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=WF= A Final Mystery part II

 
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7/13/2009 12:58:42   
Falerin
Legendary Loremaster


The continued thread. Time is ticking inexorably toward the conclusion.

< Message edited by Falerin -- 7/13/2009 12:59:11 >
Post #: 1
7/13/2009 13:30:09   
Krayola
Mmm, I wuv fish!


For the sake of having to go back, Here is the current puzzle.

http://i31.tinypic.com/1zvwytf.jpg

Here is the current theory to solve it.

quote:


Original: Lkeas





Sweetness! Thanks Eldron

So... yeah, my bad, the blackbuck is actually an antelope, not a gazelle. And I'll go with the other players and say the bird is probably a falcon.

What blows my mind is that he said "yes" for both the x-ray baby and the x-ray rat guesses. Weird??

So anyway, he said "pretty much" I guess in answer to the question about using the first letter of each animal name. Since it's not a definitive yes we aren't sure how important they are. But the number of animals is definitely important. If we type it out with numbers included, it'll look something like this:

1dog2goose1dog1frog1dog1frog1goose1xbaby1arm1goose1dog1goose1arm1goose
1ant1xrat1dodo1falcon1ant1goat2deer1dodo1ant1goat1ant1goat1dodo2goat
1fish1aard2giraffe1aard1fish1xbaby1goose1fish1ant1goat1aard1falcon2goat1falcon
1arm1goose2fish1aard1goat1arm1goat1dog1xbaby1dodo2goat2fish
1giraffe1aard3fish1aard2goat1ant1xbaby1frog2goat1xrat1dog1frog

If instead of typing numbers we just type however many animals there are per picture, it looks like this:

dog goose goose dog frog dog frog goose xbaby armadillo goose dog goose armadillo goose
antelope xrat dodo falcon antelope goat deer deer dodo antelope goat antelope goat dodo goat goat
fish aardvark giraffe giraffe aardvark fish xbaby goose fish antelope goat aardvark falcon goat goat falcon
armadillo goose fish fish aardvark goat armadillo goat dog xbaby dodo goat goat fish fish
giraffe aardvark fish fish fish aardvark goat goat antelope xbaby frog goat goat xrat dog frog

One thing of note is that all of these names start with one of 4 letters: A, D, F, or G, with the exception of the x-ray images. This looks strangely similar to the ADFGVX cipher, except there's no V's (unless the falcon is a vulture like Caotica suggested?). Which is worrisome because I don't understand the ADFGVX cipher very well at all; it looks quite complicated to crack. There's some info here:

http://www.richkni.co.uk/php/crypta/adfgvx.php

EDIT: Apparently there's also an ADFGX cipher with no V's, perhaps that's what was used:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ADFGVX_cipher

But it seems we need a key at some point? I wonder if Fal's clue about ramen might come in handy... but the word only has 5 letters, and Eldron's code seems to break more easily into chunks of 6 (or 12, or 3, or 4...) like so:

dggdfd fgxagd gagaxd f.a.gddd agagdg gf.a.gga fxgf.a.g afggf.a gff.a.ga gdxdgg ffgaff f.a.ggax fggxdf
(apparently this code sets off the forum censor. periods added so you can read it, no significance on the cipher :P)

How do we crack this with no key?


_____________________________

AQ DF  Post #: 2
7/13/2009 13:46:40   
tobi728822
Member

Well, i've noticed that there are 2 pictures for goose and 2 for goat, I think that each animal has 1 picture, why would those 2 specifically each have 2 different pictures
AQ DF MQ  Post #: 3
7/13/2009 13:53:59   
  Verlyrus
DragonFable Boxcat


<lordtomato> Counting Lkeas' words came up with 13 words with 6 chars each
<lordtomato> that suggests a 13 letter long key
<lordtomato> however
<lordtomato> if moved around to produce 6 'words' of 13 letters each, then that suggests a key of 6 letters

I believe it is so?
So we are trying to find either a 13 or 6 letter long key.

EDIT: I think Fal's Ramen clue was to lead to the Raman equation thingymabobber.
EDIT 2: Perhaps the 3 fish are greenfish fish fish? so gff rather than fff?

< Message edited by lordtomato -- 7/13/2009 14:05:54 >
AQ MQ  Post #: 4
7/13/2009 14:26:26   
Krayola
Mmm, I wuv fish!


<Krayola> are those 2 "deer" in the black picture really deer, or antelope. because that would make it 3 D's in a row because the dodo which is unusual. That would be the only pics in which the animals side by side start with the same letter.

<Krayola> Look at the pic though, no two animals starting with the same letter are next to each other except those "deer" and "dodo"

<Krayola> But I believe the purpose of the plural images is to prevent animals with the same letters from being side to side



I believe that those two derr in the black box are actually antelope and that the 2 D's lkeas p[osted for them should be A's.
AQ DF  Post #: 5
7/13/2009 14:34:52   
Dragonnightwolf
How We Roll Winner
Apr/Jun/Aug15


I now suspect we are looking at eldron's picture message the wrong way. YES I said message.

I just typed into google "Picture ciphers" and got a very helpful bit of info. With wikipedia's aid we may yet have "hope" of solving this riddle.

Eldron suggested a "key" to "knowledge" What if knowledge is the key we're looking for? Because falerin replied "I tried looking for such a key eldron, but without results" (More or less he's saying he was unable to locate one) to which he said he'd leave it to us.
Suggesting that they may not be helping us further on this puzzle.

Also eldron said "Then I guess we'll have to sweep it under the proverbial rug"

Something about that message makes me inclined to believe we are perhaps dealing with something verbal.

Also. Here's that link to the info on the picture cipher.



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steganography

Hope this stuff helps a whole bunch. I'll check back later cause I have some other stuff I need to go do(rl related) I'll be back later to assist further.

Oh and Eldron. That was most ingenious, using pictures for a message!
AQW Epic  Post #: 6
7/13/2009 17:57:05   
  Vivi
Outsmarting Bugs


Knowledge lacks the appropriate number of letters, so that's not the key. The comments about "Iran around..." are definitely relevant here though, he made that same "typo" on IRC.

quote:

Iran around looking for a key like that Eldron, entirely to no avail; i guess it is up to them now.

quote:

<Falerin> Iran arround for sometime about that key. Ultimately eldron decided we should sweep it under the proverbial rug.


I'm also curious about the rug...Persian rug maybe? It'd connect the Iran and rug comments together.




At the idea of re-using steganography:
quote:

[18:16] <Falerin> No dinosaurs here
[18:17] <Falerin> or anywhere


For those unfamiliar with the mosaiq puzzle, Eldron (I think it was Eldron) hinted at steganography by making a comment about a spiky terrian saurian (a stegosaurus).

< Message edited by phoenixfire555 -- 7/13/2009 18:19:19 >
AQ DF MQ  Post #: 7
7/13/2009 18:28:48   
Dragonnightwolf
How We Roll Winner
Apr/Jun/Aug15


iran around could mean another thing rather then the country. It could actually mean. I ran around. Meaning I went around something.

But I can't quite figure out what the rug comment means...yet. In another note, I wouldn't just outright dismiss the knowledge context, somehow it's important.

I remember in ultimate mk3 the first words you see on the screen after the midway logos and stuff are the words "There is no knowledge that is not power"

In this instance of knowledge however eldron directly "links" it with a key. A key to knowledge. Meaning what we're looking for is a key that will unlock the specific message.

Also, I searched for cipher rugs and only came up with cipher(weaved) rugs which is basically a dead end. So whatever it means, it's obviously not referring to that being a cipher.

Another point to make to my fellow cryptonaughts is this. We are just a week away from the final conclusion.



Take a look at this, this explains what proverbs are. Apparently there are a lot of ways to use a proverb.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Proverb

< Message edited by Dragonnightwolf -- 7/13/2009 18:29:42 >
AQW Epic  Post #: 8
7/13/2009 18:35:52   
  Vivi
Outsmarting Bugs


There's a Persian proverb "Doubt is the key to knowledge", but doubt doesn't fit the number of letters we need.

Aaron says he has something, let's see what he thinks.
AQ DF MQ  Post #: 9
7/13/2009 18:35:52   
Aaronrules380
Member

ok got the answer
spoiler:

with the key "doubt" and using a normal alphabet I get
CREATJONSHANDLJKSBTTHEFEETOFDJSTRUCTJON
now since j and I are the same in ADFGX we get
Creation's hand liks bt the feet of distruction
or CREATION'S HAND LIES BY THE FEET OF DESTRUCTION
AQ DF MQ  Post #: 10
7/13/2009 18:36:49   
  Vivi
Outsmarting Bugs


spoiler:

Doubt was right? Awesome!


< Message edited by phoenixfire555 -- 7/13/2009 18:37:22 >
AQ DF MQ  Post #: 11
7/13/2009 18:59:13   
kirbymaster2
Member

Montage time!

quote:


[14:03] <Burn> Try doubt
[14:03] <Burn> "doubt"
[14:03] <lordtomato> I doubt it, it's got 5 letters

A long, long time later....

[18:32] <Vivi|AFKing> I found a persian proverb that fits "key to knowledge", but the word they use is doubt.
[18:32] <Vivi|AFKing> 5 letters :|
[18:32] <Vinger> why it can't be 5?
[18:33] <Vivi|AFKing> We were thinking 6 or 13 and Fal semi-confirmed that
[18:33] <Vivi|AFKing> [17:46] <Vivi|AFKing> If we're restrained to 6 or 13 letters I cannot think of anything
[18:33] <Vivi|AFKing> [17:47] <Falerin> meaning you have something if you ARE not so restrained?
[18:33] <Vivi|AFKing> [17:47] <Falerin> If so you might consider errors in logic on your part?
[18:33] *Aaron knows the answer.


/faceplam

Next time, let's not doubt what Burn says...

AQ DF MQ  Post #: 12
7/13/2009 19:12:56   
Vinger
Member

Burn answer was a guess.Vivi and Aaron used the complete route.
AQ DF MQ  Post #: 13
7/13/2009 19:25:38   
Vykeria
Member

so is that right?

_____________________________

AQ  Post #: 14
7/13/2009 19:28:00   
  Vivi
Outsmarting Bugs


That is the answer to this particular puzzle, yes. Now we sit and wait for the next puzzle. I'm sure there's something really fun in store for us ^_^
AQ DF MQ  Post #: 15
7/13/2009 19:29:45   
Vykeria
Member

Okee dokee.
Although I dont exactly get these puzzles i get other puzzles so i can probably help.
AQ  Post #: 16
7/13/2009 20:41:25   
Krayola
Mmm, I wuv fish!


Knew it was 5!

< Message edited by Krayola -- 7/14/2009 2:05:26 >
AQ DF  Post #: 17
7/13/2009 20:54:54   
Dragonnightwolf
How We Roll Winner
Apr/Jun/Aug15


heck, I had no clue that it was only 5 letters.

Interesting choice for a keyword too don't you think? Doubt. I mean doubt basically means you don't believe or you don't quite "Trust" something.
AQW Epic  Post #: 18
7/13/2009 21:39:09   
  Verlyrus
DragonFable Boxcat


>.<
/headdesk
my bad... sorry guys... :(

Excellent guess, Burn!
Great work Vivi and Aaron!

Hopefully the next puzzle will be less tomatofail, and more epictomatowin! :D
AQ MQ  Post #: 19
7/13/2009 22:04:08   
cnguyen
Member

MY guess is that there's going to be a quest! And the reward will be a Creation battlesuit. If not, a gauntlet named Creation!
I know because
HAND erga gauntlet!
or
Feet of Destruction erga things you wear on your body [a battlesuit]!
We'll jsut have to wait and see

_____________________________

Post #: 20
7/13/2009 22:16:54   
mluther
Member
 

i'd like to see a new gautlet but creation and destruction? sounds allout like the creator and the devourer.
AQ MQ  Post #: 21
7/13/2009 22:22:12   
Vykeria
Member

*gasp* maybe it hints to the devourer coming soon
AQ  Post #: 22
7/13/2009 22:22:49   
Lkeas
Member

Nice work guys! So it was a 5 letter key after all? I knew you all could figure it out once we knew what type of cipher it was. Wish I could have been there for the big reveal. :) Unfortunately I'm out of town on business (out of country in fact) so my participation will be spotty at best until after Thursday. I trust you all to keep up the great progress!
AQ DF  Post #: 23
7/13/2009 23:19:27   
Dragonnightwolf
How We Roll Winner
Apr/Jun/Aug15


oh that sounds like fun lkeas. Take pictures and send me some!

Good work Aaron, you "Keyed" it in :)
AQW Epic  Post #: 24
7/14/2009 2:02:46   
Lord Asrius
Member

The key is not to overdo your puns. :P
But is the same hand as on Protus?
AQ DF  Post #: 25
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