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=MECH= Symbolism

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5/9/2010 21:22:18   
Crimzon5
Member

When writing, does anyone here think of adding symbolism to his or her piece? In Language class, we tackled some novels and during discussions, our teacher pointed out some symbolism.

Some examples:

In Noli Me Tangere (a book our national hero wrote based on the setting of our country during the time of the Spaniards) there's a particular scene in the early chapters:

In the long dining table, the chair on the short side is the spot of honor/power. There was a party in a rich native man's house. Now, there were two Spanish priests there, arguing over the seat (through the means of insisting the other one to take it, waiting for the moment to say "okay, I'll take it if you insist"). Now, no one even had the thought of giving the seat to the owner of the house who also happens to be the host.

The symbolism here is that the power of Philippine's government (during Spanish time) was not only fought over by the colonists, but also limited to them (the Spaniards) and not the natives who actually happen to live on the land.



Sometimes, I argue with myself. Was the author really clever in making such symbolism, or was it up to the reader to decipher something from his work? So anyways, does anyone have experience in using symbolism to the point that people try to decipher it?

< Message edited by Crimzon5 -- 5/9/2010 21:54:45 >
AQ DF  Post #: 1
5/9/2010 21:26:40   
Postmaster General
Member

Annalyzing literature is one of my favorite things to do when reading a piece. Symbolism is one of the many things that can be picked up, but I too must ask myself if it is really possible for the author to have intended that, or if it is just my own mind lining the writing up with a situation.

I enjoy symbolism in my own pieces and try to have each character, while still exhibiting character depth, to be symbolic of a specific trait.
AQ DF MQ AQW Epic  Post #: 2
5/9/2010 22:40:18   
Goldstein
Member

For me, it seems as if symbolism comes by accident. And whenever I feel that elusive thing creep into my paper, I tend to do this...I imagine that, ten years in the future, what would it be like to dissect my piece, looking for symbolism? Usually, I like what I imagine.

Прощай сэр! Желаем удачи!
Farewell Sir! Good luck!
Post #: 3
5/9/2010 23:55:48   
alexmacf
Member

I like to play with common symbols. You tend to expect people with daggers to be assassins, untrustworthy, and traitors, si? I love to write characters with daggers who are completely and totally faithful and loyal in their own way, and not just to themselves. They may assassinate, but that's not a major part of their characterization. One expects male lions to be used to symbolize the brave folks, but I use them to symbolize the lazy people, in closer reality to real male lions.
I just like to play. It's a major part of my writing.
AQ DF MQ  Post #: 4
5/10/2010 0:49:02   
Eukara Vox
Legendary AdventureGuide!


 I never set out to write using symbolism. I tell the story as it unfolds in my mind. If there is symbolism, chalk it up to subconscious insertion.
AQ DF MQ AQW Epic  Post #: 5
5/11/2010 0:45:32   
demolitiondragon
Constructively Friendly!


 I used to avoid it like the plague.

However, the story I'm working on atm has it. But that story... *words cannot describe this* ...it broke my style into a thousand pieces.

So now, I'm not sure.
Post #: 6
5/11/2010 7:45:37   
Crimzon5
Member

Personally, I get the idea "Hey, this would make a great symbolism," but the second thought of "I doubt anyone would even think of deciphering this."
AQ DF  Post #: 7
5/11/2010 9:18:26   
superjars
Member

Usually, when I'm rereading the first parts of something I've written, I start to see the first vestiges of symbolism, so I just continue with those themes and try to keep the message underlying the work. Like Eukara, I don't think I ever set out to use it, but it does seem to show up even when least expected.
AQ DF MQ AQW Epic  Post #: 8
5/11/2010 12:24:33   
.::oDrew
Member

The best stories are stories that mean something; they go beyond writing for writing's sake and force the reader to formulate an opinion - not about the story itself, but about what the story says. This requires at least some degree of symbolism or metaphor to elevate the story beyond itself.

That's not to say that all great stories must include some sort of social commentary, or what have you. But parallels to the "real world" can be drawn from many of the greatest novels - The Lord of the Rings, The Lion, the Witch, and the Wardrobe, How To Catch a Mockingbird...these are just a few that jump to mind immediately.

Of course, this is coming from someone who is primarily a poet, and poetry is a craft where symbolism is paramount...so, caveat emptor, I suppose.
Post #: 9
5/11/2010 12:45:56   
Jadugarr
Member

I don’t like writing in intentional symbolism. I just want to write something that is fun for me to write.

I’m writing a story because I want to tell a story. If you can somehow relate what I write back to the world, and subconsciously connect it to certain ideals that you find similarities between, then good on you; maybe I did say something, but that’s not what I was saying.
DF MQ  Post #: 10
5/11/2010 15:30:38   
Fleur Du Mal
Member

I write in symbols both intentionally and unintentionally. I don't think anyone has had to go through great lengths to decipher what I've written here. Really, I think most of the symbols I've used have been pretty simple and if they have gone without notice, the writing should've been understandable (and enjoyable - I hope) in other ways.

Crimz, I don't think the example you gave about the men fighting politely over the dinner table seating requires that much deciphering. It's good symbolism but I think it shouldn't really baffle the reader, as it is clear enough.

The symbols I put in stories and poems are a lot of the time for setting mood, sometimes just for amusing myself, and in some poems, just for the sake of them being symbols. With haiku and tanka, it's because it goes with the general form and definition of those poem types that there are symbols -- generally those derived from the nature.

As a person who is continuosly hinting and alluding, I couldn't survive too long without symbols.

DF  Post #: 11
5/11/2010 17:29:15   
Sir Nicholas
Member

My friend, I'm pleased that you've asked, because I had an idea for a little bit 'o symbolism right in the next chapter. I won't bore you with details, but the punchline of it is, Sir William's world is about to come tumbling down.

The scene with the Death Knight did have a bit of symbolism in it: Namely because it shows exactly what the Evil powers can do to a good and honorable man. To see just how far he can fall, its exactly what I'm trying to pinpoint.

_____________________________

Jesse, Elda, Marcus, Jolana, Vegalok, Damien, Eliac - I remember you all. Wherever you are, I hope you are all safe.

And Falerin, I hope you have found peace.
AQ  Post #: 12
5/11/2010 17:42:52   
Xplayer
Roaming the Web


 I love symbolism. I believe that an author has an obligation to send some sort of message through his or her story. Through symbolism, I can keep accomplish this while not being anvilicious (although some symbolism can be anvilicious if not done properly).

Although sometimes symbolism can cause issues, especially if the reader completely misses it. I once wrote an entire poem that was from the perspective of a dying tree, but I used a human body as a symbol for a tree's body. The result did not go over well with my creative writing teacher, who did not see the tree in my description.
AQ AQW  Post #: 13
5/11/2010 19:30:22   
horusmaster9
Member

Symbolism? I only actually include subtle symbolism in shorter works. But for my long works, I lose symbolism altogether. Those longer pieces are, in my opinion, meant for entertainment value more than they are meant for morals and such. Plus, I'm not going to intricately place intended details purely for symbolism in a longer story. I'm most likely going to write the longer stories as I want to, not as the "message" dictates. Overarching themes might find its way in there, but I just think that symbolism is better suited to things like poems and short stories. But that's just my opinion.

_____________________________
Post #: 14
5/11/2010 20:20:53   
Sir Nicholas
Member

A thought just occurred to me: An idea that I had not thought of originally, but now, I'm quite pleased with it. The Paladin Temple itself, where Sir William is knighted, it serves as a symbol- As is the way its portrayed as an unshakable foundation, a beacon of Light in a world that is about to be swallowed by an approaching Darkness.

I've fully developed the final plot-points of Dark Waltz and when I'm better rested, I'll get to work on the next chapter.
AQ  Post #: 15
5/12/2010 4:30:43   
Xirminator
Member

In my opinion, symbolism ought to occur accidentally. You can deliberately put symbolism in your story, but what would be the point, really? Most of the symbolism that English professors spot in the classics was probably a sudden whim of the author, rather than the ultimate meaning of the novel or something.

If I'm writing something with symbolism in it, it's most likely accidental.
AQ DF  Post #: 16
5/13/2010 18:50:15   
Firefly
Lore-ian


 Symbolism being often accidental doesn't take away its significance. Sure, during the first draft, a lot of the symbolism is accidental. However, while editing, it's possible to spot the "accidents" you made, then turn them into something that ties into the work. Therefore, I'm not sure it can be labelled as accidental. I often find myself slipping things in as I write, but I notice them and (hopefully) can focus on how they can help my story thematically.

Therefore, I do think analysis is valid. Some of the really detailed bits may be overthinking, but it doesn't change the fact that the substance is /there/. After all, the birth of a story itself is hardly logical, and the symbols created by whims can be just as meaningful. (Of course, as long as it is coherent and ties into the work as a whole. And as long as the reader doesn't miss the point entirely...)

EDIT: A type of symbolism analysis I do /not/ like is when readers shove the symbols into specific little boxes. Sure, there are many wonderful works that symbolize specific things (George Orwell's books come to mind). However, very often, people take works that are symbols for more general things and force them to become spokespeople for politics/war/history ect. when they're simply comments on human nature in general. That's when it gets annoying and narrow-minded. (For instance, a story about discrimination does /not/ have to be an allegory to WWII, with the main villain as Hitler, ect.).

< Message edited by Firefly -- 5/13/2010 18:54:09 >
AQ  Post #: 17
5/15/2010 10:11:25   
Xirminator
Member

I agree that the word accidental is not perfect for symbolism. I was just saying that authors who go out of their way to create symbolism - or critics that try to see it - are just really trying too hard. Personally, I don't think a lot of analysis should be devoted to it, not the way they do it at my University, at least, where every character has to stand for something and represent a particular aspect of whatever society the book was written in.

In my opinion, there's no need to think so hard about every aspect that can be interpreted as a symbol. A good book will make you think about those things on your own.

< Message edited by Xirminator -- 5/15/2010 10:16:23 >
AQ DF  Post #: 18
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