Home  | Login  | Register  | Help  | Play 

Revision of certain rules possible?

  		Logged in as: Guest
  Printable Version
All Forums >> [AE Forum Resources] >> Forum Support and Suggestions >> Revision of certain rules possible?
Forum Login
Message << Older Topic   Newer Topic >>
11/9/2010 17:55:54   
Ash The Phantom
Member

Some may remember my previous thread here made almost a month ago, I had it deleted because after revising it, it seemed more of an attack on the moderator's and AK's here rather than a proposition of change. I'm re-posting it to leave out my opinions of the mods and AK's themselves, and focusing only on my opinions of certain rules. I did not mean to cause offense or harm to any AK or moderator, and I give my apologies if I did.

I'll be up-front, here. I'd like to propose a revision of certain rules on these forums. After spending a lot of time on another game's forums, I noticed that they allowed a lot of freedom in their forums. Discussion of suggestions, future content, silly joke threads and even limited off-topic discussion, and yet spamming, hate threads, and the general riff-raff was kept to a minimum, purely out of the power of the user's self-control and minimal moderation on part of the forums staff. Then when I return here I have to remember that I'm very restricted in my ability to post, refraining from posting simple discussion because I fear getting into trouble.

I'm not saying get rid of the rules and allow chaos to overtake these forums, no. But I believe certain rules in the General Discussion Forums are far too restricting. I find it hard to think of a genuine discussion topic that isn't against the rules or already made in the form of an "Official" thread that only vaguely covers my own topic of discussion.

This brings me to my first point: "Official" threads, Tagged threads, and threads that otherwise restrict the amount of user-made discussion topics, I believe, should be kept to a bare minimum. As things are now, I find that there are too many of them. As I'm typing this, there are FOUR Official Threads in the AQ GD, out of a total of 13 threads. While they do serve a purpose in keeping duplicate threads to a minimum, this is also a problem. We should allow users to make their own threads, and allow these to become unofficial "Official" threads. There's a feeling of fear on these forums, things feel rather serious, uptight and suppressing because users don't have the freedom they think they ought to have, a lot of people fear posting simple things because it could get them into trouble, myself included. Allowing users to make a thread and have it made "Official" can do a lot for boosting a forum's "Self-esteem", so to speak.

I'd also like to mention "Suggestion" threads in the GD. While there are "Suggestion" subforums, these do not cover the kind of suggestions some people might have, and the General Discussion board is the only other place to go to. The AQ Suggestion board is the prime example of what I think the other suggestion boards should be like, allowing free posting of user topics and feedback in that thread. While an example like the AQW Suggestions board is organized for suggestion types, it's not user friendly in terms of specific suggestions and user feedback. My prime example of a change that should be allowed is a suggestion thread made in the AQW General Discussion about a PvP Server earlier today. That wouldn't fit into any kind of Suggestion board for AQW, yet it's against the rules for discussion in the GD. Why? It's a wonderful topic for discussion and a good way to get a pretty good suggestion out there where it wouldn't fit anywhere else. Suggesting that it be added is one thing, but discussing it is another. I call these "I think there should be..." threads, and I see them often. They're made often enough, but deleted on sight for being "suggestions" when you can clearly discuss the topic in the GD without harm. If you can't post it in the suggestion's board and you can't post it in the GD, you can't post it anywhere, and you can't give a suggestion out that could potentially be the best thing in the game since weaponry. My suggestions for this would be to either change how the Suggestion boards work in AQW, DF, MQ and the other games to be more like AQ's. If you can't do that, then allow unique suggestions to be openly discussed in the GD. Unique suggestions include game functions, server suggestions, new quest lines, etc. It would also help the Moderators and AK's out by having one less type of thread to have to vigilantly look out and delete on sight. In other words, suggestion threads can be nice topics for open discussion, and certain types of suggestions that don't fit into the suggestion board should be permitted in the GD.

I'll use a theoretical example as my next one. A person posts on the General Discussion forum of AdventureQuest, the topic is "Is there something about the game that gets on your nerves?". People begin to post, but the thread is later deleted. The reason? "Use the (Dis)Accomplishment thread to discuss this subject". However, the rules also state that idle chatter in the (Dis)Accomplishment thread is considered "spam" and will be deleted. This has happened a lot in the past with similar circumstances and outcomes. I believe that, while similar to a (Dis)Accomplishment thread, it's not exactly the same and can be discussed in a completely different manner. IF it takes a turn that makes the thread into a duplicate, then it should be deleted in favor of the official thread.

That brings me to my next point about moderation. Moderators shouldn't jump on a thread that has the potential to become a duplicate or rule-breaking thread. Assumptions like that just cause more headache than leaving the thread alone, because just as it has potential to become a rule-breaking thread, it has the potential to become a great discussion. If it seems to be taking a wrong turn, warn the user(s) responsible, and if they continue, take action, delete the posts and warn the rest of the users in the thread to avoid turning the thread into a duplicate or rule-breaking thread at risk of the thread's locking or deletion. I've only seen this done a few times since I've been a part of these forums, which has been a very long time.

Long story short, I beleive there should be more freedom in what we can post as a "General Discussion" thread. It's hard to find a topic that isn't "against the rules" or taken over by an "official" thread, and I believe it could boost friendly activity to a great degree.

_____________________________

Pass the detritus!
AQ DF MQ AQW  Post #: 1
11/9/2010 18:15:57   
Skurge
The Dealer


 +80% posts I've made in the General Discussion have been deleted for reasons I never even knew existed. What your saying makes alot of sense, there are so many
threads like '=AQW= Arcangrove Discussion Thread,' made by Archknights or Moderators to supposedly prevent 'spamming'..

Having to give people a little freedom could prevent title chasing also, it's too easy for forum users to keep their eyes on a board and report something quickly so they could
be considered for a job like the ones AKs or Mods have.

~S
AQ DF MQ AQW Epic  Post #: 2
11/9/2010 18:56:05   
ClaytonPoweredUp
Member

I agree the forums are VERY constricted and sometimes I'm nervous to make a post due to a mod jumping me.
AQ DF MQ AQW Epic  Post #: 3
11/10/2010 3:06:12   
The Forgotten
Exquisitely pathological


 Different games are built by different teams. Each one has its own position on suggestions. AQ is built by staff that were once players. As a result, they're more open to suggestions than AQW.

For AQW, suggestions are taken depending on what the staff desires. If they're not interested in a type of suggestion, it's not going to be looked at, and any posting of that type of suggestion would be in vain. A PVP server might appeal to certain users, but it's probably not feasible. Suggestion threads also happen to have a tendency to become petitions or spam/flame threads when left for all to post in, and none of those are appealing outcomes.

As for the locking of threads... you could just PM the staff/assistant in question if you want an explanation. If someone locks a thread, they've got a good reason for doing so. It's far easier just to speak with the person doing the locking, rather than suggesting a change in policy. Locks are handled on a case-by-case basis, so the best way to appeal them is to go directly to the AK/Mod.

The same applies to Official/Unofficial threads. If you think the AK/Mod's decision was improper, you're going to get better results by going to them directly.
AQ AQW  Post #: 4
11/10/2010 3:27:16   
Ash The Phantom
Member

I'm going to quote Everest, when I had my previous thread deleted he said this to me in a PM:

quote:

... I also hope you didn't request the thread be deleted because you felt nobody would listen to you; if that's the case I can assure you that no thread in that forum is simply written off with no rumination involved on our parts.


I don't expect anyone to change anything based on the opinions of one rather insignificant user, but it's nice to be heard.

As for your post:

quote:

A PVP server might appeal to certain users, but it's probably not feasible.

But the thread could be used to discuss player views on the matter. That's an honest-to-goodness discussion. It may not be current in-game content, but it's a harmless discussion that I believe should have the same opportunity as anyone else's thread.

quote:

Suggestion threads also happen to have a tendency to become petitions or spam/flame threads when left for all to post in, and none of those are appealing outcomes.


I'll quote a section of my original post.

quote:

Moderators shouldn't jump on a thread that has the potential to become a duplicate or rule-breaking thread. Assumptions like that just cause more headache than leaving the thread alone, because just as it has potential to become a rule-breaking thread, it has the potential to become a great discussion. If it seems to be taking a wrong turn, warn the user(s) responsible, and if they continue, take action, delete the posts and warn the rest of the users in the thread to avoid turning the thread into a duplicate or rule-breaking thread at risk of the thread's locking or deletion.


My biggest beef is that most moderators and AK's assume that the thread will take a wrong turn and they don't give it a chance based on events with different users at different times. I think they should give the thread a chance to progress, if it shows signs of becoming a rulebreaking thread, take action, if not, leave it to be discussed.

< Message edited by Ash The Phantom -- 11/10/2010 11:30:13 >
AQ DF MQ AQW  Post #: 5
11/10/2010 4:36:35   
etching
The Spongy One


 >As I'm typing this, there are FOUR Official Threads in the AQ GD, out of a total of 13 threads. While they do serve a purpose in keeping duplicate threads to a minimum, this is also a problem. We should allow users to make their own threads, and allow these to become unofficial "Official" threads. Allowing users to make a thread and have it made "Official" can do a lot for boosting a forum's "Self-esteem", so to speak.

Keep in mind, if you change the thread filter to 14 days instead of 2 days you will see a lot more threads than 13.
There's one situation where user threads are promoted to official threads --- when the week's newsletter is posted.
Other than that, I fail to see any point of tagging user threads, as most user thread topics aren't broad enough
to cover the entire subject like official threads do...


>I find it hard to think of a genuine discussion topic that isn't against the rules or already made in the form of an "Official" thread that only vaguely covers my own topic of discussion.

And what's your reason for not going ahead and making your post in the designated official thread?
The official threads are meant to be generic enough to cover the subject topic.


< Message edited by etching -- 11/10/2010 4:53:05 >
AQ  Post #: 6
11/10/2010 5:45:53   
BlueKatz
Member

I AGREE WITH STUPID TAGGED THREAD ARE STUPID

Seriously, it drive me nut for many years (ok...just 1 year...how about for many months, for many days, hours, minutes?). But seriously, i'm not joking but Tagged thread going out of hand be cause most TAGGED THREAD don't eve have a TOPIC

I mean when AK make tagged thread they do it like "hey...put everything here"

SO WHY CAN"T WE PUT ALLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL AE GAME INTO A THREAD?

Because we can't....seriously we can't. In fact it will be a mess, and a while, boring paper that everything was written on are boring. EVERYTHING IS ON TOPIC, BUT ALSO OFF TOPIC. So in fact, you got no discussion in a blank thread with a note "all discussion about ___ go here"

A very good example is DF Holiday thread. It's really really useless. When It mad, there's only around 50 posts were made, other post are because of merged.

So say "let's talk about Holiday"
We say "uh...I like Easter"

WTF (sorry) but that's not even discussion. This is:
"Mogloween is coming :D what you guys expecting :DDD"
"Cool, I want to see next version of PK"
"Woa, more candy hunting :D"
"Awesome I missed last year"
"I hope we can get upgraded version of last year cape"
"Anyone have cool look for Mogloween?"

I don't have much time, but I can also put another example: This time is about AQW discussion: Wow, there are too many...

Equipment discussion thread: ok... what the heck... "Anyone this look good?" "What do u think about red cape" "I hate J6 armor"... Woa...never get any real topic. All spam random...i don't even want to show my option in that place, cuz who care?

Class discussion thread: ummm "I like SL" "DL is the best" his isn't best uber thread... I never can really discuss any strategy here and learn anything about classes

...

I will post more when I have time. but any forum memer have to admit that there are too much useless tagged thread. And they fear to disobey to rule, so they give up, and do nothing
AQ DF AQW Epic  Post #: 7
11/10/2010 6:57:58   
The Braken Bard
Member

I have to agree that these 'General' Threads for certain topics in AQW are kind of annoying. For some subjects, it is good, for example 'Character Backstories'. But for other kinds of topics, it's simply not going to work. Because you get general threads, you get only general talk. We don't get discussion on any particularly specifc topics and because there's no place to discuss it (as General Threads are filled with general talk, and getting a reply to your specifc questions seems unlikely), it feels like a restriction of freedom in that respect.
AQ MQ  Post #: 8
11/10/2010 10:47:29   
Ash The Phantom
Member

Keep in mind, if you change the thread filter to 14 days instead of 2 days you will see a lot more threads than 13.
There's one situation where user threads are promoted to official threads --- when the week's newsletter is posted.
Other than that, I fail to see any point of tagging user threads, as most user thread topics aren't broad enough
to cover the entire subject like official threads do...

I actually forgot about this setting, to be honest. And I'm not saying "Tag every user thread" either, I'm getting at the amount of moderator and AK-made Official threads. My suggestion is the let the users make the kind of thread topics that are deemed "Official" topics by the AK's and just have the AK tag it, instead of having the AK make the thread and give one less topic available for creation by users. It feels like we're restricted by the amount of tagged threads because they're so generic and general, a lot of specific things can be grouped into it, and it's just TOO general to the point you have people talking over eachother and it's difficult to talk about a specific thing when other people are talking about specific things.

< Message edited by Ash The Phantom -- 11/10/2010 10:51:29 >
AQ DF MQ AQW  Post #: 9
11/10/2010 10:49:53   
Mordred
Member

How does an Official or tagged thread made by an AK make one less topic to discuss? You aren't very clear on this point, which will make or break your whole argument/reasoning.
AQ DF MQ  Post #: 10
11/10/2010 10:52:19   
Ash The Phantom
Member

I edited it while you were typing, I realized it wasn't quite clear what I meant and clarified.
AQ DF MQ AQW  Post #: 11
11/10/2010 11:04:59   
Mordred
Member

Really? Because tagged threads really only make up ~10-20% of all GD threads. And they're not restricting at all. You say that they're too generic, but they're generic to be less restricting. An example would be release threads. Often, they're "Talk about the release, what you expect in the future of this release(if it spans over a saga, such as Mogloween in DF), what would you have preferred to see, ect." You make it sound like that tagged threads are "Talk about the release and only the release." Given the nature of most of the games though, this is not plausible, as many releases draw upon past info, or are simply fun to speculate on. And the staff usually loves constructive criticism, which I often see in many tagged threads.
quote:

TOO general to the point you have people talking over eachother

That's more about these people's behavior than anything else, especially the nature of the thread.
quote:

and it's difficult to talk about a specific thing when other people are talking about specific things.

No one could ever "take over" a thread. It may seem like that, but another person can step in at any time and bring up a past, seemingly forgotten subject, and end up reviving a short discussion it.
Thus, I fail to see your point.
AQ DF MQ  Post #: 12
11/10/2010 11:27:33   
  Ultrapowerpie

Mail Moogle of AdventureQuest
quote:


I understand moderators and AK's take actions differently based on their own methods, however it shouldn't be left entirely to their own decision as to what threads should go and stay. I suggest a simple talk with another available AK or moderator to decide together, a type of teamwork to make a greater decision rather than a guess as to where they think the thread will end up.


And what makes you think we DON'T do that? I know of plenty of times where I've asked AK's or Mods about a thread before acting. Quite honestly, you shouldn't be commenting on a process you know nothing about, because the AKs/Mods DO talk to each other, quite a bit more often then you think we do :/ Making incorrect assumptions like that will only hurt your argument.

< Message edited by Ultrapowerpie -- 11/10/2010 11:28:22 >
AQ DF MQ  Post #: 13
11/10/2010 11:36:31   
Ash The Phantom
Member

Know what, just lock this thread. It's not getting my point across, I'd rather not take part in these forums at all than try do something that could be helpful to the community. Lock it, and forget it existed.
AQ DF MQ AQW  Post #: 14
11/10/2010 11:39:05   
Mordred
Member

What?! Why? Honestly, if you could make a stronger point, then you could make a change! But if you roll over and forget it, nothing will change. We're just pointing out the examples you've provided aren't solid in our eyes. Just come up with new ones!
AQ DF MQ  Post #: 15
11/10/2010 11:41:20   
Ash The Phantom
Member

"Come up with new ones" is hard to do when there's nothing else to come up with. Everyone here just blew up my examples, there's nothing more to discuss.
AQ DF MQ AQW  Post #: 16
11/10/2010 11:48:57   
Vivi
Outsmarting Bugs


 I'll go ahead and lock the thread for now since it's been requested, however if any moderators with input to provide wander by the lock may be removed to give people some chance to give their own opinions on what's been said.

If you change your mind on the lock request feel free to PM me and I'll unlock it, and you can always PM the head moderator of a board you want to discuss the rules of (or Circe if the rules aren't forum-specific) if you have feedback on them.
AQ DF MQ  Post #: 17
Page:   [1]
All Forums >> [AE Forum Resources] >> Forum Support and Suggestions >> Revision of certain rules possible?
Jump to:






Icon Legend
New Messages No New Messages
Hot Topic w/ New Messages Hot Topic w/o New Messages
Locked w/ New Messages Locked w/o New Messages
 Post New Thread
 Reply to Message
 Post New Poll
 Submit Vote
 Delete My Own Post
 Delete My Own Thread
 Rate Posts




Forum Content Copyright © 2018 Artix Entertainment, LLC.

"AdventureQuest", "DragonFable", "MechQuest", "EpicDuel", "BattleOn.com", "AdventureQuest Worlds", "Artix Entertainment"
and all game character names are either trademarks or registered trademarks of Artix Entertainment, LLC. All rights are reserved.
PRIVACY POLICY


Forum Software © ASPPlayground.NET Advanced Edition