=DF= Cryptic Discussion Thread (Full Version)

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Melissa4Bella -> =DF= Cryptic Discussion Thread (4/6/2014 16:59:29)

Hiya DragonFablers!

You wanted more various threads of discussion about Classes and we listened! This week we will be introducing a new class thread in DragonFable.

This thread: All things Cryptic

Now for the rules of this thread:

  • All =AE= Comprehensive Forum Rules apply.
  • The "All Classes" thread will remain pinned to the top of the forum until all the current class threads are released.
  • There will be a Class Directory stickied to the top of the forum once a few class threads are active for quick locating.
  • On suggestions: The DragonFable staff offer specialized suggestion threads from time to time and you may post your suggestions when those events occur.
  • Please keep discussions to the various versions of the Cryptic armor.
  • Most important: Have fun!



    • Bamzalot -> RE: =DF= Cryptic Discussion Thread (4/7/2014 20:35:42)

    Just like how Rogue is my favorite base class, Cryptic is my favorite Anomaly class.

    I have always been a fan of Psychic abilities so this class instantly became a favorite. It's fun to use and has great animations. That potion stealing ability is nice too. 50% chance to take a potion from monsters that shouldn't even have them, and it's even (nearly) spammable! Drastically improved defense and offense it good as well.

    I will say though, some of those skill animations shake me a bit. There's just something about stabbing your knifes into your opponent's brain without giving them any way to defend themselves. Suddenly locking their sanity up in chains is a bit punishing as well. There is also mental electrocution. Wait, was that also a thing? Probably, it's Cryptic...

    Despite this unforgiving torment to your poor, hopeless, enemies, a 9/10 class for me!



    ergotth -> RE: =DF= Cryptic Discussion Thread (4/8/2014 17:43:45)

    aaah, I wish I could try this class. But in the overall, I have same opinions as Bamzalot (based in hat I saw about this class). Sounds like something cruel xD



    DJ9K -> RE: =DF= Cryptic Discussion Thread (4/9/2014 2:55:13)

    This class, in combat, is ridiculous! Its damage output is far underestimated, due to throw(275% damage) and rapid(2 hits of 175% for 350% total) being nearly spammable! Use throw, rapid, Than any other skill, than throw is back up, and rapid after that! Non stop comboing that even lets you throw in somethings else in the mix.

    And above this, the defenses! As long as you don't use stealth immediately after illusion or vice-versa you can stack up 320 to dodge, parry, and block! Plus it has a long blind~ making it able to be an evasion tank. Just use steal for a quicky heal in there if you run out of potions, and use stealth to unlock backstab for another 250% attack and increase crit by 30%! DPS can be unreal with little to no risk of dying.

    Add in mind poison for DoT and Cage for a stun or aimed if you have trouble hitting. All can be done between throw and rapid. And if you're feeling fancy, there's always the final for 250-325% total damage + 100% crit for a big finisher.

    All around, this calss is the strongest one I've played that isn't Doom Knight. Even better than most of the DC classes(that or I just suck at using the DC classes, one or the other :P) and since getting the class I haven't had to change class for any reason other than "impossible" bosses. Even against the super strong Jayson, on extreme hard-mode, I came out with almost 100% hp. Without using baby dragon too.

    However, on a down side, we have so much Crit late game that its passive is pretty useless. I fear how useless it will be when the level cap raises.

    Edit: I guess I also forgot to mention, it has a tough time in multiple enemy fighting. It is a single enemy specialty class for sure, and due to this its multi skill is only averageish. Making it take longer to fight multiple enemies than the other Atlean classes.



    ergotth -> RE: =DF= Cryptic Discussion Thread (4/9/2014 9:39:03)

    ^ tnx, I always wondered if Cryptic was so weak as they said, glad to know they are wrong, I have the Ascendant and my friend let me try his Riftwalker, so far, both classes are stunningly strong.



    Boozermaniac -> RE: =DF= Cryptic Discussion Thread (4/9/2014 15:48:04)

    Ive got all 3 type of anomaly armours and so far cryptic is the best one. Good things are offensive and defensive stats, but multi killing is trickier, well ull just need to do more defensive style for start against 3 monsters and think the timing of what defence to use in which situation.



    Eaglestrike -> RE: =DF= Cryptic Discussion Thread (7/22/2015 20:18:05)

    Uhm..has anyone realized that the D/P/B of Illusionary Veil does not work on the turn you activated it? or is it intentional?



    Aura Knight -> RE: =DF= Cryptic Discussion Thread (7/22/2015 20:45:03)

    I like the look of this class the most out of the others. I kinda wish I had started off as a rogue so I could actually try the class out for myself. From what others are saying it seems it's rather unappreciated despite being a powerful class. A shame it seems it isn't the best at fighting multiple enemies though.

    If I do switch my starter class it will be into rogue just so I can use this class.



    Rio3678 -> RE: =DF= Cryptic Discussion Thread (7/22/2015 21:25:50)

    I really love the the quest you do to unlock this class. Especially the last part.



    Eaglestrike -> RE: =DF= Cryptic Discussion Thread (7/22/2015 21:47:25)

    since the stat changes Cryptic really got some love hahaha, crit increase is now much appreciated. Regarding to damage, I think Ascendant still beats Cryptic, as cryptic relies on chance to crit while Ascendant relies on powerboosts.



    Hopeful Guy -> RE: =DF= Cryptic Discussion Thread (7/23/2015 2:14:06)

    Cryptic is IMO the best Atealan class since 14.0.1. The defences can basically be looped to the extent that you'll never get hit at all, and after 5 turns, whenever you use Stealth for defence, it has the side effect of giving you close to 100% Crit (since 25%+30%+equips (I get 35% from equips)+LUK). So although Ascendant still does beat Cryptic in damage terms, Cryptic is arguably still a better class.



    PusatShrade -> RE: =DF= Cryptic Discussion Thread (7/23/2015 2:26:34)

    My third character is a cryptic and it absolutely decimates whatever gets in his way. It is definitely on par with the DC classes in my opinion.



    crabpeople -> RE: =DF= Cryptic Discussion Thread (7/23/2015 4:33:17)

    @Eaglestrike
    quote:

    Uhm..has anyone realized that the D/P/B of Illusionary Veil does not work on the turn you activated it? or is it intentional?

    I thinks it's intentional. Just because it's not the only class with a delayed shield. Both ShadowHunter and ChronoZ have delayed shields.
    It's not a problem in practice because you have the other shield (Illusion) so just when you still have 1 turn active on illusion shield, use veil.

    @Aura Knight
    quote:

    A shame it seems it isn't the best at fighting multiple enemies though.

    While it's true the mult has a cooldown of 2 turns, the class has 2 shields. So you got plenty of turns to clear any mult fight.

    @Rio3678
    quote:

    I really love the the quest you do to unlock this class. Especially the last part.

    Yeah I agree. The otehr 2 atealan quests are meh. [8|]


    About the class. Mana costs are pretty low for a tier 3. p/d/b items are useful with his shields. The blind doing multiple hits helps a lot in order to get it's effect (specially at hard mode). And yeah as mentioned it has a perfect defense rotation.

    Men I had great times with this class. I remember using old Rolith Opness in order to get this class being lv10 or less. And it has been an excellent farming class (although RW does better in that regard). Having the alchemy trained at low levels made the healing quite OP [:D]. If ver 14.0.1 came before I decided to change the base class i would still be using cryptic.



    Aura Knight -> RE: =DF= Cryptic Discussion Thread (7/23/2015 4:51:46)

    So its defenses are amazing enough to deal with any other weakness it might have? That class sounds better and better the more I hear about it. I regret starting as a warrior.



    Shadows Morgenstern -> RE: =DF= Cryptic Discussion Thread (7/23/2015 6:45:33)

    Still prefer RW, but Cryptic has the best look. If you keep pointing out every way to Cryptic is better Ash will start digging most likely. :P



    Sakurai the Cursed -> RE: =DF= Cryptic Discussion Thread (7/23/2015 9:58:39)

    @Aura - Cryptic still can't compete with RW's farming speed, and the same goes for Ascendant's sustained damage. What 14.0.1 did for Cryptic was make it as good as the other Atealan classes; before the update it had decent defense and damage, sure, but the other two were always masters of their chosen field while Cryptic was just sort of there. Now there's actually a reason to choose Cryptic.



    Hopeful Guy -> RE: =DF= Cryptic Discussion Thread (7/23/2015 10:54:09)

    Sakurai: With the equips I have (OK, I will concede that this is a bit specialised) Cryptic is better than either RW or Ascendant. I have the following items which I use normally: Battle-worn Doom Blade (level 80), Sovereign Wings (level 80), Zeclem's Band (level 80), Ascended Helm (level 80), Linked Bands of Nature's Bounty (level 77), and any Trinket or Belt. That gives 35% Crit and 61 D/B/P with a decent trinket and belt, and I have 200 LUK, adding more to both. Then you can just use the following combo:

    Illusion-> Throw-> Rapid-> Illusionary Veil-> Throw-> Rapid-> Backstab-> Mental Torture-> Throw-> Rapid-> repeat.

    As long as your enemy hasn't got a massive amount of Bonus, you basically don't get hit at all. Meanwhile, the 35% Crit and 10% from LUK add to the 25% from Paranoia to give 70, and when Veil is active, it adds another 30% to give a nice round 100%. And Throw-> Rapid-> any-> Throw-> Rapid is more than enough to be very close to RW in farming terms, at least in my opinion.



    flashbang -> RE: =DF= Cryptic Discussion Thread (7/23/2015 12:15:57)

    I got this class with a level 10 base rogue. A month ago, I believe.

    But he isn't level 18 so I can't use it good



    Sakurai the Cursed -> RE: =DF= Cryptic Discussion Thread (7/23/2015 14:48:15)

    @Hopeful - It's obviously got the best defense, that goes without saying. But it can't do anywhere near Ascendant's sustained damage (after 3-4 turns, Ascendant pulls way ahead and the gap keeps widening from there) nor can it do anywhere near 550% damage on the first turn like RiftWalker (it can only catch up on the 9th or 10th turn). So, like I said, it can't compete with them in their chosen fields.

    You could say that it's the best in that it has the fewest weaknesses I suppose, while the others are more focused - RW suffers a lot on tanky bosses and hard-hitting bosses while Cryptic can keep both its defense and damage going, and Ascendant is average in farming speed while Cryptic is well above average. However, in my subjective view Ascendant is best, as its defense is sufficient for most anything, its first-turn damage is quite a bit lower but on its 2nd turn its damage can be near-equal, and its sustained damage is waaay better. It's basically just personal preference as to what's the most important in a class.

    Here's a little summary as I see it:

    RW - Fantastic short-term damage, poor defense and long-term damage
    Asc - Fantastic long-term damage, good defense and decent short-term damage
    Cry - Fantastic defense, good short- and long-term damage



    GreenGuy23 -> RE: =DF= Cryptic Discussion Thread (7/23/2015 15:46:29)

    @Sakurai My main character uses Riftwalker, and with the right equipment, it can be a pretty hybrid class. If you use the Blade of Awe (small amount of health/mana), Twilly's staff (More health regen than BoA, no mana), since the class gets in a ton of hits on basically all of its attacks, it can regen a good amount of health/mana pretty quickly. If you use the Birthday Trinket, Dragon of Destiny, you get at least a 50% chance (around that) of regenning health. There is also a trinket that drops from Artix's quest Memory-Demons that regens a good bit of health as well as increasing your defense. Those trinkets combined with some good weaponry, can help you get your Riftwalker pretty hybrid.

    Now, about Cryptic. My new secondary character is a Rogue/Cryptic (waiting for Ranger!!!), and I absolutely LOVE the class. I don't particularly like stabbing someone in the brain when they can't defend themselves, but besides that, I really love this. Honestly, I think this is my 2nd/3rd or so favorite class.



    Sakurai the Cursed -> RE: =DF= Cryptic Discussion Thread (7/24/2015 2:46:43)

    Well yeah, items can cover the weaknesses of most any class; Asc for example can equip one of the nuke trinkets and/or a weapon with a trigger/on-hit special for better farming, and its offense combo has even more hits than RW's so it can cover its defense on challenge bosses fairly well in the same way as RW.

    Anyway, effectiveness aside, Cryptic has always been my favorite of the Atealan classes aesthetically; as an Asc, I'm totally jelly of Cryptic's animations. :[



    FallenAngel -> RE: =DF= Cryptic Discussion Thread (9/23/2015 14:35:41)

    Not sure if the devs watch this thread anymore(Ash, you there? xD), but in case they do I want to point out something that always bugged me.

    Cryptic, effectively, is a class that(even more than Rogue, which it builds on) is all about the crits. Before the last big engine update, when people still had crit percentages pushing 80, both its passive(to some degree) and its Stealth skill were devalued because everyone stacked crit and you'd max out from the passive alone before even using Stealth.
    Now that gear crit has(thankfully) been cut in half, the problems with Paranoia and Stealth have been alleviated. Even if you go for those 80 crit again(as an example, I haven't combed through all gear to see the exact number you could theoretically get to, but that should be a decent ballpark number for offensively oriented max level players), that's gonna be 40% and still leaves room for full Paranoia stacks(+25%) as well as Stealth(+30%).

    However(and here we come to what's always bugged me)...there's still Mental Assassination with its built-in 100% crit, when everything else in the class' design opposes this...
    As the Cryptic's Paranoia grows(heh) and he activates Stealth, his crit% will naturally reach lofty heights(90+), a skill with built-in 100% crit is highly counterintuitive on a class like that since you basically gain next to nothing from that 100% crit chance.

    Ah, but now you say "It's obviously intended to be a turn 1 nuke while you're still at lower crit rate!".
    Well, no...I don't believe it was supposed to be that. The name, Mental Assassination, combined with the animation of carefully mind-probing your enemy before sniping him with a psychokinetic laser(still one of my favorite animations in the game btw) does not scream "quick and dirty 1st turn nuke" to me.
    Nor does the fact that the skill builds on the Paranoia passive to become stronger. No, I believe it was fully intended to be a skill you build up to for several turns and then finish with a big damage blast.
    Unfortunately, as is, that's not the case.

    If your Paranoia is maxed and you are in Stealth, simply using Rapid(a 2 turn cooldown move) does an average of(let's assume 40% base crit here, as above, +25% from Paranoia and +30% from Stealth for 90% total) 350*1.95 = 682.5%
    How about Mental Assassination? 325% for max Paranoia stacks *2 for guaranteed crit = 650%
    Yeah. Oh and it clears your Paranoia stacks so your next couple turns your effective damage will drop even more. Doesn't sound half as awesome as the animation made it look, right?

    As is, against bosses it's only useful to use it on turn 1 and then just build Paranoia, never using it again(should the fight last long enough that you could...the thing has a whopping 14 turn cooldown)) and I think that's a terrible waste of the skill's potential.

    In my opinion, to bring the skill closer to its intended purpose(or at least what I think its purpose was intended to be ^^;), the 100% crit should be completely cut(as explained, the class gets enough crit from its other features, no need to put +crit% on the "final" skill, much less make it +100%) and the base damage numbers adjusted to turn it into a worthwhile nuke(or rather Assassination) to build up to.

    I'm proposing(to have a base to talk about, obviously it doesn't have to be these exact numbers):

    0 charges: 350%
    1 charge: 380%
    2 charges: 410%
    3 charges: 440%
    4 charges: 470%
    5 charges: 500% (if that seems like a lot, keep in mind Riftwalker has a 440% skill with no prerequisite skills or buildup on a 4 turn cooldown)

    This means the class would lose some one-turn-win potential(0 charges MA under old numbers is 250% with guranteed crit for 500% effective), but that's the Rfitwalker's niche anyway(and Throw is so lightning fast compared to MA that even going to 2 turns against certain monsters shouldn't hurt too much, farming time wise) but gain an actual Assassination skill(that you can build your Paranoia for and then enter into Stealth, using all of your class' synergy to maximize that one attack) that does the name proud.



    Ash -> RE: =DF= Cryptic Discussion Thread (9/23/2015 14:44:33)

    I'll give you the same answer I gave everyone else when they wanted me to fix small issues with the other two. If I poke at anything, other than a bug, on the Atalean classes I'm re-balancing ALL of the skills on ALL of them, not just adjusting one skill on one class. So you either get a whole new skill set on all 3 or you deal with a skill being meant to be used on turn one, regardless of what the name sounds like. Honestly with everything Cryptic can do the Final skill should be the least of anyone's worries.

    (Most everyone screamed "NO LEAVE THEM ALONE" the last time so make of that what you will)



    Aura Knight -> RE: =DF= Cryptic Discussion Thread (9/23/2015 14:53:17)

    To me, cryptic is fine as is. Yes it doesn't seem to be quite as powerful as the other two but its defensive capabilities makes up for that. And it's not like the class is weak at all. I'm enjoying using cryptic a lot more than I did riftwalker. There's just something about the attack animations of this class that feels right to me. Attacking an opponent's mind seems pretty cool. Can't say I'm a huge fan of the purple color the class has but that's not much of an issue. When using the class, sometimes the final skill isn't even needed because the class allows you to crit well enough to not need the extra damage from the final. Cryptic isn't meant to be a powerhouse but the constant crit boosts make it seem like it is. I can't say I agree with more changes to these classes, but I only experienced two of them so far.



    Shadows Morgenstern -> RE: =DF= Cryptic Discussion Thread (9/23/2015 15:06:18)

    Pretty curious about roughly what changes you would do to them Ash.



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