try again the next time. Eventually RNG will be on your side. But if all you get is a single chance, a low drop rate could be the difference between you getting something awesome for a bit of effort or wasting time to get nothing at all.

Even the rare item drops from monsters we sometimes get would be better off being seasonal. Having a few weapons or armors available each year during the lesser known events would be pretty nice. If the same rewards are use, there would be no need to make new things and artists can be relieved of some pressure.
AQ DF AQW  Post #: 53
4/20/2017 21:07:24   
fxmybrute13
Member

Makes me think of this accursed thing. Might_cause_ptsd,click_at_your_own_discretion
DF AQW  Post #: 54
4/20/2017 21:27:07   
Icaro
Member

i would be ok if they brought back some drops from certain monsters, especially the house items from dage (the blademaster's house items). At least seasonal rare (i think it was around black friday when they were released).
Post #: 55
4/20/2017 21:38:43   
Aura Knight
Member

Allowing some rare monster drops to return will only hurt the ego of a few players but maybe such a thing is necessary. The mentality of having exclusive items makes you special is something I can't fathom. It's one thing to argue that you spent money on something you were told will no longer come back, but how does an actual price compare with effort for getting a rare drop? I think as long as there's no money involved, some rares can and should return. Perhaps the amount of rare drops is low compared to rares you can buy in a shop but I think it would be fair. Change some of them to seasonal items and everyone can enjoy them.

One item that comes to mind is the banished brawler armor. And I suppose the other pieces of the set. Why couldn't it be seasonal and have it available during Blade's birthday each year? It was pretty fun getting the armor and is one of my favorite ones to use. Why shouldn't others have a chance at it?

< Message edited by Aura Knight -- 4/20/2017 21:39:31 >
AQ DF AQW  Post #: 56
4/20/2017 22:09:57   
iDreadnaut
Member

I think we need some pools to better understand how most players feel about rares. Pools here in the forum and on twitter, since both have a slightly(?) different player base.

There are people that really don't care about rares and there are those that care A LOT. Once I met a guy on FB who said my account from '08 is "bad" (he used a more meaningful word), because I didn't buy rares from '08~'14, and he wasn't the first. I understand that some people collect rares and some don't, but players implying that an account's worth is defined by its rares as if everyone does/should collect rares, isn't something healthy to the game at all. It's actually really toxic.
AQW  Post #: 57
4/20/2017 23:07:27   
juanz1996
Member
 

For me, isnt really a "problem" all items should have a rare part in them and why should classes be other thing? 4 Reasons, feel free to say im wrong since im not really sure of them:

1) Making some classes rare is a way of putting the value on those players that "stay in the game". And.., no... if someone is new on the game it doesnt mean he/she should be able to use the full power of wherever class was in the past, that is not a way to go at least for me.

2) Something that offer functio. in the game shouldnt got rare? why? who say it? true there are class that offer good and unique way of playing.. yet there arent like 20 of them and is why we shouldnt worry about a couple of classes going rare. putting the rare on an item is something every game work with and classes shouldnt be other thing.

3) There are what 5-10?(correct me on this one people) classes that are rare AND are really powerful?(like abyssal?) that is not a number that SHOULD worry us and it doenst seem like a REAL problem at all.
(again, correct me on this one i may be completely wrong)

4) And very important. . . . . . . you need really those class to enjoy the game in the best way ? Most of OP classes are permanent and most of farming classes are permanent too as well as solo classes.

No, we dont need rare classes to come back since they are not a real problem they are not even a problem to begin with.


I thought it would be good to say something more realistic? Feel free to comment as I may be wrong.

AQW  Post #: 58
4/20/2017 23:31:42   
Aura Knight
Member

quote:

Making some classes rare is a way of putting the value on those players that "stay in the game". And.., no... if someone is new on the game it doesnt mean he/she should be able to use the full power of wherever class was in the past, that is not a way to go at least for me.


Yes, having certain rare classes is proof that you were playing at a certain time, but as for what you said in regards to new players about how they shouldn't be able to use the full power of something they missed, I cannot agree with that. Obviously not all classes that go rare are worth having, but I think if players wish to better criticize the game, they should have experienced all it has to offer. This is difficult to do if some classes go rare.

quote:

Something that offer functio. in the game shouldnt got rare? why? who say it? true there are class that offer good and unique way of playing.. yet there arent like 20 of them and is why we shouldnt worry about a couple of classes going rare. putting the rare on an item is something every game work with and classes shouldnt be other thing.


If it affects your experience in game, it shouldn't go rare. Lots of people seem to agree but there are also others who don't. My concern is that with classes going rare, we lose out on some unique skillsets, possibly unique animations and artwork. I'm sure many games have rares, but I think we have too many. AQW is becoming less of a game. With players focused on buying rares and being /afk for a long time to show off what they bought, seems some of us are forgetting this is a game at all.

quote:

There are what 5-10?(correct me on this one people) classes that are rare AND are really powerful?(like abyssal?) that is not a number that SHOULD worry us and it doenst seem like a REAL problem at all.
(again, correct me on this one i may be completely wrong)


True, the number of rare classes that are powerful and useful isn't the highest, but don't people like variety in what they can use? It's just unfortunate to lose unique skillsets due to unneeded exclusivity of some classes.

quote:

And very important. . . . . . . you need really those class to enjoy the game in the best way ? Most of OP classes are permanent and most of farming classes are permanent too as well as solo classes.


Well, an answer to such a question probably varies with each person. Do I need some rare classes I missed? Probably not. Doesn't mean I wouldn't mind having them. I missed blademaster and still want it. I also missed dark caster and evolved dark caster. Though they may not be the best classes I'm still interested enough to wish I had them. We do have plenty of amazing permanent classes and perhaps as the game grows older, we can get new variants of rare classes so that those of us who missed out can experience something new.

quote:

No, we dont need rare classes to come back since they are not a real problem they are not even a problem to begin with.


Perhaps we don't need rare classes to return, and maybe this isn't an issue, but I am certainly not against such a thing happening. If those who make collecting rares their reason for playing the game are able to convince the ones in charge to do something, then perhaps we can too. I don't think it hurts to try. Worst thing that happens is our requests get denied.

< Message edited by Aura Knight -- 4/20/2017 23:32:27 >
AQ DF AQW  Post #: 59
4/21/2017 0:22:10   
Ninjaty
Member

Holy snap this thread has exploded while I was away.


In response to Alina
quote:

We have been releasing too many rares the last few years, and I want to dial that back. Rare items have a definite place in our game, but we should not be making items rare just to do so. If an item goes rare, it should be for a good reason -- because it is a signifier that you were at a place (or point/event) in the game, and want a souvenir of that.

Making rare variants of everyday release gear has gotten out of hand, and should not be necessary. We are going to try cutting back on that level/quantity of rare items -- see how that works out -- and making sure that the items that do go rare deserve it.

As long as this simply applies to future items, absolutely, go for it. That way no one loses anything, everyone gets what they were promised.


In response to Christophisis
quote:

How did you go to this extreme? We're not saying that everything should be free and that certain players should be punished. People would still have to buy the rares is they made a return.

When you take a rare item and return it to the game, you specifically remove it's very reason for existing in the first place; which was to be rare. You deliberately take an item that a specific player group centers around, that the item is intended for, and pull it straight out of their hands, making it useless to them, and then give that item to another group. My example of taking high-end farming items and making them available for 0 gold is the same; you take the item, remove it's original purpose (being farmed for), make it unappealing to the people that specifically wanted it for this purpose, and then make it available to everyone equally. Same exact situation, with different types of items.
quote:

This is simply about giving players the opportunity to obtain what they want through legitimate means.

No, it isn't, because a rare, by it's very existence and nature in AQW, is only meant to be legitimately available for the short duration it is initially available in. After that, it is meant to exist solely with those that obtained it, or it would have no value in it's existence at all. Furthermore, when you just retroactively take it back, after having already given it to a certain group, all you do is step on that group for the purpose of stepping on that group. That's not healthy for a community either, and only serves to split it up.
quote:

The elitist mentality is the worst type of mentality. It causes unnecessary conflict. Certain players aren't "suffering" because other people will have access to a very small portion of these elitist items. Significantly more people would profit from this decision than those who will "suffer".

Again, this has nothing to do with being elitist, it has to do with being FAIR. If you give something to a specific group (determined by the properties of the item), and then remove the exact property that group is interested in, you have just taken the item back again, and away from that group. You have just removed the appeal, from the very group that was supposed to be interested in it. To do with with items that people have gotten attached to, would be nothing short of cruel. Give a person a pet, let them grow attached to it, and then yank it out of their hands months or years later, because you now make them allergic to the animal in question. The thing you don't get is, it does hurt, no matter the circumstances.

This is about fairness for all player groups, yet you seem to not consider rare collectors valid enough to deserve the respect you give the others. If a rare collector has obtained a rare they really wanted, they have pride in it and they treasure it, just as if someone interested in end-game farming items have spent months farming for one. If you take the rarity away however, it becomes worthless from the collection standpoint, just as if you make that end-game farming item something you can get in Yulgar's shop for 0 gold. You have taken all the appeal away, the very appeal that was the reason for the item being created in the first place. If something cannot hold up to it's reason for being, it shouldn't exist anymore, because it is no longer needed.
quote:

In regards to your argument about Legend tags, we're only talking about having accessibility to items. Legend items are still accessible to those who are willing to purchase a membership. The problem with Rare items is that there's an insurmountable barrier that you can't pass.

And that is what you don't get! To collectors, rarity is not a barrier, it's a feature. It is the key factor in determining their ability to like the item, to determining whether or not to have it in their collection. It is alpha and omega, just like the farming criteria for someone who collects end-game farming items, or someone who wants only Dage's Legion or Nulgath Nation items; it is specifically what makes the item attractive to that audience in the first place.

That is not something you should mess with, because in doing so, you mess with the entire group. Essentially, you just casually decide that this group isn't worthy of having the items in question, and try to allocate the items to another group.

If you at all care about fairness, let each group keep what they have been given. Don't try to change items in a way that makes them unappealing to the very groups they are intended for. Instead, focus on the new items. Focus on getting the team to make something new for your group, and eventually, those will far outweigh the amount of rares that exist. I have said this many times over: good neighbors do not steal from one another; they repsect each other's property. I have never gone on a crusade, asking for items left and right to be made rare, just so they would appeal to my group. So why are you going around, proposing to point left and right, to take things away from the rare collectors, by making said items useless to them?
quote:

Like you said, Rares definitely have a place in the game. However, there are certain items that are labeled Rare that shouldn't be. Quibble's 19th shop is a prime example. That shop is full of iconic items from other AE games, most of which are currently accessible. All those items being rare means that people who play the other games can't get the iconic items they love because they weren't playing AQW at a specific time. It would be different if these items were never part of AQW or are rare in MQ, DF and AQ, but that isn't the case. The experience offered from that shop extends beyond AQW.

Many items from that shop are not meant for the rare collectors (they lack the proper tags), yet they remain unavailable. By all means, I agree, let those items come back for people to enjoy. They were never meant for the collectors, yet we are the ones who currently have them, likely because a more suitable place for them has never been found.

So with that in mind, let me propose that they be added to the artist's alley shops, to showcase art from their respective games.


In response to Aura Knight
quote:

It must be annoying for artists to constantly have to make items only to realize they'll go rare and only a few players actually buy them. Seems like an insult to their talents. No wonder some artists quit.

That has nothing to do with rares specifically, and for the purposes of high-end farming items, they are the same as rares in this case; relatively few people will ever get to enjoy them, because of their unrealistic expectations to people's time and dedication. Many people will never have the time for many farmable items, and would, due to their schedules, not be able to obtain the items within years or even decades, making those items as good as unavailable to them. In that regard, at least rares can be flexible enough to allow everyone a chance to get them, assuming they are there.

An artist should be happy that their art is enjoyed to any capacity, that someone may even have their creation as a favorite of theirs. If you truly care about your craft, then one person enjoying it should be just as good as a billion. And also, many items aren't worn that often, not because they're rare, but simply because they are forgotten or undesired. That, again, has nothing specifically to do with rares or rare collectors, but rather with people's desire to get what's new and leave everything else behind, only to be forgotten.
quote:

Allowing some rare monster drops to return will only hurt the ego of a few players but maybe such a thing is necessary. The mentality of having exclusive items makes you special is something I can't fathom. It's one thing to argue that you spent money on something you were told will no longer come back, but how does an actual price compare with effort for getting a rare drop?

It's really just a matter of finding what appeals to you. I collect rares of many sorts, in my various hobbies, because these are the things that appeal to me. I like to have numbers to relate to, I like to keep track of how many survive the tests of time, and I feel I can only fully appreciate such items. Just like some people want to own items that can only be obtained through long sessions of dedicated farming, I downright love items that exist in a defined quantity, and then try to hold onto my copy, to try and preserve it.

Both of these, from different persepctives, are impossible to get their hands on. Time is also a valuable resource which you use to purchase things with, through the method of farming. If you know the joy of feeling your investment was worth it, and know the pain it would cause if the item just became freely available for a price that in no ways compare to what you paid, then you should also know the feelings of the rare collector. Something we invest in, if taken away, will leave a void where that thing once was; we will feel cheated and betrayed, because we earned the item through the method of which it was made available, only to have tha validility of that effort taken away, the price nullified, and the value tarnished.
quote:

I think as long as there's no money involved, some rares can and should return. Perhaps the amount of rare drops is low compared to rares you can buy in a shop but I think it would be fair. Change some of them to seasonal items and everyone can enjoy them.

While I do not have any monetary argument in this case, I would still prefer that these remain as they are too, though I do consider items like these to be a gamle of sorts. The staff can easily forget to remove an item from a monster after the duration it was meant to stay, and thus we will never know, until someone manages to confirm it's remaining presence. Still, the staff did intend for the item to leave, and they did make us all invest time in trying to obtain it, so for them to value their word, to keep their promise, they would have to let it go.

Personally, I care deeply about the ability to trust in the AQW staff. But if rares just start coming back, then what kind of message does that send? Are rare collectors no longer welcome, or can we no longer trust their word? While I doubt the first one will ever come true, the second option is an equally tragic pill to swallow, if we can no longer assume the staff is truthful.


In response to iDreadnaut
quote:

There are people that really don't care about rares and there are those that care A LOT. Once I met a guy on FB who said my account from '08 is "bad" (he used a more meaningful word), because I didn't buy rares from '08~'14, and he wasn't the first. I understand that some people collect rares and some don't, but players implying that an account's worth is defined by its rares as if everyone does/should collect rares, isn't something healthy to the game at all. It's actually really toxic.

It always saddens me to hear about events like these as well. While I do encourage collectors to compare what they each have with one another, I never intend it to be anything more than friendly discussion about a common interest.

Even when I have something another collector would want, or they have something I would love to have, we still usually manage to have a friendly discussion about it, and just have a good time. Sadly, the collectors are not all like this.


It's kind of tragic how, in just wanting to keep what the staff has given us, rare collectors are always singled out as the ones being greedy or elitist, just for wanting to be left with what they have. We don't try to take things away from other player groups to make our own. Why can we not all just appreciate what we have been given, and repsect each other as neighbors in this community? Why must people with a passion for rares, always feel hunted for their items, when no other group is seemingly subject to the same?

I would just like to be able to discuss the game with all of you, without feeling like I had to defend my life every time I come to the forums. To be able to appreciate the things we have each been given, without anyone trying to take something away from someone.

< Message edited by Ninjaty -- 4/21/2017 0:34:51 >
Post #: 60
4/21/2017 0:54:10   
Aura Knight
Member

quote:

That has nothing to do with rares specifically, and for the purposes of high-end farming items, they are the same as rares in this case; relatively few people will ever get to enjoy them, because of their unrealistic expectations to people's time and dedication. Many people will never have the time for many farmable items, and would, due to their schedules, not be able to obtain the items within years or even decades, making those items as good as unavailable to them. In that regard, at least rares can be flexible enough to allow everyone a chance to get them, assuming they are there.

An artist should be happy that their art is enjoyed to any capacity, that someone may even have their creation as a favorite of theirs. If you truly care about your craft, then one person enjoying it should be just as good as a billion. And also, many items aren't worn that often, not because they're rare, but simply because they are forgotten or undesired. That, again, has nothing specifically to do with rares or rare collectors, but rather with people's desire to get what's new and leave everything else behind, only to be forgotten.


Because certain things are available for a limited time, not everyone can have a chance at them. People take breaks from the game for various reasons. And one of the biggest disappointments is when you miss out on something amazing. And for the many ac rares, I don't think it's fair to say everyone has a chance at them because not everyone is willing or capable to spend money on the game. I believe AE gave us a nice alternative form their artix points system or the ACs we can earn by doing offers. In that regard, players who would normally have no chance at some things are able to buy things too. Unfortunately, that all depends on how good the offers are or if they work properly. This thread, however, isn't for discussing the pros and cons of AExtras.

I suppose for some players, endgame items are like rares in that while there is a chance to get them, the effort required is too much for some to handle. Missing out on an endgame item is like missing out on a rare. The only difference is that endgame items are permanent. So there's always the possibility that anyone can inch towards it, even if it takes years.

An artists should be happy regardless of how many people can use their items, but wouldn't it be more satisfying to know your art could be used by future players too? Who knows, maybe some set an artist created could inspire someone to make something even more amazing. While I still think it's a shame not everyone can experience certain things because of rarity, it's a good thing we have a wiki so that, at the very least we can view some great items we may have missed. It's too bad the artists can't decide what happens with their designs in game.

quote:

It's really just a matter of finding what appeals to you. I collect rares of many sorts, in my various hobbies, because these are the things that appeal to me. I like to have numbers to relate to, I like to keep track of how many survive the tests of time, and I feel I can only fully appreciate such items. Just like some people want to own items that can only be obtained through long sessions of dedicated farming, I downright love items that exist in a defined quantity, and then try to hold onto my copy, to try and preserve it.

Both of these, from different persepctives, are impossible to get their hands on. Time is also a valuable resource which you use to purchase things with, through the method of farming. If you know the joy of feeling your investment was worth it, and know the pain it would cause if the item just became freely available for a price that in no ways compare to what you paid, then you should also know the feelings of the rare collector. Something we invest in, if taken away, will leave a void where that thing once was; we will feel cheated and betrayed, because we earned the item through the method of which it was made available, only to have tha validility of that effort taken away, the price nullified, and the value tarnished.


I never did understand the appeal of rares. I just don't see the point in buying something just to /afk for a long time in a room where everyone else is /afk too. My opinion on this is that it's a silly practice. But there are no rules that say you can't buy rares and show off so whatever. As long as those who do have rares are humble and don't look down on those who happened to miss those same items, maybe there'd be no hate. But as @iDreadnaut pointed out, there are some conceited rare collectors and they are a negative part of the community. It's fine to enjoy doing something but it's not alright to be rude to others. I may sound a bit hypocritical since what I'm hoping to see is something that will be hated by a certain group and I couldn't care less. Well, I suppose my opinion on those who hoard rares is not important.

As for the whole pain of having something taken from you, I do understand that. But I don't particularly feel attached to any of my in game items. Would it be disappointing to log in one day and find something missing? Of course, but I'm not saying that we take away the rares players have to add them back to the game as permanent content. The only thing I want is for others to have a chance at some things they may have missed.

It's obvious you strongly oppose this, but where do you stand on the topic of making variants of rare items so others can get to experience things that are similar to ones they previously missed out on?

quote:

While I do not have any monetary argument in this case, I would still prefer that these remain as they are too, though I do consider items like these to be a gamle of sorts. The staff can easily forget to remove an item from a monster after the duration it was meant to stay, and thus we will never know, until someone manages to confirm it's remaining presence. Still, the staff did intend for the item to leave, and they did make us all invest time in trying to obtain it, so for them to value their word, to keep their promise, they would have to let it go.

Personally, I care deeply about the ability to trust in the AQW staff. But if rares just start coming back, then what kind of message does that send? Are rare collectors no longer welcome, or can we no longer trust their word? While I doubt the first one will ever come true, the second option is an equally tragic pill to swallow, if we can no longer assume the staff is truthful.


Yes, staff should keep their word, but they should also be influenced by players that aren't rare crazed. Even though there aren't many players who covet rares, those players seem to be the ones whom influence things the most. Why must others be at the mercy of their desires? After 8 years, there must be some way to compromise.

quote:

I would just like to be able to discuss the game with all of you, without feeling like I had to defend my life every time I come to the forums. To be able to appreciate the things we have each been given, without anyone trying to take something away from someone.


Seems like a perfectly reasonable thing to want. Maybe someday we can all get along. Though I don't support the addiction to rares some players may have, I don't go out of my way to call them out on it. What people do on their characters is their business anyway. Do I sometimes feel jealous towards some players because of what they have? Of course, but then I eventually get over it because I have hope that I can get something similar at a later date. Sometimes I can and other times no luck. But we can't always get what we want.

I think that as long as those who collect rares aren't stuck up, they're alright people. But the ones who use their exclusive items as an excuse to think themselves better shouldn't bother playing the game at all. At least not until they learn manners.

< Message edited by Aura Knight -- 4/21/2017 1:14:52 >
AQ DF AQW  Post #: 61
4/21/2017 1:34:25   
Ted Zlammy
Member

Ah, rares, a somewhat controversial topic! But, to the opening post regarding prominent items that were once rare but show up again... It is an interesting subject. It is a shame how some NPCs have interesting gear that is rare, and it's also a shame how some items of interest are brought up in game but are rare. However, I know that it isn't unheard of for an item to make a comeback though. Take the Shadowreaper of Doom for instance. It was available originally in a rare 2010 Mirror World event, but years later was permanently added to the Mirror Realm merge shop as an item you could grind for during the Chaos Lord saga.

So yeah, certain well reputed items reappearing is a possibility. Should anymore reappear though? Hmm... Depends on the item. I'm not too savvy with AE game knowledge for the most part so I can't comment on any items in particular, but... I do think that if something with a reputation similar to that of the Blinding Light of Destiny went rare in the past, it ought to to have been available for all due to it's wide acclaim in the first place and should have it's rarity questioned.

---

To the topic of Rares that aren't items of note possibly returning... Eh, they probably shouldn't. It would antagonize a decent chunk of the player base.

If AE were to do so... Well, I think they'd need to establish a point from when they would do so. Namely, they should outright declare that FROM NOW ON from a certain date, all items than have a chance of returning in some fashion. Old rares would be left alone and any reappearances would bring fault on AEs part, but any items that are brought back beyond that point wouldn't bring fault to AE or lower trust or the like. Because from than on all purchases would be fully on the Player, not AE. They'd have known in advance that any item was fair game for returning, and while being allowed to be upset at AE for having an item beyond that point return, they should've known it could've come back and isn't a breach of trust in the slightest.

Eh, that's all the random thoughts I have on this at this late hour. Time to sleep~

< Message edited by Ted Zlammy -- 4/21/2017 1:35:33 >
MQ AQW  Post #: 62
4/21/2017 2:15:46   
Poly
Member

quote:

Ted Zlammy:

Old rares would be left alone and any reappearances would bring fault on AEs part, but any items that are brought back beyond that point wouldn't bring fault to AE or lower trust or the like.
AE is at no fault at anytime for making any modifications or changes to the game. You agree to the legally binding contract between you and Artix Entertainment when playing AQW.

quote:

29. MODIFICATIONS.
Company may, in its sole discretion and without prior notice, (a) revise these Terms of Use; (b) modify the Site and/or the Service; and (c) discontinue the Site and/or Service at any time.



quote:

Aura Knight:

It's obvious you strongly oppose this, but where do you stand on the topic of making variants of rare items so others can get to experience things that are similar to ones they previously missed out on?
I agree on this. If a rare was to be re-released, they could rename the original "Classic" or simply rename the original with a (Rare) tag on its name as a rare variant. Rare hunters would oppose, appear conceited and want to appreciate rare art themselves' and don't want others to appreciate beautiful artwork that has gone rare. It's egotistical for someone to not want others to have a really cool or beautifully drawn item because they want to be part of a special minority, and to exclude others who would like to also show appreciation to an artist by wearing something they've dawn. Ultimately, it is up to the AE staff on whether or not they want to do this.


< Message edited by Poly -- 4/21/2017 6:06:11 >
Post #: 63
4/21/2017 2:36:29   
Aura Knight
Member

I still have difficulty understanding this whole value thing that some rares supposedly have. Only ones that should have value are those that require actual money to obtain. I'm not one who puts emotional value on such things. If I have a rare, great. If not, well, not so great. But only if it's something that could affect my game experience. One group's happiness shouldn't be at the expense of another's. Unfortunately, the change I wouldn't mind is at the expense of others. Man, this thing wouldn't be an issue if the prospect of rares was never part of the game. I'm sure we'd all be happier.
AQ DF AQW  Post #: 64
4/21/2017 5:50:38   
XeNON_54
Member

Wish they could bring this thing back.
I didn't even have the chance to farm for it since they barely gave an announcement about it.
Post #: 65
4/21/2017 10:07:43   
polar
Member

I'm really in favor of rares being edited then released,it keeps the original form while having an alternative to those who weren't able to get it. One favorite that comes to mind would be Vordred's Sword which was edited and released as Doom lord Skull breaker. The original was just out of reach but after a few years an edited version came out and yes I went for it.

I do understand that having rares lets you be unique compared to new players but of the playerbase I've encountered that's the only thing the are aiming for, show off to new players what they have but when it comes to fellow old players of equal or greater standing they shrink into uniform.They don't even try to be unique, I mean if you're going to show off your rares then show me something I haven't seen among the first 100 players

BTW,if you're going to show off your rares,better do it at the bank instead of yulgar. The bank has a lot more people coming and going while yulgar is full of living statues

< Message edited by polar -- 4/21/2017 10:09:54 >
AQ DF MQ AQW  Post #: 66
4/21/2017 10:58:02   
Icetex
Member

Here's my opinion on the rare issue
I don't personally would care if any of my rares came back
In any form really
So I can see where everyone coming from
But at the end of the day it's just a game it's not like physical items.
With that said I feel rares are unessary
AQ DF MQ AQW  Post #: 67
4/21/2017 12:25:21   
Meloette Wells
Member

@Ninjaty
quote:

An artist should be happy that their art is enjoyed to any capacity, that someone may even have their creation as a favorite of theirs. If you truly care about your craft, then one person enjoying it should be just as good as a billion. And also, many items aren't worn that often, not because they're rare, but simply because they are forgotten or undesired. That, again, has nothing specifically to do with rares or rare collectors, but rather with people's desire to get what's new and leave everything else behind, only to be forgotten.


Ok, I think you're missing the point here. It's not about "having people to enjoy your work." the issue expressed here is one of the pointless-ness of putting your heart and soul into a project, only for it to disappear after a week. Picture this, that No Matter What you do, No Matter How Hard you work to make something. It is destined to disappear.

For example, picture if you kept re-living the same week (Groundhog day style), and whatever you did in that week didn't matter because everything would reset. Sure, you can try to do a bunch of random things for fun, but what if you want to make progress in your life. What if you want to work on some project you been planning for years, but you can never finish it before the week is up.

Another issue with knowing everything you do would just reset, would be the tediousness of it. You do the same thing that week, but eventually you'll exhaust your options of things to do. You would grow tire of constantly repeating that week over and over. Who knows maybe you'll even go insane from the idea of being trapped in that week for a moment longer.

Groundhog day analogies aside, the point is that artists know that their work isn't permanent. They know that their hard work is always replaceable every week; heck what's to say that the artists themselves aren't replaceable? Back in the first days of AQW, Nulgath/Miltonius used to be the head artist, and E-V-E-R-Y-O-N-E wanted his gear. Once Dage came around though, there was a shift in everyone's favorite artist. Dage kept improving his skills, and people kept wanting more and more gear from Dage. Sure Nulgath was still around, but eventually he had to move on from AQW (shortly in the form of OS, before leaving AE entirely).

If the original head artist of the game can be replaced, who to say that some new guy, like Laken or Aranx, can't be replaced just as easily? All it took to replace Nulgath was a new guy making enough content to win players over via just out-producing/out-quality his content. (Although Dage's art style, and Nulgath's are two completely different beasts entirely, but no one can deny that Dage uses a lot of details while Nulgath used to go for simpler designs.)

Edit1:

ALSO! While I'm still fluming a bit over people stating an artist should be happy their work is seen at all , Can we just note how alot of people here are lumping all Rare hunters into "Get a rare, and afk in yulgar."

Not All Rare Hunters Do That.

Some Actually Play The Game.

They May Just Prefer To Use Rare Gear.

Also these Elitest that everyone is worrying about, that's not Every Rare Hunter either. AQW's Community is full of people that try to be Elitest over Rares, PvP, and even just being either Legion or Nation. The Problem People are having with "rare hunters" being jerks, is more of a general community problem that isn't just exclusive to rare collecting.

Sheesh, My Gosh. Stop with the generalizations of whole groups like Artists, Rare Collectors, and etc.

(Seriosuly though, It sounds like you're telling artists You Should be happy your art is in the game at all! It's INSULTING as heck just to hear something like that. Especially, when you spend alot of hard work making art. It's just give off the impression that the community don't give a hoot about the Artist's feelings at all, as long as that player get their gear/art to make their own character look cool. Same thing for Rare hunters' feelings as well. My Previous posts, while I don't like rares either, tried to explore reasons and justification for rares being a thing.)

I'm Not Adding another Edit to this post.

< Message edited by Meloette Wells -- 4/21/2017 12:50:45 >
AQ DF MQ AQW  Post #: 68
4/21/2017 15:25:36   
Ted Zlammy
Member

@ Poly

Ah, legality and what not! Yes, AE has the right to do whatever they want to do with the their product and aren't at fault for doing so. In my tired stupor I probably shoulda clarified it more when I said that "AE would be at fault," it wasn't a matter of that but, eh, a matter of "stance and trust" For several years (heck, we're edging our way close to a decade with us being close to 9 years now) , they've said things along the line of "This is the last chance to get so and so item" and more or less declaring that Rare items are meant to be go rare forever and are meant as a souvenir and what not. AE could just spontaneously go back on that and start releasing old rares and have every right to, but they would appear to be "going back on their word" and would be at "fault" for doing so. Folks would perceive it as that anyway, feel a "breach of trust," get mad and well, things can snowball on the internet.

I was more or less just suggesting something to reduce backlash and what not if AE were to reintroduce rares is all. Personally, I'm in the same camp of people who don't really care if rares get released again in some fashion. I'm just one of those cautious people who don't like seeing the pot get stirred up is all.
MQ AQW  Post #: 69
4/21/2017 15:55:32   
Aura Knight
Member

quote:

Also these Elitest that everyone is worrying about, that's not Every Rare Hunter either. AQW's Community is full of people that try to be Elitest over Rares, PvP, and even just being either Legion or Nation. The Problem People are having with "rare hunters" being jerks, is more of a general community problem that isn't just exclusive to rare collecting.

While it's true not all rare collectors are disrespectful to others, there are some and it annoys me that those few persons are the ones who seem to get what they want. Obviously those few aren't a good representation of all rare collectors and as proven by this thread, even those who do have rares wouldn't mind allowing others to experience what they have.

Since there have been instances where rares were brought back, sometimes altered, it doesn't seem like doing such things again is an impossibility. I wonder what AQW staff members think about such a thing.

< Message edited by Aura Knight -- 4/21/2017 15:56:13 >
AQ DF AQW  Post #: 70
4/21/2017 23:03:29   
juanz1996
Member
 

auraknight:
quote:


I still have difficulty understanding this whole value thing that some rares supposedly have. Only ones
that should have value are those that require actual money to obtain. I'm not one who puts emotional value on such things. If I have a rare, great. If not, well, not so great. But only if it's something that could affect my game experience.One group's happiness shouldn't be at the expense of another's. Unfortunately, the change I wouldn't mind is at the expense of others. Man, this thing wouldn't be an issue if the prospect of rares was never part of the game. I'm sure we'd all be happier.


Again... that hard way of looking to rares like most people have i cant understand what you dont understand. There are a lot of valuable items that arent able to obtain with money.
You can call it what you want but most people that play the game(76,9999%?) play it for fun AND because they wanna build a character make it diferent from others is exactly the way life/games works and im not even being emotinal, is just the way games work with. you build something. someone that grew up with a guitar is probably gonna feel attached to it.

we are all (even me) runing around like if we were diferent ej:
you have this people that respect rares (me) and those that dont think that is "nice" but still they want those things too to come back....arent we the same after all?

and
quote:

One group's happiness shouldn't be at the expense of another's. Unfortunately, the change I wouldn't mind is at the expense of others. Man, this thing wouldn't be an issue if the prospect of rares was never part of the game. I'm sure we'd all be happier.


No, no and well no xD, we are rare hunters and that is not an issue for other groups as i already pointed it out in my previous comment, we arent an issue we arent hurting anybody and yes the quantity is rares is high no doubt on that.

edit: The whole situation of rares will never hurt others groups since most of the content isnt rare if someone dont care about rares why should he/she even try to make them come back? when there are just a few that change the game somehow. When we discuss about changing something it must be something important, with a valid reason to complain about not because "it wouldnt hurt to try". Actually if you think it you cant take all rares away of your mind and what is left? yes, nothing really has changed, rares dont hurt if they exist. If you "wish to have something you missed" that is never gonna be a valid argument just someone that want a rare that is not gonna change his game experience to a diferent level and in adittion to that discuss about what problem have people that collect rares, that for me is a least very confusing.
---------------------------------------------
It insult me so bad as an artist that people have the courage to complain about what an artist should be proud of, idk most but i already enjoy the art i do at the very moment i do it and end it.

And this is a note to myself too... can we go back to the real discussion this is getting really off-topic :/

< Message edited by juanz1996 -- 4/21/2017 23:28:24 >
AQW  Post #: 71
4/21/2017 23:27:17   
Aura Knight
Member

By constantly demanding things be exclusive, those who prefer having rares are hurting potential future players by taking away certain experiences from them. Since I feel the game already has too many permanent rares, would it be so bad to have less of them and maybe use old rares as a base for future items? I couldn't care less for armors, weapons, capes or helms that have gone rare. By all means, keep those exclusive. Such things have little to no impact on actual game experience. However, classes are something I hate seeing be permanent rares. And my reason for this is simple. People would be missing out on unique skillsets. It's not easy constantly having to make art for the game, but I'm sure it's even harder to make classes. There's so much time and effort put into that. And to have just a few players use said class seems like an insult to the talents of class creators. Why put in so much work, if not everyone is able to appreciate that effort?
AQ DF AQW  Post #: 72
4/21/2017 23:48:08   
juanz1996
Member
 

quote:

By constantly demanding things be exclusive, those who prefer having rares are hurting potential future players by taking away certain experiences from them. Since I feel the game already has too many permanent rares, would it be so bad to have less of them and maybe use old rares as a base for future items? I couldn't care less for armors, weapons, capes or helms that have gone rare. By all means, keep those exclusive. Such things have little to no impact on actual game experience. However, classes are something I hate seeing be permanent rares. And my reason for this is simple. People would be missing out on unique skillsets. It's not easy constantly having to make art for the game, but I'm sure it's even harder to make classes. There's so much time and effort put into that. And to have just a few players use said class seems like an insult to the talents of class creators. Why put in so much work, if not everyone is able to appreciate that effort?


who really demands that? is not like that there is a group dedicated to hunt AE for rares release, you are overlooking the problem maybe? As i stated before is a very few items that are rare and change somehow the game so that is not gonna hurt future players that is just too much imagination at least for me. indeed the game has to many rares alina say they will work on that so that is one think done. As classes going rare i do hate (even if it doesnt look like) classes going rare, but i stop it there since there isnt too many of them to really worry about, there are like hundred of classes permanent and complain about those few is pointless. and well the comment about talents creators i think we should stay away from that(note to myself too lol), seems a bit disrespecful and off-topic.

pd: why did you come back trident of storms? why xd

< Message edited by juanz1996 -- 4/21/2017 23:49:15 >
AQW  Post #: 73
4/22/2017 1:05:41   
Doxus the OverLord
Member

Rares

The concept of rarity and all its exclusivity in AQW makes me angry.
This is how I feel for being honest with you all.



Rare classes

I think this shouldn't happen cuz, playing AQW is only viable through using a class. No matter if it's Warrior or VHL. You'll be using a class.
Maybe making something like what was made to VoT/Collector could be a good example. Anyway, I don't think it was made the best way cuz VoT is stronger than Collector.
Making remakes of rare classes could be good, but we need to be having two classes of equivalent power. Not as it is with VoT/Collector.
Saying that "removing the feature of classes being rare would kill part of rare item colector's gameplay" is too radical point of view.
By the meaning of lore, and the content of the game by itself, I REALLY THINK that having rare classes isn't a good thing. And it isn't about having the power to be watching all things happen in universe. How about people who haven't even started to play and now know that they never had the opportunity of having some classes?



Rares as Tokens of time

It's nice to know that things are looked by this way.
It's nice to have souvenirs, but a souvenir is more like a cosmetic item than a useful item.
Classes are useful items, not cosmetic ones.



AQW Birthday Classes

Why being rare? Why not letting them all permanent be in-game for letting us see the advances in game skills, mechanics, etc... and the progress made by class designers through the time?



My point of view

I just think that classes shouldn't stay with rares. All other items, despite them being iconic or a part of AE's lore, we have to agree that it all was tokens of time.
I just think that classes shouldn't be that kind of things. It's only it.

< Message edited by Doxus the OverLord -- 4/22/2017 1:07:57 >
Post #: 74
4/22/2017 1:24:52   
Christophoses
AQW Release Tester & Lore Connoisseur


@aaronarco

quote:

I'm pretty sure you guys get my point, that AE wont bring back something that could trigger hate/disappointment from players, esp. the sensitive ones who would cry "I'll quit this game if . . " if such idea is given out.


A large majority of the OG players don't play AQW anymore. I knew a lot of people who played this game from the start and haven't logged on in a couple of years. In all honesty, and from a business perspective, those people have already paid for the rares they bought. Bringing back some rares would be beneficial to the majority of the people currently playing AQW and any people that join the game in the future. Also, salty people shouldn't get their way. Saltiness should be discouraged. These are game items, not precious metals or minerals.

----

@LouisCyphere

quote:

What about a Throwback Thursday shop? A monthly or whenever shop that contains previous rare for sale.


Throwback Thursday is a huge thing for millennials. The results of a recent study show that millennials are one of the most sentimental generations out there, even to things that they didn't necessarily experience. Since millennials make up a huge portion of this game bringing back old and iconic items would go a very long way. FOR SCIENCE!!!

----

@Meloette Wells

quote:

The idea of re-releasing the calendar classes was because Tomix put alot of work into making those things that barely anyone get to use anymore. It would've been at a marked up price compared to the originals mind you, but it still would've allowed people to enjoy the hard work Tomix put into making those classes. (Seriously, if you haven't seen some of then, check some like Time Killer or Avatar of Time.)


I own nearly all the calendar classes, and they do look amazing. It's a shame that this in-game purchase system wasn't figured out much sooner.

quote:

There also been talked of making "variants" of rare items. In the calendar class discussion, people generally agreed that the new dc versions of the calendar classes should be edits or recolors like how AQW handled the calendar class for this. They also generally agreed that the original calendar owners should get the varients for free as well.


That's not a bad idea, but it still doesn't solve the problem that some people paid outrageous prices for shipping. For the sake of fairness, people should buy these hypothetical revamped versions for 1.5X the original price of the calendar.

quote:

With Bardric's armor since the edits done to them was really minimum, one could argue if someone had the wolfhound badge, the thing that gives the armor, then they could get a free version of the bardric set. I mainly suggest this for Bardric's wolfhound armor because of the package's $60 price tag (with stated to be valued at $180 in that design noted, if anyone didn't bother to check the links)


That's a great idea. It's fair to those who already purchased the package and it gives people a chance to get the specific canonical variant of the set.

----

@Aura Knight

quote:

It would seem the focus of rares in this thread has to do with ones we can buy in a shop, but what of the ones that are monster drops? As I'm sure many of us have experienced before, it's no fun being at the mercy of RNG. You can try to get something for a long time and still not succeed. What if the thing you wish to get is just a drop? How does it feel to try for something for hours, possibly days, or even longer and still fail? There's something not right about that.


There's actually no point for boss drop items to ever go perma-rare. AE doesn't make money from them unless there's a purchasable variant, in which case people don't tend to actually purchase the items they can obtain for free. At most, boss drop items should be tagged as seasonal rarity.

----

@Ninjaty

quote:

As long as this simply applies to future items, absolutely, go for it. That way no one loses anything, everyone gets what they were promised.


That still doesn't address the major, and main point of this thread: items that have already gone rare.

quote:

When you take a rare item and return it to the game, you specifically remove it's very reason for existing in the first place; which was to be rare. You deliberately take an item that a specific player group centers around, that the item is intended for, and pull it straight out of their hands, making it useless to them, and then give that item to another group.


Rare items don't exist for the sake of rarity. They aren't designed specifically for people who care about owning a rare item. Many people that participated in this thread have claimed that they couldn't care less about whether or not an item is rare. We here, on the forums, make up the minority of the player base, but that's still an example nonetheless. As for people who care solely about rare items, they are entitled to their interests as long as it doesn't cause disappointment to others, and a lot of people are disappointed by not being able to obtain a specific item because of an artificial rarity.

quote:

My example of taking high-end farming items and making them available for 0 gold is the same; you take the item, remove its original purpose (being farmed for), make it unappealing to the people that specifically wanted it for this purpose, and then make it available to everyone equally. Same exact situation, with different types of items.


This example is inapplicable to the discussion at hand. End-game items require a lot of time and effort to farm but very few of them ever go rare, so you have every opportunity to obtain them and take as long as you want to do so. Furthermore, items would never go from end-game to 0 gold, or rather gold at all. They wouldn't even be available for ACs.

quote:

No, it isn't, because a rare, by it's very existence and nature in AQW, is only meant to be legitimately available for the short duration it is initially available in. After that, it is meant to exist solely with those that obtained it, or it would have no value in it's existence at all. Furthermore, when you just retroactively take it back, after having already given it to a certain group, all you do is step on that group for the purpose of stepping on that group. That's not healthy for a community either, and only serves to split it up.


I'm sure that telling players who missed out on an item that they will never be able to obtain said item is a much better solution to keeping the community whole. If I had a dollar for every time that a war was started in Yulgar over rare items I would be rich. Bringing back certain rares would benefit a significantly larger portion of the community than it would "harm".

quote:

Again, this has nothing to do with being elitist, it has to do with being FAIR. If you give something to a specific group (determined by the properties of the item), and then remove the exact property that group is interested in, you have just taken the item back again, and away from that group. You have just removed the appeal, from the very group that was supposed to be interested in it. To do with with items that people have gotten attached to, would be nothing short of cruel. Give a person a pet, let them grow attached to it, and then yank it out of their hands months or years later, because you now make them allergic to the animal in question. The thing you don't get is, it does hurt, no matter the circumstances.

This is about fairness for all player groups, yet you seem to not consider rare collectors valid enough to deserve the respect you give the others. If a rare collector has obtained a rare they really wanted, they have pride in it and they treasure it, just as if someone interested in end-game farming items have spent months farming for one. If you take the rarity away however, it becomes worthless from the collection standpoint, just as if you make that end-game farming item something you can get in Yulgar's shop for 0 gold. You have taken all the appeal away, the very appeal that was the reason for the item being created in the first place. If something cannot hold up to it's reason for being, it shouldn't exist anymore, because it is no longer needed.


You don't seem to acknowledge that I have said multiple times that ONLY SPECIFIC items would return. Rare collectors would still have stuff to "value".

As for "respecting" rare collectors, I can't find it in myself to value a portion of the community that finds joy in others not being able to obtain specific items. That's egotistical and takes away from the fun of the game.

quote:

just as if you make that end-game farming item something you can get in Yulgar's shop for 0 gold


I honestly don't know why you keep bringing this up. End-game items have nothing to do with rares. Difficulty and accessibility are two completely different discussions.

quote:

And that is what you don't get! To collectors, rarity is not a barrier, it's a feature. It is the key factor in determining their ability to like the item, to determining whether or not to have it in their collection. It is alpha and omega, just like the farming criteria for someone who collects end-game farming items, or someone who wants only Dage's Legion or Nulgath Nation items; it is specifically what makes the item attractive to that audience in the first place.


Valuing an item's rarity over its quality is an insult to the devs that design items.

quote:

That is not something you should mess with, because in doing so, you mess with the entire group. Essentially, you just casually decide that this group isn't worthy of having the items in question, and try to allocate the items to another group.


No, I'm saying that the mentality of "Ihave something you can't get" doesen't overule those who just want to have the items they want and are willing to obtain them through ligitimate means.

quote:

If you at all care about fairness, let each group keep what they have been given. Don't try to change items in a way that makes them unappealing to the very groups they are intended for. Instead, focus on the new items. Focus on getting the team to make something new for your group, and eventually, those will far outweigh the amount of rares that exist. I have said this many times over: good neighbors do not steal from one another; they repsect each other's property. I have never gone on a crusade, asking for items left and right to be made rare, just so they would appeal to my group. So why are you going around, proposing to point left and right, to take things away from the rare collectors, by making said items useless to them?


You don't seem to realize that people who join the game late and/or those who missed on on an item have already been done an injustice. As for your statement on why I can't just leave this topic alone and let the rare collectors forever have what's theirs, I don't believe in giving elitists what they want just because they want to be elite. Someone's interest is completely respectable until it affects someone else. More people are affected by the rare tag than those who benefit from it. As such, change is in order. Cutting off a group of people from the items they want is the antithesis of fairness.

quote:

That has nothing to do with rares specifically, and for the purposes of high-end farming items, they are the same as rares in this case; relatively few people will ever get to enjoy them, because of their unrealistic expectations to people's time and dedication. Many people will never have the time for many farmable items, and would, due to their schedules, not be able to obtain the items within years or even decades, making those items as good as unavailable to them. In that regard, at least rares can be flexible enough to allow everyone a chance to get them, assuming they are there.


That doesn't mean people should never have the chance of obtaining the items they want.

quote:

An artist should be happy that their art is enjoyed to any capacity, that someone may even have their creation as a favorite of theirs. If you truly care about your craft, then one person enjoying it should be just as good as a billion. And also, many items aren't worn that often, not because they're rare, but simply because they are forgotten or undesired. That, again, has nothing specifically to do with rares or rare collectors, but rather with people's desire to get what's new and leave everything else behind, only to be forgotten.


You can't tell an artist what they should feel. Obviously, rarirty is a problem since some devs have left AQW for that very reason.

quote:

It's really just a matter of finding what appeals to you. I collect rares of many sorts, in my various hobbies, because these are the things that appeal to me. I like to have numbers to relate to, I like to keep track of how many survive the tests of time, and I feel I can only fully appreciate such items. Just like some people want to own items that can only be obtained through long sessions of dedicated farming, I downright love items that exist in a defined quantity, and then try to hold onto my copy, to try and preserve it.


I love items that have canonical significance, yet I can't obtain some of them due to artificial rarity. As such, your interest becomes the detriment to my own interest and those of many other players. There's a problem here. In your opinion, how should we solve it?

quote:

Both of these, from different persepctives, are impossible to get their hands on. Time is also a valuable resource which you use to purchase things with, through the method of farming. If you know the joy of feeling your investment was worth it, and know the pain it would cause if the item just became freely available for a price that in no ways compare to what you paid, then you should also know the feelings of the rare collector. Something we invest in, if taken away, will leave a void where that thing once was; we will feel cheated and betrayed, because we earned the item through the method of which it was made available, only to have tha validility of that effort taken away, the price nullified, and the value tarnished.


We're talking about a pixelated item that has an infinite supply if certain code is written. There is no legitimate rarity to these items. We're not talking about finite resources like platinum or diamonds. Rare items are only created to create barriers. We're talking about artificial rarity.

quote:

Personally, I care deeply about the ability to trust in the AQW staff. But if rares just start coming back, then what kind of message does that send?


That they care about everyone, including new players.

quote:

Are rare collectors no longer welcome, or can we no longer trust their word? While I doubt the first one will ever come true, the second option is an equally tragic pill to swallow, if we can no longer assume the staff is truthful.


This statement makes it sound like only you and your fellow rare collectors matter. Everyone matters. All 100% of the community.

quote:

It's kind of tragic how, in just wanting to keep what the staff has given us, rare collectors are always singled out as the ones being greedy or elitist, just for wanting to be left with what they have. We don't try to take things away from other player groups to make our own. Why can we not all just appreciate what we have been given, and repsect each other as neighbors in this community? Why must people with a passion for rares, always feel hunted for their items, when no other group is seemingly subject to the same?


Having a specific item that nobody else can obtain and wanting it to stay that way does, unfortunately, sound greedy. It promotes exclusivity instead of inclusivity.

----

@Ted Zlammy

quote:

Ah, rares, a somewhat controversial topic! But, to the opening post regarding prominent items that were once rare but show up again... It is an interesting subject. It is a shame how some NPCs have interesting gear that is rare, and it's also a shame how some items of interest are brought up in game but are rare. However, I know that it isn't unheard of for an item to make a comeback though. Take the Shadowreaper of Doom for instance. It was available originally in a rare 2010 Mirror World event, but years later was permanently added to the Mirror Realm merge shop as an item you could grind for during the Chaos Lord saga.

So yeah, certain well reputed items reappearing is a possibility. Should anymore reappear though? Hmm... Depends on the item. I'm not too savvy with AE game knowledge for the most part so I can't comment on any items in particular, but... I do think that if something with a reputation similar to that of the Blinding Light of Destiny went rare in the past, it ought to to have been available for all due to it's wide acclaim in the first place and should have it's rarity questioned.


I created this thread to address why significant items should return. Not all items should return because not all of them have the reasoning to do so. It's mostly canonical items that should make a permanent comeback. Your statement here explains my point very accurately.

----

@juanz1996

quote:

No, no and well no xD, we are rare hunters and that is not an issue for other groups as i already pointed it out in my previous comment, we arent an issue we arent hurting anybody and yes the quantity is rares is high no doubt on that.


Rare hunters aren't the problem, the rare tag is the problem. We don't have a problem with the players, we have a problem with the game.
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