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RE: Should we really be attacking the undead right now?

 
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4/14/2018 11:58:50   
Greyor_42
Member

@BluuHorseOfficial

And as shiny had pointed out earlier in the war thread, the skeletons are only wearing bikini tops. Or not even that. Such shameless behavior must be dealt with appropriately.

< Message edited by Greyor_42 -- 4/14/2018 11:59:06 >
DF  Post #: 26
4/14/2018 13:08:06   
BluuHorseOfficial
Member

Yep. They being mean and I no liek meanie.
DF  Post #: 27
4/14/2018 14:34:12   
Shiny_Underpants
Member

quote:

~original: @Greyor_42
And as shiny had pointed out earlier in the war thread, the skeletons are only wearing bikini tops. Or not even that.

Honestly, I feel as insulted as Dante when he had to war against the false Baron. This isn't about greed; this is honor. There is an art to underpants, and these... things... are mauling it.

And on top of swimming without a lifeguard, the slimes are contributing to a toxic atmosphere.
DF MQ  Post #: 28
4/14/2018 14:55:12   
Holyemperor
Member

Wait... what!?

I was under the impression we were always the villains; I did not partner up with genocidal maniacs like Artix and Galanoth for nothing!
Post #: 29
4/14/2018 17:31:59   
Sneevillord
Member

First they came for the Undead, and I did not speak out— (Because Undead are not allowed to talk)
Because I was not an Undead.

Then they came for the Elementals, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Elemental.

Then they came for the Monkees, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Monkee. (Kind of)

Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me.





It's only a matter of time, how long until Dove declares war on... Me?... Him?... Her?

You.

< Message edited by Sneevillord -- 4/14/2018 20:30:10 >
AQ DF MQ AQW  Post #: 30
4/14/2018 17:45:09   
  Starflame13

Gryffin Warrior of DF GD & RP


I mean, the quest complete screen does say

quote:

The beaches are safer now, thanks to your efforts.


So at the very least, that implies that all the undead on the beach are causing some type of danger to the citizens of FalconReach. And we're here to keep things safe!
AQ DF MQ AQW  Post #: 31
4/14/2018 20:29:09   
Sneevillord
Member

@starflame13, that's what any dictatorship would have you believe, that you're defending the homeland by attacking, the innocents you destroy are threats, you're clearing them out for your own kind.

“He who fights with monsters should look to it that he himself does not become a monster, when you gaze long into the abyss the abyss also gazes into you.”


In book 1 robina taught us that those we ruthlessly hunt for gold and to further are skills have worth, are something to be protected. But in our subsequent war mongering we forgot what we fought for, peace. Kindness to those who could not protect themselves. Not from us. Not enslaved undead who are capable of thought and emotion. Our interaction with violent sociopaths twisted us, as we absorbed the fanaticism of Artix and galanoth in our zealous hunt for our vision of the world. When we looked into the ice on the same cliff we appeared on, we looked into the ice and saw a distorted reflection of who we once were before preoccupied by power and control. Why did we not recognise cinquefoil as robina? Because we forgot that portion of existence.

"Demons run when a good man goes to war.Night will fall and drown the sun,When a good man goes to war.Friendship dies and true love lies,Night will fall and the dark will rise,When a good man goes to war.Demons run, but count the cost.The battle's won but the child is lost."

< Message edited by Sneevillord -- 4/14/2018 20:42:52 >
AQ DF MQ AQW  Post #: 32
4/14/2018 21:32:41   
Greyor_42
Member

@Sneevillord

quote:

Our interaction with violent sociopaths twisted us, as we absorbed the fanaticism of Artix and galanoth in our zealous hunt for our vision of the world.


Violent Artix may be with the undead, but he is far from a sociopath. Remember, Artix can actually hear the thoughts of the undead thanks to his contact with the Darkness orb, and they hate being undead. Artix is doing the only thing he can when he slays them, send them back to death's realm where they both belong, and desire to return to. And Galanoth isn't one either, as he actually had the dragonslayer order team up with the DragonLords to prevent the Rose from hunting dragons to extinction. Galanoth and his order doesn't slay just any dragons after all, just the evil ones(which, unfortunately, had a bad tendency to outnumber the good ones).

quote:

Why did we not recognise cinquefoil as robina? Because we forgot that portion of existence.


No, we're just.... not the sharpest lightbulb in the crayon box. We never have been. You have to remember, even way back in Book 1, Gary of all people was able to outwit us.


As for what Starflame posted, remember, this is Falconreach's beach they're on. It's not just dictatorships that would have you attack what may be a hostile invasion to your own territory to defend said territory. Almost any civilization would do that.

Besides, it's been hinted at both in-game and out-of-game, that there is most definitely something much deeper to this than "a bunch of undead wanting to have fun".

< Message edited by Greyor_42 -- 4/14/2018 21:35:11 >
DF  Post #: 33
4/14/2018 22:46:39   
dragon_monster
Member

quote:

Violent Artix may be with the undead, but he is far from a sociopath. Remember, Artix can actually hear the thoughts of the undead thanks to his contact with the Darkness orb, and they hate being undead. Artix is doing the only thing he can when he slays them, send them back to death's realm where they both belong, and desire to return to. And Galanoth isn't one either, as he actually had the dragonslayer order team up with the DragonLords to prevent the Rose from hunting dragons to extinction. Galanoth and his order doesn't slay just any dragons after all, just the evil ones(which, unfortunately, had a bad tendency to outnumber the good ones).

When did Galanoth ever teamed with dragonlords? And also no he did kill innocent dragon for the potential of eating to much and no not other sentient beings but food sentient beings also eat like fish. Also kinda ashamed that dragons got in danger because of an human order that appeared in an just an few years but then again the humans are the mightiest specie on Lore.
Also Artix did eliminate the 3 ghosts of christmas for being ghosts.

< Message edited by dragon_monster -- 4/14/2018 22:50:17 >
AQ DF MQ  Post #: 34
4/14/2018 23:09:20   
Greyor_42
Member

@dragon_monster

quote:

<Character>: A hunt? Good to see that you are still your dragonslaying self, as well!
Galanoth: Don't be foolish. I was not here to slay the dragon. I was hunting it down to send it to the Dragonlords.
<Character>: What?!
Galanoth: With the Rose being as active as they are, dragons are one of their main targets.
Galanoth: The Order of Dragonslayers have made a treaty with the Dragonlords...
Galanoth: ... in order to preserve the dragon population that is now dwindling.



quote:

Also Artix did eliminate the 3 ghosts of christmas for being ghosts.


We've been over this before. The canonicity of holiday events, especially the ones in the early days, is dubious at best(even moreso for the ones that have no actual bearing on the main story, like the one you're talking about).
DF  Post #: 35
4/15/2018 0:49:34   
dragon_monster
Member

Except that was with Xan as the main villain and he referenced his fall in the lava and what happened after that(Lymcrest).

Also yes it seem the mighty dragons stand no chance against an organization from an kingdom of humans mighty are the humans the mightiest on Lore. So why would we not wipe out the undead there not sentient if they are there barely there the corpses of loved ones and we are humans we are he mightiest on Lore we do not give our beaches to any other species.

< Message edited by dragon_monster -- 4/15/2018 0:56:04 >
AQ DF MQ  Post #: 36
4/15/2018 0:56:21   
  Starflame13

Gryffin Warrior of DF GD & RP


Poking this thread back onto topic, which focuses on the situation of the CURRENT WAR.
AQ DF MQ AQW  Post #: 37
4/15/2018 2:08:39   
TFS
Member

I'm guessing the punchline after the boss fight will be something along the lines of "Zorbak's hockey team was just trying to enjoy their spring break, you jerk."
DF  Post #: 38
4/15/2018 2:46:08   
HellsWolf666
Member

If there is one thing that we learned from book 3 is that a lot of magical beings have their own free will and even societies like the clawkin or the davir so it only makes sense that slimes and flying eyeballs might have those too and all they did was just go to the nearest beach for some R&R. And for all we know their only crime is to party so hard that the humans got jealous of their dancing skills. As for the undead we do have soup and chomper that kinda prooves thay undead do have free will and desires so for all we know they might have some kind of an undead union or an undead rights movement that forces necromancers to give them a week off once every few years and up untill now they went to places with no humans so we never noticed them untill they chose the beach.

my point is that we should just let them have their fun (and then politely ask them to leave so it would count as "getting rid of evil" to make medal claiming legit)


< Message edited by HellsWolf666 -- 4/15/2018 2:52:14 >
DF AQW  Post #: 39
4/15/2018 7:39:22   
BluuHorseOfficial
Member

Well, the undead can go to some black sand beach in doomwood if there is one. Or maybe near a lake?

In any case, these undead have failed in the holy, sacred ritual of le “donning thine holy underpants” and that is a huge disrespect to my friend Shiny_Underpants and I stand for my friends.
DF  Post #: 40
4/15/2018 9:51:40   
Da Awesomancer
Member

@HellsWolf666 Whether undead have free will or not is generally based on what kind of undead they are. The kind raised by necromancers generally lack any free will, and even the freer ones like Chomper and Soup are subservient to their Necromancer. Other undead, like Liches and Deathknights, have free will, but that's generally thanks to having been raised by their own power, but even they can be manipulated or controlled by the Darkness, such as with the one who trains you in the Deathknight class, Sir Malef-somethingorother.

Considering this is a small army of undead, all of whom are sporting Zorbak colors, it's quite likely that they are all under Zorbak's control, and as such lack free will. Therefore, it is heroic to smite them and purge them of the dark taint that binds their souls to their rotting shells.
DF AQW  Post #: 41
4/15/2018 10:16:23   
dragon_monster
Member

I have to repeat it does not actually matter if they have free will or not when we kill the undead its not even an permanent death there souls go to death realm and they can be brought back as undead again.
Does it not make it better?
AQ DF MQ  Post #: 42
4/15/2018 11:12:31   
Da Awesomancer
Member

@dragon_monster No, the knowledge that the undeads' freedom from enslavement is only temporary, and they can be re-raised and bound doesn't make anything better. If anything, it's just kind of depressing.
DF AQW  Post #: 43
4/15/2018 11:20:53   
dragon_monster
Member

Well why not its depressing either way if their undead there in an dead body that can not feel anything and that is terrible. If we kill them for an short while they while taste feeling until they do not.
So basically its either an unlife of torture or an unlife or torture with small pauses in it.
AQ DF MQ  Post #: 44
4/15/2018 14:02:01   
HellsWolf666
Member

quote:

Well, the undead can go to some black sand beach in doomwood if there is one. Or maybe near a lake?

just because they are undead doesn't mean they all need to enjoy cold dark places... they used to be human after all.
quote:

the knowledge that the undeads' freedom from enslavement is only temporary, and they can be re-raised and bound doesn't make anything better. If anything, it's just kind of depressing.

this is exactly why they deserve some time off from being raised - killed - raised again.

quote:

So basically its either an unlife of torture or an unlife or torture with small pauses in it.

i think it is better to not know what freedom tastes like cuz that would make the unlife a lot harder ... best to just leave them be as they would eventually get used to it and won't see it as something so bad.

undead UNlives matter - give them to rights they deserve and the rights you would want as a future undead regardless of how much free will one may or may not have.
join the cause - join the undead union & labour association


DF AQW  Post #: 45
4/15/2018 14:31:51   
Greyor_42
Member

^

All undead know what freedom tastes like, though, As all of them were unfairly taken away from Death's Realm, where they were free, and at rest. You need to understand, they're not "having fun" of they're own free will here(the only exception to this are people who turned themselves undead of their own volition, A.K.A Liches, who are generally evil beings, and need to be slain anyways). They're not getting any "time off". They don't want to be undead. They just want to go back to relaxing in Death's realm, and that is the only right an undead longs for. You're technically advocating extending their torture(because that's all existence as an undead is-torture). Remember, Edgar's(Vayle's brother) soul as an undead was in constant pain.


quote:

best to just leave them be as they would eventually get used to it and won't see it as something so bad.


That is a terrible thing to think. You're basically saying that they should all suffer from Stockholm Syndrome......

< Message edited by Greyor_42 -- 4/15/2018 14:34:57 >
DF  Post #: 46
4/15/2018 14:38:38   
dragon_monster
Member

Also while we now he Irismancer is sentient do we know all eyeballs are?
AQ DF MQ  Post #: 47
4/16/2018 13:49:30   
Jet Silver
Member

I mean Walic has a pet Jimmy the Eye.

And jeez. Half of them are already gone. They should've been getting slaughtered by volleyballs, not by axes.
AQ DF MQ AQW Epic  Post #: 48
4/16/2018 14:04:11   
Greyor_42
Member

@Jet Silver Well, Jimmy the Eye is of the rare Blue variant, which are stated to be more friendly and intelligent.

Again, you're still under the assumption that this is completely innocent. Which is almost certainly not the case. Sure, it probably isn't Valtrith, But it could very well still be Zorbak, and in case you forgot, while he has helped us on occasion, he is still a villain, and doesn't care about his undead servants well-being, unless they're rendered useless, so he wouldn't give them a vacation.

< Message edited by Greyor_42 -- 4/16/2018 14:10:31 >
DF  Post #: 49
4/16/2018 16:35:53   
ShadowMoon
Member

the undead get rid of the beach goers
we get rid of the undead
afterwards, the beach is finally cleaned of unnecessary things that do more harm then good.
AQ DF MQ AQW Epic  Post #: 50
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