Suggestion Log (Full Version)

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Xendran -> Suggestion Log (11/28/2012 20:42:23)

[Defence Changes]
Defence will be changed to a percentage of damage reduction. This applies to all defence types (Resistance, possibly more in the future)

[Stat Changes]
HP will be controlled by a stat called Vitality along with your Level. Boosters now restore HP based on a % of your max.
Vitality will grant protection against all status ailments and effects except for critical hits, as hp is a natural protection against crits already.
EP will be controlled by it's own stat + player level as well, and boosters now restore EP based on a % of your max.
This stat will offer a small amount of energy regeneration per turn.
Focus will be removed. Bots are now more dependant on various stats, including some that are based on your lowest stat.
Agility will be removed.

[Armor Changes]
Armor will no longer offer flat defences. Dexterity and Technology stats on armor will take care of this.
Defensive armors will offer a small amount of HP regen based on the armor level.
Offensive armors will offer a small amount of EP regen based on the armor level.

[Damage Ranges]
Weapons will no longer trade off stats for damage, but will have varying damage ranges with the same average damage on weapons of the same level.
This allows for more variety in equipment choice.

[Eqiupment Changes]
Most equipment will no longer cost varium.
Most current varium equipment artwork will be available in the Equipment Reskin Shop. [Varium Only]
New, rare, and exclusive skins will be available in the Reskikn shop. [Varium Only]
Varium-Only weapon abilities will all be sidegrades.
Varium-Only equipment will all be sidegrades. An example is reduced damage and stat points in exchange for passive HP regeneration, or a chance to inflict an ailment.
Encumberance reomved, as the ability to reskin weapons replaces this. There should be no advantage to using a higher level weapon at a lower level the way that the current encumberance system is implemented.
All requirements removed from purchasing items.
Stat distribution in the back end will now be determined in a percentage value. The display to the player will remain the same as currently. This allows for universal scaling of all weapons.

[Cosmetic Changes]
All cosmetic changes listed in the equipment section also apply here.
Revamped class artwork will be available for sale in the Reskin Shop. [Varium Only]
Alternate Skill Animations will be available for sale in the Reskin Shop. [Varium Only]
Armor/Hair Color Customization will now cost a small amount of varium. [Varium Only]
Armor/Hair Color Randomization will be available for 1 Battle Token.
Armor/Hair Color Reset will be available for 5 Battle Tokens.
Bot skins will be available in the Reskin Shop [Varium Only]


[Enhancement Changes]
Enhancements are removed, and instead place with weapon scaling.
Weapon scaling is Varium Only. Credit users have access to gear of equal power, therefore scaling a weapon is a matter of convenience/cosmetics/preference.
Stats can no longer be placed manually on weapons. Armors, however, retain this ability when enhanced above their base level.
Weapons statistics are now assigned as a percentage value, and then scaled based on level. (For example, 30% Strength 20% Dexterity 50% Technology. These percentages automatically distribute the weapons stats based on how many total stats it has.)
Stats round up from order of highest % allocation to lowest % allocation. When enough rounding has occured that the item now has the correct number of stat points, the rest of the stats will round down.
Weapons can be scaled to any level from any other level at a cost. This cost is based on the level difference between you and the weapon. This eliminates the issue of players not needing credits by using varium to scale weapons unless they are willing to pay very large amounts of varium for constantly scaling a weapon that is massively out of their level range.


[PvE Changes]
Additional sidequests available for purchase. These must NOT be related to the main storyline.



goldslayer1 -> RE: Suggestion Log (11/28/2012 20:57:24)

i like it :D



Blaze The Aion Ender -> RE: Suggestion Log (11/28/2012 21:19:01)

I disagree with being able to re-skin anything
Feels less... Pure



Xendran -> RE: Suggestion Log (11/28/2012 21:28:50)

Pure...? What's that even mean?
EDIT: Note that skins would not be cheap, probably around 500 varium for premium skins and 350 for standard.



Mother1 -> RE: Suggestion Log (11/28/2012 21:28:54)

I have to ask what is wrong with focus and agility? A lot of this idea are cool but why remove these two?



TRizZzCENTRINO -> RE: Suggestion Log (11/28/2012 21:30:09)

quote:

[Stat Changes]
HP will be controlled by a stat called Vitality along with your Level. Boosters now restore HP based on a % of your max.
Vitality will grant protection against all status ailments and effects except for critical hits, as hp is a natural protection against crits already.
EP will be controlled by it's own stat + player level as well, and boosters now restore EP based on a % of your max.
This stat will offer a small amount of energy regeneration per turn.
Focus will be removed. Bots are now more dependant on various stats, including some that are based on your lowest stat.
Agility will be removed.

oh sure now casters and health spammers will be more powerful, and stats will be abused with no 5 focus, and can still use the powerful attack of the bot

quote:

[Armor Changes]
Armor will no longer offer flat defences. Dexterity and Technology stats on armor will take care of this.
Defensive armors will offer a small amount of HP regen based on the armor level.
Offensive armors will offer a small amount of EP regen based on the armor level.

uh no, this would make armors useless and make any hp/ep regen passive meaningless, why dont you just say to give every class a reroute and bloodlust.

quote:

[Damage Ranges]
Weapons will no longer trade off stats for damage, but will have varying damage ranges with the same average damage on weapons of the same level.
This allows for more variety in equipment choice.

not supported, our weapon damage system is good and reassuring as it is, no need to mess around with it.

quote:

[Eqiupment Changes]
Most equipment will no longer cost varium.
Most current varium equipment artwork will be available in the Equipment Reskin Shop. [Varium Only]
New, rare, and exclusive skins will be available in the Reskikn shop. [Varium Only]
Varium-Only weapon abilities will all be sidegrades.
Varium-Only equipment will all be sidegrades. An example is reduced damage and stat points in exchange for passive HP regeneration, or a chance to inflict an ailment.
Encumberance reomved, as the ability to reskin weapons replaces this. There should be no advantage to using a higher level weapon at a lower level the way that the current encumberance system is implemented.
All requirements removed from purchasing items.
Stat distribution in the back end will now be determined in a percentage value. The display to the player will remain the same as currently. This allows for universal scaling of all weapons.

not supported, you cannot get the skins of any weapon you want in a shop, you have to have that particular weapon in your inventory to do so, and no to hp regen on varium only weapons this would be op and unfair to non vars.

quote:

[Cosmetic Changes]
All cosmetic changes listed in the equipment section also apply here.
Revamped class artwork will be available for sale in the Reskin Shop. [Varium Only]
Alternate Skill Animations will be available for sale in the Reskin Shop. [Varium Only]
Armor/Hair Color Customization will now cost a small amount of varium. [Varium Only]
Armor/Hair Color Randomization will be available for 1 Battle Token.
Armor/Hair Color Reset will be available for 5 Battle Tokens.
Bot skins will be available in the Reskin Shop [Varium Only]

skin feature on weapons is already enough, and it would be weird if you have gammabot and use assault bots skin, when you attack with its special your assult bot will look like it is healing you while you deal damage to your opponent. than the features above are not necessary, we need to think about useful features not these ones that doesnt do anything useful.

quote:

[Enhancement Changes]
Enhancements are removed, and instead place with weapon scaling.
Weapon scaling is Varium Only. Credit users have access to gear of equal power, therefore scaling a weapon is a matter of convenience/cosmetics/preference.
Stats can no longer be placed manually on weapons. Armors, however, retain this ability when enhanced above their base level.
Weapons statistics are now assigned as a percentage value, and then scaled based on level. (For example, 30% Strength 20% Dexterity 50% Technology. These percentages automatically distribute the weapons stats based on how many total stats it has.)
Stats round up from order of highest % allocation to lowest % allocation. When enough rounding has occured that the item now has the correct number of stat points, the rest of the stats will round down.
Weapons can be scaled to any level from any other level at a cost. This cost is based on the level difference between you and the weapon. This eliminates the issue of players not needing credits by using varium to scale weapons unless they are willing to pay very large amounts of varium for constantly scaling a weapon that is massively out of their level range.

not supporting this either, the DEVS needs to refund every single one of us who has purchased enhancements which will take alot of work. and when the enahncement prices are lowered it will be easier for non variums to enhance their weapon. also it will limit builds because you cant use a support build, a dex build or a jugg build without enhancements.
and the weapon level scaling feature should not be varium only, we need to let everyone playing this game enjoy the features that they offer.

so i strongly do not support these.




goldslayer1 -> RE: Suggestion Log (11/28/2012 21:31:18)

@mother1
what do u mean whats wrong? how about the fact that the staff themselves said agility was just a band-aid to fix a problem long ago in beta? (same reason for focus being implemented)

basically, u shouldn't be punished for having hp, because ur already being punished enough via less stats on defense (because ur spending more for hp)



TRizZzCENTRINO -> RE: Suggestion Log (11/28/2012 21:38:08)

@above why are strength and health spammers powerful then? why are casters powerful? because health is more useful than defence 8 or 10 health=1 defence. you see the point?



goldslayer1 -> RE: Suggestion Log (11/28/2012 21:47:52)

@trizz
health "spammers" aren't powerful, health simply allows u to live longer, a successful health "spamming" build will depend on whether or not u can compete in terms of builds. if all u have is HP, i guarantee u are going nowhere.

in this case, heal loop was successful because it could "spam" health, along with damage. allowing it to live longer while still dealing good damage. its whats happening now.

health is not more usefull than defense. this only holds true if ur average match is 4 turns.

after a certain point, u get more in return from putting up more defense than in health. and because u have high hp, u actually end up having way less defense after agility.

and define casters?
which ones? do u mean the tech mage ones?

again health, but with damage. in mage's cases, it also has high defenses.



Xendran -> RE: Suggestion Log (11/28/2012 21:49:34)

Trizz, this is a list that is assuming certain things about stat balance in EpicDuel Omega, one of the main things being % reduction on armor, and that battles are going to be lasting quite a bit longer.

Also you provided no logical arguments against anything. Also, bot skins woudl be new ones, not replacing one with another. Do not post on this thread unless you give a proper detailed analysis on the suggestions. Continued posting in this thread without giving proper feedback is not going to be a good idea for you.

Also, focus and agility are both massively broken. Agility makes no sense and is a result of the complete garbage HP system that we currently have, focus is just a bandaid to try to prevent people from spamming one stat, because spamming one stat is almost always superior at the moment.

The regen on varium items was an example of a sidegrade. It would be balanced in a way to make it fair, this whole post completely removes every advantage that varium players have in combat. ALL of them.
Weapon skins would not be of every weapon, skins are exclusive to the reskin shop and are not available as the default artwork on any other weapon.

As for armor, does weapon damage make str obsolete? do armors make tech and dex obsolete? No. Your point is flat out invalid. Also this is a small flat regen, not based on damage input or output.

Your comment about skins and whatnot being not useful: If varium players lose their advantage, there has to be cosmetics for people to keep buying. Currently the game is in a horrible financial state compared to what it should be, and this is because there is massive stigma over the amount of pay2win in this game. This game holds an extremely poor reputation in the gaming community currently.

Your comment on enhancements is flat out wrong. There is gear weighted towards every stat. This makes equipment choice matter quite a bit more, and makes it more likely for people to carry quite a few different weapons around instead of just whatever is the most powerful and then enhance it to be an end-all. Also, refunds and whatnot are not applicable, you might want to read the refund and privacy policies of this game.

About making weapon scaling available to non vairums: No, free players do NOT get features. they get the game and an equal grouind in combat. Everything else related to cosmetics, convenience and personal preference is varium. This is how f2p games work. If you are personally too cheap to pay for these things that's your own problem. Gaming is a hobby, hobbies cost money.

Not only do most of your comments not contain valid arguments, they also show that you do not properly understand the vast majority of the suggestions properly. Please reread, and ask questions about things you do not understand, for clarification. Also, before commenting about what would or would not be good to make f2p/p2p, you need an understanding of how the video game market works in 2012, it's drastically different than it was when epicduel still started, especially the "freemium" market.



Mother1 -> RE: Suggestion Log (11/28/2012 22:00:12)

@ Xendran

They also had the DSF in the game as well to try and prevent this, but thanks to Enhancements this problem was easily overcome.

Ok my problem with the removing of Agility would be as Trizz said those high health high strength player as well as Caster who use 111+ health. These HP spammers use this so they can take heavy damage without getting KO'ed quickly. As it is right Strength itself is OP and the only thing that is holding them back would be agility since it is what lowers their defenses for spamming the HP stat. Remove it and you just made them 2-8 defense and resist points stronger depending on their health which would make them that much harder for anyone and extremely harder for those using none OP builds.

Focus right now has become a lot more used thanks to the infernal android. Before I would rarely see focus builds but now i see them in one vs one and two versus two more then ever. I win some I lose some. However I believe their attempt at focus was for people to use balanced builds (stat wise) as well as the DSF but even with these people still do it anyways and come out on top.



Xendran -> RE: Suggestion Log (11/28/2012 22:02:11)

@Mother1: I appreciate the more constructive post, but you still did not read it fully. Everything you know about stats now is completely obsolete due to the upcoming Omega patch. Take these concepts under the assumption that stats are balanced without needing the bandaids of focus and agility. % reduction for def/res is the biggest factor in this.

Throwing out numbers like 111+ hp and 2-8 defence are completely irelevant, since the stat system is being remade.



TRizZzCENTRINO -> RE: Suggestion Log (11/28/2012 22:04:15)

@above i do not want to make long explainations because it will be useless to explain it to you. i have made my point very clear in a few short sentences.
and you are the one who is not explaining everything properly, you didnt put any % on how much you think the armor would regen your HP/EP, the definition of small can vary depending on each person, 13% HP/EP regen will seem small to some while lots to others.

most health abusers are also strength or tech abusers, they deal heavy damage and can destroy you before you destroy them if you are not strategic. so without agility they can be way harder to defeat, agility shouldnt be removed but rather increased the penalty of high health.

focus it what prevents stat abusers from getting the advantage of offensive bots, if it was removed i can use a strength and tech build to get the best of everything.

quote:

Also, focus and agility are both massively broken. Agility makes no sense and is a result of the complete garbage HP system that we currently have, agility is just a bandaid to try to prevent people from spamming one stat, because spamming one stat is almost always superior at the moment.

and how is this any logical? its not trying to prevent people from spamming one stat but trying to prevent people from spamming health. explain yourself clearly next time before telling me to.

quote:

About making weapon scaling available to non vairums: No, free players do NOT get features. they get the game and an equal grouind in combat. Everything else related to cosmetics, convenience and personal preference is varium. This is how f2p games work. If you are personally too cheap to pay for these things that's your own problem. Gaming is a hobby, hobbies cost money.

you are wrong about that, many interesting hobbies are free. so shall we make class change varium only? and make varium gears for credits disappear? everyone deserves to try the features, but non vars need to use their time to earn the credits in-order to use it.

varium shouldnt be used to make non vars our slaves or punching bags, it should only be used to get something powerful anytime you want without needing to spend time farming for credits.
you logics of thinking that only varium players deserve the best features are ridiculous.



goldslayer1 -> RE: Suggestion Log (11/28/2012 22:06:59)

@trizz
u do know that health is a stat?



Xendran -> RE: Suggestion Log (11/28/2012 22:07:39)

There are no numbers because these are concepts. Do not attempt to bring formulae into a concept thread. I explained before, everything we know about stats is obsolete due to omega.
I explained almost everything as much as i needed to. There are one or two things that i could elaborate on due to people not being able to understand it properly, but neither of them have anything to do with anything you've said so far.

Also, if you aren't willing to post a detailed explanation when providing a counterargument, refrain from even posting. Also, agility in the second sentence was a typo, seems pretty obvious, i'll go edit that.

quote:

varium shouldnt be used to make non vars our slaves or punching bags, it should only be used to get something powerful anytime you want without needing to spend time farming for credits.
you logics of thinking that only varium players deserve the best features are ridiculous


You clearly don't play this game, as currently varium DOES make non-vars our slaves and punching bags in battle. Non variums should not get access to cosmetics or convenience any where near the same aesthetic value as varium players should. You need a lesson on marketing in video games if you're going to have an argument against somebody who has taken multiple university courses on general media marketing and video game marketing. There is a reaosn that this games playerbase hasn't grown anywhere close to as much as it would have if this game wasnt massively pay2win.



TRizZzCENTRINO -> RE: Suggestion Log (11/28/2012 22:14:35)

@goldslayer: it is a stat but it is not the same type of stat as dexterity or technology, since you cant enhance it and it increases by 2 points for each stat point.



Xendran -> RE: Suggestion Log (11/28/2012 22:15:47)

quote:

@goldslayer: it is a stat but it is not the same type of stat as dexterity or technology, since you cant enhance it and it increases by 2 points for each stat point.


Irelevant, stats are being changed. If you continue to post about information that is not relevant to the thread, i'm going to start considering it spam.



TRizZzCENTRINO -> RE: Suggestion Log (11/28/2012 22:19:21)

@above keep thinking this way then, im sure if varium will make us defeat non vars all the time there wouldnt be any non vars around, try to pay some respect and not look down on non vars, they are same as you and me sitting infront of a laptop. the DEVS are trying their best to make this game fun for everyone. if you think you have the right logics in game marketing im dying to see how your game company would turnout if you had one :P. AQW is the most successful AE game and their only benefits for paying players are better art and faster way to earn tokens to get your desired class or armor.



goldslayer1 -> RE: Suggestion Log (11/28/2012 22:22:10)

@trizz
actually, i know aqw, i played it, and somewhat still do.
members also have extended storylines, more maps, they have more quests, more weapons (all weapons have different damage ranges)
and the enhancement system in AQW is more balanced.
at least if ur a non member in AQW there isn't much different in stats. (aside from the amulet fiasco)

anyway, why go off topic?



TRizZzCENTRINO -> RE: Suggestion Log (11/28/2012 22:28:19)

@above we are expressing our views on his suggestion, he might think its off topic but it really is clearly on topic, there is no right or wrongs. it all depends on what the majority of people think.
i am a F2P player in aqw and i earn my ACs, yet i can compete fairly and win against most of the members, ED should be fair for everyone like that and varium is only used as a shortcut to access powerful items in less than a minute, while it takes non vars playing constantly for days.

@below why do you think im angry? dont make false statements. weapon skins should be varium only feature but weapon scaling should not be a varium only feature, some players that payed lots during gamma and beta may not pay anymore but they got all these promo items which are weak, how is it fair? if a non var likes the look and stat of the alpha weapons they would be able to use it but pay a decent amount of credits inorder to do so, still depends on the level gap between you and the gear.



Xendran -> RE: Suggestion Log (11/28/2012 22:29:14)

quote:

@above keep thinking this way then, im sure if varium will make us defeat non vars all the time there wouldnt be any non vars around, try to pay some respect and not look down on non vars, they are same as you and me sitting infront of a laptop. the DEVS are trying their best to make this game fun for everyone. if you think you have the right logics in game marketing im dying to see how your game company would turnout if you had one :P. AQW is the most successful AE game and their only benefits for paying players are better art and faster way to earn tokens to get your desired class or armor.


1. Non variums ARE second class citizens, but I AM trying to help them here.
2. Im trying to TAKE AWAY the advantage of varium players and make it more like AQW where artwork is what you pay for. I don't think you actually understand some of the words im using (aesthetic, cosmetic, etc.) and are simply arguing blindly. I HATE the fact that varium weapons are better. Weapon Scaling doesn't make weapons better though, it simply alters their level. Credit users will have the EXACT same power of equipment, but varium players will be able to look more unique due to using skins, or using a weapon that they've scaled to a different level.
3. Seeing as i have 2 years of university already and i have 3 years to go, including multiple marketing and business courses, game programing, game design, art direction, Interface management, etc, i'd say a game company would (and will be in the near future due to already being associated with two companies) be a very profitable industry for me.

EDIT: @Above: If your opinions are not well laid out with logic to back them up, and contradict each other, they are essentially spam. Therefore i suggest you stop posting things that are either incorrect, irelevant or not well thought out before you start racking up a large number of spam posts on these forums.


I'm agreeing with you about varium (partially. Varium users should still have to workk for weapons, just not as hard.), so i don't understand your argument about it. I agree that it shouldn't give a combat advantage, so why are you getting all angry?


I'm going to say this one last time: Anything regarding stats, or assuming current stat/combat mechanics is not relevant to this thread and will be reported to the Lawman as spam.

@Above again: Because why should they? They aren't paying. If they want that kind of cosmetic improvement, they have to pay. Again, it's not the devs problem if you can't afford a cosmetic change, because you still have fullly unrestricted access to the game's core content.



Mother1 -> RE: Suggestion Log (11/28/2012 22:42:38)

@ Xendran

The majority of players buy Varium just for what you want to get of a combat advantage. Sure varium has other uses such as name changes, house etc, but most people by promo's for the advantage. Epic duel is a PVP game and while it has other features it is mainly just that a PVP game. Most people wouldn't even buy varium if it didn't give them an advantage in combat and the staff said it themselves. If there is no advantage for varium players no one would buy it, and without the funding they get from varium sales Epic duel would fail. Not my words but the staffs.




Xendran -> RE: Suggestion Log (11/28/2012 22:44:49)

Actually, paying for advantages is what causes quite a few games to fail financially, because they lose the vast majority of their playerbase due to the Pay2Win payment method.
A large number of varium players use varium for things other than advantages. Varium bikes are actually extremely popular, for instance. Almost every varium user i've seen has a bike.



TRizZzCENTRINO -> RE: Suggestion Log (11/28/2012 22:51:45)

yes mother1 that is true, but i have seen a balance thread about 2v2 and most(varium players) complain about them getting partnered up with a weak non var player that they always lose because of it. varium should give some advantage but not too much, this game would be no fun if there is less and less non var players. the DEVS need to think about that too, i have not played ED for a 4 days because all i vs is full varium 5 focus BM and smoke and massacre BH, it really gets boring.



Mother1 -> RE: Suggestion Log (11/28/2012 22:58:11)

@ Trizzz

I am guess that is why they are sending in all this varium powered stuff in for credits to undo the gap they made over the years. In Omega as well they said they would be making enhancements cheaper so Non variums could afford them and as well as make it cheaper for varium players as well. Soon Varium won't have anymore advantage other then getting slightly better gear and promos.

Oh and off topic I believe I did face you a few days ago as well.

@ Xendar

I know change is coming in omega, but I have to ask how do you know everything you posted will be changed like this? Last I checked only the staff knows what is truly coming and they only said a few things that we know that will be happening such as removing some resrictions and weapons being upgradable but nothing else.



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