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Sugestion for Hype Dragonfable

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5/1/2024 20:20:45   
israelpaiva25
Member

Why don't we focus more on competitiveness and pvp in dragonfable? And dragons too, the name says it all dragonfable

Make a pvp without AI, real players with a queue, rank per season with rewards for rankings, create an Auction/sale system, an npc for players to list their rare items, for Dragon coins, and other players buy, this npc consumes a 20% tax on dragon coins from sales and could use these dragon coins to distribute in the war/monster wave system, distribute to the players who kill the most monsters/waves in the war, there would be a rank that would be updated every 30 minutes, to know your position and earn a % in dragons coins or something else you prefer, but before paying rewards from rankeds and wars, always take a break of a few days, to investigate the top ranked players, to check if there is no they used hacks or cheats and only then paid.

Wouldn't that reinvent dragonfable? It would make it much more fun without taking away the essence, and they should also pay a little attention to the dragon's pvp

I used Google Translate, I'm Brazilian, sorry for the English!!!!!!
DF  Post #: 1
5/1/2024 21:50:18   
Laeon val Observis
Member
 

 First of all, live PVP and auction proposals are forbidden suggestions (understandable that English is a secondary language for you, but inexcusable under these premises). And just because non-Epoch Chronos have been made accessible for DC purchase does not empower us, the playerbase, to make such suggestions.

Second of all, notwithstanding the burnout nature of wars (do not ignore the feedback loop that will result in trying to increase war waves required to clear a war with an increased playerbase, as is much what you're trying to achieve), you're devaluing the current image of the game that you need no more than a DA to clear all its contents. Remember, it is safer to assume all of the items that can be purchased for DCs end of quest to bypass drop RNGs are NDA contrast to their high/max level drop equivalents which are DA. And if we are to factor in potential endgame implications, even if you somehow acquire non-Inn best in slot (BiS) gear via the DC drop bypass, the fact that you only have half class skills accessible as an NDA is not really a sufficient encouragement, and going along the lines of just using Pyro, KAA, and Archi to try and "bribe" through that is not really a healthy perspective either. And as it is currently, wars have a lot of things going on under the hood that can go wrong. So adding this... DC "donation drive"... will cause more trouble than benefit.

< Message edited by Laeon val Observis -- 5/1/2024 22:01:05 >
DF AQW  Post #: 2
5/2/2024 12:30:27   
israelpaiva25
Member

I really didn't know that these suggestions couldn't be made and I can't understand the reason for these rules, sorry, on the other hand, I think the game is very easy and doesn't encourage people to want to farm to equip their character to be in infinite pve, I felt that they increased difficulty of the latest quests that are launching, but I think they should increase the difficulty even more to encourage better equipment to farm, more strategies, pvp would bring more competitiveness and make players want to farm more, regarding wars, they should include a rare drop even if be it 0.5% or 1% per wave, to encourage players to join the fight against wars, to have a chance to drop this rare item, whoever already has their medal defense set has a hope or a taste of being able to have something more .
DF  Post #: 3
5/2/2024 17:13:36   
Laeon val Observis
Member
 

 The forbidden suggestions that you so recklessly laid onto the table are forbidden can be summed up due to intense technical and manpower requirements.

More difficulty... more difficulty? Do you not realize how many Inn quests are there compared to classes? There's no math here. Let's say for the sake of argument, since you're somewhat insistent, that your PVP proposals are implemented. Let's also rule out "fun" builds because only competent builds will have the best consistencies deserving of rewards for this kind of battlefield (If you're smart, you can go into the non-duo, trio, etc fights of the Inn with barely any high All resist builds, something I personally did during the days prior to Pirate being reimagined. I doubt PVP will be as forgiving). Even if we take it to the hypothetical extreme that that we also add in the equivalent to AQW's PVP amulets (they're items that increase a player's HP in PVP) and a multiplayer PVP like what is done in EpicDuel, another AE game wherein you'll better fit in if you're a PVP nut, the permutations are blatantly smaller compared to the amount of Inn fights that have already been released over the last almost seven years, and it's still counting. And dragon PVP, what permutation exists there? Practically none. Conclusion: regardless of what kind of PVP you talk about, a lot of things need to be done to spice them up beyond just builds, something that will take significant time and resources (something that I feel that a certain dracomancer nut in Reddit and Discord is underestimating) when Fleshweaver and Hard Mode are already backburned for a long time now.

Rare drops? They aren't so much as a challenge and more of an inconsistent test of patience. Case in point: while I was content that I acquired the C7 trinket via drop RNG, I had to grit my teeth for the more likely scenario that I had to confront and win against Pandora eight times for both it and Elpis. And it wasn't definitely fun to tomb raid to acquire the Aventail if we are to ask for a non-Inn example.

More... elite... war rewards (Do not dare use the word "elite" in these parts lightly. Even I had to think it out just to use it here)? Notwithstanding your war records, you should feel it. Even with chain waves, warring still has that feeling of eternity that offsets any incentives to go high on the waves cleared. And no, while I am proud that I have the DM accessories that I really desired (Belt, Necklace, Ring, EUD), I am reminded also that those were times that I was less... stable... which is why I could acquiesce them with relative rapidity. Even now that I have more stability and restraint, I too feel the daunting amount of waves having to be cleared to get the war to 100%. In fact, I would have been content with just the Belt because I already had C7 and the Dominion accessories (the latter somewhat easier now to earn courtesy of the reimaginings done to DK, whose set items definitely use less merge item quantities than DM accessories) prior to the revisions to the DM requirements of Belt, Necklace, and Ring to make them more palatable in the presence of EUD and Cannon. And be glad that NDAs now have an NDA to DA conversion for those accessories so they don't have to suffer more burnout to start from scratch should they decide to purchase a DA. So, as it currently stands, DF currently offers sufficient tools in DM items despite them being overshadowed in terms of quantity by cosmetics requiring said medals.

And now, you'll probably use the cosmetics argument. Before you proceed with such, perhaps you should contemplate on this Reddit post why we have to take caution in releasing more items that offer damage, stats, and/or resistances (Here's the original as I have some corrections on quote):

quote:

Most of the time new damaging weapons are released with new Inn challenges.

In either case (since the Inn also sometimes provides cosmetic only rewards), after a point there isn't a point to releasing a new damaging weapon without power creeping older weapons.

Take Ice elemental weapons, for instance.

You have the SoulForged Scythe (Ice), the Ice Scythe (DA), the Frostscythe III (Inn reward for clearing Ice and Dragons), Snow's Repose (Frostvale 2021 item), and Antithesis weapons (Monthly DC weapon).

The above are the most commonly used ice weapons each for specific purposes.

SoulForged is one of the easiest to access Ice weapons with +10 All resist.

Ice Scythe is easy to access and has one of the strongest special ability slots in game (and is thus used for the Special Slot of any weapon listed here).

The Frostscythe is the Best in Slot Ice weapon (meaning unless you purposely want to avoid optimizing, there isn't a reason to not use it if available).

Snow's Repose and Antithesis weapons provide a large amount of Main Damage Stat (Str/Dex/Int) and are good for Offensive gearswap.

So if another Ice-type damaging weapon were added, what role could it fill that hasn't already been filled by the top Ice weapons without power creeping them (most likely MPM, BPD, or specific elemental resistance Ice weapons)? Adding extra damaging weapons would be a bit pointless if nobody will use them over other options.

Not to mention, adding multiple variants of weapons increases database clutter and also makes extra busywork for balancing each tier's stats.

Though somewhat dated due to the revisions to Ice Scythe's special earlier this year, this post should still provide sufficient substance to think about before attempting to suggest new items.

< Message edited by Laeon val Observis -- 5/2/2024 17:16:51 >
DF AQW  Post #: 4
5/2/2024 19:08:40   
israelpaiva25
Member

So, my thought is that to keep a person in the game, it's not just history, history is very important, but a constant evolution of the character, the feeling of always wanting to get stronger, having a goal of getting stronger to try to get beyond that. challenge, or competing with something to do all this has a meaning in the end, farming without a final meaning or reason is also demotivating, I don't know if you understand my feeling, always having something to aim for, to improve that's what makes An RPG player always wants to play.
DF  Post #: 5
5/2/2024 19:16:23   
Laeon val Observis
Member
 

 Oh, I do get your point. But to say that an RPG player wants to always play? Wow. Unless the game you're playing is Esports worthy, that's a long shot that would get you the remarks that go along the lines of asking you to touch grass and get a life, and a textbook example of subtraction neglect. Go ahead and do your research on that jargon.

EDIT: And as much as I would like to avoid this, improve your punctuations por favor. It uses up unnecessary brain power to try to figure out where one sentence ends and another begins when said brain power could be used to focus more into discussion. And I'm not just educating you on not only history, but also practicality.

< Message edited by Laeon val Observis -- 5/2/2024 19:25:46 >
DF AQW  Post #: 6
5/2/2024 20:13:18   
israelpaiva25
Member

Why do you seem so mad about this? I don't know what your problem with this is.
DF  Post #: 7
5/2/2024 21:16:41   
Laeon val Observis
Member
 

 No, just giving an evaluation and reality checks where appropriate which you then shrug as "history", and in a way that puts it into getting over or to forget something. And since this is getting into a loop, last piece of reality checks before I leave this thread as is: with the small crew (devs) manning the game with some volunteer testers, and with Hard Mode and Fleshweaver in the backburn as they juggle those with existing plans such as reimagining classes (yes, I'm looking at the seemingly forgotten Shadow Hunter) and Books One and Two, shouldn't bug reporting or checking for certain plot holes/inconsistencies be more than enough for us players at the current state of things? Look, the devs have delivered amazing content without being hampered by a galvanized playerbase such as in AQ (probably attributable to the latter game's volatile interactions with its almost Mickey Mouse currencies and resistances to game balance revisions). And us, the playerbase, respond in kindness and understanding. Delayed release? Take your time, it's gonna be glorious. Reimagined class feeling too wonky? Tell where it's falling short, or where it can cause an escalation in power of the major repercussions' kind. Which is something you might want to look into next as your current pace of dialogue is underestimating it. Swapping to just Dropbear or Hidebehind for a defensive should tell you how little stat variances are needed in this game that can put a player in an advantageous or disadvantageous position.

As a last personal advice, careful how you use the term "continuous change". At this point I do recommend that you read about subtraction negligence and putting more thought into the Reddit post I quoted instead of rushing yourself to respond. Put consumerism into the corner for once. You don't always have to seek for "more", especially the significant. It's not always about getting able to one punch an adversary nor for satisfying your roleplaying fantasies. And since you seemingly still underestimate your beliefs of what RPGs should be, how about also supplementing your head with the concept of ikigai so at the least you get why I structured my previous post as such.

And if you think I don't understand that my posts have traces of my ideals and perspectives on this game, oh, I do. I won't stop others putting their own views here, even the devs, even though they might run contrary to my inputs. Unless there seems to be any changes to your perspectives and pace on this thread, as I said earlier, I see no point inputting my views further. So for now, go and see how this thread goes as is. De nada.

DF AQW  Post #: 8
5/2/2024 22:13:17   
  Verlyrus
DragonFable Boxcat


 PvP without AI is something that I've considered and looked into, but the fact of the matter is that the game isn't balanced for it. In most cases, whoever went first would win. This would also split our very limited resources into more parts, which would result in other parts of the game suffering. Unfortunately, it's not something I'm interested in setting up.

An Auction house or player trading is also something that I am not interested in setting up. It creates an incentive to steal accounts, and creates an economy that we do not have the resources to balance.

As for wars, I do not want to encourage such heavy grinding, and spending time trying to solve cheating would, again, take away from resources that are better spent elsewhere.

While these would certainly change the game, they would do so in a direction that I do not agree with.

The endgame is currently the Inn challenges, and I'm always looking to create interesting and difficult fights. I suggest trying those if you find the main story too easy.
Considering the gap between casual and Inn challenge players, I feel like there's actually more room for mid-tier content.

That said, simply making numbers that increase, then gear to grind for that matches that increase, while I understand that some people enjoy that, is not the direction I want to go.
AQ MQ  Post #: 9
5/3/2024 2:39:10   
DragonKeeper
Member

quote:


I feel like there's actually more room for mid-tier content.


Such Goldilocks challenges sound really great. They are not too difficult and not too easy.
DF  Post #: 10
5/3/2024 9:36:48   
israelpaiva25
Member

*PVP
I understand, but did you think about a data system, which would draw who would start the fight? It could be based on some LUK or CHAR status or just 50/50, or the weakest player in league points would start first, about class balancing , it was just allowing some classes in pvp, and in the future maybe releasing others based on balance,
*WAR
Regarding war, wouldn't you think it's worth putting at least one rare drop that would serve something, to at least encourage you or give you a fantasy that could achieve something other than just defending medals? you would put whatever you thought was fair, I don't know, and the % could be 0.5%, 0.2% I don't know, just having a chance to win an "extra" in addition to the defenders medal would be interesting,a non-direct interaction between players, within the game, something like showing the players who killed and helped the most in the war, would receive some additional reward and the others would be able to see that player's ID would be very interesting and immersive, checking if this player used cheating /hack on this activity in question would require that much time from the team? Before electing the player this check could be carried out, This event and verification could be done at the end of the event and since it would require a lot of time for the team, it could be done once every 1 month or two months, and only for players who entered the rank, only for those who were eligible, I don't know the top 100 or top 20 to avoid time and strain on the team during verification, if they had used something illegal at the event, they would not be eligible.

*AUCTION HOUSE would mess up the economy because? those who would save money and think it was fair to pay or sell would be the players, and so all dragon coins would be bought from you in the same way, and you would burn a part of the dragon coins on the market, with the rate of negotiation forcing players to buy more, they would price the items themselves at the price they think is worth it or not, and you could simply configure the items to be advertised at a minimum price, as perhaps the fear is that they will sell items cheaper than they otherwise would game stores, I don't know, but I respect your opinion, I just wish the game had a little more public interaction between them, that seems much more immersive and fun.
(Just a problem I thought of, but easy to solve, when creating other characters on a dragon amulet account, not receiving 2k more dragons coins, as they could abuse this, creating characters to earn dragon coins and buying items with dragons coins , or the dragon coin you win is DC LOCKED, only use it to buy items within the game and not at auction)


A few more questions, do you intend to release the game for mobile? And would there be translation options for the stories into other languages?(If it would take time for you, that's okay, I understand) Even if it were through Google Translate, I don't understand many things about the story because I don't know how to speak English :(
But I played Dragonfable in 2011 when I was a kid, I recently went back to remember it and the game has really improved compared to before, I just miss a more focus on dragons, specifically on the baby dragon/big dragon, something we could have a progression from. with him, train him beyond just feeding and giving meaning to the dragon's pvp, some items equippable in exchange for pvp items or customizable, I don't know, the saga that grabbed me the most when I entered dragonfable was the dragons egg saga


Maybe my thoughts on interaction between players and progression are like this, because I got used to playing mmorpgs like Lineage 2 (best game I've played to date, let's see if its successor TL reaches its golden age), Perfect Worlds among others, I farmed with a purpose of "being the strongest or going head to head with other players", that's what held me back in these games.This thirst to test myself against other players or to be stronger or equal to them, which kept me in these games, testing myself against AI or bots are not that rewarding in my opinion, after a while you end up losing interest.

I think just a little bit of interaction between players, between the community within the game wouldn't hurt, it doesn't need to be in pvp specifically but in some other way it would be healthy for the game and not harmful.

I gave some ideas, which you can change and adapt to the reality of the game, I think that at least the War one you could try to implement and adapt in the way you think is most appropriate for the game, but something following a logic of showing people within the game who killed the most and contributed to the war an event every 1,2 or 3 months as they see fit and being able to be rewarded with special items or items representing their great milestone, it would be very exciting, and the players' nicknames and IDs were visible to the others, for everyone to know and want to be in their place next time.




< Message edited by israelpaiva25 -- 5/3/2024 10:41:33 >
DF  Post #: 11
5/3/2024 16:17:20   
Laeon val Observis
Member
 

 *Sighs* A translation suggestion was made years ago, and this is what Verlyrus had to say about that:

quote:

Unfortunately, DragonFable isn't quite set up to make translation something feasible.

While it would be very cool to have translations, it would take an insanely incredible amount of resources, and basically remaking the entire game.

And as I suspected, you're compensating by being a combative player in terms of goal setting as the root cause is language barrier because progressing through the story should be a reasonable drive for moving forwards in the game no matter how obvious it is.

Your PvP and auction proposals... honestly, at this point I regret going against my instincts to request a thread deletion knowing that those two should've had decent weight for such a reason as those two are forbidden suggestions despite the Verly already giving sufficient education as to why (this is not the first time they had to tell the community personally that those are not on the list of improvements despite, as they said, being potential game changers), so I'll keep it direct for you. Do you not consider the human element to be part of the resources that are already stretched thin in this game? Look around you. Despite innovations in AI, we still need humans just as a redundancy for verifying validities, and that will include claims of cheating, hacking, and other illegal gaming behaviors. And if you'll try putting on the table to hire more hands, careful. Personal experience, a person I know couldn't be hired for a company, despite being a potentially good asset for them, due to insufficient budget. It's just one example, but that's the reality of human resourcing. You're underestimating the human aspect needed, and trying to red herring the argument by focusing solely on the technical. Either square up to that or stop altogether regardless of what is being suggested. There should be enough ground truth not only on this post but the entire thread at this point to make that decision.

The schadenfreude of a player fumbling due to a PvP misplay aside, if you really want more interaction with the community, just go to the community Reddit or Discord server/s as they do exist. A chat system had been suggested in AQ earlier this year, and if the education there to the suggestor has any valid substance, is also a big investment akin to the translation suggestion you're trying to posit. And the conclusion was just to the sites/servers mentioned earlier in this segment. And as Verly couldn't emphasize enough, test your wits at the Inn. It might not have the schadenfreude I mentioned earlier, but it should have enough content to sate your drive for power seeking as they are varied enough and is still growing. Not to mention that since the devs do have ongoing plans to reimagine Books One and Two, as I said in the Convergence (Part Two) DNs thread, it would be interesting how they'll encourage a tactical mindset on the player as revising certain enemies is an "when not if" scenario. It was already done with Doctor When.

The RNG drop once again. War or not, do you not get the reason why the DC drop bypass shops were implemented in the first place? While there are players who might have the time and the self-perceived notion of being lucky, those shops are there so that those who are less... available... but still want the item can acquire them. Provides inclusivity and could lessen the (frustrating) reasons why a player would resort to illegal means just to have their way in the game. And yes, RNG drops by virtue of being RNG drops have time and again across any game have been a sufficient motivator for illegal gaming behavior, so don't try to sidestep on the belief of all people being good on this.

*Heavy sigh* Another (port to) mobile suggestion. At this point, I'll say what I have in mind with that particular frequent suggestion: instead of uttering platitudes, how about showing us a hypothetical interface. Unless you can provide one that is not too cluttered and not too action intensive for the player's part that could fit on the screen of a phone, there's no point in piping up this suggestion further.

< Message edited by Laeon val Observis -- 5/3/2024 21:31:24 >
DF AQW  Post #: 12
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