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Energy Parasite to weak

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2/1/2014 18:33:43   
lionblades
Member

Even at max Energy Parasite is barely useful because of low drain (lets be realistic nobody uses an super high energy build like NPCs) and happening at 3 turns instead of 1

Solutions:
1. Switch Battery Backup and Parasite from TM to BM. TM already has assimilation and battery backup makes TM energy control too powerful.
2. Buff Parasite %
3. Remove Parasite Support req. (Assimilation has no req. AND improves with STR why should Parasite have a 42 support req.)
4. Increase base damage (85% like assimilation sounds good)
5. Use total energy energy from opponent rather than current energy levels (cap at 300 to prevent abuse)

These are just some solutions I came up with to make BM energy control on par with other classes.

Note: Not all of them have to be used.
AQW  Post #: 1
2/1/2014 18:49:18   
Mother1
Member

quote:

1. Switch Battery Backup and Parasite from TM to BM. TM already has assimilation and battery backup makes TM energy control too powerful.


Doing this will leave BM without anyway of draining energy once again while give TM 2 ways to gain and drain energy. This would make BM even more UP while giving TM too much power. Not a good idea IMO

quote:

2. Buff Parasite %


To be honest Parasite energy is actually the most balanced out of them all. The real problem is that with so much energy restriction it seems under powered. I have had many times in battle when this move crippled me due to not being able to use my energy fast enough.

quote:

3. Remove Parasite Support req. (Assimilation has no req. AND improves with STR why should Parasite have a 42 support req.)


This could work for making it useful for more builds, but how does this make it so the BM will get more energy?

quote:

4. Increase base damage (85% like assimilation sounds good)


Actually no it doesn't. It still doesn't help the BM get energy back any better and if anything give strength BM a way to destroy energy while getting a more powerful attack.

quote:

5. Use total energy energy from opponent rather than current energy levels (cap at 300 to prevent abuse)


Could you explain this one better please?
Epic  Post #: 2
2/1/2014 18:49:34   
dfo99
Member
 

 all classes have 1 skill that drain mana, so the switch that you say not suported.

the best is deal 100% dmg, remove the sup req, reduce the duration to 2 turn (not is a nerf, it is for drain more faster the enemy mana), and buff the max drain % to 40%.

< Message edited by dfo99 -- 2/1/2014 22:26:08 >
Post #: 3
2/1/2014 18:52:30   
dfo99
Member
 

 mother1

weak not is = giving little mana, he say changes toamke the skill more "useable", that is diferent of "effective"
Post #: 4
2/1/2014 19:01:05   
lionblades
Member

@Mother1
quote:

but how does this make it so the BM will get more energy?

Removing the support req. doesn't but it does allow more build variety and less constraints for a BM to use. At lower levels this is extremely helpful where there is less stats to invest in. Basically a indirect buff.
quote:

Could you explain this one better please?

If a opponent has 100/600 energy left the current Parasite take 15% of CURRENT energy which would be 100 at max level.
I suggest that instead of using the 100 current energy, Parasite will always be based on max energy, in this case the 600.
AQW  Post #: 5
2/1/2014 19:08:37   
Ranloth
Banned


 Energy Parasite is good enough, but its drawback IS the damage penalty on it. Making it 85% damage will be good enough, and retain Support requirement to prevent Strength builds from abusing it. Removing the requirement AND increasing damage is a straight up no. Removing requirement won't make it any better. It's the damage crippling it.
AQ Epic  Post #: 6
2/1/2014 19:13:27   
edwardvulture
Member

I'd make the energy regen scale with the opponent's current energy on activation. Ex. You get what you get back the 1st turn every turn.
AQ DF MQ  Post #: 7
2/1/2014 19:30:07   
lionblades
Member

@Trans
quote:

Removing requirement won't make it any better. It's the damage crippling it.

Removing the support req. allows less constraints. Lower level players will have more build variety when investing in this skill(remember they have less skill points so the 42 support severely limits investing higher points). Also,there is nothing wrong with abusing a stat--all classes do it. TM has str abuse with assimilation. Dex abusers etc. Remember in Omega when everyone had 5 focus builds? That was no fun at all. Stat req. are not the way to fix these. If you believe removing is too much, another solution could be to tone down/lessen the support requirement (say 30 support at max).
AQW  Post #: 8
2/1/2014 19:36:59   
  Exploding Penguin
Moderator


 how about make parasite take energy on impact, and then again on the following opponent's turn? This will be slightly confusing but what it's intended to do is make it more effective against battery backup users because they're unstoppable to a BM. The math will pretty much just be that the first turn is doubled effectiveness, then the next 2 turns (or however many turns it lasts after that, I'm not sure) it will be normal effectiveness.

Or make it have cooldown 1 and you can stack it multiple times for increased effectiveness.
Epic  Post #: 9
2/1/2014 19:54:25   
Ranloth
Banned


 We can lessen the requirement, sure, but 30 Support is too little.. Make it around 34-36 at L10, and it should do the trick. Easier to invest at lower level, and not too crippling.
AQ Epic  Post #: 10
2/1/2014 20:10:57   
dfo99
Member
 
quote:

retain Support requirement to prevent Strength builds from abusing it


this argument is annoying because, static charge, static granade, battery pick up and others mana skills not have stats requeriment, and the parasite is the only bloodmage mana skill.

static charge and assmilation make you argument completly non sense, because both work best with str and not have stats requirement.

say that will be best with 100% of damage not is exactly because i want damage, i think that will best for be used constantly.
Post #: 11
2/1/2014 20:43:02   
Ranloth
Banned


 Because other classes have different requirements. Only because one class has requirement on similar type of skill, doesn't mean other class needs to have one too.

Static Charge cannot rage nor be critted, and its return depends on damage - useless against tanks. Assimilation has VERY SLOW scaling with Strength, and deals 85% damage at that. Instead of comparing two different skills, which do NOT work like Energy Parasite, how about you bring up a logical argument? Balance isn't a playground, so saying my argument is "annoying" with nothing to back it up with - apart from saying others skills do this and that AND not looking at the rest of the skill tree - will not help your argument.
AQ Epic  Post #: 12
2/1/2014 21:41:33   
dfo99
Member
 

 static charge depends on damage not is a good reason to abuse of strength? how it prevent the str abuse?

the assimilation have a very slow scale but still is improved by str, how work the prevent str abuse of this skill?

parasite, static charge, and assimilation not work equal, but all have the same effect: give/drain mana. so is rational compare them.

the skill tree not is a obstruction for remove a stats requeriment because the stats requirements from skills can be switched, also recently the club requeriment from frenzy was removed (making the tlm the only class with 1 skill with main weapon requirement), so maybe the stats req can be replaced, switched or removed

the argument is annoying because many people use.


< Message edited by dfo99 -- 2/1/2014 21:48:05 >
Post #: 13
2/1/2014 21:50:31   
Ranloth
Banned


 Slow scaling on Assimilation prevents the skill being overpowered in hands of Strength builds. Likewise with Static Charge - it cannot crit nor be raged, which prevents the free unblockable hit from being out of hand. They don't have requirements because it's not necessary to have them on these skills, because they have a drawback of their own to compensate for it.
AQ Epic  Post #: 14
2/1/2014 22:11:58   
dfo99
Member
 

 this is true, but energy parasite also has its drawbacks. these disadvantages do you quoted made static charge and assimilation less efficient with str, but the problem of stat requirement and not cause 100% damage, is that make the skill energy parasite becomes totally useless with str. this is the point that you do not understand

< Message edited by dfo99 -- 2/1/2014 22:13:58 >
Post #: 15
2/1/2014 22:14:01   
Ranloth
Banned


 Hence why I'm going for the suggestion of making it deal 85% damage on hit (like Assimilation) and lowering the requirement - to around 34-36, but not completely removing it...
AQ Epic  Post #: 16
2/1/2014 22:21:57   
dfo99
Member
 

 85% still is a big restriction for use enegy parasite. 100% will made you use every time that you wanna, not when you need. with requirement not will be good use maxed.

< Message edited by dfo99 -- 2/1/2014 22:24:21 >
Post #: 17
2/1/2014 22:26:51   
Ranloth
Banned


 You don't need to max it in order for the skill to be efficient... 85% isn't a "big restriction" but keeps the skill in check, so it won't end up being too strong. Instead of wanting big changes and perhaps overshotting it, how about baby steps and perhaps undershotting the buff and then getting another one - instead of a buff then nerf?
AQ Epic  Post #: 18
2/1/2014 22:33:54   
dfo99
Member
 
quote:

Instead of wanting big changes and perhaps overshotting it, how about baby steps and perhaps undershotting the buff and then getting another one - instead of a buff then nerf?


can you explain it better?

< Message edited by dfo99 -- 2/1/2014 22:34:50 >
Post #: 19
2/1/2014 22:39:44   
Ranloth
Banned


 Remember CHs with old Static Charge when Plasma Armor was introduced? PA was meant to be a buff to CHs, but it ended up in overpowering them greatly. Then SC got nerfed into oblivion and was useless for a long time (ineffective). Very good example of overshotting a buff, which resulted in nerfs elsewhere.

< Message edited by Trans -- 2/1/2014 22:40:11 >
AQ Epic  Post #: 20
2/1/2014 22:53:32   
dfo99
Member
 

 the blood mage classe never will be OP again after the passive skills removed. the energy parasite need a supreme buff to make the bms op.
Post #: 21
2/1/2014 23:02:13   
Ranloth
Banned


 What are you on about. I'm giving you an example of when the Devs overshot their buff and it's resulted in many nerfs instead, hence why I'm for making small steps towards buffing - to avoid unnecessary nerfs. :|
AQ Epic  Post #: 22
2/1/2014 23:15:19   
dfo99
Member
 

 100% and no req doesnot looks too much overpowered, the enemy still will can spent faster the mana making the next 2 turn of parasite almost useless
Post #: 23
2/1/2014 23:21:11   
Mother1
Member

@ Dfo99

Oh sure and this will give strength blood mage another free powerful attack they can use without investing into support. So not only will they have a good way to get rage against tanks (High defenses going against high attack = good rage gain) since the attack will do 100% damage but they will also have an easy way to drain energy since the support requirement is gone which keeps the skill from being abused will be gone as well.

Epic  Post #: 24
2/1/2014 23:24:57   
Ranloth
Banned


 PA and old SC coupled together, didn't seem overpowered to the Devs either. Or changing HP scaling in Omega and not altering Str/Support - which is likely due to removal of Agility and lower likelihood of abuse (which has proven to be wrong).

This is getting funny now. I agree on the buff, and as do you, but you don't agree on the buff which is almost the same as yours, and you don't seem to understand. If 85% damage was to be too low, they'd buff it up to 100%, and players would be happy from a double buff. Whilst if 100% could be a bit too high, they'd have to nerf it and players wouldn't be happy. (psychological effect)
I'm not against the 100% damage idea, but simply stating why baby steps should be taken when you alter a skill greatly - from dealing 50 damage, most of the time, to 100% of your weapon's damage.
AQ Epic  Post #: 25
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