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Support Buff

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9/19/2014 22:20:30   
theholyfighter
Member

Support being clearly under Str, Dex, and Tech, I thought of a way that might keep balance in place with support taking a slight advantage.

What if Support decreases the energy needed for Field Medic, as well as increasing your HP amount?

Field Medic energy decreased:
25: -10
35: -20
45: -30
55: -40
65: -50

Health increased:
20: +10
30: +20
40: +35
50: +55
60: +80

There's another way off my mind that works similar but is based on Support compared with other stat(s); however seems too complicated.


< Message edited by theholyfighter -- 9/26/2014 21:26:26 >
AQW Epic  Post #: 1
9/19/2014 22:38:16   
  Exploding Penguin
Moderator


 I don't think support is under all the other stats that much, I think it's just that the classes which can successfully use support-based builds are extremely limited. Support focus BH is surprisingly strong, believe it or not.

An interesting prospect would be to massively buff crit chance so it would be viable to have a build with, for example, an 80% crit chance, but to massively reduce the bonus damage from crits to be near nothing. I'll probably make a new thread about it to describe it in detail more.

But, I do support this anyways because support is meant to, well, support. That's why it buffs defensive skills and in one case, energy steal (BH), but it doesn't buff the staple healing skill like it used to.
Epic  Post #: 2
9/19/2014 23:23:11   
theholyfighter
Member

I did think of a higher crit probability, but then I wouldn't want to see endless rants on not critting or getting crits too much. After all, crit is still a luck based feature.

Thanks for your feedback!
AQW Epic  Post #: 3
9/19/2014 23:46:45   
suboto
Member

How about something on the means of scale like this:
+1hp per 5support
this would bearly increase with support but give that slight bonus for what you invest into it.
focus 5 with 45+14support would improve their heal by 8hp
max support build would be like 177+35support which would improve their heal by 38hp
This scale would be great on improvement to supports value.
i support this idea
Epic  Post #: 4
9/19/2014 23:49:43   
Silver Sky Magician
Member


 I think support is perfectly fine, it just shouldn't be spammed unlike other stats. I would hardly call that 'unbalanced', particularly since dex abuse isn't viable for most classes either.
Post #: 5
9/20/2014 0:02:28   
  Exploding Penguin
Moderator


 @Silver Sky Magician:

It's too unpredictable with random crit nukes and the fact that your aux will get deflected a lot more now that deflection chance scales with tech. If using a semi-high support hybrid build, it can work fairly well, but only on very few classes. It also has almost no use in 2v2 thanks to turn ordering totally screwing up anything related to support, and that it's way too easy to work around the super strong shields a support build puts up. They should at least give support builds way more energy gain than other builds so that they can spam skills more in 2v2 to make the best use of their stat, rather than getting hit by EMP and being useless since a good amount of drains have ridiculous cooldowns or scale with strength.

The CH static charge scaling rework was a really nice touch that put it in the right direction, but I think they need to do that for most other energy recoveries/drains.
Epic  Post #: 6
9/20/2014 0:43:29   
DeltaNoob123456789
Member

I think the old fashion way will be better, Field Medic improves with Support
Post #: 7
9/20/2014 5:34:05   
RageSoul
Member

Too luck dependant . Make it progress like it before the removal but in this way :


* Base Amount ( lower ) + ( % Support ) { can be less than or more than 100% )


--> % Support would make sense seeing the 10x stats made the progression noticeable


Yes it still requires heavy spamming , but it wont be as worse as our current Field Medic that is really ruined that any number change to it will either break it ( weak for FM reliant builds ) or buff it , simply because the rest of the mechanics and skills really needed a rework. Sounds a bit off-topic but as long as anyone has the same benefit in Field Medic ( and other Energy skills / manipulation ) , it's going to be hard , but not impossible .
AQW Epic  Post #: 8
9/20/2014 6:31:38   
Justingbieberfangirl
Member
 

 Well FM is too strong now. And i totally support this if the heal BASE get reduced by a bit. And improves with support in general.

It is always useful.

Against new plague core n poison and it gives up to 720 HP with the crit heal core. Meaning it is very efficient and requires just a turn.

Can you think of anything that deals more than 720 damage costing 350 energy or less requiring something(stata) 42 or less.... I can't.


With this people who wont have high support won't at least be able to heal that strongly.

So SUPPORTed

Post #: 9
9/20/2014 6:36:25   
Ranloth
Banned


 ^ That's actually a pretty neat solution, with lowering the base and Support scaling back. It scales with level too, which is fine, just base is a bit too high. In a way, it's also a nerf to Strength due to them having to sacrifice more out of their build, as opposed to likes of Focus 5 and tanks, who may invest a little bit more in Support.

Generally speaking, buffing skills to improve with x stat does not count as a buff to a specific stat, i.e. new SC has Support scaling but it doesn't make Support more useful for all, whilst FM is shared by everyone and equally as useful, which does fall under Support's power. (if that makes any sense)
AQ Epic  Post #: 10
9/26/2014 21:52:25   
theholyfighter
Member

To me support is definitely on par with other stats, or even close.

There are only 4 options you can find

Base
45 (focus)
45+(leftover stats)
85 (maximum best value)
Spam support

Support is definitely not on par with other stats, as seeing how it affects gameplay features. However it's "Support", literally meaning its existence and investment is for the sole purpose for gaining indirect benefits towards gameplay.

For why I decided to have support decrease the energy cost rather than increasing Field Medic's amount is for the sake of not letting heal loopers roam as it had happened, due to Field Medic's cooldown.
AQW Epic  Post #: 11
9/26/2014 21:55:56   
  Exploding Penguin
Moderator


 Support is actually a very decent stat, the problem is:

People think support is underpowered because you can't abuse it. It's meant to supplement other builds, not be a focus of investment. If you're spamming like 80-100 support, then your build is flawed in so many nameable ways it's ridiculous. I've seen many extremely successful focus or balanced-stat builds that utilize around 75 support, and they work very well.
Epic  Post #: 12
9/26/2014 22:06:52   
theholyfighter
Member

Not abusing actually, but its influence on gameplay is far beyond those on other stats.

HP: well, once it reaches 0, you lose.
EP: energy control being one of the few pillars to victory.
Str: consistant direct damage free of costs, free of cooldown
Dex: Blocks and Defense
Tech: Deflections and Resistance, plus a Robot
Support: Crits, Aux damage (high cooldown).

Another thing to notice is the Skills that the stats improve.
For strength, it's Assimilation and a few damage magnifying skills.
For dex, basically fixed-damage skills and Technician+Mineral Armor
For tech, fixed-damage skills and SmokeScreen+Plasma Armor
For support, shields, Malf (IIRC got nerfed), Intimidate.
AQW Epic  Post #: 13
9/26/2014 23:10:51   
  Exploding Penguin
Moderator


 Just going to point out that support builds are probably the strongest on BHs or CHs right now. Go try it out, it's actually pretty fun!

As a stat it needs more versatility. I think that going first, slight buffs to most defensive skills, and improved damage on your aux is already pretty good. Would be nice if most energy flow skills scaled with it though.

EDIT:
Currently running a hybrid 72-support focus CH. The random crits you get which you normally wouldn't against those 20-support builds is really good. You also go first very often, you build rage up faster, you gain a bit more energy (please buff the support-energy scaling on static charge; it's still almost completely unnoticeable) from static charge, your matrix just became even more godly than it was before, and your malfunction can severely cripple some builds.

< Message edited by Exploding Penguin -- 9/27/2014 23:22:31 >
Epic  Post #: 14
10/4/2014 19:39:39   
VanitySixx
Member

Support is a fine stat if you use the right builds. Auxiliaries do more damage than your gun and primary if everything's upgraded to your level, so that's a fine source of damage for almost any build.

Support LITERALLY support (boost) your defensive skills such as Reflex Boost, Energy Shield, etc, and since those skills are used quite a lot, support is needed.

Support helps 5 focus builds that focus mainly on technology. Why? Spam technology, now you have a powerful robot with a somewhat powerful aux that has a low chance of being deflected. And if you're lucky enough to have a Dread aux, then you'll be doing some really nice damage.

Support is definitely on par with the other stats. If we're looking for complete balance in this game, support is the LAST stat we should worry about. But, that's another story...
AQW Epic  Post #: 15
10/5/2014 8:14:57   
Stonehawk
Member

Strength spam works extremely fine, support spam works extremely bad.
140+ strength can pwn even strong focus builds by hitting a single button, spamming mark of blood and strike for example.
Support requires a brain to be used, strength requires only clicking a button and most of the time it works, making the game a bit boring most of the time... (except for those that got new bot, but it's still hard sometimes since they can heal and wait for the effect to go away, since they got high enough health)

What bothers most of the players is strength easiness.
AQ DF MQ AQW Epic  Post #: 16
10/5/2014 9:33:29   
Silver Sky Magician
Member


 ^

I can beat STR builds most of the time with a 5 focus build. Not sure how it is with legendary ranks though.
Post #: 17
10/15/2014 21:57:50   
Yo son
Member

People that try to apply real world logic to a game... come on you get hit by an artillery shell and survive! you get shot and survive! poison is so kind that it will leave only 1 HP left! Come on people s a game, it was designed logic and physics are not its limits.
Post #: 18
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