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9/5/2013 2:20:47   
Tri Phoenix
Member

with this i am sure that many players will come back to epic duel if this happens this is it :
The Seasonal Rare , Limited-Rare , Limited-Seasonal-Rare , Rare , Ultra Rare Items should have more stats then the normal items and since many people bought varium in the last phases they will come back because they will have more stats on their weapons and not wasted their money, i think this should be like this :
Seasonal Rare Items - +2 Stats more then the normal weps
Limited-Rare - +3 Stats more then the normal weps
Limited-seasonal-rare - +4 stats mpre then the normal weps
Rare - +5 stats more then the normal weps
Ultra Rare - +6 more stats then the normal weps



P.S i think that package items should be here 2 and they should give 6 or 7 stats

Support Who likes this idea
AQW Epic  Post #: 1
9/5/2013 2:39:59   
Mother1
Member

Not supported.

This would make the power creep even worse then it is now. Especially since promo items will have the most stats out of everything.
Epic  Post #: 2
9/5/2013 3:00:11   
Tri Phoenix
Member

was there any difference in other phases with promo items
AQW Epic  Post #: 3
9/5/2013 14:00:39   
goldslayer1
Member

quote:

was there any difference in other phases with promo items

promo items would most often be items with the most stats in the game (delta gear for example when it came out)

personally, i like the idea. it gives a small boost to the players who stuck around long to collect these rares.
this would help with retaining more veteran players, so they wont leave so quickly.

while mother1 has concerns about powercreep, the fault here is mainly due to cores.
stat wise, non vars and vars are equal.
if i have a rare by being a long time player, and a non var has a rare as well, then they would have the same amount of stats.

@OP
i would suggest a better scaling. (example numbers)

Seasonal/Limited/Promo Rare: +3% more stat (seasonals always come back, and limited usually get restocked, and promos come back the next year for credits, which can be considered seasonal. unless the promo items itself is of higher rarity)
Rare: +6% more stats
Ultra Rare: +10% more stats

by having them in percentages, it helps to better account for the increase in levels (which increases your stats).

< Message edited by goldslayer1 -- 9/5/2013 14:07:28 >
AQW Epic  Post #: 4
9/5/2013 18:06:42   
  Exploding Penguin
Moderator


 To be honest, I would support anything that would make each item more unique and not clones of each other (aside from unique promo cores).
Epic  Post #: 5
9/5/2013 19:16:16   
Bionic Bear
Helpful!


 @above
A complete agreement. I wouldn't mind the old stat system being brought back. If they had no requirements but their old stat bonuses, all would be dandy in my little land.
Post #: 6
9/6/2013 1:29:08   
CN2025
Member

support. i think 2-4 stats extra is enough
AQ DF AQW Epic  Post #: 7
9/6/2013 3:13:55   
Jekyll
Member

Definitely agreeing with this. Now there will be an incentive to get certain types of rares besides art and possibly cores.
AQ DF AQW Epic  Post #: 8
9/6/2013 12:56:54   
CHELSEA ROX
Member

supported
This is unique and I think this is necessary. This will prevent ED from becoming a dress up game. Currently only cores divide players.
Epic  Post #: 9
9/6/2013 14:30:26   
Mother1
Member

@ goldslayer1

Then what about those promo weapons that didn't have cores? Those still had more stats then free items or other rares at the same level. Not only will this idea bring back power creep with stats, but it will promo pay to win even more, and IIRC there is a policy against buffing rare items which this would be doing if every item with a rare tag (Seasonal, limited, Rare, and/or ultra rare)
Epic  Post #: 10
9/6/2013 17:23:25   
goldslayer1
Member

@mother1
thats not buffing rare items.
this isnt asking to buff a specific item, its asking for a system.

a system where rares and ultra rares, are more valuable to the player instead of a useless tag that doesn't help you in any way at all.

despite being able to increase your weapons stats and damage, this new system still has problems like the old one.

the old one had problems with rares, because new ones would coming replacing the old ones pretty quickly, you basically had to keep buying in order to stay afloat.

the new one, you can simply buy anything from the junker bot, and it will be just as useful (stat wise) as an ultra rare item that may have been release 3 years ago.

the fact that some players may have ultra rare items (founder, beta gear, etc) only shows that player's dedication/loyalty to the game to have stuck around for that long, and IMO should be rewarded in a better way that doesn't necessarily makes it unbalanced, while not making it seem like you're rewarding a specific group (i.e founder fiasco, which is why they dont buff rares)

no one's going to have more power than someone else, everyone is able to get rare items whether its seasonal items, special occasion, or a war rare people will be able to obtain more. may not be the same items as before, but there will be more.

and cores itself is a completely different issue.

< Message edited by goldslayer1 -- 9/6/2013 17:24:11 >
AQW Epic  Post #: 11
9/6/2013 22:46:00   
CN2025
Member

seasonal one extra stat
limited two extra stat
limited seasonal three extra
rare four extra
ultra rare five extra


this will give loyal/ hard working players a slight edge then people who dont buy varium

not counting the cores



< Message edited by Mecha Mario -- 9/6/2013 23:17:03 >
AQ DF AQW Epic  Post #: 12
9/6/2013 22:52:24   
ND Mallet
Legendary AK!!!


 You may think that having extra stats for different rarities is fine now, but you forget we have 4 different slots of items. 5-6 stats on one item is one damage or maybe two defense. But you have 5-6 on 4 items giving you 20-24 extra stats or 5-6 level advantage on someone who doesn't have any rares. This also defeats the purpose of Omega where all items are supposed to be the same and allowing for more variety in choosing your gear, rather than having to buy every new promo for more stats to stay competitive.
AQ DF MQ AQW Epic  Post #: 13
9/7/2013 0:40:27   
AQisFuN
Banned


 I think:
Limited Rare - 1 stat
Seasonal Rares - 1 stat
Limited Seasonal Rares - 2 stats
Rare - 2 stats
Ultra Rare - 3 stats
AQ AQW Epic  Post #: 14
9/7/2013 2:51:49   
Tri Phoenix
Member

@ND Mallet
What is the Use of buying promos if all the items are same again ?
because of this all items being same the game has turned into a dressup game and its no use of buying the items with promos except for cores and they will be back with credits next year and if the admins make rare items to have higher stats people will start buying varium again to buy those rare items, more people will come back to playing epic duel and there will be much more varieties of builds except everybody having the same build like str blood mages or glass cannon tech mages.
This way people will be able to make more defensive or more offensive builds they will have a chance to make like high hp builds and so on ...
AQW Epic  Post #: 15
9/7/2013 3:02:53   
RageSoul
Member

I'm with this idea . That way , we don't just tell who's new and who's old but also it does rewards loyal players to continue .


Devs please !
AQW Epic  Post #: 16
9/7/2013 5:50:37   
Mother1
Member

@ Tri Phoenix

The reason they made everything the same was so you wouldn't be forced into having to buy the next promo or certain item to be competitive. By putting your idea into play you would be forcing people into doing so since certain items in this case all rares will have more stats then regular items.

Everyone would be forced into using rare items instead of what they would like to use just because rares would give more power in stats. As ND Mallet explained doing this would defeat the entire purpose of omega.
Epic  Post #: 17
9/7/2013 7:19:15   
Ranloth
Banned


 @Tri Phoenix
What's the problem in people buying promos for art and a core (year early)? What's wrong with all items being the same (stat wise)? People buy packages in AQW despite everything giving you looks. Stats there (or "enhancements") are fixed and you cannot adjust them. And you can usually apply the same enhancement on basic items as you would on your super cool Dage Set (in AQW).

People do spend money for art and AQW is a great example of it.
AQ Epic  Post #: 18
9/7/2013 22:27:03   
CN2025
Member

limidted rare one

seasonal one

rare 2

ultra rare 3

prize code rares 1 extra stat



< Message edited by CN2025 -- 9/7/2013 22:28:12 >
AQ DF AQW Epic  Post #: 19
9/8/2013 19:56:43   
goldslayer1
Member

there are non var rares that can be attained via credits, and promos come back around for credits the year after.
so its not forcing anyone to buy the next promo every time.
people seem to forget that all items would still be the same, just different stats depending on its rarity.

no single rare will have more stats than another rare.
so the equal-ness still applies, because rarity is not varium exclusive.

quote:

all rares will have more stats then regular items.

i guess you said it best.

regular items (average IMO would sound better)

not having any bonuses from rare items kinda defeats the purpose of getting such rare items, if their performance is going to be the same.
AQW Epic  Post #: 20
9/8/2013 20:32:37   
Mother1
Member

@ Goldslayer

People also collect rare for rarity score or did you forget that. You can also get the treasure hunter cheevo for getting a high enough rarity score, and even get on the all time rarity LB if you get a high enough rarity score you can't do that with regular items.

Now even if this idea went into play here are my issues with it.

1 It promotes pay to win since Rare promo's and higher are now varium exclusive (Every promo being made now is seasonal rare with the exception of phase promos) and Rare's offer more points then seasonal and limited rares

2 People will be forced to buy rare items and not use what they want since every rare item (Season- ultra rare) will give more stats and put anyone using non rare gear at a disadvantage. Omega is suppose to be about being able to use what you want not be forced to buy promo's or use a certain piece or pieces of gear to say competitive. That is so Delta and back not omega.

3 As I explained before this will be going against the buffing of rare's policy since in order to do this you will have to buff all rare items old and new. last I checked giving rare items extra stats for the chance of bring back some old players isn't a good reason to buff rare items. It will only cause balance issues down the line since it will be another form of enhancements if you use a full set of gear that is ultra rare, Rare Etc.

< Message edited by Mother1 -- 9/8/2013 20:33:57 >
Epic  Post #: 21
9/8/2013 21:02:24   
goldslayer1
Member

if you need more reasons as to why rarer items (compared to regular items) should have a little more power, here's 1 more.

X-600 Marauder: Regular (auxiliary)
Damage: 39
Stats: 15
Credit Price: 14,375
Varium Price: 835

Dage's Doom Cannon: Limited-Rare (Auxiliary)
Damage: 39
Stats: 15
Credit Price: 25,875
Varium price: 1070


Blaster: Regular (Sidearm)
Damage: 35
Stats: 18
Credit Price: 11,450
Varium price: 790

Egg Laser: Limited-Rare (sidearm)
Damage: 39
Stats: 15
Credit price: 23,450
Varium Price: 955

Epic Staff: Regular (Primary Staff)
Damage: 35
Stats: 20
Credit price: 11,750
Varium Price: 805

Titan's Terror: Limited-Rare (Primary Staff)
Damage: 35
Stats: 20
Credit price: 33,750
Varium price: 1,300

Arch Mage M: Regular (Tech Mage Armor)
Def/Res: 10
Stats: 18
Credit price: 12,200
Varium Price: 795

Warbot: Limited-Rare (Armor)
Def/Res: 10
Stats: 18
Credit price: 30,950
Varium price: 1280

do you see the huge difference in price despite the items being statistically the same? (none of these items have cores in them)
rarer items cost more than regular items.
i dont think prices are fair when the performance is the same.

@mother1
and rarity helps you in battles how?
the rarity boards were made for people who willingly collect hundreds of items (because thats what you need to get on there)
but how does having x20 of the same item help me in battle if i can only equip 1 at a time?

1) the only "Rare" promo im aware of after omega, is the Omega phase promo, all others will come back a year after the promo was released. thus letting players get the promos. it also pretty much makes the point for varium being a "time advantage" as some of you claimed here.

2) so those who buy rares should be put at a "disadvantage" as opposed to those without rares?
and if thats the case, then why is nearly everyone that has an azrael's will sidearm using it?

3) its not just for bringing older players back, its too also keep the veteran players who are currently here.
this also helps with people who buy rares as opposed to regular items. since mentioned above, items of higher rarity, cost more despite having the same performance as regular items.


also the rarity leaderboards are useless, and a waste of money.
just check out the current leader.
he has multiple copies of the same item for various items.

good luck getting in those LBs by getting single items.

< Message edited by goldslayer1 -- 9/8/2013 23:36:59 >
AQW Epic  Post #: 22
9/8/2013 21:30:01   
Mother1
Member

quote:

and rarity helps you in battles how?
the rarity boards were made for people who willingly collect hundreds of items (because thats what you need to get on there)
but how does having x20 of the same item help me in battle if i can only equip 1 at a time?


People care about rarity points last I checked. Otherwise they wouldn't spend money to get the items or farm for credits to get the items in the first place. Giving rare items more power then regular items as I said before supports power creep. Omega was made so everyone could use what they want without being disadvantaged (Stat wise) and this idea destroy's part of what omega was made to represent.

quote:

1) the only "Rare" promo im aware of after omega, is the Omega phase promo, all others will come back a year after the promo was released. thus letting players get the promos. it also pretty much makes the point for varium being a "time advantage" as some of you claimed here.


This idea would give more stats to rare and ultra rares then it would seasonal and limted rares. Which means it supports pay to win since non variums would be disadvantaged since they can't get rare items outside of seasonal and limited rares. The staff used to do prize codes to give away ultra rare stuff, but the whiners moaned and groaned about how unfair it was until the staff just said they would stop.

All in all paying players would have more power then free to play since Free to play can't get items above seasonal and limited rare.

quote:

2) so those who buy rares should be put at a "disadvantage" as opposed to those without rares?
and if thats the case, then why is nearly everyone that has an azrael's will sidearm using it?


I am not saying that. I am saying that those who buy rares should have a stat advantage over those who don't which is what this idea promotes. Omega was made to remove that, and this idea brings that back. Omega was made as I said before to make it so you could use any item you want, and you wouldn't be at a STAT! disadvantage.

Azreal's sidearm has a core to it, which doesn't offer extra stats, but a special one time use per duel effect. It is just that the effect is so useful, that most who have it wouldn't switch guns to use it.

quote:

3) its not just for bringing older players back, its too also keep the veteran players who are currently here.
this also helps with people who buy rares as opposed to regular items. since mentioned above, items of higher rarity, cost more despite having the same performance as regular items.


By supporting as I said before Power creep and pay to win even more. This will as I said before cause balance issue, force players to buy rares unless they want to be disadvantage (Stat wise) and make it so they can't use what they want without being at a stat disadvantage. If the staff wanted this they would have never made all items the same stat wise.

quote:

also the rarity leaderboards are useless, and a waste of money.
just check out the current leader.
he has multiple copies of the same item for various items.

good luck getting in those LBs by getting single items.


It is they players choice and as you can see many players choose to spend their money that way cause they want recognition We can't control what people do in game, however the staff can keep ideas that would give one group an unfair advantage over another in one form or another out of the game.

This idea promotes giving stat power to players with rare items, as opposed to those who don't get rares, and would put the group who doesn't get rare items at not only a core disadvantage but a stat disadvantage. It will destroy balance even worse and that isn't the way the game needs to go for the sake of a few older players.
Epic  Post #: 23
9/8/2013 22:07:01   
goldslayer1
Member

quote:

Omega was made so everyone could use what they want without being disadvantaged (Stat wise) and this idea destroy's part of what omega was made to represent.

pretty sure thats not entirely the reason why omega was made.

quote:

Which means it supports pay to win since non variums would be disadvantaged since they can't get rare items outside of seasonal and limited rares.


Bio Hazard Husk - Rare
Ebil Hazard Husk - Rare
Light Mechachillid - Rare
Medium Mechachillid - Rare

so you can see, there are non var rares.
and these are just armors (which have less quantities as opposed to weapons)
id be happy to list you primaries, sidearms, and auxiliaries that are also rare.

i think you mostly point out seasonals and limited because those are more common now in omega because its still somewhat new.
wait until theres more time for new events to come, and more rares will come.


quote:

Omega was made to remove that, and this idea brings that back.

i think you mean the non var to var power balance.

ill explain it again, this isn't to make variums have more power, this is to make rarer items have more power over regular ones.
rarity is not varium exclusive. so the point that it would be pay to win isn't such a good argument when this is about rare (in general) items, and not varium items.

quote:

This will as I said before cause balance issue, force players to buy rares unless they want to be disadvantage (Stat wise) and make it so they can't use what they want without being at a stat disadvantage. If the staff wanted this they would have never made all items the same stat wise.

Azrael's Will.
and as i explained before, a rare item compared to a rare item, is still the same stat wise.


quote:

It is they players choice and as you can see many players choose to spend their money that way cause they want recognition We can't control what people do in game, however the staff can keep ideas that would give one group an unfair advantage over another in one form or another out of the game.

War kills was another way players could get "recognition"
remember firewawa, dragonwawa, Mokta3?
those guys easily (from my estimation) spent upwards of $4000 on war kills.
where is their recognition now?

the point is, rarity boards are useless and a waste of money, just like the war kill boards.
they serve no purpose to your gameplay. (albeit, warkill did a little bit)

EDIT:
Actually let me retract something.
"Ultra Rare" is more of an ego boost, it is exactly the same as a "Rare".
so "Ultra Rare" and "Rare" are exactly the same.

quote:

Rare: These items are offered as exclusive items that will never be released again. Rare items are very valuable in that they can not be obtained at any point in the future.

quote:

Ultra Rare: These special items are offered for short periods of time, are extremely powerful, and contribute greatly to the overall rarity score of the player.

- http://epicduelwiki.com/w/Rarity





List of Ultra/Rare Non Var gear.
Includes Prize Code Rares, and offsite promos/offers.

Armors:
Bio Hazard Husk
Ebil Hazard Husk
Light Mechachillid
Medium Mechachillid

Auxiliaries:
Genesis
Revelations
Mecha Disintegrator
Mecha Launcher

Sidearms:
Alpha Blaster
Bounty Pistol
Mecha Cannon
Mecha Laser
Rabble's Attack Tome
Tuna Cannon

Primaries:
Swords
Alpha Blade
Artix's Triumph (technically not varium, can apply to non vars)
Azrael's Deathbringer
Azrael's Souleater
Banx0rz Blade
Charsketch Sword
Crystal Laser Sword
Dark Overfiend Blade
Death Flame Sword
Energy Rapier
Harvest Cleaver
Moose Bane E
Moose Bane P
Overfiend Blade
Rapier
Soul Harvester

Staffs
Alpha Staff
Energy Mecha Staff
Mecha Staff

Clubs
Alpha Maul
Energy Mecha Maul
Mecha Maul

Wrist Blades
Alpha Daggers
Energy Mecha Claws
Mecha Claws


all of these items are rare, and can be attained by non-varium players, saying that non-variums cant get rares isn't a good excuse.
you might not see many with them because well, they're rares.
and you may notice that most of these are recent (recent i mean by a year or 2) because it was only until recently when the devs started worrying about non-vars.



New suggested rarity boost.

Seasonal / Limited: +3% more Stats (Rounded up)
Ultra / Rare: 6% more Stats (Rounded up)

Rares, Limited, and Seasonals can be attained by variums and non variums alike. so this wouldn't be pay to win.
whether or not players (variums included) have rares is up to them.
but with time and dedication to the game, they will grow their inventories and fill them with rares.

< Message edited by goldslayer1 -- 9/8/2013 23:33:01 >
AQW Epic  Post #: 24
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