=AQ3D= News August 1, 2017: Discussing Classes (Full Version)

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RKC -> =AQ3D= News August 1, 2017: Discussing Classes (8/2/2017 18:01:56)

quote:

Artix Krieger | Tuesday, August 1, 2017
[image]https://www.aq3d.com/media/2729/classes.jpg[/image]

Q: What do you want to be when you level up?
A: Everything.


"Warrior, Mage, Rogue, Paladin, DragonSlayer, Ninja, Necromancer, Guardian, Alpha Pirate, Ranger, Shaman... today we talk about these things!"

Ultimate freedom of customization is at the core of all the AdventureQuest games. Want to be an axe wielding healer who wears an armored ninja gi? Go for it! Furthermore, you can switch between any and all of the classes you unlock. Which right now, is very limited-- but that is about to change.

Philosophy for 60+ Classes

Collecting and leveling up classes is one of the most fun parts of the previous AdventureQuest games. It follows a few philosophies that are important to understand.

First, we like being able to do and experience "pretty much anything" on our hero.

Second, we want to make sure you can always play with your friends. Switching between classes instantly solves the problem of "we need a support" or "we need more DPS!" or any other type of challenge. Also, as monsters get smarter and have new skills, your party will be able to change strategies.

Third, trying out new classes is fun and leveling them up is rewarding. Especially since we are planning a story-line for each major class.

We have A LOT of classes coming, which makes the philosophy behind designing them so important.

1. Classes should be fun and interesting to play.
2. Each Major Class must be different.
3. Each class must serve a purpose/role.
4. Each class will use a resource (like Mana).
5. Some classes are general use, and some for more specific use (Mage vs Fire specialized Pyromancer)
6. Classes need to be easy to switch between (not requiring you to change your gear or do a bunch of settings each time).
7. Some many be easy to acquire, some many be hard (i.e. maybe Cleric + Knight = Paladin).
8. You should be able to collect them all (i.e. You can have both a Vampire Knight or a Werewolf Warrior).
9. Weapon types must be universal equip slots (Yes, we are adding bows and dual wield hand cannons).
10. Did we mention fun?

Instead of mana, some classes will use their own thing!

Not every class uses magic or mana but each class will use some kind of resource like mana. Magi will still use mana. Guardians will use Dragon Magic. Alpha pirates will use bullets or scurvy or something. Other classes like Warriors and Rogues may use resources similar to rage, stamina, blood-thirst, or combo points as you may be familiar with from other games. That is, they start with 0 resource, and increase it with successful attacks.

What order classes will be released in?

Before we add a bunch of new classes, we have been hard at work on fixing the existing classes' skills. Rabblefroth has been helping us re-balance and tune up Warrior, Rogue, Mage, and Guardian. I met with him this morning and reviewed all the changes in progress. For example, you can now move while casting spells on the Mage class. Fireball's cast time has been significantly reduced. Many of the mage spells have changed and there have been a bunch of other "feels fun" changes. Ice lance is a nice new projectile attack, cannot wait to see it with art in game.

[image]https://www.aq3d.com/media/2730/img_01082017_133728_0.png[/image]


(Dage's concept art for two of the new Mage spells... including the Ultimate)

In fact, Rabblefroth has redone all of the classes. Each class now has an "Ultimate Skill." For example the Mage's Ulstimate Skill an area of effect rain spell which rains fireballs down in a area, dealing damage to all enemies near the mage. Combat overall has become slightly faster, and the former auto-attack button is being replaced with a skill. This will let us do some neat things like filling up a resource gauge by landing normal hits (i.e. my original plan for Guardian.)

Finishing our base classes 1st (Warrior, Rogue, Mage, and Guardian)

Tomorrow, Rabblefroth is going to have a pretty close to final version of our base classes. Korin created new animations that we will be using for some of the new skills. The previous super big, jumping, mega-crazy animations will be used mostly for the Ultimate skills. There is a little more animation / server-timing complexity that I do not have time to fully explain here, but I will keep you posted regularly on the progress-- I am so excited to get these out for testing.

Bow and Dual Pistols classes!?

We will be adding equip slots for bows, dual pistols/crossbows, and hand weapons (aka brass knuckles). Certain classes will only use these special types of weapons. For example, our first class to use bow will be Ranger. If you do not have a bow, you will have access to a default bow. Very much the same way if you somehow manage to delete all your weapons, the game automatically gives you a sword. The first class to use dual pistols this will be Alpha Pirate (which is a Kickstarter exclusive reward).

Do not worry, there will be other dual wielding classes in the future. Our biggest challenges with these special weapon types is that they use special animations-- and will not work nicely with the skills of other classes (like using archer skills while having a war-hammer equipped). There has been months of back and forth over how to handle this particular issue. Given the technical limitations of the devices we are supporting, this will be our best and fastest to implement plan. We are also experimenting with how we can have dual-wielding classes >_>.

Class Ranks, Skills, and Passive Skills

When you get a new class it will be Rank 0 and you will only have one or two skills available. Just by playing the class you will rank it up. The skills will unlock very quickly. The first time you get to use your Ultimate should *coughs* literally be a blast :D From then on, ranking up will increase your passives making your skills and defenses even better. As they say, "A class should not be judged until it is rank 10." For major classes with storylines, Class Ranks will likely play a role in unlocking special armor pieces for that class. Inversely, you may need to complete certain quests to level up some classes.

Plan for Necromancer, Paladin, DragonSlayer, Ninja, Cleric, and Shaman

Once the base classes are finished, we are going to immediately dive into DragonSlayer. It would be nice if we had it in time for Ashfall: Part III, but then again... it would have been nice if Paladin was ready for DoomWood. Our best course is to complete these properly and release them when they are fun and properly made. Especially Necromancer... which, if we hit our goals, will be a ton of fun and play unlike anything you have ever seen before O_O.

Legendary Kickstarter Backers

Holding true to our promise, we will be releasing the classes listed in the Kickstarter for the backers who pledged at that level to test first. When they are ready for testing, they will be obtainable at the Founder's Sancturary where all the Kickstarter rewards are located. If you were wondering why the Shaman class has been mentioned in each of these posts, it is going to be released for all players along with one of our two World Designer Backer's areas-- which is going to be really cool.

A Few More Thoughts on Classes

Needless to say, I am extremely eager to use the Paladin class. Which is a major class. There are also going to be sub-classes like Undead Slayer and Holy Defender. Actually, we could use your help coming up with a better name for the term "sub-class". But these are derivative classes offer variants to Paladin, which is a solid "all around use" class. Where Undead Slayer is very specialized for doing massive damage against the undead, but sacrificing defense as well as power vs other types of enemies. And Holy Defender is a more tank-like build that can take a bigger beating in exchange for giving up attack power. So if you like playing one type of class, you will still have different flavors of it to play in different situations.

I think we can all agree that the classes are one of, if not THE MOST important part of AdventureQuest 3D. It is the heart of the game. We will instantly know if the upcoming re-done base classes are right, because you will saw, "WHOA! This is so much more fun!" we are 100% committed to getting that response... and we will keep iterating until we do.

Battle on!


Tagged. ~Rickyb20




One Winged Angel1357 -> RE: News August 1, 2017: Discussing Classes (8/2/2017 19:53:00)

Seems like Artix is finally breaking on his philosophy for every class should be able to do everything




Iron Volvametal -> RE: News August 1, 2017: Discussing Classes (8/2/2017 20:20:13)

So, are Classes going to be like in AQW where they take Inventory Slots? Because I would really be against that.


They mentioned that some Classes will require some Ranks of the other Classes(ex. Cleric+Knight=Paladin), so I assume you would have to either have them both a certain rank or Merge them together for the new Class, sacrificing the 2 beforementioned classes from your inventory.


I really like the way Classes work right now, with them having their own Slot in the Menu instead of requiring Inventory Spaces. I hope they don't change that.




LouisCyphere -> RE: News August 1, 2017: Discussing Classes (8/2/2017 23:23:23)

Classes having inventory slots would be counterproductive since we already have a tab for storing classes.

So they're going to revamp the whole class mechanic with adding ranks. It's fine with me since AQ did it first. Although I want to see more skills rather than the very simple 4 skills of AQW.

I would like to see the Class Revamp because the game and combat right now feels very much AQW with focus on grinding for items and the 4 Class skills.
Let AQ3D have its own identity! The game is leaning too much on the familiarity of AQW.

Regarding dual wield or new weapon types, still no word of shields? How come? AQ have shields. If anything, I want AQ3D to be more faithful to AQ rather than AQW.

As for the term of sub-classes, how about "Focus" to be more simple or "Specialization" if you want it to sound more classy.




RKC -> RE: News August 1, 2017: Discussing Classes (8/3/2017 4:07:42)

I just want them to complete the Alpha pirate set. It has no Glove, cape and weapon.

Please artix just add the missing pieces to the set I beg of you[:(]




Vypie -> RE: News August 1, 2017: Discussing Classes (8/3/2017 13:41:59)

I feel a bit disappointed with the direction the classes seem to be heading.

New skills are great and all, it's awesome that they are giving us a 5th button and a sweet ultimate skill.

I was hoping for more depth for each class, though. It appears there will be no class customization or skill tinkering.
It seems like the only choice of playstyles will instead be about choosing between pre-made classes and "subclasses" that you have no control over, and I hope to be wrong. :(

New classes are always cool, but if all we have is quantity, then you are not really adding depth to the game. Each individual class would benefit SO MUCH from customizable skill choices.
Considering the game has a simple combat, there should be depth behind the action. You know, to tweak a certain class so that it fits our playstyle. Like choosing between a pool of skills or between different skill upgrade variations.
It opens up lots of in-class options to experiment with. A class should be something for the player to explore and discuss as well.

These are all things that keep the player invested. Building their own gameplay preferences, finding ridiculous or effective skill choices, and becoming an individual in what is otherwise a sea of player clones.

Maybe some of the "subclasses" mentioned in the design notes could instead be specializations INSIDE the class. A pyromancer would simply be a mage that focused on more offensive, fiery options for their skill choices/upgrades.
...But if you wanted, you could go half way, or maybe focus mainly on heat manipulation (Ice&Fire).

Classes that function drastically different should definitely get their own skill set, of course.


'Gigantic' is a game that I feel went in a nice direction. They too have 4 skills for each hero, plus a ultimate skill.
For each of the 5 skills, there is a mini "talent-tree". Upgrading a skill gives you two options, and each of those opens up other two that further specialize on top of the first choice, giving you a total of 4 variations per skill.

___________

For example, Mage's defensive shield could go something like this:

0. Default: Increase defense by X%

1. Lava Barrier: + melee attackers suffer damage when hitting you.
1a. Rock spikes: + X% extra defense increase. When effect wears out it explodes, dealing damage to surrounding enemies.
1b. Firewall: + All surrounding enemies take X damage per second while in area.

2. Rolling Bubble: + Increase movement speed by 20% for the duration
2a. Arcane Rush: + While moving, Auto-attack frequency doubles
2b. Reassemble: + Teleport forward X distance

Imagine the possibilities! In combination with your other skill variations, you can have endless options in ONE class. Making more from less really adds depth and denseness.
The community grows stronger when you let players analyze, explore and discuss this kind of stuff. And it makes things less boring when you still have things you haven't tried in the game! :)




XeNON_54 -> RE: News August 1, 2017: Discussing Classes (8/4/2017 9:17:31)

I think Mage's mana shield skill would be better if it was instead a damage absorb type instead of just flat +defense.
Once the shield takes a certain amount of damage it breaks and does a small AoE damage to surrounding enemies.




LouisCyphere -> RE: News August 1, 2017: Discussing Classes (8/4/2017 11:14:18)

Adding new skills would take a lot of worth (animation aside, they have to consider balancing them)
I rather have passive skills that would morph or transform the skills that we're using.

Ex. A passive that can increase the damage of Fireball, or another passive that can increase the burn damage of Fireball but decrease basic damage or a passive that makes the fireball hit multiple targets.

A passive would be easier to implement rather than full blown skills.




Exodiarc -> RE: =AQ3D= News August 1, 2017: Discussing Classes (8/7/2017 0:24:57)

0. Instead of labeling them as subclasses we can simply categorize them. Alpha classes being basic classes, beta classes being Intermediate. and omega being Advanced. Or as simple as Just Basic>Intermediate>advanced lol.(basic)warrior+(Intermediate)cleric=(Advanced) Paladin.

1. Dual weilding class that's not limited to certain weapons.(different from a gunner class like Alpha pirate.) Introduce a R-Hand and L-Hand system for any future dual weild class. How this would work out is halving the stats of both weapons which would equate to one weapon. And/or giving it a 20% offensive stat boost, with the drawback of having -10% to all defensive stats since this would clearly be a offensive class.

2. More depth to these classes. instead of having 20 classes that act like One, let's have One class that can act like 20. Anyone who's played Aqw knows what I mean lol, now that we can equip vanity items a class like warlord/VoidHighlord would be obsolete Since they have the same skills as a warrior. if you wanted a different look you'd use a costume. So it'd be much nicer to let's say, bring passives to classes and/or technical boosts depending on what role they play.(Love the huge array of classes AQW holds, one of the best features of Aqw.) it'd be lovely if we can build a class to our liking let's say a class has a total of 6 skills +one ultra skill. Like this you can switch out skills from the class interface and even create builds. while only 5 skills are displayed, the 5th being the ultra skill. Or even skill points.

3. More character customizability. Eyes, mouth, and face.

4. Housing!

5. Pvp.

As of right now this is the only thing I can think of.




Roaros -> RE: =AQ3D= News August 1, 2017: Discussing Classes (8/8/2017 4:43:27)

Guilds and end game content. Ideally for guild runs because they tend to go much better, but doesnt have to be. I think the game would be better with each class having specific gear. I know this one will never happen though.




One Winged Angel1357 -> RE: =AQ3D= News August 1, 2017: Discussing Classes (8/8/2017 14:24:04)

If the stats get some actual depth to them in terms of how they impact the game it is very possible we will see some classes needing max haste builds for optimal DPS, max armor builds for tanks, ect.

But the best system for that would be you equip items to a class and when you switch it remembers the load out do you don't have to quickly reset for your max stat or just run a single class because inventory management systems aren't in place




Neo21 -> RE: =AQ3D= News August 1, 2017: Discussing Classes (8/20/2017 17:17:59)

quote:

Needless to say, I am extremely eager to use the Paladin class. Which is a major class. There are also going to be sub-classes like Undead Slayer and Holy Defender. Actually, we could use your help coming up with a better name for the term "sub-class".


Specialist class perhaps?
Captures the fact that it's a subclass or higher tier class




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