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1/3/2015 12:38:06   
xzkamityx
Member

What is with all the hate on this game? Gamma had way worse stat abuse and depended more heavily on pay to win that omega or delta. I understand why some varium players aren't happy. Still, over half the community wanted something to be done about balance, so the devs did something and everybody complains. It may have not worked out the way everybody hoped, but now instead of having TLMs walking around being unbeatable by any other build, every class has a build that works effectively, and wins. I'm just saying, I don't think the devs deserve all the hate that most of the Ed is giving them, when all the devs have done, is listen to the community and what the community wanted.
AQW Epic  Post #: 1
1/3/2015 13:15:30   
dfo99
Member
 
quote:

Gamma had way worse stat abuse and depended more heavily on pay to win that omega or delta. I understand why some varium players aren't happy.


lol, you answer youself question.
Post #: 2
1/3/2015 13:40:22   
xzkamityx
Member


quote:

lol, you answer youself question.

only reason a few are mad is because they don't have near as an advantage, but im talking about the community as a whole.
AQW Epic  Post #: 3
1/3/2015 13:46:46   
Lord Machaar
Member

First of all, ED forums in Omega have never reflected the ED player base.

If I say during christmas, 1500 players played the game, only 20 posted here on forums. And most of them are level 40, few of them use credits... and so on....

Personally I won't judge if the players are happy or not according to what is posted here by some members.
- Because first of all only FEW of those members actually play the game, most of them are just haters who quitted the game long ago, and still judging the game.
- And FEWER actually care for the game, not taking consider if they use Varium or Credits.
- And even THE FEWEST actually talk about general problems, not problems that touch them, their Class, their build.....

I won't judge ED based on forums, personally, when I quit the game I quit the forums, Why would I post about something I don't play and encounter? It's like judging an XBOX ONE while playing PS4. I quitted the game & forums for 1 year and half. Came back and started posting after I played the game for 7 days and gave my PROS and CONS.

And this what should all members do, not posting out of anger, speaking of your Class/Build.

But as I told you the ED forums have died in Omega. And personally I think it's too late to take forums members suggestions as most of them don't really reflect the game.

My solution is doing IN-GAME POLLS and going IN-GAME to ask players of all types and ages.

< Message edited by Lord Machaar -- 1/3/2015 13:50:35 >
MQ Epic  Post #: 4
1/3/2015 13:59:33   
Scyze
Member

Most of the hate (I think) came after Omega. We all thought the changes were going to be the greatest thing to happen to EpicDuel because of the way it looked to us. Once the phase actually went live it was disliked by most because of the changes. People felt they got ripped off since their Enhancements got removed and some were angry because Armors became one (No more P/E versions). All of these things really annoyed them because the things involved with real money got nerfed.

I'm not blaming anyone for what they do since it's their choice. If someone's raging about their Enhancements being turned into nothing but an Achievement, is it fair for me to say it's stupid? I'm not on his/her shoes to feel what he/she's feeling.

People then left because they found something better in life. It happens with all games because people change as they get older. A 7 year old may play Adventure Quest and then move onto AdventureQuest Worlds when they're 11. Then they might move onto other games (League of Legends, World of Warcraft, Dota, etc.) because it's more challenging and fun for the age group.

< Message edited by Scyze -- 1/3/2015 14:12:46 >
AQ DF MQ AQW Epic  Post #: 5
1/3/2015 14:02:01   
xzkamityx
Member

quote:

My solution is doing IN-GAME POLLS and going IN-GAME to ask players of all types and ages.


I remember them doing this when rabblefroth first had his NPC, except they would always have a stupid answer(what is you favorite class (A.potatoe B. mercenary C. bounty hunter D. Tech mage D.cyber hunter E. Tactical mercenary. F. Blood mage) , and over half the people would pick A. If they did this again. i feel as if they should take it seriously, because if you stupid answer choices about something that can inpact the game, you're gonna get stupid answers, which helps no one
AQW Epic  Post #: 6
1/3/2015 14:16:17   
Lord Machaar
Member

quote:

you're gonna get stupid answers, which helps no one


There are polls which are selective, targeting some players not all.

Rabble froth's poll wasn't even related to the game.

I'm talking here about direct questions. Do you like the current phase? If Yes or No Justify. Just like forums, you don't come here and make a thread, saying I hate Omega, and not explaining why.

Put a question in game, DIRECT question with simple options. Do you like the new X feature? Justify, why...

The inconveniences that might face this feature are first of all: Alts.
But this can be fixed by IP check.

As I can see you talked about trollers in your post. Justification will be a decisive criteria while looking at the answer. Choosing Potatoe will be followed by a reason, why? French fries? Your response will be taken away. As simple as that.
MQ Epic  Post #: 7
1/3/2015 15:32:35   
  Exploding Penguin
Moderator


 I personally think because the newer omega playerbase consists mostly of spiteful people who for some reason still play the game even though they clearly don't like it anymore, and of far more immature people than we have seen in the past.
Epic  Post #: 8
1/3/2015 15:58:47   
Variation
Member
 
quote:

only reason a few are mad is because they don't have near as an advantage...


Nope it's more of the horrible compensation we received for enhancements. I know the developers aren't required to give refunds/compensation, but when they remove something that many, many players have spent hundreds of dollars on and give a poor compensation it's only expected for most of those players to be angry. Out of all of the heavy spenders that I've known since Beta only three of them still play. That speaks for itself.

EDIT: @Below: I didn't say that the tiered enhancement achievement was the only "compensation." I'm well aware of what the compensation was for enhancements.

< Message edited by Variation -- 1/3/2015 17:31:43 >
Post #: 9
1/3/2015 17:03:30   
I Underlord I
Member

The tiered Enhancer Achievement was not the only compensation for those who purchased enhancements; there was a 30% refund for Varium (no cap) and 10% refund for Credit (capped at 100K) for the total cost of enhancements. In addition, previously-enhanced Varium weapons retained the 15% sellback as if they were still enhanced (that is, the total price was used). The Cheevo itself is worth a good amount of rating points, increasing depending on the tier; this meant a lot more back in Delta, and even now is much better than nothing. These two recompenses, in particular the partial refund, are by no means "horrible."

Regardless of one's personal opinions on enhancements, Varium advantage or lack thereof, etc., the removal of enhancements was the best update and greatest step towards balance in the game's history.

_____________________________

"Memories and thoughts age, just as people do. But certain thoughts can never age, and certain memories can never fade."
~ Haruki Murakami, The Wind-Up Bird Chronicle
AQ  Post #: 10
1/3/2015 17:34:39   
Drianx
Member

The compensation was a slap in the face. Not because I say it (and I have Ultimate Enhancer cheevo, and for that you should have spent many 10k varium packs on enhancements only), but because the vast majority of players who ever spent varium on enhancements say so. I have yet to meet a varium player who was satisfied with it.

Removal of enhancements was not a bad thing itself, but it made varium enhancers feel ripped off, first because it was awfully compensated, and second because it ruined the commitment that players made when they spent that varium. Because when you decide to buy varium, you actually commit yourself to stick around and stay loyal to the game system that you decided to invest in. When the system changed completely, for many the commitment lost its purpose.

I am not trying to bash anyone, these are just facts.

< Message edited by Drianx -- 1/3/2015 17:35:10 >
AQW Epic  Post #: 11
1/3/2015 17:46:07   
Variation
Member
 

 @I Underlord I: So lets say someone has 100,000 varium worth of enhanced items in their inventory prior to Omega (that they will not sell). Those items would've lost their slots (but would've stayed upgraded to Omega's standard) and you would've only received 30,000 varium + some enhancement achievement.

100,000 varium is worth $500USD

30,000 varium is worth $150USD

So if you spent 100,000 varium on enhancements you were only compensated $150USD worth of varium + some achievement (that achievement didn't keep majority of those players playing). The opinion most paying players who purchased enhancements would formulate after seeing how poor, from a financial standpoint the compensation was would not be "Oh this was a great compensation, I got an achievement and a 30% refund!"

@Drianx: Excellent points, especially regarding the affect enhancements had on some of the players who purchased them.

< Message edited by Variation -- 1/3/2015 18:01:01 >
Post #: 12
1/3/2015 18:03:45   
I Underlord I
Member

I am well aware of how poor the compensation may seem, particularly to one who had spent an inordinate amount of real-life money for the Varium to buy enhancements, but from an objective standpoint it is excellent (at least in comparison to, say, what one may have been subjected to in other games). In addition, unless one enhanced equipment unnecessarily, or switched gear often, there should have been no need to purchase multiple--much less many--10K-Varium packs; it was the Credits prices that were outrageous, not the Varium (though I don't deny they were high, but even so most of the concern here was in the rare nine- or ten-slot items). If people were spending hundreds of dollars on enhancements alone, I'm sorry to point out that they were already essentially wasting that Varium.

30% is a lot, to say nothing of the 15% sellback including the costs as if an item were still enhanced (which you described as a non-factor in your hypothetical, Variation). Financially, one may have lost a lot of money, and this is both unfortunate and in a way unfair; however, especially keeping in mind that the Staff had no obligation to provide any form of recompense, it was more than reasonable. One should also consider that spending money on something virtual, particularly if it is a form of entertainment, is a risk in many senses; if this fact was not deliberated on by certain players, it is not a fault of the part of the developers.

I do agree that there should have been greater compensation (at least for those who spent hundreds or even thousands of dollars on enhancements), but there should be a limit. Especially when taking into consideration the fact that these individuals reaped the benefits of the enhancements repeatedly in PvPs, especially against those players who did not purchase much or any Varium.
AQ  Post #: 13
1/3/2015 18:12:52   
Satafou
Member

The compensation for the removal of enchantments was devastating, not only personally but to the player base as a whole. The fact the return rate was so low, with it not even taking into consideration of sold items with enchantments equipped (not that it could). Yet here we are, with lvl 1's having limo's getting free credits but people who actually help keep this game up and running and providing money to help the game flourish get treated worse than free to play players. Now i'm not saying that people who support the game are any superior to a free to play player in anyway, but the fact the staff are so willing to help free to play players, but yet varium payers can't even get a proper refund is just downright wrong. I for one have spent over +100k varium on enchantments but i got a measly 12k back. Why? Simply because it was 30% refund, that's 100k instantly down to 30k, and as mentioned before, it didn't include previously sold weapons with enchantments unlocked. Not to mention, i personally don't care about achievements, although i got the top 1% achievement for enchantments, it still means very little. Achievements, stars they bring no advantage to PVP, and i'm not saying they should. However as a result of this one simple fact i simply don't collect them, i am currently 2 blue stars, but if i actually did missions and collected achievements i'd be on 5 blue stars closing in on 6 blue stars.
Post #: 14
1/3/2015 18:19:18   
king altoen
Member

^^ You are comparing original cost with % compensation.

Imagine that you had 100$ then someone took that from you, and gave you 30$ instead. That pretty much explains the feeling varium enchancers felt.

Moving on, Past promos that were supposed to be powerful weapons, and were available before Cores were introduced (ex: Eggzookas, bunnyzookas, frostbane), Omega releases, and they are as good as basic bazookas. Yeah slap in the face.

Honestly, I dont even care about the cheevo they gave us. what is that gonna help me in?



< Message edited by king altoen -- 1/3/2015 18:23:12 >
Epic  Post #: 15
1/3/2015 18:26:22   
Drianx
Member

quote:

I am well aware of how poor the compensation may seem, particularly to one who had spent an inordinate amount of real-life money for the Varium to buy enhancements, but from an objective standpoint it is excellent (at least in comparison to, say, what one may have been subjected to in other games). In addition, unless one enhanced equipment unnecessarily, or switched gear often, there should have been no need to purchase multiple--much less many--10K-Varium packs; it was the Credits prices that were outrageous, not the Varium (though I don't deny they were high, but even so most of the concern here was in the rare nine- or ten-slot items). If people were spending hundreds of dollars on enhancements alone, I'm sorry to point out that they were already essentially wasting that Varium.

Compensation should have been in accordance with the loss that removal of enhancements provoked. The vast majority of players did not even want a compensation, they rather wanted their game back.

quote:

I do agree that there should have been greater compensation (at least for those who spent hundreds or even thousands of dollars on enhancements), but there should be a limit. Especially when taking into consideration the fact that these individuals reaped the benefits of the enhancements repeatedly in PvPs, especially against those players who did not purchase much or any Varium.

No offense, but that is a limited perspective over people who used varium enhancements. Like in any other competition, if you wanted to compete at highest levels, you needed the ultimate gear. Professional athletes for example, are not just 'people who pwn noobz', but people who take competition extremely seriously, and are committed to invest anything for winning. When athletes who competed for the Olympic Games were asked 'Would you take a drug that guarantees you a Gold Medal, but kills you after 10 years?', most of them answered YES. Ultimate performance only comes with ultimate sacrifice and investment - money, time, effort. Epicduel is a competitive game, and everyone is here either for his own goals, or for his faction. And if some people wanted to take it seriously enough to spend money into it for becoming more and more competitive - yes, by paying-for-winning - it was their choice, because that is how the game was at that time.

< Message edited by Drianx -- 1/3/2015 18:30:28 >
AQW Epic  Post #: 16
1/3/2015 20:16:57   
Lord Machaar
Member

To be honest with you guys, your accounts aren't really yours, they are owned by AE. And this implemented in the AE rules which no one reads. No I didn't read them. I saw it in a post when a similiar subject was treated.

So guys once you spend your money on that account, it's no longer your money.

With that been said. @Variation The contract you are talking about is moral more than a paper contract, so ED devs could have taken away that whole system without a single compensation.

But they know this will result into a massive quitting, and contradicts with many of the game rules (Varium grants you a long term power).

Don't get confused, I did spend a lot varium and credits on enhancements, I got 6k var back. And some credits and a shiny cheevo.

I agree with you that the compensation was horrible. Atleast all of the enhanced weapons could've stayed enhanced in Omega. E.G: You fully enhanced Frost Slayer in Gamma, it will stay full enhanced in Omega (Max stats and damage) for the rest of the game. So when you level up, you don't have to add stats points. As they are already there.

I think this just of many ideas that could've compensated the players who have spent thousands of varium on that feature. But what's the point of this discussion now? Past is past, and a proverb says, "crying over a dead man, is no use", as he is already dead, and you didn't manage to save him or treat him better as you cries come out of regret.

< Message edited by Lord Machaar -- 1/3/2015 20:19:44 >
MQ Epic  Post #: 17
1/3/2015 23:26:47   
DeathGuard
Member

quote:

^^ You are comparing original cost with % compensation.

Imagine that you had 100$ then someone took that from you, and gave you 30$ instead. That pretty much explains the feeling varium enchancers felt.

That's something called investment. You gave the $100 to that person because you were investing in something.
You signed a contract( we call it the ToP) which you agreed to and since some people don't have a habit to read what they are signing, they result in ignorance and in a loss.
The contract clearly states that AE isn't obligated to give refunds, YET Devs did give a refund to every single player, be it varium or nonvarium user.
Now that you know that, do you feel it is a "rip off" or "unfair"?
It will be a lot worse in real life. If you make an investment and the contract clearly states you are not compromised to get a refund, it will be on the business man's will to give you a refund.

If anything, everyone should be grateful because you actually got a high refund. You didn't just payed such enhancements, but also used them for a long time, and yet, after you "gave" back a used item, Devs gave you a refund. You approached what you invested in, and you enjoyed it. You were also given refunds. Other companies wouldn't have done it but remember, AE is player friendly, it is an indie company, and what we are looking for is to make happy, not angry. Just remember that.


I know refund was low. I can't argue that but being a player that both invested in varium/credit enhancements, I feel grateful I got a refund out of it, even though we weren't suited for it.

< Message edited by DeathGuard -- 1/3/2015 23:27:20 >
AQ DF AQW Epic  Post #: 18
1/4/2015 0:23:58   
lionblades
Member

The enhancement refund was a punch in the face, but, to me, it wasn't the reason for quitting.
I don't know about you guys but EDs gameplay seems a bit off (after the passive to active update?)...like the classes don't suit my style of gameplay. Its really hard to play as TM caster when parasite can take away energy forever...every class has energy drains etc.. I like it when each class had a defined role like tanking, damage, stalling for IA bot, support etc. I'm not going into all the balance details but for me its not "hate" but nostalgia. I used to play this game many hours but not anymore. It's still fun to log on to play a couple battles, but too much gets irritating. No hate money-wise, but I miss the ED that I played when I first joined.
AQW  Post #: 19
1/4/2015 1:01:14   
  Exploding Penguin
Moderator
quote:

The compensation was a slap in the face. Not because I say it (and I have Ultimate Enhancer cheevo, and for that you should have spent many 10k varium packs on enhancements only), but because the vast majority of players who ever spent varium on enhancements say so. I have yet to meet a varium player who was satisfied with it.


Well, you just met one. I didn't mind it at all and enjoyed having some varium back in my pockets even though I lost my advantage. IMO it wasn't bad at all because people stopped making rude comments like "varium noob" and such. The compensation wasn't necessarily fair, but enhancements should really never have existed in the first place given how much of an advantage varium players had over f2p users.
Epic  Post #: 20
1/4/2015 5:07:18   
Satafou
Member

quote:

No offense, but that is a limited perspective over people who used varium enhancements. Like in any other competition, if you wanted to compete at highest levels, you needed the ultimate gear. Professional athletes for example, are not just 'people who pwn noobz', but people who take competition extremely seriously, and are committed to invest anything for winning. When athletes who competed for the Olympic Games were asked 'Would you take a drug that guarantees you a Gold Medal, but kills you after 10 years?', most of them answered YES. Ultimate performance only comes with ultimate sacrifice and investment - money, time, effort. Epicduel is a competitive game, and everyone is here either for his own goals, or for his faction. And if some people wanted to take it seriously enough to spend money into it for becoming more and more competitive - yes, by paying-for-winning


This is a very important point, one thing that players don't seem to realize is that if you want to be the best then you have to take responsibility for that. If someone expects to be top class player world wide, for league of legends player. You think they can do that on a normal performance computer? Of course they couldn't. They could have extremely good mechanics and a considerably large amount of knowledge on the game, however if they don't take responsibility for having a computer than runs on high FPS then they simply won't make it to the level they desire. Same goes for Epicduel, varium showed who really cared for the game and who wanted to get better at the game. When i bought my first ever package, i said to myself "you know what? I want to become one of the best players,i want to prove to everyone what i am really capable of." I use to think that whoever was on the daily leader boards were pro and those who were on the all time leader boards were just unbelievable. However i put effort into the game, and before i knew it i won daily 2vs2 with 373 wins without originally having the intention of going for it ( i played only 17 hours that day also) and i managed to reach the all time leader board in the end with one of the highest win ratio's. My point of me stating this is, you just can't simply expect to be the best without taking the measures for it. Do you expect to be equal with low level qualifications with someone who has a degree going to the same job interview? Heck no, you most likely wouldn't of even of gotten the interview, they'd just throw your CV in the bin. You just can't argue to be equal if you don't put in the same amount of effort as others do. If you really wanted to be one of the best at this game, you could easily support the game every so often, £30 really isn't a lot of money.
Post #: 21
1/4/2015 11:00:49   
  Battle Elf
has ten 1v1 wins


 Hi everyone,

Financial discussions are no longer allowed in the ED GD since they inevitably lead to flaming and divides amongst the community. Please refresh yourself on the =AE= Comprehensive Forum Rules as well.

From the ED GD Rules
quote:

  • No "Financial" Discussions
    Artix Entertainment appreciates every player, no matter how much he or she has spent on the game. Demeaning players because they have not upgraded, or vice versa, will not be permitted in any form. Since such discussions tend to devolve into flaming, we will no longer permit users to create threads about any sort of financial status. That means no Varium vs Non-Varium threads, no Free Player vs Paying Player threads, no threads about the unfairness of Varium prices, and so on. Anything related to finances will not be allowed. If you are unsure if the topic would be acceptable or not, ask the head moderator for permission before creating it.


    • Locked.

    Thanks,
    Battle Elf
    ED GD Archknight
    AQW Epic  Post #: 22
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