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8/19/2012 23:28:51   
Mother1
Member

I know in the past they couldn't do it since they didn't have the coding ability, but now that they do I think they should make the pyro fly's normal energy attack defectable instead of blockable. I say this because energy attacks when they aren't in striking form have to deal with tech and not dex yet this attack has to go through both stats (Tech to do damage and dex since it has a chance for a block. As well as shadow arts for the hunter classes and now thanks to the new system the only non phyiscal energy attack that is blockable.

Most people stopped using the pyro fly since they don't like relying on it's luck based special, and even though it did get a small buff to the special damage most people still don't use this bot. I know a lot of people would most likely say why should this bot have a normal attack that isn't blockable why the others do well the answer is simple it is the only energy bot that attacks with energy that isn't in a phyiscal form. Plus it would make more sense if it was deflectable being a non physical energy attack rather then blockable. Plus with this buff more people might want to use it more.

So tell me what do you think?

< Message edited by Mother1 -- 8/20/2012 2:38:20 >
Epic  Post #: 1
8/20/2012 2:07:06   
ReinXI
Member

supported only because the pyro-flys attack "is" a laser.. so they might as well add that since both gamma, and infernal got the deflect not block on there energy attacks
Epic  Post #: 2
8/21/2012 2:02:02   
fishing989
Member

the ply got the same thing but your talking about its Main attack and not the ST (Special attack) the (ST) is Non-blockable however the norm or Main attack is..

they did this to all Bots that has 2 attacks a mail and a (ST)
AQ DF AQW Epic  Post #: 3
8/21/2012 2:24:28   
Mother1
Member

The only reason I said this was because the pyro fly is the only energy bot that has a laser for it's main attack. So why is it still blockable when they made it so energy attacks that don't strike (Meaning using hands, claws energy claws etc) deflectable. They did it with the gamma bot, and the infernal android. Plus they admins said it themselves that the Pyro fly itself was and still is one of the more underpowered bots so why not give it this buff since it's main attack is an energy laser?
Epic  Post #: 4
8/21/2012 4:12:25   
theholyfighter
Member

Gamma Bot's special is energy-laser too yet blockable.
AQW Epic  Post #: 5
8/21/2012 4:14:34   
ReinXI
Member

they changed it to deflectable with bot changes ^
Epic  Post #: 6
8/21/2012 4:33:08   
Mother1
Member

^ Which is one of the reasons why I am pushing for the pyro fly to get this as well since they made the breakthrough.
Epic  Post #: 7
8/21/2012 4:37:34   
ReinXI
Member

I know I supported it XD I'm just telling holy fighter :P
Epic  Post #: 8
8/21/2012 13:22:50   
Rui.
Banned

 

 what ??? The pyro fly is one of the best bots around. Random skill disable is op if it works. Considering on other bot can completly destroy a class like a pyro. Secondly if pyro is given a deflected the regular blockable robot needs to be given a 25% chance to do double damage. Since my physical damage bot gets blocked its only fair it gets a chance to do more damage.

And deflected needs a boost. If i beam gets deflected half the damage needs to be returned to the user. This should apply to energy gun and aux too. Half deflected damage back to user. But them again all energy aux and guns need to have their damage boosted.
Post #: 9
8/21/2012 13:29:09   
Stabilis
Member

quote:

The pyro fly is one of the best bots around. Random skill disable is op if it works.


Is it really with the best robots? What percentage of players are currently using a Pyro Fly? Disabling a skill is overpowered if it works [on the best skill(s)]? Sure, though you also need to say that it is underpowered if it does not work [if on the worst skill(s)].

Grandeur. This robot is only luck, which is why I do not rely on it, which is why I do not use it. No strategy involved.

< Message edited by Depressed Void -- 8/21/2012 13:30:08 >
AQ Epic  Post #: 10
8/21/2012 13:42:54   
Rui.
Banned

 

 all bots are luck based. You never know if your main attack will get blocked or not. The special makes them unique. If you campare all robot specials the pyro has the potential to be the most devastating. You can rage special and do a sure shot 80% unblockable undeflected damage on other bot can do this. And if it disable the main skill of a player in first turn lol ...

You just need to know what you are doing, if the pyro primary is given deflection its too much since its just like having a gun or aux at your arsenal with an added ability to disable a skill.

The yeti special can be overcome by using 2 boosts when your gun and aux is eaten the bio borg can be dealt with by using gun aux robot heal etc but no way in hell can you over come this bots special. And mind you they all cost the same

what can be changed is give the pyro user the option to disable the skill but only for 2 turns. And the special does 0 damage one time use per match only. I would close my eyes and buy this against emp users.

< Message edited by Rui. -- 8/21/2012 13:48:32 >
Post #: 11
8/21/2012 15:08:44   
Mother1
Member

Ok I was talking about it regular attack being deflectable since it is the only bot that uses a laser for it's main attack. For all those who didn't agree with me, look at all the other bot's regular attacks. 6 of them a physical striking attacks which indeed justify them being blockable. The exception to the physical attack rule are the Assault bot and Pyro fly however the Assault bot use a physical energy attack which makes justifies it being blockable, but the pyro fly unlike the rest of the bots isn't a physical striking bot regular attack wise.

Also as I stated before they nerfed the Infernal android this way and buff the gamma bot in this way since they made this coding breakthrough so why should the pyro fly's laser attack be blockable. All energy attacks that aren't striking (Guns, aux) go against tech their opponent has to do damage, why is it that this but has to go against tech and dex while the others don't?

Lastly for those who think this is over powering the bot it isn't remember it's does 10-14 damage which improves with tech and focus. In fact it damage matches that of the assault bot, and infernal android attacks. Plus because this bot's normal is still blockable the hunter classes already have an advantage against it due to their shadow arts. Please already have put this bot into storage since it's special is so random and even though it got a buff in special damage it should still receive this buff as well since they were already hard pressed in thinking of a buff for it in the first place.

This new rule could also apply to any new bots they make in the future that has a laser primary or special as well.
Epic  Post #: 12
8/21/2012 15:24:07   
Rui.
Banned

 

 you just want to continue with the same demand taking energy laser as an excuse. But its just op and unfair to physical bot users. If you want to use the laser logic then massacare should be blockable while plasma canon, plasma bolt, fireball etc goes into deflect bucket. If all physical bots normal damage gets 2x damage chance or if the deflected robot damage backfires at the user this is just pointless. Btw Would love to see a massacre block lmao

< Message edited by Rui. -- 8/21/2012 15:28:48 >
Post #: 13
8/21/2012 15:53:14   
Mother1
Member

Masscare was blockable my friend. I remember when I was a lower level several people used it and the attack was indeed blockable. However people complained about on the forums that they didn't like the idea of an attack that cost so much to use to be blockable. Eventually they chanced it so it was unblockable and does at least 20 damage.

Also the amount of physical bots vastly out number energy bots. There are 6 phyiscal bots and only 2 energy bots. unless you want to include the gamma bot and infernal androids since they have energy special but then it would still be 4 physical 2 energy and 2 that can do both.

Also how is the pyro fly oped? because it has a special that can disable someone's build if it hit's the right move? Guess what that is based on luck my friend. If you could choose the move you wanted 100% of the time then it would be overpowered, if you could use it more then one per battle then it would be overpowered. Or if you could have both then it would be overpowered. But to make the special more balanced they made it random.

So tell me how is it fair that a move that relies on tech to both attack and damage be affected by dex which is for all physical forms off attack which include strikes.

Besides you read the posts yourself as well some people don't use it because they don't like relying on luck.

< Message edited by Mother1 -- 8/21/2012 16:02:24 >
Epic  Post #: 14
8/21/2012 16:20:39   
Rui.
Banned

 

 wow i joined in the delta phase when they released the wraith items. About 9 months old here. Do you have a video of massacare being blocked? it was just 3 months back did i notice supercharge was a 3 hit move.
As for the op part here are 3 reasons. No robot has a sure shot damage except the pyro special that does fixed 80% damage this is physical damage so yea your logic should make it blockable.
Normal damage being deflectable makes this just like a very powerful aux.
And lastly its a small friggin fly my yeti should be able to nom nom it for breakfast lol but seriously laser can be deflected using a mirror so technically either the whole damage or half damage gets gets deflected back to the user needs to be put it place same goes for gamma and infernal.
Post #: 15
8/21/2012 16:49:24   
Mother1
Member

That was a while ago so no. But I do remember people complaining about it being blockable since you have to spend 33 energy min for this and 60 for it fully powered which is a lot of energy and even more painful for bounty hunters since they don't have a strike move to recover energy.

As for the pyro fly being the only bot to have a sure damage special no wasn't. The Azreal borg has always had an ublockable special attack as well. and now the baby yeti has the same thing as well. Sure these due less damage then the pyro fly but they are unblockable and have grantee damage.

Ok for your second one you forgot about sidearms since those are unblockable as well, but don't forget that classes with high resist (cyber hunter, with it's plasma armor, and just about any build with high tech) can reduce the damage done by this bot not to mention it is has to worry about being blocked as well? but seriously the pyro fly is the first bot of it's kind that has a non physical energy attack just like the gamma bot was the first bot to have an energy special. Also if they made more bots that attacked like the pyro fly (meaning using a non striking energy attack as a normal attack) I wouldn't mind if they made it deflectable.

Ok for the last part I will respond to both. If the baby yeti could disable the pyro fly then they should give the Azreal borg back the ability to nerf the bio borg's ability it would only be fair if the baby yeti could disable the pyro fly for two turn (ok don't take that seriously since I was going with your joke)

But seriously if they made deflects this way it would be the opposite side of the bio borg's ability which reflects half of the malee damage back at the user with the exception of the strike itself doing it's full damage. But in all honestly while it wouldn't fit here, it would make a great idea for a special ability for a new robot. Of course it would have to have the same immunity to the azreal borg's special like the bio borg does but it sounds like a cool Idea.

< Message edited by Mother1 -- 8/21/2012 16:50:42 >
Epic  Post #: 16
8/21/2012 17:00:04   
ND Mallet
Legendary AK!!!


 @mother 1. Saying that you need tech to improve the damage and dex for it to hit and that is why it should be deflectable can be translated right over to any and every blockable attack, like Bludgeon or Berzerker for example. They need strength to improve and dex for them to hit so should they be deflectable rather than blockable?
2. Saying that because it's energy that it should be deflectable means I can argue that all energy based attacks(skills and strike alike) should be deflectable rather than blockable or unblockable.
3. It's a normal bot attack. All normal bot attacks can be blocked. It's the specials that generally can't be.
AQ DF MQ AQW Epic  Post #: 17
8/21/2012 17:17:29   
Mother1
Member

ND Mallet guy it wasn't until this coding breakthrough came that this was possible. Remember the gamma bot's attack was blockable in the past, and I can also agrue the same with the baby yeti special being blockable before it was buff. The infernal android was also made deflectable but unlike with gamma it was a nerf instead of a buff since it's energy attack was unblockable before.

Also what you are talking about is a physical attack that does physical damage with the bludgeon, and as for berzerker while the primary can decide what kind of damage it does the fact of the matter is that you are still using a weapon to strike with it. The pyro fly does neither of these. I never said that energy moves that are in the form of strikes should be deflectable only the ones in the form of long range (Meaning non physical) that is what would separate it from the assault bot since it does energy attack damage but in the form of a strike not a beam. Same could be said with the berzerker.

< Message edited by Mother1 -- 8/21/2012 17:18:19 >
Epic  Post #: 18
8/21/2012 17:26:09   
ND Mallet
Legendary AK!!!


 You're arguing that because it's energy that it needs to be deflectable. Because it improves with tech and not dex that it should be deflectable. Every bot attack increases with tech. If the laser was physical would you be arguing for it still? It's still a laser improving with tech and having to go against dex but instead it now has to go through even more defense because it's physical and can get blocked. Overload improves with dex and is energy, should that be blockable? Your arguments are nothing more than "If X has Y and Z is similar to X then Z should have Y too." The problem is that Z, the normal Pyro Fly attack, in this situation is more closer to V, the other normal bot attacks, rather than X, the deflectable energy special on Infernal and Gamma.
AQ DF MQ AQW Epic  Post #: 19
8/21/2012 18:29:56   
Mother1
Member

Robots in the games are machines so of course they would improve with technology. The only other stat that would make some sort of sense to make it improve with is support since a bot is also used for that, but they choose technology for bots.

Also I was talking about an attack that attack with pure energy <in this case since the attack is just that energy> (that don't involve a strike or physical contact) be deflectable not attacks that work with something other then tech that are pure energy being blockable. That was the main point I was trying to argue from the start. ND mallet guy nothing else. Plus the staff wasn't sure how to buff this bot in the first place so I thought hey why not make it's energy beam deflectable instead of blockable along with the buff they gave to it's physical attack.

Also about the energy attacks that work with dex none of those are blockable or deflectable but at the same time If they had to have an effect on them I would say deflectable since they are just that energy attacks that don't involve striking (which involves strength in this case) just about every attack that invloves strength that has a physical form of attack be it energy or phyiscal (which excludes sidearms since while they involve strength it doesn't invlove a physical strike) is blockable with the exception of Massacre (which was changed due to people complaining about using so much energy only for the attack being blocked) That was the logic I was going by with attack for a buff.
Epic  Post #: 20
8/21/2012 19:23:01   
Rayman
Banned


 I Wont support more bots being deflectable, its just to much, the dmg already inprove with Tech and to make the bot hit the 100% all the time you need Tech. So you just need tp spam tech and use bot and you got a free High Dmg Hit, And builds that are supposed to do block wont work because its to simple, just spam tech and use the bot and there u got free Dmg.
AQW Epic  Post #: 21
8/21/2012 19:40:35   
Mecha Mario
Mechanized Plumber


 All balance suggestions, and discussions belongs in the balance thread. The Reminders on Posting did mention where to post for balance suggestions.

quote:

Balance Suggestions
These types of suggestions do not belong here and still should go to the Balance Discussion Thread in the EpicDuel General Discussion. Changes to class skills, stats or suggestions of new skills or stats are considered this type of suggestion.


For that reason, locking this up.
DF MQ AQW Epic  Post #: 22
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