What is the Problem!?!? (Full Version)

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Shadow Jester -> What is the Problem!?!? (2/3/2012 8:29:34)

Soooo I been gone for a long time. I've been reading the forums due to Buffy being banned. I been seeing stupid threads. Getting locked and all that.
I've been noticing problems.
People are still complaining.
quote:


This behavior here in the ED GD is just a reflection on the negative feelings caused by the game.There are several things wrong with this game that causes players to leave it feeling unhappy and even ripped off which eventually leads them to quitting.
#1 Pay-to-win
This happens way too much. If the other side doesn't even have a chance there is no point of the competition in the first place.
#2 Nature of Pvp
This one is obvious. When doing actual pvp's there is only one side that wins and one side must always lose.
Although there are certain things to make a lose or win more deserving such as removing or reducing the effects/chance of weapon specials.
#3 Not worth the money
As you know, weapons get outdated just like that. Also, you spend a bunch of money on enhancements just to compete. Its gone just like that. They need to reduce enhancements and make more ways to spend varium.

Seriously. I thought the community was better without me. I was a terrible person. I guess Mir is not trolling anymore.
PVP games are very unbalanced. I'm not comparing the whole game to WoW ,but only its PVP
They have more classes than ED.
One of the classes and one hit ko another one. Their PVP is so unbalanced. Coming from a WoW player who plays at the max level. Only the level bracket that is balanced is at the level 85.
ED's problem is that its Pay to win. Since I got my items back on my first account I've been playing CH and noticing some problems. I was using a high Dex build and I was vs a BH with less Dex than me and more STR. The BH was blocking the whole time. He was always Deflecting too. I thought it was strange. I left the game around the Arrival of Delta.
What are your thoughts about the this. Should the Devs TAKE more time BALANCING THE CLASSES or keep doing what they are doing. Adding more weapons. More levels. More features.



xxmirxx -> RE: What is the Problem!?!? (2/3/2012 8:44:38)

quote:

Seriously. I thought the community was better without me. I was a terrible person.
I wouldn't say bad person you shouldn't feel that way.
quote:

ED's problem is that its Pay to win.
On ED point view they need cash to run game sure pay to win but surely you can do npc. Shadow Jester you shouldn't EVER FEEL LIKE YOUR BAD PERSON BECAUSE YOUR NOT. Sorry for caps



Shadow Jester -> RE: What is the Problem!?!? (2/3/2012 8:53:43)

Well that doesn't mean that unskilled level 34 players with varium should beat a level 34 non varium player with skill!
Well it seems like people enjoy. ignoring my posts.



Stabilis -> RE: What is the Problem!?!? (2/3/2012 12:48:07)

^ I'm actually surprised more people are currently not banned... I would say the forum and game management is being somewhat modest.



Remorse -> RE: What is the Problem!?!? (2/3/2012 13:21:18)

@Sageofpeace

I think you are right!


Perhaps the reason the froum community has become so baddly behavied IS because they feel they have nothing left to resort too!
They are making players throw out their last cards. When players have said everything they possibly can "constrctively" yet the problem is not even looked at nor even reconised as something they should possibly look at, that is when players resort to bad behaviour.


Solution!:

Keep players up to date of all the small detail.

For instance you dont have to say your solving problem when your not because that just makes people impatient, BUT you could just tell us that you RECONISE it as a problem, THATS IT!
Thats all you have to do and players wont feel left in the dark/neglected!





The Game -> RE: What is the Problem!?!? (2/3/2012 14:24:16)

I had to remove several posts from this thread. Please stay on topic and remember that discussion of banned members is not allowed.



Lord Nub -> RE: What is the Problem!?!? (2/3/2012 14:37:47)

The answer to the OP's comment is simply to lower the minimum percentages.

How many people get ticked off from getting blocked by low dex so often?

Minimum block chance should be lowered to 0%

Crits 0%

Deflects 0%

Rage more support based, faster/slower based on support.

My biggest issue is the block chance, makes no sense for it to be at 4%. A block is a HUGE gamebreaker and only upsets players and makes them want to quit playing the game. Maybe add crush damage or something but for players to be blocking at a 4% rate when they have no dex and games being decided ultimately on luck is not fun.

Lower minimum rates = lower luck factors

Also, players being banned from forums doesn't mean anything unless you don't know how to create an e-mail account. I'm sure banned players are busy scouring the forums. TBH I was banned a ton of times before the merger because of how AE decided to handle their forums. I don't take kindly to censorship but some things get out of hand especially in here and things need to be done but banning doesn't do much since players can just create another account.

Seems to me they are trying another approach here by giving the ED community a little more leeway in their posts and trying to change the attitudes of the players instead. They have however had an issue with locking so called "Balance threads."

One thread for the most popular topic doesn't work and it's a losing fight since everything ever discussed in every single thread involves balance in a way and who in the world actually reads that thread with 15 different conversations going on? Surprised they haven't changed something about that yet.

Edit: Just saw the post from above so modified a little as to not mention names.



I am Primal -> RE: What is the Problem!?!? (2/3/2012 14:43:29)

^ agreed the random luck isn't needed



PD -> RE: What is the Problem!?!? (2/3/2012 15:00:29)

It's the interwebz. People can get away with things without suffering the consiquences of diminished moral and reputation standing.



PivotalDisorder -> RE: What is the Problem!?!? (2/3/2012 15:23:06)

I hate being blocked too, but who wants to be facing dex based Bounty Hunters and Tactical Mercs every fight? [both classes have Smoke Screen]
and we would be if block chance could be reduced to 0%. would be horrible.



Lord Machaar -> RE: What is the Problem!?!? (2/3/2012 15:54:54)

Lord nub- Eh what are you saying again?
Crits 0%
Deflects 0%
Rage more support based, faster/slower based on support.
and block chance shud be dropped from 4% to 0% ... ?? Str builds will own the stage and Support builds will go rare and that's im not agreed with... Plus now at 1vs1 i can't see more than 5 builds "Most of players" are using/ and that kill the chance for another creative players to create more builds ...



Lord Nub -> RE: What is the Problem!?!? (2/3/2012 16:52:32)

^ Okay to start off please understand how the percentages are affected by stat allocation.

I am stating the minimums should be changed to 0% should the opponents have the proper stats to compliment such a scenario.

Also, block chance would require more points placed in dexterity than just 2 points per percentage otherwise it wouldn't quite work. In order for a player to make another players block percentage 0%, that player is leaving themselves open in other areas,

Support, Tech, and Str and opponents can exploit those weaknesses.

Also keep in mind hit % and block % are two different beasts so while my opponent may not be able to block me, he can still hit me since the max block % would still be 40% without SA or 50% with. Also while a player is smoked, said player has other ways of dealing with the scenario, Sidearm, Aux, Skills, or Assault bot special.

The possibilities are endless and would create a much more strategic game but that is where the problem lies. Should the game become strategic, most of the players here wouldn't have as much fun because they wouldn't be able to get those lucky wins and some of us would very rarely lose.




PivotalDisorder -> RE: What is the Problem!?!? (2/3/2012 17:22:16)

Lord Nub: you are right about players quitting if they cannot win over 90% but at the same time, you think the game would be better
if it went back to TLM and BH dominating ? allowing block chance to hit zero would make classes with Smoke Screen into gods.

I appreciate that players can use alternatives, but why should we be forced to bow to 2 classes because you think making them
unstoppable will force other players to be more "tactical". why not give all classes smoke screen, reroute and a passive armor?


so you are saying 0% chance to block, 4% minimum to hit? [in a workable scenario]



Stabilis -> RE: What is the Problem!?!? (2/3/2012 17:50:48)

If it is 0% chance for a player to block it would then be 100% chance for the attacker to hit.



IsaiahtheMage -> RE: What is the Problem!?!? (2/3/2012 18:05:18)

I agree with Lord Nub and not because I am a STR user because of what he says makes sense. Its absolutely ridiculos for someone with 0 dex to still be able to have a 4% block chance. Same for crit chances and deflect chances. The minimum chances need to be 0%. Having someone still have a 1 or 2% chance to crit me or deflect me when my support is in the 80s and theirs in the 20s is insane. You do not deserve to crit or deflect against me. Its as simple as that. And like Lord Nub said if you have a 0% for any of those factors to happen against your opponet clearly means their is a flaw in your own build.



PivotalDisorder -> RE: What is the Problem!?!? (2/3/2012 18:30:58)

@Isaiah: you need to think of it like this. when you smoke a player and he has 0 dex, does he suddenly become some overweight blob
that cannot move, even slightly? of course he doesn't. he still has his own natural ability to try and get the frack out the way of attacks.

that is why they have a 4% base chance to block.

@Depressed: you misunderstood me and my message was for Lord Nub anyway.



Lord Nub -> RE: What is the Problem!?!? (2/3/2012 18:38:29)

@Psibertus,

Tac Mercs have Mineral armor and in order to have an unblockable build even with smoke would mean low Tech and Sup leaving them open to other types of builds.

Bounties don't have an armor period and take more damage from everything even though they recoup a little through attacking. As I stated, the assault bot still exists as well for smokescreens should one decide to use it. The difference from the way it works now and with the zero is that the bounty won't get blocked should his smoke be high enough to create such a scenario.

I'm simply stating players should have more control over the outcome.

Also I didn't say anything about having a win rate over 90% so please refrain from putting words in my mouth. Whether a players win rate is 98% or 50%, is it not still annoying to lose to a 4% block that should be 0% against the proper build type?



IsaiahtheMage -> RE: What is the Problem!?!? (2/3/2012 18:40:46)

@Psibertus Yes but real life logic should not be compared to ED. As it is completely out of reality. Don't you get tired of seeing players with 0-0 def block your attacks? Or if you have 100 support and your opponent has 25 wouldn't you be extremenly pissed if they deflected or crit you? I remember when I had 79 support and my opponent had 28 yet he crit me twice and deflected me once and all I did was deflect. That is a 51 support difference. It just ticks me off.



PivotalDisorder -> RE: What is the Problem!?!? (2/3/2012 18:57:10)

I wanted to write a long post but neither of you are worth the effort. I hope they follow your advice to the letter.

I thought the balance team was bad......



IsaiahtheMage -> RE: What is the Problem!?!? (2/3/2012 19:53:05)

@psibertus So you resort to flaming now... nice. I guess you do not have a good reply to our posts otherwise I see no reason to resort to flaming. Oh well. @Lord Nub Agreed.



PivotalDisorder -> RE: What is the Problem!?!? (2/3/2012 20:25:51)

flaming? a tad over sensitive it seems. I was specifying the reasons I am not gonna reply, rather than you thinking I just ignored the post :)

and I am not posting on that issue above. I want them to change the game that way so you can see first hand how bad it is having 0% chance
to block almost every fight from turn 1 if they go first, and vice versa. and don't even get me started on dex builds being cloned by the masses.

I have come to realise that their are certain forum members who will NEVER change their mind regardless of what is discussed in the topic
and it is best to just post once and then don't reply to any more of their posts on the subject.

you are not one of those Isaiah btw.



IsaiahtheMage -> RE: What is the Problem!?!? (2/3/2012 20:38:42)

@psibertus Well IMO when a player says "I wanted to write a long post but neither of you are worth the effort" that is usually considered flaming to me. Anyway you wont have a 0% chance to block unless your dex is horrible. Average high lvl players have at least 20-24 def if not more. When you get smoked your dex will take quite a drop but usually players either have real high def like 25-30 or a physical armor or HA or MA if you're a Merc or TLM. So I don't see how they have a 0% chance to block.



PivotalDisorder -> RE: What is the Problem!?!? (2/3/2012 21:54:09)

Ok man I apologise [to you only]

I've tried about fifteen times to write an explanation, but I'm gonna end up writing a build guide for every class with every possible
scenario just to explain that being able to smoke and then reflex boost will be incredibly powerful if they have almost no block chance,
cannot hit you with blockables, and are stuck trying to do damage to a class that not only now has supremely high dex, but that also has
blood lust, shadowarts and energy shield. 5 focus BH would be incredible, Tech deflects, Dex blocks, Str damages, Support shields.

I could write a ton of combat scenarios which the BH would always have an answer for. I doubt anyone but other BHs would beat them.
boosting one stat like that, when it heavily favours classes with either Smoke screen or Reflex boost just seems very short sighted.

4% minimum chance to block...thats 4% out of 100%...just deal with it. maybe YOU should use unblockables if they are so amazing :P
cause so far the only answer I've seen from Lord Nub was use assault bot and unblockables. even though all classes have melee skills.

most of all, the nerf/buff would crush non-vars who are usually forced to rely on their base chances if they wanna do any dmg before they lose.

I don't know what to say, I cannot see one positive idea in favour of it other than "noobs won't block me anymore herp derp"



Lord Nub -> RE: What is the Problem!?!? (2/4/2012 1:43:39)

^ You don't make much sense especially using comments such as herp derp and you apparently don't understand the difference between block % and hit %.

Since Reflex boost and Smokescreen was the scenario you decided upon I will use that as an example. Your stating that a player that uses smokescreen then reflex boosts becomes unstoppable.

Was something changed with the duration of skills I'm not aware of? Last I checked smoke lasts 3 attacks and the first was used on a reflex boost which without shadow arts, means the smoked player still has a 60% chance of hitting with primary not to mention 100% chance of hitting with sidearm, aux, or selected skill.

Your saying that changing the chance of the player using the Smoke and Reflex Boost of being blocked to 0% from 4% is such a bad idea?

Your also stating that your deflecting every time apparently and you have some support shield. Please tell me how two fully equipped players would end up in some scenario where one player has a 0% chance for every aspect.

Not gonna happen. Your also using an offensive class and saying they would go defensive with reflex and energy shield? Those take a turn to use along with the opponent hitting the one they did not cover and don't forget they don't have a passive armor so they will most likely take a lot.

They apparently also have uber support, dex, and tech to create the 0 scenario on their opponent. Only way someone would end up in that scenario is if they deserved to be such as a 34 full varium vs a 29 non with primary only. Too bad for the non guess he's gonna need to npc, buy some equipment, or hope for a better matchup eventually.

@Below,

Yeah it happens, I got a few responses to the 0% thing and kinda went from there. Thing is, balance is the most discussed thing in this forum and I think that basically answers your topic.




Shadow Jester -> RE: What is the Problem!?!? (2/4/2012 1:46:38)

Daaayyyuuum. No one even replied to what the thread was.
The question to make it a discussion was
quote:

Should the Devs TAKE more time BALANCING THE CLASSES or keep doing what they are doing. Adding more weapons. More levels. More features.

/CRY



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