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Bring Back Old Passives and Make Other Classes better

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2/10/2014 0:20:14   
...Porsche...
Member
 

 Hello everyone,
My name is Porsche, I’ve been a long time supported and contributor to the game since 2009. I really enjoyed passive skills, I believe they added much more intensity to battles. I think certain classes that have these active skill armors are put at a disadvantage when compared to other more specialized classes like TM and BH. Currently, these two classes dominate the game and I feel as though other classes are hard put to compete effectively.
I propose that we take a second look at passive skills, we find alternative ways of dealing with dominate TMs and BHs, and we find ways to help TLMs, CHs, BMs, and Mercs who are currently struggling in the new gaming dynamic. If we don’t soon, I think the game could die.
What are your thoughts and suggestions?

< Message edited by ...Porsche... -- 2/10/2014 0:37:13 >
Post #: 1
2/10/2014 0:25:16   
  Exploding Penguin
Moderator


 No, not everyone thinks old passives were better. I do, and I would love to see passives return, but I don't think everyone does.

Hybrid armor is a specialty of merc and makes the class more unique. Using cores in a way that takes away a class's unique attributes is simply something I can't support.

No, I don't think TM deserves a nerf. I'm a BM and I win against them fairly often. I don't see how they can be OP, I can only see how they're overused, and that's because the strength build they host is very simple and easy to use, is fast, and gets a decent (but not great) ratio.

Popularity =/= overpowered. I'm surprised at the amount of people who aren't willing to change their build to counter particularly overused builds that they lose against quite often because the overused build is a good counter to their current one. I wasn't doing too well against strength TMs and BHs, but I just changed my build 2 or 3 times and found a very successful one and I'm quite content with my win rate now. I guess not everyone does this, and gets too clung onto a single build.
Epic  Post #: 2
2/10/2014 0:37:29   
Mother1
Member

@ OP

Personally I would love to see those passive armors go back to being passives especially hybrid armor since with that armor many focus 5 builds with the infernal android have a great way to stall to power up that accursed bot's special to rage blast you.

Especially if you don't have the necrosis bot, using a poison class or the poison bot. But what I want and what the game actually needs are two different things so unless what I want is what the game needs then it shouldn't happen.

also you know why TM and BH are used mostly by the masses? Because there simple and effective builds have been found for these classes that give decent win rates. With the other classes most of the decent builds I have seen takes brains to use and most players sadly don't like having to think too much which is why they stay away from those classes and go with the classes that have effective and simple builds to use.
Epic  Post #: 3
2/10/2014 0:46:31   
Matt 1000
Member

I agree old passives were alot better in every way. The passives didnt have one stand out overpowered skill like we have now with tech mages assimilation and battery back up. Those skills blow away hybrids and blood lust without question, and new shadow arts and energy parasite are almost useless. Deadly aim was one of the most fun skills in epic duel all it needed was a little nerf to bring it in-line with the other passives.
AQW Epic  Post #: 4
2/10/2014 0:55:13   
Cyber Dream
Member

Ah, as a Merc....I would love to see Passives come back. Every Merc I fight, I always ask them about the Hybrid skill. MOST of them I ask don't even use the skill anymore. So from the Merc POV, we took a nerf. Idk about the other classes. It's hard to tank as a merc without passives. Even when I have 340+ res and def unbelievable damage is still done to me. So my suggestion would be to either nerf str or bring back passives. (MERCS POV)
AQW Epic  Post #: 5
2/10/2014 1:01:59   
RUHULSAM
Member

i supprt that previous one was far better
Epic  Post #: 6
2/10/2014 1:02:02   
Mother1
Member

@ matt

The reason they got rid of passives sadly was because they wanted to get rid of must haves in order to "Increase variety and diversity." Oh the irony of this since all this really did was change what was a must have.
Epic  Post #: 7
2/10/2014 1:05:33   
1baronisme
Member

They should seriously bring back this and put in Power Weekend once a month help others get to 40 and help 40 get to higher ranked WAY easier...

_____________________________

~Dennis The Beast~
Epic  Post #: 8
2/10/2014 1:12:18   
Matt 1000
Member

Removing passives gave less diversity and made everyone build copy the most OP builds because nothing else worked and hop to tm and bh. Since they were the only ones which got half decent passives to active switches.
AQW Epic  Post #: 9
2/10/2014 1:13:28   
Cyber Dream
Member

This a topic we should really be hard on. Changing Passives to Actives was a big mistake and should have been discussed more. I know alot of time was put changing it but alot MORE time should be put into revamping it. Lets admit it, we all thought that changing Passives to Actives was gonna be a change for the better. But it kinda turned out to be a change for the worse.
AQW Epic  Post #: 10
2/10/2014 1:15:07   
Pen in Hoof
Banned


 Hi!

This is my first post on this account, and boy, what a good place to leave a comment!

I'm certainly not a wizard with stats, skill trees, and the like. But I do have an idea or two, might as well run it up the flag and see if anyone salutes it.
Personally, I feel that returning to passives would be taking a step back. Mathematically speaking, the rate in which bloodlust and deadly aim would be growing in comparison to the static skills like hybrid and mineral armor at later levels would cause other problems later down the line.

don’t misunderstand me, I’m not saying that returning to passives is a bad idea. I’m only saying that there might be better alternatives if they were well-reasoned thoughts. I do think the game has the aptitude for more versatility as it stands now. However, these are not very easily attained.

I think that certain classes require more time, logic, and critical thinking skills. Now, those are not necessarily bad things, however, I do think all the classes should have at least the possibility of having a choice between “logic” builds and “clicker” builds.

I think the problem is a little deeper than what people first assume. One the one hand, there is a decent group of people that are doing well with either TM or BH. On the other hand, there is another group of people, that have done a lot of work, and are doing well with other classes.

Instead of pointing the finger at BH or TM, I think our energy would be best spent advocating for increased versatility for the other classes. If we simply complain more about these two “popular” classes, all that will likely result is a nerf of those classes. Although it might “band-aid” the issue, it really doesn’t solve the problem.

In a perfect world, all players would be able to choose what kind of style they want to play, what kind of class they want to play, and be able to do marginally well. However, we know that right now a few of the classes are simply more evolved and “steam-lined” if you will let me use the phrase. I think the solution lies somewhere in adjusting the skill trees of the other classes so they can more equally match those of the highly efficient TM and BH.

Signing off for the first time (please be gentle)!

Pen in Hoof!


< Message edited by Pen in Hoof -- 2/10/2014 1:23:04 >
Post #: 11
2/10/2014 6:26:39   
Jacob [Back to ED]
Member

Absolutely, as a matter of fact they just copy their build, and might change to TM to copy the build. Which is a stupid think actually.

And I really hope that they would bring back Passive skills. They truly added fun and excitement to the game. Nevertheless, made a vast of builds. Not only Strength TM.




Alas, this game was perfect back in Beta, Gamma, and Delta. But now it's just a mess!
Epic  Post #: 12
2/10/2014 6:30:16   
Theclown
Member

i dont agree i think the balance is better than in delta time


greats,

Turles
Epic  Post #: 13
2/10/2014 6:37:20   
kosmo
Member
 

 i dont support the return of passives;
this change has a very big potential, passives were pretty hard to balance expecially since they were doing totally different things, and belive me or not but this change is getting better evry balance update, it needs still good work but this is the right direcrtion for me.
Epic  Post #: 14
2/10/2014 7:56:49   
ZamuraiED
Member

We can all see clearly, even the 'creators' of epicduel, that since the new update (taking armors etc) a lot of people have stopped playing, right now there is 253 people online.. that is a joke.
At this time if the armors and passive cores weren't taken there would be 1000+ people online.
It is starting to get annoying battling the same people over and over again.
Epic  Post #: 15
2/10/2014 8:06:29   
omixxx
Member

I support this post I believe passives should return
Epic  Post #: 16
2/10/2014 8:07:17   
DarkDevil
Member

1. passives are not coming back
2. what tells you that removing passives are the reason everyone quits ? everyone has his own reasons.
AQ Epic  Post #: 17
2/10/2014 8:51:02   
wildtorres
Member
 

 Yes i completely agree with porsche... day by day the game is becoming a one sided game where only tm and bh are playing and winning...
Post #: 18
2/10/2014 8:56:07   
OverlordED
Member

Totally Agree. We need the old passives back, they should've made a nerf to the must haves such as the Deadly Aim, and other overpowered skills. Also it was much more fun at least playing while having passive skills. I'm a BH and having Blood Lust and Shadow Arts was just awesome, I quite expected it to be a bad thing that people would dislike, because I didn't like it myself, and what people told me they thought about the new active instead of passives when I asked.
Post #: 19
2/10/2014 8:58:24   
Ranloth
Banned


 No, old passives won't be back under any circumstances. It was said by the Devs themselves, soon after the change, and it was justified. They will not be back, no matter how much players will complain.

Nerfing wasn't even a solution. Passives as a concept was hindering the balance, in a way, and removal of them was the best solution. It was justified plenty of times as well, and some players could see the reason for it.

Not everyone will like change, but you have a choice to: adapt or quit. Simple as. You can't ever please everyone, no matter how much you try.

quote:

Nightwraith @Nightwraith_ED
Passives seem great. Bonus power for little sacrifice. However, no strategy. Builds become stagnant because you HAVE to invest in passives.
https://twitter.com/Nightwraith_ED/status/399187782146330624
quote:

Nightwraith‏ @Nightwraith_ED
I guess if all else fails, we could always revert to the age of Diamond Blades (+10 Dmg for Hunters) and Supercharge (100+ Dmg for Mages)
https://twitter.com/Nightwraith_ED/status/399194448455692291

In other words, the idea of bringing back actives has been vetoed - it will never happen. And if you didn't get the 2nd tweet - it's was sarcasm.

< Message edited by Trans -- 2/10/2014 9:09:25 >
AQ Epic  Post #: 20
2/10/2014 9:10:30   
...Porsche...
Member
 

 Everyone who doesn't support this post you all have your own opinions but you must agree with me some classes like tactical merc are terrible atm and need a serious buff

< Message edited by ...Porsche... -- 2/10/2014 9:11:01 >
Post #: 21
2/10/2014 9:11:07   
ZamuraiED
Member

In reply to trans.

It is clearly obvious the mods won't do anything about it, I see two mods playing G00NY and sundance.

They make these changes and barely test them for themselves they don't even notice how bad they have made this game.

more people would agree with me on the fact that some changes need to be made and the mods should test it aswell themselves.

Even this x10 thing is pointless, i know it isn't much change because it's only x10 but it's remotely pointless in many ways.
Epic  Post #: 22
2/10/2014 9:19:26   
Ranloth
Banned


 Mods only test, the ultimate decision is Rabble's and/or Titan's. The Mods will only give feedback and the Devs will make changes, if they themselves deem them to be necessary - so feedback from Mods doesn't have to be listened to 100%.

x10 wasn't pointless. Yeah, sure, it's big numbers and living with 1HP is more frustrating than ever, but it fixed many rounding problems with ED as well as each stat point giving you a bonus - as opposed to having to invest 4-6 stat points to get a bonus damage/defense. Before, decimals were always rounded up - x10 fixed it. If you weren't aware of how it works behind-the-scenes (how rounding works, and so on), I'm not surprised you see it as unnecessary - and likewise with many other players.

Regardless, passives will not be making a comeback, ever. Not in the form they were at least, so actives are here to stay.
AQ Epic  Post #: 23
2/10/2014 19:28:49   
Emperor_Blitz
Member

Tm's have been op for over a month now it's really annoying besides when we did have passives we had more players than 250, 250 is just a joke and bringing passives back would be a good idea.
Epic  Post #: 24
2/10/2014 19:41:03   
Mother1
Member

@Emperor_Blitz

People are leaving for more than just that change. Many other problems besides this are causing problems that are causing people to quit not just TM being strong due to the change of passives to actives.

Epic  Post #: 25
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