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Nerf Malfunct and Smokescreen

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3/3/2013 12:29:51   
1wd
Member
 

 Malfunct is now a bit OP because, now that resistance is nerfed, Malfunct should be nerfed to reflect on that. Smokescreen should be nerfed as well because the improved bloodlust can help BHs regenerate catastrophic amounts of hp now.
Post #: 1
3/3/2013 14:11:48   
Trifire
Member
 

 Dude they are fine where they are at. They already nerfed malf, lol. They shouldn't nerf smokescreen becuase then my caster mage would be OP.
Post #: 2
3/3/2013 15:58:35   
  Exploding Penguin
Moderator


 Blood lust needs nerfing by 2-3%, not smoke. Malfunction already got nerfed by 3 points of tech on all levels (which is about 1 resistance point or less), so they're exactly equal, just that one has a support requirement and removes dex, and the other has a strength requirement and removes tech.
Epic  Post #: 3
3/4/2013 0:32:24   
Goony
Constructive!


 In my opinion 1wd is on to something here...

Let me put it this way, the removal of enhancements means that there are less statistics, therefore there is less defence and resistance on players characters now. Weapon damage remained the same as did the skill progression values. Skills improve more by level than by statistic up to a point, normally around 6-7 skill points!

The reduced HP and less defence means that these debuffs are far more effective than they were before Omega, whereas intimidate has gone the other way due to changes to skill progressions!

The whole game now revolves around the use of these two skills and they would be the 2 most widely used 1st turn skills in the game since most players now use a class that has one of these skills... Does that indicate that there is an issue with these skills, to me yes!
Epic  Post #: 4
3/4/2013 0:51:07   
rayniedays56
Member

@ goony.

I agree that a slight nerf for these would be best, but not pushing it.

I have pulled these from the wiki:

quote:

Smoke Screen
Improves With: Technology (+1 Dexterity reduction at 22 Technology; +1 Dexterity reduction per 4 Technology after)


I say +1 Des reduction at 22 technology with +1 reduction per 4.5 Technology would be a good enough nerf. This means, instead of +7 dex reduction at 46 technology would be turned to +5 dex reduction.

Also, adding a +2 EP cost would pull it off much better. The same would be put on malfunction.




Bloodlust does NOT need a nerf. I found this:

quote:

BHs regenerate catastrophic amounts of hp now.


6HP every 100 damage is catastropic???
AQ DF MQ AQW Epic  Post #: 5
3/5/2013 4:39:34   
zion
Member

Can't agree more with Goony here. Every BH uses it as a first move since it works absolutely perfectly with all their other moves (including passives and finishing move). Ditto with Malf for CH. The only TMs who don't use malf as a first move are crazy tech abuse casters.
AQ DF MQ AQW Epic  Post #: 6
3/5/2013 21:27:15   
santonik
Member

smoke takes (easyly) over 40 dex out.
if i have 46+32=78 dex. my defence is 24-29
78-40=38dex my defence is 12-15

Look this
my defence(24-29) minus smoke(12-15) = my defence (12-14)
That gives more 12-14 damage 3 rounds
total extra damage (12-14)x3=(36-42)

same is malf

Smoke works 5 ways rising hit% , take out some dex(less defence),reduce blocks changes and reduce some skills and you gain rage.

Malf works 5 ways rising deflection changes, take out energy defence, reduce deflection, reduce some skills and gain rage.

i dont using this calculation armors at all because those gives 0-10 armor(depends defence)
and i dont use hybrid(+6/+5) or others passive shield. Tacticalm (+10)physical cyber. (+10)energy defence


Thats why i want those debuffs nerff little bit more. that is my opinion.
I want only more balance.

Maybe this is little nerf. When they hit. Hit doing 85% damage+little nerfs smoke/malf

it is still good move.
Epic  Post #: 7
3/5/2013 23:35:42   
Giras Wolfe
Member

Goony is absolutely right. I can have 5 focus, and a -41 malfunction that absolutely devastates my opponents defenses. Why should all builds seemingly revolve around these 2 skills?
AQ AQW Epic  Post #: 8
3/6/2013 0:12:19   
Drianx
Member

quote:

Why should all builds seemingly revolve around these 2 skills?

Very good question. Tank Caster Mages are doing fine without it because Mages have other worthy burst damage skills. But hunters are stuck with using debuffs because
- Poison is weak
- Stun Grenades are weak
- Multi shot is weak

So, besides Massacre, the debuff (Smoke/Malf) is a must for hunters, but not for Mages.

On the other hand, shouldn't shields be nerfed as well?

< Message edited by Drianx -- 3/6/2013 0:13:00 >
AQW Epic  Post #: 9
3/6/2013 0:14:13   
Giras Wolfe
Member

quote:

shouldn't shields be nerfed as well


Um...no?
AQ AQW Epic  Post #: 10
3/6/2013 3:37:32   
A.T
Member

If malf and smoke were to work in such a way that they decrease equal amount of res/def rather than dex/tech it would most likely be balanced.
AQ DF MQ  Post #: 11
3/6/2013 3:41:10   
Renegade Reaper
Member

i was thinking the same thing. with fewer stats, you have less defenses. in which case, these skills should
have been nerfed to reflect that change. instead they remain as if enhancements were still here, but they arent.

a small nerf is more than justified.
AQ DF MQ AQW Epic  Post #: 12
3/6/2013 7:32:35   
Drianx
Member

@Giras
Usually a shield is stronger than the nerf. For example, debuffing 40 technology with a lv7 malfunction takes away less than 10 resistance points, which are largely covered by a lv1 energy shield.

SO nerfing debuffs will make them useless against classes that can raise energy shield or defense matrix.

I'd rather see shields buffing a percentage like this:

- Assault Bot removes 65% of STAT debuff.
- Shield removes 90% of RESISTANCE debuff.

Energy Shield: removes 90% of resistance points debuffed:

level 1: 20 energy required
level 2: 18 energy required
level 3: 16 energy required
level 4: 14 energy required
level 5: 12 energy required
level 6: 10 energy required
level 7: 8 energy required
level 8: 6 energy required
level 9: 4 energy required
level 10: 2 energy required

< Message edited by Drianx -- 3/6/2013 7:41:21 >
AQW Epic  Post #: 13
3/6/2013 7:35:59   
Ranloth
Banned


 Drianx, apart from that, since Tech and Dex both have slower progression (or the same instead) and we have less stat points than back in Delta, Energy Shield and Defence Matrix are even more efficient. I'd blame it on the scaling of Shields as well but won't clogg up the thread since I've explained it in my own one around a week ago: http://forums2.battleon.com/f/tm.asp?m=21140776 - and you've replied to it so yeah.
AQ Epic  Post #: 14
3/6/2013 7:38:43   
Drianx
Member

My point is - and I expressed it more or less in that thread too - that shields are too strong for the debuffs. Check my suggestion above for limiting their effectiveness.
AQW Epic  Post #: 15
3/6/2013 7:42:54   
Ranloth
Banned


 That is an interesting one. 90% could be a bit too much though; they are effective, I agree, but there is still the case of not getting your stats back (Tech/Dex) so you suffer from lower blocking/deflections, and skills are affected. Perhaps 80-85% would be better (probably 80%) and stat being as it is now. Concept is interesting though. How about Azrael Bot? It has 65% on both but that one debuffs Shields.
AQ Epic  Post #: 16
3/10/2013 20:56:16   
xxDantExx
Member

everyone is talking about balance but w/ all the class only mages ( both tech & blood ) have deadly aim,,
sidearm goes w/ strength and w/ mages building str's their gun damage is obviously higher than the rest of the classes...
...how about if deadly aim should be nerfed as well,,, ( if talking about balance then everyone should have a balance in side arm damage as well,
......depending on the statistic of the strength )...
AQ DF MQ AQW Epic  Post #: 17
3/14/2013 22:10:49   
Trifire
Member
 

 Yeah, the nerfs should be nerfed. LOL. So should the shields because of the stat scaling. Also a tank hunter build works too you know.
Post #: 18
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