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Time invested vs reward.

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1/11/2012 12:22:57   
Rui..
Banned


 This idea just struck my mind when i was talking about enchanting or enhancing gears.
At level 34 the experience gain stops and by then most of the players kinda invest less time on this game or log in for updates. It would be awesome if a level 34 or whatever the max level in the future to autogain 2x credits.
What are your thoughts on this fellow duelers. I am sure it would be a win win change.
Post #: 1
1/11/2012 12:42:01   
Ranloth
Banned


 In AQ or DF, when you get to the cap - you get normal Gold rewards and no Exp until it's raised. Why should ED be any different?
Besides reward sweep is planned anyway, so Exp + Credits will be scaled to Lvl (so you don't have to farm for an item for a long time).
AQ Epic  Post #: 2
1/11/2012 12:44:09   
TurkishIncubus
Member

Being max lvl is just the begining of the story not the end. I dont think it will be fair for lower lvl players.

_____________________________
Epic  Post #: 3
1/11/2012 15:05:12   
hardcore59
Member

DF isn't pvp which you dont have to have mountains of money to do good unlike ED which barely gives any
AQ DF MQ AQW  Post #: 4
1/11/2012 15:10:43   
Ranloth
Banned


 PvP or not, still falls under AE. In AQ, you have to farm for items as well and pricing can be quite steep but we make it in the end, without any bonuses at Lvl cap.

Edit:
@PD
Thank you!

< Message edited by Trans -- 1/11/2012 16:22:44 >
AQ Epic  Post #: 5
1/11/2012 15:20:12   
hardcore59
Member

so just cuz it's in the same company it has to have the same rules
AQ DF MQ AQW  Post #: 6
1/11/2012 15:23:50   
PD
Member
 

 That's not the point he's trying to make.

He's saying that bonuses are unnecessary and unfair, and cites AQ as an example. You don't need bonuses in ED to get by.

It's the same reason why most people were and still are opposed to Tax Breaks in the Government - They don't really deserve free money. And neither should you in ED.
Post #: 7
1/11/2012 15:39:16   
My Name is Jake
Banned


 It is a good idea and would help max level players to be able to buy enhancements with credits (seeing as varium enhacements are horrendously overpriced) but unfortunatly it would only help max leveled players.
AQW Epic  Post #: 8
1/11/2012 16:24:56   
Lord Nub
Member

Does that not give more incentive to reach the cap and reward the players that do?

Also, because it's not currently in another game doesn't mean anything. Is the game complete and will never be updated again?

It could perhaps jog someones mind for some sort of reward for cappers. Also tax breaks....lol if you would like to refer to the real world then how about social security? Once they reach the cap they get a check each month. Also how about retirement? Same deal there.

AQ AQW Epic  Post #: 9
1/11/2012 16:34:21   
PD
Member
 

 ^^ You pay into Social Security to get benefits later. Retirement is not working anymore and living off of what you invested into your later life.

Not a valid comparison.
Post #: 10
1/11/2012 16:45:29   
Ranloth
Banned


 Show me a game, AE of course as it makes sense, where at Lvl cap - you get bonuses. I don't recall exclusive items at Lvl cap in AQ, DF, AQW, nor MQ. That includes any bonuses.
Why would you get bonuses for getting to end Lvl? What if someone else reaches Lvl cap but next day, it goes up - not fair much? People got to enjoy the double Credits and you don't?
AQ Epic  Post #: 11
1/11/2012 16:56:39   
PD
Member
 

 I'm sticking with Trans on this one. You're not entitled to bonuses at the top nor is it fair for everyone else. Why should the Top get the easy(ier) play while the bottom go through much harder times? It's especially not fair in the context that varium highly correlates with leveling speed.

Removed off-topic and unnecessary commentary. ~Ashari

< Message edited by Ashari -- 1/11/2012 17:54:41 >
Post #: 12
1/11/2012 17:28:48   
rej
Member

Double credits is too much. But i do like the idea. How about the credit amount is raised from 32 to 34? (Fitting, since you are reaching level 34)
AQ DF MQ AQW Epic  Post #: 13
1/12/2012 1:59:16   
charwelly
Member

Well Trans it would be a good change for them to earn 2x credits it would make us more unique i guess
100% supported

_____________________________

Retired Again.
AQW Epic  Post #: 14
1/12/2012 2:07:24   
PD
Member
 

 Ideally you'd want a system that rewards effort. With the current metagame it would only mostly serve those who have varium because believe it or not having varium greatly affects leveling speed (Stat points avaliable, to higher damage outputs, to more defenses, to more credits, "squishier" opponents in the POV of yourself. Ect). Also note that it makes you lose less because you are stronger in comparison.

It would be hard to implement without outright rewarding those who pay, or at least being biased to people who pay to reap its benefits. It's collateral damage. Isn't the whole point of this to reward effort and not payment?

< Message edited by PD -- 1/12/2012 2:09:46 >
Post #: 15
1/12/2012 2:08:20   
Sipping Cider
Member

Eh, would be an unfair advantage over lower level players and right now I think missions are a good solution to credit problems.
Epic  Post #: 16
1/12/2012 2:13:20   
Lycus
Legendary AdventureGuide!


 Here are my worries about this idea:

People are already complaining that the gap between level cap and level 31 + below is already quite large, exactly why we've tried to tighten up the battles, so you get a lot more even fights - but these battles still happen, and this would just add to the advantages that level 34's have over level 29's, 30's, 31's and may be even 32's, it would even start creating a gap between level 34 and level 33.

If we continue to do what is planned, and just introduce exp/gold scaling, then that caters for this more. Level 34's will still gain the most, since they're top of the chain, but not to an unfair advantage, since level 29's - 33's (all levels will, but these are the ones that can battle level 34's), will also be on this scale, so they will be at a lot less of a disadvantage.

The game needs to be enjoyable for everyone, as much as possible. The most fairest thing to do would be to introduce the scaling system, which benefits everyone. I do know what you mean, as someone at the level cap, you theoretically are a top contributor of time and effort, since you've *probably* played more than players of lower levels. Isn't it enough rewards though that level cap items are naturally stronger than the other levels? I know it's hard to earn them, and that's the point being made - but as stated the scaling system should take care of that still.

These are just the problems that appear to me straight away on the surface of things, I understand you, and I know it's nice to be rewarded for all your effort :) but it needs to be done in a way that doesn't create gaps, or make gaps bigger between levels!
AQ AQW Epic  Post #: 17
1/12/2012 2:33:30   
Luna_moonraider
Member

@Lycus

yes u have tighten up the battle but the problem here is when u hit lvl cap as a non varium and if u do not have at least well 20+ enhancements u cant do much in 1v1.1v1=death button, if u click 1v1 and do not have any enhancements. the tightening up of lvl helped but the previous system allowed every1 to battle people 5 lvl lower than them. this really helps non varium but since the tightening all u can meet in 1v1 is variums/ maybe a few lvl 29 noobs if u r lucky but usually not the case. and mind you the non-varium/varium gap is very big now. the tightening basically made 1v1 a p2w battle mode when u hit the lvl cap. yes i can beat varium players because i have full enhancements so i dont mind clicking the so called death button or wat ya calls it ahh 1v1 button. but think bout new players i bet they dont even dare click 1v1 cause they know that the doomed if they do so. basically what u guys did was to chase away all non varium in 1v1 and forced them to do npc/jug/2v2. Reducing the amount of non varium players in 1v1 is bad for both variums and non variums. reason being varium players would vs other varium players. and non variums are basically forced to farm for full enhancements in order to stand a significant chance in 1v1 because there are not many non variums in 1v1 and most non variums prefer to play a mode they can actually well win a few battles.

_____________________________
AQW Epic  Post #: 18
1/12/2012 5:21:29   
Fay Beeee
Member

How about shortening the level cap, when you reach level 30. So 30-32 31-33, 32-34 and on the down scale also 28-30 29-31 30-32 and 31-34.?
This wild give the lower players the 5 scale, right up until level.
Not so scary for them either. :)

Just a thought.

_____________________________
Epic  Post #: 19
1/12/2012 10:07:24   
Gepard Acht
Member

^ that will probably take a long time to wait for the battle
AQ AQW Epic  Post #: 20
1/12/2012 10:50:05   
Rui..
Banned


 A varium player does not benefit a lot with this cause we just buy the 10k varium pack and are dully enchanted. The only way we could use the credits is to change class. Moreover the main benefit goes to the non var users who can start enchanting their end game items to compete with the var players. I dont thing comparing epicduel with other games is logical cause the game play is diff. And yeah try to think out of the box :)
Post #: 21
1/12/2012 11:41:43   
Ranloth
Banned


 Comparing games? I gave it as example, didn't compare them nor did anyone. It wouldn't be fair for those at Lvl 32 with end-game items (my 2ndary is L29, needs 2 more items and done) so I should be over by Lvl 31 at latest if not mid-30. Then for 3.5 Lvls I get nothing out of farming but at 34, I get my double credits so I can enchance?
No, balance will be here to change rewards which will benefit everyone. Credit boost can be acceptable, but in same way as Exp + Token - buy it for Varium, and for an hour.
AQ Epic  Post #: 22
1/12/2012 12:13:07   
Lycus
Legendary AdventureGuide!


 @Luna: I don't think your thinking about the other levels, when you're level 20, and you're put against a level 25, it was very hard for them to win, if you're level 25-30, and you pressed 1v1, it's also very hard to win against someone +5 levels from you. On the behalf of all of the lower levels, the update will make battles a lot more fairer for them to win, it may be harder at level cap, but as I said, we're hoping to be able to introduce a scaling credit system. This means those at higher levels will earn more credits, thus being able to buy more enhancements/weapons, which will help the problem you're stating. We're slowly working to try and make it fairer for all levels, and saying it's not fair that level 34's are now more likely to be put against a level 33, or a level 34, doesn't make sense, because most people will say that's a lot more fair. The credit scaling will help Non-Variums, if we can get it ready, and I do understand that it is hard to win as a Non-Varium in 1v1 with a fully enhanced Varium, but I can assure you that balance is being looked in to very heavily right now, and these things will be looked in to! :)
AQ AQW Epic  Post #: 23
1/12/2012 13:07:59   
PD
Member
 
quote:

A varium player does not benefit a lot with this cause we just buy the 10k varium pack and are dully enchanted. The only way we could use the credits is to change class. Moreover the main benefit goes to the non var users who can start enchanting their end game items to compete with the var players. I dont thing comparing epicduel with other games is logical cause the game play is diff. And yeah try to think out of the box :)


A 10K Varium package will get you the Frost Set with full enhancements on every item. The point is that varium players will be those at the top mostly and the other people will be down below - Mostly because Varium players have absurd advantages which nearly gives them a free win, and the disparity between rewards given from won/lost fights. The system would literally be rigged to favor varium players. What's the point of the non variums benefiting from this if they can't even arrive there. You don't exactly need strategy to win a fight when you have a 70-80 Stat point advantage.

As for comparing other games. The combat systems are simular enough in conception and in working to be compared.

< Message edited by PD -- 1/12/2012 13:08:55 >
Post #: 24
1/12/2012 13:34:31   
Luna_moonraider
Member

@ PD

totally agree with ya. but pd it is not 70-80 stat difference i will prove it to ya below.

Best stat a NOn var merc/tlm can have

25+6 from mjolnir
16+6 from pirate blunderbuss
13+8 from carrierzooka
16+5 from bio hazard husk

grand total:95 stat points

Best stat a varium merc/tlm can have

28+10 from delta destroyer sword
20+8 wraith gun
19+8 from eggy zooka
18+8 from frost reaper armor

grand total:119 stat points

119-95=24 stat

now that is if u are fully enhanced if u r not well that a different case. and note that the enhancing is hard as it is quite expensive to do so.most varium players will run round with +119 stat while most non var would have lesser than +95 stat maybe no enhancements and having just +70 stat that is like 49 stat difference. yes i know that the weps are rare but yeah this is the best i can do.well 40-60 stat difference would be accurate.


< Message edited by Luna_moonraider -- 1/12/2012 13:36:10 >
AQW Epic  Post #: 25
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