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Akanthus Paranoia

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9/16/2017 21:47:56   

I've had another idea that's been bothering me and after some discussion on Discord I want to see what you guys think about it. If it's true it'd be pretty significant but I'm not sure I know enough to judge how likely it is. So, in Are Rocks Evil, there's some dialogue that sort of bugs me. Early on in the quest, when Jaania is confronting Zlatomira, she says this:


Jaania: Granted, <Character> most likely took the king to safety...

She clearly expects us to take Alteon somewhere else, and doesn't object to the idea at all. And then there's this at the end.


Akanthus: I will gather troops and pursue <Character> at once.
Jaania: ...
Jaania: What do you mean...?
Akanthus: <Character> and his/her associates have kidnapped the king.
Jaania: What?!
Akanthus: I have seen it with my own eyes.
Jaania: ...
Jaania: Then why didn't you STOP him/her!?

Now, suddenly, when Akanthus tells Jaania that the exact thing she expected and wanted to happen did happen, except with the word "kidnapped" thrown in there, she panics and completely reverses her attitude on the situation. Akanthus doesn't bother explaining further or giving any context for an unilateral decision, and Jaania goes along with it unquestioningly. There are a few possible explanations. It could be a mistake in the writing, which isn't likely or productive to discuss. Jaania could legitimately trust Akanthus too much for her own good, since he's had something like five years to get in her good graces. She could have changed her mind because Akanthus found it worthy of concern, and kidnapping does make the situation sound bad. Or her turnaround and agreement could be because of some unnatural influence courtesy of Akanthus, who we know is already a fairly shady character. Akanthus' past is frequently lied about, Saellah is the only person familiar from before the Rose and he alluded to some suspicious goings-on way back when, and Akanthus has some talent with illusions judging from Amadeus' veil being seen through. It's all circumstantial, but combined with Jaania's strange behavior I think it's reasonable to consider the possibility that Akanthus has some unnatural ability to tamper with people's minds.

What do you guys think?

< Message edited by Lineolata -- 9/17/2017 14:36:23 >
AQ DF  Post #: 1
9/16/2017 23:12:33   

Akanthus is a very unknown person, little by little we know more of him. I agree with you that Akanthus has the power to manipulate people.
DF  Post #: 2
9/16/2017 23:16:48   



and Akanthus has some talent with illusions judging from Amadeus' veil being seen through

actually, that's most likely due to his armor, not any magical talent he might have. his armor was designed to resist magic, so it's only natural that his helmet would make him more or less immune to the effects of illusions, like the one seppydeus cloaks himself in.

one of the most dangerous things about akanthus is not his strength, or some magic he most likely doesn't even have. it's his charisma. remember what elryn said: "akanthus lies to everyone. especially jaania." note that despite this, EVERYONE believes pretty much everything he says(aside from the hero and elryn, thanks to them knowing about him lying to everyone, and most likely seppydeus, since he's probably suspicious about everyone and everything that isn't him or his daughter.) this can only mean the not only does he lie to everyone, he's also INCREDIBLY good at hiding it.

it's probably because of this that jaania would so quickly change her tune, which actually makes him a pretty terrifying opponent to go up against. with that kind of guile, if he so chose, he could turn all of greenguard aganst the hero with some grand tale about how we suddenly switched sides and are now a terrorist or something, and even if we were to defeat him, it would only serve to martyr him in the public eye, and prove his point that WE'RE the bad guy.
DF  Post #: 3
9/19/2017 22:50:31   
Gabriel Castro

I think you're overthinking this, Lineolata. When Jaania asked the hero to take the king and his daughter to safety, she did it on an impulse. She saw that we were the most capable of doing such task, and asked.

Jaania never trusted us, but, like you said, she does trust Akanthus.
Post #: 4
9/28/2017 12:04:04   

It seems to me like Akanthus has an ability to manipulate people, but I think it has more to do with him just knowing how to talk to people than it does with having a supernatural power. A lot of people in real life (especially corrupt leaders) have the same ability.

In a way, I think this makes Akanthus even more dangerous than a lot of the magical threats to Lore. He's managed to talk himself into a high position of power where he can directly influence and manipulate Jaania and Alteon, and therefor the entire kingdom. With time, he could do massive amounts of damage to Lore. He's already on his way to causing the genocide of lots of magical creatures, and putting the Hero at the top of the most wanted list. Greed had a similar ability to manipulate people to turn on each other, but unlike Akanthus, Greed used a magic spell that could easily be reversed. Akanthus' influence can't be gotten rid of so easily.

Before seeing this thread, I didn't put much consideration into the fact that Jaania trusted him so easily, and I think it could warrant some discussion.
DF  Post #: 5
10/8/2017 15:42:41   

Now that i think about it, the magesterium is after him, he could be a magic user (or a powerful one). And he could use that armor to hide his power so its unable to be sensed by others so everyone in the end thinks he doesnt have any magic ability. In the end its what makes him suspicious, Jaania doesn't trust him anymore to leave him in charge, the reason for her to want Seppydeus to keep an eye on him, but he is the 2nd in command so she must respect that.

I say Jaania doesn't trust him anymore because of the littel gala incident and how Akanthus responded towards the ''kidnap'', she clearly knew something is odd about him.

Although i think Akanthus is a magic use i believe it is just charisma. Charisma is a powerful enough by it self, and if used by a liar it can be used to manipulate the people's mind. He is smart, he is powerful, and he is playing a very big game that, otherwise why would he manipulate people for his will?

Your paranoia might come true, i think Seppydeus will be the one to find out, for he is playing a game himself!
DF AQW  Post #: 6
10/8/2017 17:03:30   

I think the only bit about Akanthus's story that has a grain of truth is him being from the land of the Magestrium, considering his reaction to their presence.


Master of Light and Darkness
Rio Skyron
with Bianca, my blade of Destiny
theme song
DF MQ AQW Epic  Post #: 7
10/8/2017 17:40:06   

I'm with Rio here. But it should also be reembered that when Robina said "I was there! Father is being taken to safety, he wasn't kidnapped," Jaania beleived her as well. Jaania seems to believe whoever shouts loudest and sounds most reasonable, including herself.
DF  Post #: 8
10/9/2017 20:25:01   

@GammaCavy so all we have to do is explain to her why what she's doing is wrong, but do it as loud as possible
DF MQ AQW Epic  Post #: 9
10/9/2017 22:28:42   

AQ DF MQ AQW Epic  Post #: 10
10/9/2017 22:36:38   


the only flaw i can see with that plan is that like gammacavy said, loudest and most reasonable. jaania's mind is so closed and broken that to her, the idea of her POSSIBLY being ever wrong is completely unreasonable. she basically has the common 5-year old mentality of "i'm right because i say so, and anybody who disagrees is insane and doesn't know what thy're talking about" when it comes to her war against magic. at least, that's the mentality she tends to outwardly project whenever anyone tries to debate with her whether what she's doing is right or wrong.
DF  Post #: 11
10/10/2017 14:31:40   


I know I was mostly making a joke lol. That idea was just to funny to not share.
DF MQ AQW Epic  Post #: 12
10/10/2017 19:07:56   

Rio's solution would be fun to see though...
DF  Post #: 13
10/10/2017 19:21:16   


not gonna lie, it WOULD be amusing to see the hero come to the conclusion that "maybe i should speak LOUDER to get my point across to her.", and end up accidentally causing their debate to devolve into a really petty shouting match, with each of them trying to yell louder than the other because jaania starts thinking something along the lines of "oh no, they're actually making good points, i have to yell louder than them!"


scene in swordhaven
<hero>: Jaania, i need to speak with you.
*a five minutes later card transitions to yulgar working his forge in battleon, and we hear an echo of the hero's voice
yulgar:.....did i just hear <hero>?!?

< Message edited by Greyor_42 -- 10/10/2017 19:29:41 >
DF  Post #: 14
10/11/2017 2:37:38   

The way I see it Jaania is just... too dumb to be the TRUE antagonist of the storyline. She'll get doubts or going to feel like she went too far and someone will just get her out the way and takes over the Rose.
Akanthus is a good candidate being the mysterious "I'M NOT THE LICH KING ALL" looks, his style to sneak attack, and his "just a tiny bit too late to stop the King's KIDNAPPING but he seen everything to be ABSOLUTELY sure about the king was kidnapped by the EEEEVUL <hero name> who could only possibly be up to the most EVIL, CUNNING, and WORLD ENDING thing imaginable"...
I think "Dark Stare Tsundere" just gonna to get some big power and bail to return later on every Friday 13th.
DF  Post #: 15
10/11/2017 7:34:43   


I figured Akanthus was going to be the true Antagonist from the Very beginning, that he was going to be the Ghetsis to Jaania's N.
DF MQ AQW Epic  Post #: 16
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