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6/14/2018 18:00:26   
NDB
Member

The following are my ideas for a better EpicDuel. Some suggestions may come off as being very specific. A few may be unrealistic/impossible at this time. But the idea is what counts.

Game Features

1. Leaderboard
  • All-time Experience leaderboard. We already have Rating, Influence, and Fame, so why not?

    2. Bot prevention
  • Mandatory battle captcha.
  • Random rearrangement of skill placement each battle to deter pre-determined auto mouse clicks.
  • Perhaps more full-time moderators.

    3. Changing class
  • Credit-only option to permanently unlock a class, similar to unlocking a hairstyle, for, say, 250000. Once a class is unlocked, players can “retrain” to that class for a small fee of, say, 1000 Credits.

    4. Skill Cores
  • Option to buy a permanently unlocked (reusable) version of a Skill Core for a high price (say, five times the Credit price or two times the Varium price) so that the core can be equipped to an unlimited number of weapons. Under the current model, cores are lost when replaced by a new skill core, making it unreasonably expensive to test new combinations. This will allow players to freely unequip and re-requip cores without having to pay unreasonable amounts of Credits/Varium each time to re-buy cores.
  • If the above is implemented, then skill cores locked to Rare weapons (e.g. Curse on Delta weapons) should automatically be permanently unlocked for the players who own them so that an option can finally be made to remove these cores from their original weapons without losing them forever.
  • If the above is implemented, then, for fun, a new category of Achievements can then be made for each Skill Core a player has unlocked. For example, a player who permanently unlocks the Frost Shards Skill Core will unlock the corresponding “Frost Shards” Achievement on their Skill Core Achievement page worth, say, 500 Rating. Rare cores, Varium-only cores, and Endless cores can be worth slightly more ratings.

    5. Legendary Ranks
  • Additional rewards for higher Ranking players. Currently, Legendary Ranks are beneficial for PvP up until Rank 80 and the last Legend-exclusive shop unlocks at a mere Rank 50. Moreover, Ranks diminish in their usefulness at high Ranks for all builds (a Strength build, for example, has little use Robot Damage and minimal use of Auxiliary Damage and Gun Damage so will only really benefit until Rank 50) whereas the Underdog bonus does not. (A Rank 50 is not more powerful than a Rank 200 player when fighting a Rank 1 player even though the Rank 1 player receives a far greater Underdog bonus when fighting a Rank 200 than the Rank 50.) To help solve some of these imbalances and to give high ranking players an incentive to continue ranking up, I propose a new Legendary shop. This shop will unlock at Rank 100 and sell a series of Armor Skill Cores granting stat bonuses, purchasable by Rank. For example:
    • Legend I (purchasable at Rank 100): +2 Str / +2 Dex / +2 Tech / +2 Supp (This is the same as Eternal Enhance.)
    • Legend II (purchasable at Rank 125): +2 Str / +3 Dex / +3 Tech / +2 Supp
    • Legend III (purchasable at Rank 150): +3 Str / +3 Dex / +3 Tech / +3 Supp
    • Legend IV (purchasable at Rank 175): +3 Str / +4 Dex / +4 Tech / +3 Supp
    • Legend V (purchasable at Rank 200): +4 Str / +4 Dex / +4 Tech / +4 Supp
    • Legend VI (purchasable at Rank 250): +4 Str / +5 Dex / +5 Tech / +4 Supp
    • Legend VII (purchasable at Rank 300): +5 Str / +5 Dex / +5 Tech / +5 Supp
    • Legend VIII (purchasable at Rank 350): +5 Str / +6 Dex / +6 Tech / +5 Supp
    • Legend IX (purchasable at Rank 425): +6 Str / +6 Dex / +6 Tech / +6 Supp
    • Legend X (purchasable at Rank 500): +6 Str / +7 Dex / +7 Tech / +6 Supp


    6. Achievements
  • Evolving Achievements for battle record based on the current “rank” system. Example scaling:
    • Rookie (1 wins): 50 Rating
    • Fighter (11 wins): 100 Rating
    • Soldier (51 wins): 200 Rating
    • Veteran (151 wins): 300 Rating
    • Warrior (301 wins): 400 Rating
    • Champion (1001 wins): 600 Rating
    • Hero (2001 wins): 800 Rating
    • Warlord (5001 wins): 1000 Rating
    • Commander (10001 wins): 1500 Rating
    • Emperor (25001 wins): 2500 Rating
    • Grand Emperor (50001 wins): 4000 Rating
    • Legend (100001 wins): 6000 Rating
    • Epic Legend (250001 wins): 8000 Rating
    • Eternal Legend (500001 wins): 10000 Rating
    • Demigod (1000001 wins): 15000 Rating

  • Increase cap for evolving War Achievements. Example scaling:
    • 750000 Influence (tier 13): 7500 Rating
    • 1000000 Influence (tier 14): 10000 Rating
    • 3500 Super Items Used (tier 11): 4000 Rating
    • 5000 Super Items Used (tier 12): 5000 Rating

  • Increase cap of Epic Stylist now that so many new hairstyles have been released. Example scaling:
    • Epic Stylist IV (unlock 100 hairstyles): 3000 Rating
    • Epic Stylist V (unlock 200 hairstyles): 5000 Rating

  • Non-evolving Achievement for capturing War flag. Perhaps 2000 Rating. Also, consider adding a count in Factions for their number of flag capturesss.
  • Non-evolving Achievement for bank space, similar to Epic Hoarder.

    7. Arcade Tokens(/War Prizes)
  • As per the massive Arcade Achievement tier increase last update, it makes sense to add a permanent free-player method of obtaining Arcade Tokens besides the occasional daily mission or the 3-week War rotation such as a 1-5% battle drop, which has been suggested previously by another player. This will serve to create an incentive to play during War Cooldown as well as gratification for players who wish a return of some sort of item battle drop system. It will also serve to make the Arcade Achievements more similar the War Achievements which, currently, represent, for the most part, time spent playing but reward less ratings.
  • Consider adding more Influence tiers to Wars that reward more Arcade Tokens and/or Credits. Alternatively, make the Arcade Token and/or Credit reward be a factor of a player's total Influence at the end of the War, such as 1 Token and 1000 Credits per 5,000 Influence gained. Alternatively yet, consider making new tiers of Arcade Tokens, e.g. "Silver" and "Gold" Arcade Tokens that guarantee a Silver or Gold prize when used, either as exclusive rewards for reaching very high Influence goals or placement on the Total Influence Leaderboard at the end of the War. As an example, the player who places first on the Total Influence Leaderboard could be rewarded one "Gold" Arcade Token; places 2-3, 3 "Silver" Arcade Tokens; places 4-10, 2 "Silver" Arcade Tokens; and places 11-20, 1 "Silver" Arcade Token.

    8. Bosses
  • Legendary Nightwraith boss! First non-mage Legendary boss. Similar to Titan; Legendary version will have the same skills and skill levels as the normal version with the exception of Reroute. The only difference will be buffed Health (20k), Energy (20k), and stats.

    Balance (Ideas to be tested)

    9. Class Skills

    Bounty Hunter
  • Smoke Screen: Increase scaling from 2 to 3 Dexterity points per level. Debuff skills are greatly underpowered at higher levels (but not necessarily at lower levels) due to diminishing returns.
  • Static Grenade: Lower the base number, but add player level scaling similar to other skills. This skill is overpowered in the lower levels but becomes underpowered at higher levels, even with high Support.
  • Reflex Boost: Re-implement some sort of Reroute buff, perhaps similar in mechanics to Blood Commander. The two classes that have it (Bounty Hunter and Blood Mage) are very limited in their control of Energy compared to other classes, which has rendered them the two weakest classes in PvP at least since the last balance change.
  • Massacre: Consider adding a 30% health gain to make it on part with Super Charge and Surgical Strike. Currently, the skill is not useful enough as purely a damage skill and is clearly underutilized by both hunter classes. If this change is made, Energy cost can be slightly increased if needed.
  • Venom Strike: Lower Poison damage by 20-30 at all levels; increase damage from 85% to 100%. Poison skills have the potential to be too powerful for their relatively small energy cost, both in the low levels and high levels. This will also counter the rise of Poison-based hunter builds should Static Grenade and Massacre be buffed.

    Tech Mage
  • Plasma Bolt: Increase Energy cost by 20 points; reduce base damage by 10 points. Since the last buff, this skill has become far too powerful relative to its Energy cost. Technology-based Tech Mage builds, particularly non-Focus types, are in need of nerfing, especially in the low levels.
  • Malfunction: Increase scaling from 2 to 3 Technology points. Debuff skills are greatly underpowered at higher levels (but not necessarily at lower levels) due to diminishing returns.
  • Battery Backup: To counter the changes to Static Grenade, Energy Parasite, and Assimilation, buff by, say, 10-20 Energy points.
  • Plasma Rain: Increase base damage by 11 damage and level scaling by 1 to be on par with Multi-Shot. To compensate for lower energy cost, add Staff requirement.
  • Assimilation: Slightly decrease the base number (say, by 10-20) and slightly lower the Strength scaling. Tech Mage Energy control is a tad much for all builds, even at lower levels where Assimilation outclasses the likes of Static Charge and Static Smash. At high levels, the Assimilation on Strength Tech Mages is obscene in its ability to drain more than Static Grenade and Static Smash while still inflicting damage. To make up, all Strength builds can be buffed using a different approach.
  • Fire Scythe: Lower scaling from 20 to 10 Energy points per level. The high base cost is justified because the skill is unblockable and turns Primary Damage into Physical type but the 20 Energy increase per level is not.

    Mercenary
  • Double Strike: Remove percentage-based damage bonus in favor of a consistent number. All percentage-based Strength skills (Massacre, Berzerker, Bludgeon) are in dire need of reworking as they are severely underpowered when playing in the low levels where Primary Weapon Damage contributes a disproportionately low amount of the total Primary Damage. Example scaling:
    • Level 1: 20 More Damage
    • Level 2: 30 More Damage
    • Level 3: 40 More Damage
    • Level 4: 50 More Damage
    • Level 5: 60 More Damage
    • Level 6: 70 More Damage
    • Level 7: 80 More Damage
    • Level 8: 90 More Damage
    • Level 9: 100 More Damage
    • Level 10: 110 More Damage

    With this scaling, the damage bonus at Level 40 will decrease (current = 42% at max = +147 Damage with +350 Primary), but will be far more balanced in the lower levels. To compensate for the lower damage, make the skill less redundant with other Strength skills, and buff Strength builds, it can be made unblockable and/or scale with Support.
  • Blood Commander: Decrease health gain factor from 75% to 65-70%. The health gain is far overpowered as a support build and/or when facing low defense builds.
  • Maul: It does not make sense for a skill to increase in Stun chance. This is inherently luck-based (no guaranteed benefit for a steep increase in Energy cost) and is flawed in that Stun chance can be decreased relative to opponent’s Support. A better idea is to swap the defense-ignoring aspect with the Stun chance. For example:
    • Level 1: 10% Defense Ignored, 25% chance to Stun
    • Level 2: 13% Defense Ignored, 25% chance to Stun
    • Level 3: 16% Defense Ignored, 25% chance to Stun
    • Level 4: 19% Defense Ignored, 25% chance to Stun
    • Level 5: 22% Defense Ignored, 25% chance to Stun
    • Level 6: 25% Defense Ignored, 25% chance to Stun
    • Level 7: 28% Defense Ignored, 25% chance to Stun
    • Level 8: 31% Defense Ignored, 25% chance to Stun
    • Level 9: 33% Defense Ignored, 25% chance to Stun
    • Level 10: 36% Defense Ignored, 25% chance to Stun

    This will make the skill similar to Cheap Shot, except with a 25% Stun rather than Critical chance. To make them more on par, the Energy cost of Maul can be changed from 100+20/Level (280 at Max) to 160+10/Level (250 at Max). To make the Mercenary class more interesting, the Defense Ignored can scale with Dexterity, say, +1% every 5 points. Mercenaries currently have no Dexterity-based skills and a disproportionate number of Strength skills.
  • Adrenaline Rush: Lower Energy cost by 20-30 at all levels.

    Cyber Hunter
  • EMP Grenade: Increase cooldown to 4 turns and/or increase Energy cost by 20 at all levels. It does not make sense to have both Energy control skills (Static Charge and EMP Grenade) have a 3 turn cooldown. Bringing the cooldown to 4 turns will make it easier for other classes to find opportunities to escape infinite drain loops in battle. Alternatively, the base Energy cost can be increased to 110 such that a single use of Static Charge with the Support of a 5-Focus build (typically, 58-9) or less will not grant enough energy to use both EMP Grenade and Field Medic, making it harder for Cyber Hunters to create infinite drain loops.
  • Malfunction: Increase scaling from 2 to 3 Technology points. Debuff skills are greatly underpowered at higher levels (but not necessarily at lower levels) due to diminishing returns.
  • Plasma Armor: Decrease Energy cost by 10 at all levels.
  • Venom Strike: Lower Poison damage by 20-30 at all levels; increase damage from 85% to 100%. Poison skills have the potential to be too powerful for their relatively small energy cost, both in the low levels and high levels. This will also counter the rise of Poison-based hunter builds should Static Grenade and Massacre be buffed.

    Blood Mage
  • Reflex Boost: Re-implement some sort of Reroute buff, perhaps similar in mechanics to Blood Commander. The two classes that have it (Bounty Hunter and Blood Mage) are very limited in their control of Energy compared to other classes, which has rendered them the two weakest classes in PvP at least since the last balance change.
  • Plasma Rain: Increase base damage by 11 damage and level scaling by 1 to be on par with Multi-Shot. To compensate for lower energy cost, add Staff requirement.
  • Energy Parasite: Remove percentage-based energy steal in favor of a consistent number. This will maintain the uniqueness of the skill while making it far more useful and reliable in PvP, although it will be controversial for NPC fights. For example:
    • Level 1: Drain 10 Energy, Gain 10 Energy
    • Level 2: Drain 20 Energy, Gain 20 Energy
    • Level 3: Drain 30 Energy, Gain 30 Energy
    • Level 4: Drain 40 Energy, Gain 40 Energy
    • Level 5: Drain 50 Energy, Gain 50 Energy
    • Level 6: Drain 60 Energy, Gain 60 Energy
    • Level 7: Drain 70 Energy, Gain 70 Energy
    • Level 8: Drain 80 Energy, Gain 80 Energy
    • Level 9: Drain 90 Energy, Gain 90 Energy
    • Level 10: Drain 100 Energy, Gain 100 Energy


    Tactical Mercenary
  • Double Strike: Remove percentage-based damage bonus in favor of a consistent number. All percentage-based Strength skills (Massacre, Berzerker, Bludgeon) are in dire need of reworking as they are severely underpowered when playing in the low levels where Primary Weapon Damage contributes a disproportionately low amount of the total Primary Damage. Example scaling:
    • Level 1: 20 More Damage
    • Level 2: 30 More Damage
    • Level 3: 40 More Damage
    • Level 4: 50 More Damage
    • Level 5: 60 More Damage
    • Level 6: 70 More Damage
    • Level 7: 80 More Damage
    • Level 8: 90 More Damage
    • Level 9: 100 More Damage
    • Level 10: 110 More Damage

    With this scaling, the damage bonus at Level 40 will decrease (current = 42% at max = +147 Damage with +350 Primary), but will be far more balanced in the lower levels. To compensate for the lower damage, make the skill less redundant with other Strength skills, and buff Strength builds, it can be made unblockable and/or scale with Support.
  • Frenzy: Consider making unblockable.
  • Mineral Armor: Decrease Energy cost by 10 at all levels.
  • Field Commander: Not an easy fix, but clearly needs a buff. A creative change could be to make it also grant ~15% Damage Reduction.
  • Battery Backup: To counter the changes to Static Grenade and Energy Parasite, buff by, say, 10-20 Energy points.
  • Atom Smasher: Lower Energy cost by 20 at all levels; perhaps increase drain percentage by, say, 5%. The Energy exchange of this skill is far underpowered, even at Level 1. When playing in the low levels, it is possible for the skill to drain less than its cost.
  • Toxic Grenade: Lower Poison damage by 20 at all levels. Poison skills have the potential to be too powerful for their relatively small energy cost, both in the low levels and high levels.

    10. Skill Cores

    Armor cores
  • Generator: Increase base to +100 Health/+100 Energy, but reduce Armor scaling from +20 to +10. This core is disproportionately weak at lower levels.
  • Piston Punch: Increase base to 100 Energy steal/+100 Energy, but reduce Armor scaling from +20 to +10. This core is disproportionately weak at lower levels.
  • Tranquility: Opposite of Generator in that it is far overpowered in the lower levels but not particularly good at higher levels. Should change to operate as a percent of current Rage points. The current formula for Rage points, according the EpicDuel Wiki is 400+25/Level, so a reasonable model would be ~40% of current Rage points. At full Rage, a Level 1 player would gain 170 Health; a Level 40 would gain 550. Compare this to a constant 500.
  • Armored Roots: Far underpowered versus the default opposition (Generator or Piston Punch). Buff to 50%; increase duration to 3 turns.
  • Chairman’s Fury: Why is an Armor core dealing 85% Primary damage? Change damage to 15%, like Piston Punch. Buff Rage steal to 100% to make it a more competitive choice versus Generator and Piston Punch.
  • Nanosteel Armor: Buff to, say, 12%.
  • Overshield: Buff to, say, 15%.

    Primary cores
  • Frost Shards/Frostbite: Reduce damage from 100% to 85%.
  • Energy Storm: Buff to 25%.
  • Curse: Reduce Energy cost to 100. Buff to, say, 40%.
  • Growth Serum: Reduce Energy cost to 100. Buff to, say, 40%.
  • Omega Override: Buff to, say, 35%.
  • Baby/Dark Yeti Charge: Buff to 20 points.

    Sidearm cores
  • Energy Shot: Buff to 25%.
  • Pacify: Currently, the way that Rage works, the core is often useless (i.e. the opponent gets Rage in the same amount of turns that they would of or, at most, only one turn later). Change this core to immediately reduce the opponents current Rage by, say, 50%.
  • Laser Sights: Buff to, say, 12%.

    Auxiliary cores
  • Concussive Shot: The random factor of this core is silly. Change to always put the target's highest skill into cooldown. If need be after this change, Energy cost can be slightly increased.
  • Salvage: Reduce Energy cost to, say, 90. There is no reason for this core to be as costly as it currently is.
  • Laser Sights: Buff to, say, 12%.

    Robot cores
  • Infernal Android: Decrease turn bonus to 3% each turn (increase base from 85% to 91% so that it is still usable on fourth turn); reduce max damage to 115%.
  • Assault Bot E/P: Buff to 85%. As a creative idea, could consider adding some sort of heal effect.
  • (Dark) Botanical Borg: Buff to 90% against two targets.
  • Baby/Dark Yeti (Warrior): Buff to 80% damage.
  • Omega/Pink/Golden (Baby/Dark)Yeti: Buff to 90% damage.
  • Blood Hawk: Consider reducing duration to 2 turns.
  • Pyro Fly: Consider changing to place the top three skills on cooldown rather than disabling one of them.
  • Azrael’s Borg: Buff to 85%; perhaps, even 100%.
  • Bio Borg: Change to reflect 50% all attacks. Reduce duration from 3 to 2 turns.
  • Ballistic/Electro Bunny Bot: Change to function on all attacks. Change duration to 1 turn.
  • (Dark) Botanical Hazard: Consider buffing, but make it a 1 time use. Bot is a serious issue with pure Technology based Tech Mages and Cyber Hunters. In order to buff pure Technology builds (all of which are clearly underpowered), a different approach should be taken (see below).

    11. Stats/Mechanics
  • Stun: Consider changing it to reduce target’s Rage by, say, 50% instead of forcing the target to skip a turn. Animation can still be the same.
  • Strength: Slightly increase scaling.
  • Weapon stats: As a creative idea, consider adding class-specific requirements to Smoke Screen, Mark of Blood, Malfunction, Bludgeon, Assimilation, Intimidate, Adrenaline Rush, and Frenzy--essentially all skills involving the Primary weapon except fundamental Energy gain moves (i.e. Static Smash, Static Charge, Energy Parasite). Currently, far too many builds are not reliant on class-specific weapons. Moreover, players are deterred from using builds involving skills that require class-specific weapons because they have lower stats. To make things interesting, the stats of Swords can be increased much further as compensation.
  • As a creative, but possibly extreme, idea, change Focus Bonus to increase the damage of all attacks by a small amount rather than control Robot damage such that it becomes independent of Technology. Then, buff the Technology scaling of Robot to be on par with Sidearm. This will make Technology builds far more viable without indirectly buffing Focus builds in the same way Dexterity builds become more viable after the Sidearm was moved to Dexterity. Moreover, it does not make sense that all stats improve by 1 point increment (each upgrade has an effect) whereas Focus is by every 5 points. To condense these ideas, here is a bullet point summary of the proposed change:

    • Focus no longer improves Robot Damage.
    • Technology scaling for Robot Damage and Robot item damage bonus now mirror Dexterity scaling for Sidearm Damage and Sidearm item damage bonus, respectively.
    • Focus bonus threshold begins at 35 Strength, Dexterity, Technology, and Support points instead of 25; Focus Level increases by every 1 point graduation in each stat instead of every 5 (max. level = 25, or 55 stat points).
    • Focus bonus = +2 Primary, Sidearm, Auxiliary, and Robot Damage per Focus Level (at Focus level 25, would be +50).


      < Message edited by NDB -- 6/28/2018 9:36:02 >
    • Epic  Post #: 1
    6/14/2018 19:52:18   
    Mother1
    Member

    		been a while since I seen you post here.

    Though a lot of these suggestions seem like they are suited for the balance section rather than the general.

    here are my thought on these respectively

    1)

    Would be great if we didn't have Bot wreaking the game. If bots were dealt with then by all means.

    2)

    a) they removed the captcha because bots found away around this. Until it is unpassable by bots all this would do is punish the legit players.
    b) If this happens White out needs a nerf in the form of a one turn warm up. Otherwise Whiteout would turn duels in guessing games if the person with it goes first. Last thing we need are even more luck based duels

    3)

    Is this to unlock all the classes permanently or just one? If it is one I could see it work seeing as it would be costly and make a person think before doing so. For all of them no seeing as that would be the equal of 5 class changes.

    5)

    I said this before and I will say it again. While interesting why not just make ranks not affect PVP battles but rather NPC battles? This was ranks won't be underpowered, and Underdog in the process won't be overpowered in some cases.

    Incentives for this could go as followed

    1) Increased sell back for items
    2) Decreased cost on items
    3) Increased drop rates on item
    4) Unlock new exclusive items when reaching a certain rank

    The ideas that can be put in while making ranks not affect balance are endless. Meaning that if a rank 100 went up against a rank 1 for example the power between them won't unbalanced and fights would be more far and skill based.

    6)

    I see and I support this one only issue I see with it though is with the current bot problem seeing as this would reward botters if that isn't taken care off.

    7)

    A new legendary character to fight? Interesting but how about we add a save state feature with this one as well?

    I mean these bosses are long drawn out battles that sometimes takes hours and with as it is now one connection loss can destroy hours of hard work for the player which isn't fair in the least especially if it isn't their fault. With this feature added it would ease the burden of legendary bosses especially if you disconnect.
    Epic  Post #: 2
    6/14/2018 20:21:31   
    NDB
    Member

    		Thanks for the feedback. For 2, I don't think captcha is a bad idea, even if some people find a way around it (plus, I'm sure there is a way to implement it so that people can't). I wouldn't exactly consider it a "punishment" for real players, even if it can be annoying. As for Whiteout, I agree that a 1 turn warm up would make perfect sense so you have a chance to see the skill order first. For 3: yes, I meant for 250000 credits for one class. I have just edited the wording to make more clear.
    Epic  Post #: 3
    6/14/2018 21:34:22   
    .Lord Ginger.
    Member

    		@NBD

    Hey, I think some of these are good ideas.

    I disagree with the ranks one because the people who already have their botted 200+ ranks will have an advantage that they didn't work for.

    I think energy manipulation is too great for massacre to be useful, unless STR is majorly buffed because massacre is severly underpowered without a blood hawk.

    I agree with increasing the debuffs because they're very underpowered as of now and shields completely overdo them.

    For poison, I don't particularly find poison CH difficult at a higher level at all, just mainly on TLM. I think poison for hunters should be better considering they have to use a class specific weapon. I would like to buff class specific weapon skills so we see more of these instead of swords (and staffs).

    I disagree with the chairman's fury change as I believe it should deal 100% damage like it did in the past so it works with str builds.

    I would like a static charge 100% damage buff so strength cyber can be useful again, and make it unrageable and unblockable like before.

    For energy parasite, I'm not sure about that 100 energy drain/gain. Because when your opponent is still at 0 energy, I'd hope that BM can still get energy? Or it can still get wrecked by a tech cyber or TM


    Personally, I'd like to see the IA back as it used to be and just buff the other bots.

    My idea for the botanical hazard is making it stronger per focus level (besides the already focus bonus) so it can be useful as other focus builds, but yes tech TM and tech CH can be a problem for sure.

    What do you think about increasing battle speed? I feel like battles last way to long and rely too much on energy manipulation which can waste like 4 turns during a battle.


    Gun scaling is pretty awful and I'd hate for robot scaling to have that monstrosity

    I appreciate this post and I hope that NW can help us get a better balance because I feel like balance is the most important thing

    @Mother1

    I wish ranks were back to what they were before because honestly NPC battles are worthless for any high rank player.

    Underdog mode should be erased in my opinion because of how unnecessary it is.

    < Message edited by .Lord Ginger. -- 6/14/2018 22:32:08 >
    AQW Epic  Post #: 4
    6/14/2018 21:47:19   
    Greed Redemption
    Member

    		Maybe if the devs come back some of these can be implemented!
    What I'd like to see is the war cooldown time be lowered if possible

    < Message edited by Greed Redemption -- 6/14/2018 22:20:40 >
    Epic  Post #: 5
    6/14/2018 22:58:26   
    Mother1
    Member

    		Here is another suggestion that I have been spitting for the longest both here and on twitter so I will say it once again.

    ADD INFLUENCE BACK TO BATTLES AND NOT MAKE IT SURE A WAR ITEM THING DURING WARS LIKE IT WAS BEFORE ALL THE RECYCLED WARS. ALSO MAKE THE INFLUENCE ALSO GO TOWARDS THE CHEEVO OF THE AREA YOU ARE IN!

    Example

    If I win a battle in let's say frysteland the influence I would gain would be added to that cheevo. If I won in the wasteland it goes towards that cheevo and so forth.

    This would make player more active not only in factions, but during cooldowns, not to mention it would nerf the pay to win aspect of War hero during wars, and make it so world domination could be gained all the time by factions like it used to be before these recycled wars made it only a war thing.
    Epic  Post #: 6
    6/15/2018 14:15:58   
    Satafou
    Member

    		First of all NDB thank you for this post, a lot of thought and effort has been made here and kudos to you for that.

    For the most part I strongly agree and support the majority of changes presented in particular the emp and poison changes provided which seem like good numbers for balance.

    Although with TM bolt does not need nerfed, I completely understand your perspective for believing so, however the matter at hand here isn't that bolt is too strong but rather it's the fact other caster skills (fireball etc.) are far too weak and are in need of a buff. Likewise with assimilation, with low str builds the numbers are fine, but yes the scaling should be reduced.

    As a whole this is a very productive post by the OP and many of these changes should have been made several years ago (buy a class perma for a higher price, win achievements, skill cores for all items).

    I would also like to add an additional suggestion for the rework of the pyro bot. Personally for PVP this bot is either useless or beyond busted. A player using this bot purely depends on luck of disabling the skill they want and as a result there is no skill or tactical thought present with the use of pyro bot. My recommendation to rework this bot in a more balanced way is for pyro bot to be allowed to choose the skill to be disabled (ANY skill not just the 3 highest level, with the exception of heal) and in return instead of the skill being disabled for the entire battle it will be disabled for 8 rounds (this number can be changed, just what I think would be optimal to keep it balanced but not useless). This change would allow the player who gets their skill disabled to play around losing that skill for 8 or so rounds instead of having an instant lose if battery, static change etc are diabled for the entire battle, whilst the caster of the pyro bot would be using some strategic method whereby they decide what skill is most effectively disabled.

    If the devs are indeed reading this upon deciding what to do for their "possible balance update" I suggest that you take what the OP has stated into consideration as well as my suggested changes to pyro bot.

    < Message edited by Satafou -- 6/15/2018 14:17:19 >
    Post #: 7
    6/16/2018 2:12:05   
    Legendary Ash
    Member

    		I think variants of skills should have similar scaling for balance consistency with changes below:

    Malfunction scales faster a low levels, but slow at high levels making the power gain per +20 Energy cost each level inconsistent, lowering incentive to have it at Level 9 and 10.
    Smoke Screen has an even distribution scheme that makes power gain per +20 cost each level consistent, players would not be predisposed to not invest at a certain level.
    I think that either Malfunction's +1 Pt every 4 stat or Smoke Screen's +1 Pt every 5 stat should be chosen to be applied to the other skill for skill homogenization based on an evaluation of expected build spread values to produce a balanced environment.

    Venom Strike should not have any changes, its intended to be focused on flat damage ignoring armor, increasing weapon damage doesn't do it any good since a moderate skill damage and armor build is sufficient to reduce the damage to the damage floor of 30.
    The Poison needs to be stronger than a moderate build's skill damage to give it a minor incentive to invest some points in said skill to counter the bad scenario of your opponent having less armor rendering the skill ineffective.
    It is important to make players consider using class-unique skills as per the theme of the class especially when normal damage skills are the norm and is the majority in the six class skills trees combined.

    Energy Shield and Defense Matrix should be homogenized to remove the difference in benefits/detriments at early/late player stat investment levels that makes an impact on how classes stand up against another.
    Blood Shield needs to have a more balanced share of stat scaling to base resistance similar to Energy Shield and Defense Matrix, currently its almost a perfect complement to low support and high armor build for the class. I recommend a reduction in health cost for lowered duration due to the timing of a rage gain and rage attack against armor boost skills, extended armor duration skills end up being inefficient as in practice skills are not used against it in every turn of the duration due to warmups, cool downs and weapon/gun/aux/robot cycling.

    Static Grenade needs to adopt Assimilation's 1 Energy Pt for 1 Stat in return for lowered base Energy Pts to remove benefits/detriments to at early/late player stat investment levels that makes an impact on how classes stand up against another.

    EMP Grenade compared to other Energy skills has a very strong 1 Energy Pt per .45 Stat scaling which gives a Cyber Hunter more than enough of an incentive to invest more Tech stat to drain the entire Energy bar of an opponent with a slight investment in Energy Pts, it needs to be toned down possibly 1 Energy Pt per 1 Stat in return for an increase in base Energy Pts.

    Cheap Shot's 3% Ignore/10 Energy 2 turn cool down whose 25% crit *30% on crit ignore averages +7.5% Ignore compared to Fire Scythe's 3% Ignore/20 Energy 3 turn cool down is far too efficient for using a class weapon which is only 10 damage and 5 stat less than Swords, I recommend increasing Cheap Shot's base cost by +10 Energy with a standard +20 Energy per level cost and decreasing Scythe's cool down to 2 as the damage of both skills for a moderate build are on par with other energy cost equivalent skills with 2 turn cool downs.

    From a revised Cheap Shot in the previous paragraph, Level 4 22% +7.5% crit Ignore for 160 Energy corresponds to Maul's 25% Stun chance and 10% Ignore, Maul's 10% Ignore is valued at 1% Stun chance based on the difference between Level 1 and 6, a doubled energy cost in which Stun% should double if not for 10% Ignore. The conversion factor of Stun chance to Ignore% is 29.5/26.
    Suppose Maul retains a decent margin over Plasma/Stun Grenade and Overload's Stun chance, and adopts a moderate amount of Ignore from Cheap Shot. By lowering base Stun chance of Maul by 8%, we add 9.08% additional base Ignore to it.

    I agree that Focus should be removed from determining Robot damage and replace with a general buff that has diminishing returns thats based on what the player gets back for not investing in Defense/Resistance.

    I think Pyro Fly should be able to reuse its Lock skill to make another attempt at switching to disable another skill instead if the user doesn't like what was randomly disabled on the previous attempt, making it selectable to which skill is desired is too effective and affecting skill cool downs that are mostly 2 to 3 turns is worth less that a permanent disable as robots have 4 turn cool down.
    AQ  Post #: 8
    6/16/2018 7:01:55   
    Cataleptic
    Member

    		Changes that I think should happen:

    Leaderboards:
    There are too many unnecessary leaderboards, that should be removed. Rarity, code, rating, etc should be removed. I see no point in having them and it slanders what a leader should be, which is you don't need to have money to be a leader, and that's what having those type of leaderboard implies.

    Robots:
    There are immense bots in the game that aren't used because they are too weak to be used or they don't work well with the build, so they should receive a buff.

    Assault bot for example; players do not use it because it is useless. Its secondary skill is useless for any build that could be used and its attack isn't even that high, even if its scaled to have the same damage as other bots like infernal android. Bots like this, with weak secondary skills, needs buffing so players can be versatile with their builds by using a wide range of other bots, not the same ones.

    Sidenote: Pyro should stay that way that it is. Pyro may be too overpowered while going up against a player, but it is also useful in going up again the legendary NPCs that implanted into the game. They've become a lot easier to defeat because of bots like pyro.

    Legendary points:
    They should either be removed and make the level cap 40 or have the ranks deduced. the ranks should be reverted back to 60, as it once was. Resistance, defense, gun, aux, bot, primary, is all that was needed with legendary points.

    If neither is to happen, then the amount of XP required to gain those ranks should be deduced, as it was done with levels. Players could level up easy because of how immense the influences were deduced, and not only that, they also gained credits every time they ranked, so it should be the same way for ranks.


    Botters:
    There have been countless botters in the game, who used programs to bot for higher ranks and legendary ranks. Their wins shouldn't count towards the leaderboards and gain a rank, that disparages the players who got those wins by working out and making it on the leaderboards. It truly isn't fair to them.

    Also, botters should receive a ban since bottling is against the rules. And captcha should be permanently brought back so this can't happen.

    Mods:
    Present mods in the game have been useless towards the players that need actual help. They've been corrupt and only deal with conflicts that are of interest to them, which isn't fair to the players who play the game and have been muted or banned because of these mods.

    skill:
    Static charge, fireball, the mark of blood, parasite, etc need a buff. Since energy consumption is what ends up deciding who wins most of the time.

    Static charge and parasite need to be taken a good look at so it receives the same advantages as other classes. Fireball should be able to be used with a sword and a staff like fire scythe.


    Buy-back shop
    I would also like for the game to have a buy-back shop, which is a shop that you can buy items you previously sold by accident. Help team sometimes helps out but they sometimes don't realize how far they got their heads shove up their...


    < Message edited by Cataleptic -- 6/16/2018 14:46:41 >
    Post #: 9
    6/16/2018 9:40:05   
    .Lord Ginger.
    Member

    		^ I hope you know that the ranks were never at 50, they were at 60.

    Primary, Sidearm, Aux, Def, Res, and Robot.

    Yes for other robot buffs! I wan't to use other robots!

    Ash, I can't even begin to respond to your suggestion because of how many of them I think would break the game further.
    AQW Epic  Post #: 10
    6/16/2018 9:49:49   
    Cataleptic
    Member

    		^If you're going to correct me then you shouldn't hope it, since it already implies I didn't. I did know though. It was autocorrect that had me write it by accident.
    Post #: 11
    6/16/2018 10:19:25   
    NDB
    Member

    		Okay, I have read some of the feedback. Here is what I think:

    @ .Lord Ginger.
  • Venom Strike is already more powerful than Toxic Grenade because of the class-specific requirement (10 more damage, 10 less Energy Cost). But if we are to nerf Toxic Grenade, it only makes sense to also nerf Venom Strike which, in my opinion, needs a slight nerf anyway. As it is, it simply too powerful when used correctly. I agree that poison-support Cyber Hunters are not amazing, but that buffing Venom Strike, which is already very powerful, just isn't the solution.
  • Changing Chairman's Fury to 100% Damage is okay. I just thought that it's a bit strange for an Armor core to function like a Primary core.
  • For the sake of buffing Strength builds, improving the damage aspect of Static Charge is not a bad idea. I was also thinking that we could consider reworking it to be a percentage of the average of the entire Primary damage, not just the weapon bonus but decreasing the percentage by, say 15%. This would also give the Primary bonus from Legendary Ranks some additional perks. With this scaling, then:
    • A Level 40 who does not train on Strength and has 30 Support (base Support plus stat modifier) would gain 392 (Wrist Blade) or 402 (Sword) * 51% = 199 or 205 Energy.
      Compare to the current 350 (Wrist Blade) or 360 (Sword) * 66% = 231 or 237 Energy.
    • A Level 40 with 45 Strength and 55 Support (basically, a standard 5-Focus build) would gain 449 (Wrist Blade) or 459 (Sword) * 56% = 251 or 257 Energy.
      Compare to the current 350 (Wrist Blade) or 360 (Sword) * 71% = 248 or 255 Energy.
    • A Level 40 with 125 Strength and does not train on Support would gain 587 (Wrist Blade) or 597(Sword) * 48% = 281 or 286 Energy.
      Compare to the current 350 (Wrist Blade) or 360 (Sword) * 63% = 220 or 226 Energy.

      The low levels would be minimally affected by this change (although I think it should actually be buffed for low level players...):
    • A Level 20 who does not train on Strength and has 25 Support (base Support plus stat modifier) would gain 272 (Wrist Blade) or 282 (Sword) * 50% = 136 or 141 Energy.
      Compare to the current 220 (Wrist Blade) or 230 (Sword) * 65% = 143 or 149 Energy.
    • A Level 20 with 35 Strength and 40 Support (basically, a standard 5-Focus build) would gain 297 (Wrist Blade) or 307 (Sword) * 53% = 157 or 162 Energy.
      Compare to the current 220 (Wrist Blade) or 230 (Sword) * 68% = 149 or 156 Energy.

  • For Energy Parasite, we could consider letting it give the full Energy regardless of the drain. But I'm not sure that that's necessary. From what I have proposed, the skill would already be pretty good as it is. It will be nearly on par with Static Smash, except it would still have a three turn cooldown and do 85% Damage.
  • Infernal Android should not be buffed back to the way it used to be. Buffing all other bots to be on par with it would be far more difficult than just slightly nerfing Infernal Android.
  • Having Robot scale like Sidearm would actually be a massive buff for pure-Technology builds which currently have no real attacks besides skills or Botanical Hazard. Focus would have a weaker Robot, true, but the entire build would no longer have to be dependent on Technology/Robot anyway. Strength, Dexterity, and Support focus builds would all be viable if Focus was made to buff all attacks by a small amount instead of just Robot.

    @Satafou
  • Actually, on the contrary, most caster skills are quite powerful at max. Plasma Cannon, Bunker Buster, the three multi skills, and even the grenades are all powerful enough with the appropriate build. Fireball is no different, except for the fact that Strength builds, in general, are dead. The problem with Plasma Bolt, especially in the low levels, is that it is so strong that players actually benefit more by not leveling it up (keeping it between level 1 and 3).
  • Your Pyro Fly idea could work, but I still think it should be limited to the top three skills. Otherwise, most people would just go for the Field Medic.

    @Legendary Ash
  • Increasing Venom Strike's damage to 100% was just meant to be a small tweak, not a big problem-solving buff. It helps to make it different from Toxic Grenade and opens the door for more creative strategies to use it, especially with Strength builds. And no, it will not always deal 30 Damage. I do feel that the damage needs to be slightly lowered. Even two turns at max is a minimum of 310 damage which, against someone with reasonably high defenses, is already quite good for the Energy Cost.
  • Making Static Grenade scale like that would make it even more broken than it was before the last update, so no.
  • I disagree with lowering the duration of Blood Shield, simply because it is part of what makes the skill unique over other shields. I do think that the skill could use some revising, but I haven't thought of anything yet.
  • Fire Scythe is unblockable and changes your attack in Physical damage. It could have its Energy scaling lowered from 20 to 10, but I really don't think Cheap Shot needs to be nerfed at all. Remember, the goal of balance changes isn't to balance the skills themselves, but the classes.
  • For Maul, I still think that having it improve stun chance with each level is still a broken idea, no matter how you change it.
  • For Pyro Fly, the whole point right now is that it is too much of a hit or miss. Get the skill you want, and you basically guarantee a win. If you get a useless skill, then you just made it harder for yourself to win. Because of this, it is better for the entire effect to be reworked; allowing you to use the special more than once, would just make it overpowered.

    @Cataleptic
  • The purpose of leaderboards is to create a competitive spirit. I don't get why the players have to be actual "leaders". While I agree that codes and rarity are a bit silly, there is no real reason to remove them.
  • I disagree that Pyro Fly doesn't need a change. It really does. I know for a fact that it is not possible to beat Legendary Titan and Legendary Dage without removing their Bludgeon, but there's an easy fix if Pyro Fly gets changed: just remove Bludgeon from both altogether.
  • No, Legendary Ranks should not be removed from the game. No, it should not cap at 50 because there are hundreds of players who have already surpassed that; if anything, we need more content past Rank 100. I don't think lowering the XP scaling is necessary at this time.
  • Obviously botters are bad for the game. Obviously they need to be banned. The whole point is that we are struggling to find a solution. Please see Twitter conversion @Nightwraith, if you haven't already, to see why this is so difficult.

    < Message edited by NDB -- 6/16/2018 10:33:19 >
    • Epic  Post #: 12
    6/16/2018 10:43:37   
    Cataleptic
    Member

    		Leaderboard:
    The purpose of leaderboards is to see who is ranked what and where. You don't need a leaderboard to be competitive. You've also misinterpreted what I said about leaders. I'm not saying you have to actually be a leader to be a leader, only that it shouldn't taken money for you to be up there.

    Pyro
    Remove their skill to make them easier to beat? Why call them legendary if they'll be nerfed in that way. If you want to nerf the bot then you should make it choose from all activate skills and not the top 3 skills with the most points added on to.

    Bosses:
    I like the idea of fighting legendary bosses, but the skill isn't the problem as much as it is the build. All the legendary bosses are strength which is highly unoriginal and boring. The bosses should be versatile. There should be one with high defense, high resistance, high support damage, etc. You understand my point.

    Legendary ranks:
    The legendary ranks should be capped somewhere to keep a continuation of balance in the game. How long do you think it'll take a new player to rank up in the game, especially when the XP is nearly 10k and the amount you would get from a battle is incredible low, also when the game is nearly dead because of how bad the balance is.

    Botters:
    Here is an advice: It's harder to recover a character than to keep it. I believe one of the reasons for using captcha before was to keep things like this from happening, so why remove it? You're trying to find a solution but you won't give the one presented to you? It doesn't look like you want to solve it as much as you want to take a blind eye for it.

    < Message edited by Cataleptic -- 6/16/2018 10:53:32 >
    Post #: 13
    6/16/2018 11:14:30   
    NDB
    Member

    quote:

    Remove their skill to make them easier to beat? Why call them legendary if they'll be nerfed in that way.


    Currently, Legendary Titan and Dage are impossible to beat without taking away their Bludgeon. That is, if you were to beat them, you would need to use Pyro Fly to take away the Bludgeon anyway. There is simply no other way.Thus, if Pyro Fly were to be changed, then taking away the Bludgeon altogether would be a logical fix to make them possible to beat. It wouldn't make them significantly easier.

    quote:

    Here is an advice: It's harder to recover a character than to keep it. I believe one of the reasons for using captcha before was to keep things like this from happening, so why remove it? You're trying to find a solution but you won't give the one presented to you? It doesn't look like you want to solve it as much as you want to take a blind eye for it.

    For God's sake, why would I of all people turn a blind eye to botting? I single-handedly created the Bot Exposing YouTube Channel that spurred this anti-botting movement in the first place. I have supported re-adding Battle Catcha since day one. The problem is that it would be difficult to implement in an effective way, so we need to think about other solutions. Here is what Nightwraith had to say about it:

    quote:

    Players created a bot that could defeat our original captcha which was prone to freezing and locking people out of battle. That said I think your suggestions would help, but I have no idea how to implement it.



    < Message edited by NDB -- 6/16/2018 11:26:44 >
    Epic  Post #: 14
    6/16/2018 11:30:35   
      Battle Elf
    has ten 1v1 wins


    		 There is a battle captcha system, but iirc it's pretty fine tuned so it'll only appear for accounts suspected of being bots.

    Also, the ED Sug forum was disabled after the announcement that development on ED was being cut, but I think it's been long enough now to reopen it. I'll get it back up soon.

    < Message edited by Battle Elf -- 6/16/2018 11:34:49 >
    AQW Epic  Post #: 15
    6/16/2018 11:32:21   
    Cataleptic
    Member

    		That is why legendary bosses were made, so they would be hard to beat, but not impossible. A player beat M4TR1X at lvl 35, without using pyro bot. Again, hard but not impossible.


    quote:

    Currently, Legendary Titan and Dage are impossible to beat without taking away their Bludgeon. That is, if you were to beat them, you would need to use Pyro Fly to take away the Bludgeon anyway.


    Exactly! For this reason pyro shouldn't be changed.


    You were taking adhinderence to the solution that was provided to you, so it would seem like you were taking a blind eye for the time being.

    I wasn't aware that you came up with it as well before, nor did I know Nightwraith tweeted something about it. I wasn't aware that you had a youtube channel exposing bitters, but you weren't the only person that've done it.

    And I like your idea of the skills being arbitrary placed so players can't predetermine it.

    < Message edited by Cataleptic -- 6/16/2018 14:48:20 >
    Post #: 16
    6/16/2018 11:44:21   
    NDB
    Member

    		@Cataleptic

    I will try to explain this one last time from start to finish. Many of us agree that Pyro Fly is broken in PvP and that the entire skill effect should be revised. Should Pyro Fly be changed, however, Legendary Titan and Dage would be impossible to beat because the only way to beat them now is to take away the Bludgeon. (And when I say "impossible", that is precisely what I mean.) Therefore, should Pyro Fly be changed, the simplest solution would be to take away their Bludgeon altogether to keep them possible to beat. This would not significantly change their difficulty level. From my perspective, your responses have simply not aligned with what I have written. Please read again carefully.

    Also, I mentioned Twitter and Nightwraith in my first response to you. Had you actually checked, you would be aware that the skill rearranging idea was also shot down by Nightwraith for the same reason -- that it would be challenging to implement it.

    < Message edited by NDB -- 6/16/2018 11:46:45 >
    Epic  Post #: 17
    6/16/2018 12:01:07   
    Cataleptic
    Member

    		I understand what you said and I don't agree with you. And I don't need you to constantly repeat yourself. It's quite exasperating. The bots effect should still remain the same, but perhaps the effective should be as satafou said, or it could take out any active skill the player has so it can minimize the chances of it being the skill the player would want it to take.

    You mentioned that Nightwraith made a tweet regarding this. I didn't know that he did since I do not currently follow him. Nightwraith isn't a priority to me and so whether I look it up it not doesn't matter that much to me.

    The developers forsaken the game for another so not a lot of people are going to know he made a tweet regarding this.
    Post #: 18
    6/16/2018 12:09:04   
    NDB
    Member

    		I don't get it. What do you not agree with? First you say that Pyro Fly shouldn't be changed at all. Now you say that it should. All I was mentioning was that, should the specific way that Pyro Fly be changed makes it so Legendary Titan and Dage are impossible to beat, there needs to be a solution for that.

    quote:

    The developers forsaken the game for another so not a lot of people are going to know he made a tweet regarding this.

    This couldn't be more wrong. He is making a return to the game. He will update it next week with arcades, achievements, and possible balance changes. This is why I made this forum thread in the first place. He was responding to suggestions by players on Twitter, including anti-botting measures, which is when he tweeted about it.

    < Message edited by NDB -- 6/16/2018 12:14:02 >
    Epic  Post #: 19
    6/16/2018 12:15:36   
    Cataleptic
    Member

    		I said it shouldn't be changed because it's fine the way it is. If it were to be changed, since you want it changed, then I would want it as the way satafou suggested or what I said. What do you not get?


    quote:



    This couldn't be more wrong. He is making a return to the game. He will update it next week with arcades, achievements, and possible balance changes.


    This is the only reason I came on this form. Because he made a tweet saying that. That's the only tweet I've seen on his Twitter and not the other ones he's possibly said. As I said, I don't follow him and checking up on him daily isn't my priority.

    < Message edited by Cataleptic -- 6/16/2018 12:17:07 >
    Post #: 20
    6/16/2018 12:22:58   
    NDB
    Member

    		I don't have anything wrong with you not wanting to change Pyro Fly. I respect that opinion. The one part I don't get is why you thought taking Bludgeon away from Legendary Titan and Dage would be a horrible solution if Pyro Fly were to be changed in a way that made them impossible to beat.

    I think we had some misunderstandings about what either of us knew and didn't know regarding Twitter. Hopefully we are good now and can get back on track to discussing other things.
    Epic  Post #: 21
    6/16/2018 12:32:11   
    Cataleptic
    Member

    		You want pyro flys secondary effect changed if LGD Titan and Dage bludgeon were to be taken away. I don't mind their skill being taken away. I like pyros effect, and I don't want the LGD bosses for the reason its being taken away. I dont mind the skill being nerfed in the way Satafou and I proposed, I just dont want it to be a whole other skill that is being implanted.

    < Message edited by Cataleptic -- 6/16/2018 12:35:44 >
    Post #: 22
    6/16/2018 12:37:35   
    NDB
    Member

    quote:

    You want pyro flys secondary effect changed if LGD Titan and Dage bludgeon were to be taken away.

    quote:

    I like pyros effect, and I don't want the LGD bosses for the reason its being taken away.

    That's not what I want. That's why I kept repeating myself, because I don't think you really understand what I was trying to say. I am not saying that we should change Pyro Fly because of the bosses. I want to change Pyro Fly because of PvP. However, a nerf life Satafou suggested would make it impossible to beat Legendary Titan and Dage.
    Epic  Post #: 23
    6/16/2018 12:50:37   
    Cataleptic
    Member

    		Did you read my sidenote on my first post regarding this? I've said it is too powerful but it is useful going against bosses like LGD Titan and Dage. The skill should be nerfed in some way but neither of us can settle on what would be the best way to do it. You want it changed due to pvp and I don't want it changed at all.


    What if the LGD bosses bludgeon were taken away but have pyro nerfed as Satafou and I suggested? If bludgeon is the reason players can't defeat them, then permanently take it away.

    Make pyro new effect to neutralize a persons skill for the next 8 rounds or minimize the damage it could do on the enemy by disabling one active skill the enemy has. I think that's fair at the very least.

    < Message edited by Cataleptic -- 6/16/2018 12:52:54 >
    Post #: 24
    6/16/2018 12:58:52   
    NDB
    Member

    quote:

    What if the LGD bosses bludgeon were taken away but have pyro nerfed as Satafou and I suggested? If bludgeon is the reason players can't defeat them, then permanently take it away.


    That's EXACTLY what I was saying! Finally, you understand! Now can we stop arguing?
    Epic  Post #: 25
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