RE: we re just talking of the gup (Full Version)

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Lycus -> RE: we re just talking of the gup (2/2/2012 12:21:54)

@Mir: Once again, you've proven you've not listened to a thing I've said in the past, and you're making arguments just for the point of it.

Firstly the Balance Team and Testing Team IS separate, Wiseman and Ashari run the Balance Team, I run the Testing Team. Ashari and Wiseman have been coming up with no end of ways to achieve further balance, but these things have to happen step by step, we can't just change everything in one release... If you've noticed the last few updates balance changes HAVE been made, and just because none have been announced in the DN's this time, does not mean that there are not any coming. And of course the Testing Team is of finding bugs etc. because that's their job, we have the Balance Team for Balance, Testing Team for bugs and testing.

I'd also like to say, as Silver Sky Magician rightly said, your argument is that we're ignoring Non-Variums and trying to create distractions. What you don't understand is Christmas releases have to come at Christmas, Valentines releases have to come near to Valentines, they're not distractions, they're advances in the story line that have to happen at these times of the year. They're not distractions, they are advances in the story line, that can't be released at any other time. The Suggestion shop should solve most of what you are annoyed about, because it will bring new Non-Varium Weapons... Your other issue was bots - you can win the assault bot in the arcade, as a Non-Varium, that may be hard, but it's always an option to attempt. Further more, as Titan explained in the last DN's Bots, with the current system, are very hard to implement, as soon as it's fixed up a bit better, then we should be able to release more.

The enhancement/Credit issue will hopefully be fixed if/when we implement scaling credits, this means higher levels will receive more credits per win, so they can afford more! I hope this covers everything, but all the things you have raised have already been answered, if you haven't bothered to read them, that is your choice. But then raising them again is rather rude and ignorant, and I'd appreciate it if in future you read posts posted by staff, because they may explain most the things you keep bringing up...



midnight assassin -> RE: we re just talking of the gup (2/2/2012 12:27:05)

quote:

The enhancement/Credit issue will hopefully be fixed if/when we implement scaling credits, this means higher levels will receive more credits per win, so they can afford more!


Will this thing also be effective on npc?This thing can lessen the gap in my opinion.



Stabilis -> RE: we re just talking of the gup (2/2/2012 12:45:15)

If credits get scaled by level then hopefully experienced players will be prompted to purchase boosters. This would increase their popularity, thus allowing the development of battle equipment to really diversify with the extra credits obtained. Cool.[;)]



midnight assassin -> RE: we re just talking of the gup (2/2/2012 12:50:15)

^Agree with that.



IsaiahtheMage -> RE: we re just talking of the gup (2/2/2012 13:00:29)

@Lycus I agree wih some of your post. But didn't Ashari tell us like two weeks ago that Titan already fixed the bot problem? I mean how else was he able to bring out the Azrael Bot one week after we where informed bots are very difficult to create? If he was able to bring out a Varium bot a week later why can't he bring out a non-varium one? Also I do not agree with the part about arcade. IMO arcade is a token scam no matter what I do I rarely get anything. I don't wanna keep trying and trying because as a lvl 33 non-var I keep running into lvl 34 full vars and when that happens my tokens I use in arcade are basically wasted. I think you guys the testing team and the balance team should really try equiping non-var gear with no enhancements and go into battle and see how difficult it is. So you can understand our frustration.



Stabilis -> RE: we re just talking of the gup (2/2/2012 13:26:56)

Arcade battle:

• 5 tokens to use

• 5 regular battle wins (1v1, 2v2, 1v2, 1vM) gives 5 battle tokens

• each battle can range from about 30 seconds to 10 minutes

Up to 50 minutes spent just to play for 0.1% chance of a good win?



Basicball -> RE: we re just talking of the gup (2/2/2012 13:44:41)

Arcade battle:

• 5 tokens to use

• 5 regular battle wins (1v1, 2v2, 1v2, 1vM) gives 5 battle tokens (1V1) or 10 tokens (2V2/Jugg) (dunno what 1vM is)

• each battle can range from about 30 seconds to 10 minutes (average is about 1-1.5 minutes/token)

Up to 50 minutes spent just to play for 0.1% chance of a good win? (probally around 6-7 minutes)



IsaiahtheMage -> RE: we re just talking of the gup (2/2/2012 13:55:47)

@Depressed Void Agreed.



Lycus -> RE: we re just talking of the gup (2/2/2012 13:57:19)

@Isiah: Ashari was right, in the fact that, yes, most of the Bot issue is fixed, and a lot of work has gone in to making the system much more user friendly, but there are still a few adjustments that need to be made to make it as easy as Titan can possibly make it. The Varium bot was introduced because the new Valentine Saga has began, and NW/Charfade decided to create a bot for it. In the future, I'm sure there will definitely be more Non-Varium bots released.

I do understand you on the token/arcade problem, but I just used that as an example to show that the Assault Bot is actually kind of Non-Varium if you're lucky.



Stabilis -> RE: we re just talking of the gup (2/2/2012 14:09:09)

@Basicball,

Its very good that you can give us averages (such as length of battles), however averages are clearly biased. 1 -> 1.5 minutes does not represent the battles that end instantly or the battles that feel as if they last for hour(s) (which is really 8 -> 15 minutes). The average does not concern the players who do not fall under the guidelines so that is the biggest reason why they are exclusive. I say this because I have to represent(!) every player who experiences ED if you understand where I'm coming from. Not saying that your data is irrelevant as I still appreciate it for the utility of judging the abilities of certain quick-build-kills. Oh, 1vM was supposed to represent 1vNPC (monster in classic terminology).

Personally, majority of my fights last at least 5 minutes.



Ashari -> RE: we re just talking of the gup (2/2/2012 15:59:16)

@IsaiahtheMage: The problem of enhancement prices is obvious.

There is an intended gap in enhancements between Varium and non-Varium items. Any varium item on the new standard has 2 extra enhancement slots, which gives a Varium player up to 8 bonus stats from enhancements. As far as enhancements go, the gap isn't meant to be further widened by non-Varium players being unable to afford enhancements at all, which is the case for many non-Varium players right now.

As Lycus already mentioned, scaling battle rewards and enhancement prices by level would make their cost much more reasonable. It would also make enhancing low level items much more affordable. These are both big projects though and like many of the bigger balance changes, we need Titan or RabbleFroth's help in implementing them. The same is true of new skills.

Titan's made huge improvements in the bot system, but robots are still a huge time investment. Every bot has it's own art, specials and animations, which means each bot still requires a ton of work by Nightwraith and Charfade on the artsy side of development. It's not really possible to squeeze in another bot in between the already huge selection of player suggested items the staff is working on for this week. A credit only bot is on the shortlist of to-do's, so you'll be seeing one in the near future.



Basicball -> RE: we re just talking of the gup (2/2/2012 16:04:24)

quote:

RabbleFroth


ok, you got my attention

tell me more [:D]



IsaiahtheMage -> RE: we re just talking of the gup (2/2/2012 16:07:27)

@Lycus and Ashari Ok. I do agree with the scaling system Lycus. And thanks for clearing that up about the bots Ashari. I hope to see that within the next month.



xxmirxx -> RE: we re just talking of the gup (2/3/2012 2:35:11)

quote:

@Mir: Once again, you've proven you've not listened to a thing I've said in the past, and you're making arguments just for the point of it.
Once again you never said that second balance team is as well test team Ashri as well wiseman are part of test team. usually test team usually to find bugs as well try make weapons even so you wouldn't have people getting mad after dev's nerf weapons. Because balance team/ test team never brother to nerf weapons before release it.
quote:

If you've noticed the last few updates balance changes HAVE been made,
Yes ever time you nerf class you just make mages worst every time. I notice changes like mages stun is whole alot lower chance of stun then beta. Im sorry so basically okay to make non varium wait ever 4 months or so to get weapons.



od -> RE: we re just talking of the gup (2/3/2012 14:26:45)

quote:

The enhancement/Credit issue will hopefully be fixed if/when we implement scaling credits, this means higher levels will receive more credits per win, so they can afford more! I hope this covers everything, but all the things you have raised have already been answered, if you haven't bothered to read them, that is your choice.

Perfect. I've been waiting for this for a while. Is this change also going to be implemented for experience?



PivotalDisorder -> RE: we re just talking of the gup (2/3/2012 15:34:26)

so a group of people saying varium items should be more powerful because they pay. yes we know, we always knew, we keep knowing. we couldn't know that fact any more
that we already do, why waste time repeating the sentiment. now can you calm down, reign your massive egos in and actually contribute some ideas for closing the gap without
discouraging spending. To those who did, I commend you :)

I think non-var items should have 1-2 less total stats, but same damage/def/res and enhancement slots as a varium item of equal level. then the difference would be the 1-2
stats per item, and enhancements. once a non-var was enhanced, would be a max of 8 stats difference. far more reasonable. it's not like non-vars can enhance fully before
they reach 34, unless they save every single penny and get lucky on arcade.

I know no varium player would settle for a measly +8 stat difference though, but hey, they are cowards and they don't want a competitive fight, they just wanna smash some
poor non-var player into a billion pieces, then troll them, abuse them, mock them, laugh in their face, then say GG.

Angels Holocaust said it best..."I must win"



Vendile -> RE: we re just talking of the gup (2/3/2012 15:42:58)

They deserve a buff, but not to be equal with variums. At least a buff that'll give them a chance to stnad up against variumers



PivotalDisorder -> RE: we re just talking of the gup (2/3/2012 16:08:28)

@Vendile: Please read the post above yours. you are just repeating what players have been saying since the game began and half the posts in this
topic say the same thing. not trying to be rude or anything, just that your post is the baseline for obvious and doesn't really need to be said.



IsaiahtheMage -> RE: we re just talking of the gup (2/3/2012 18:10:51)

@psibertus I disagree. I do agree Non-variums need a buff but for people to pay 25-50$ just to get a +8 stat difference is ridiculos. No one would by varium. Everything would be just fine if we had good lvl 34 weapons and we were able to fully enhance all of our weapons.



PivotalDisorder -> RE: we re just talking of the gup (2/3/2012 18:25:13)

they would definitely pay to get +8. the players have proved that time and again.

and don't forget, even with increase in credits, it's still gonna take non-vars months to fully enhance and by then you have bought something better
and enhanced it while they have to debate whether to stick with what they have got or start over with a new item. 2 stats was just a number thrown
out there though, rather than an actual suggestion set in stone.

I got no problem losing to non-vars. buying varium definitely should not be autowin. they should have a good chance of beating you if they are good
players. right now it takes freak occurences for an equal level varium to lose to a non-varium. [or a seriously bad player, of which their are many]

paying to have an edge and paying to have a 90%+ win rate are not the same thing, or they shouldn't be at least. if the only reason you play is to
crush lesser players, maybe its time you find something else to do with yourself. like see a psychologist.

[most of the post was for everyone really, I am not singling you out Isaiah]



IsaiahtheMage -> RE: we re just talking of the gup (2/3/2012 18:32:08)

@psibertus You may actually be right considereding how much we have all went threw in the past with the devs and people continued to buy varium time after time regardless of when things got bad. Anyway you are also right about that. This is why enhancement prices need to be drastically reduced. Like 500 credits per enhancement or something.



PivotalDisorder -> RE: we re just talking of the gup (2/3/2012 19:21:53)

hehe like the gold skull card fiasco. 1200 for an achievement...!! :P and they tricked us by saying we would get something special.
suppose its special to someone who cares about achievements for doing absolutely nothing but spending money lol.

If I wanted achievement for spending, I'd ask for a receipt. [I would be happy to accept a 1200 var refund for Card and Cheevo]

jokes aside ^^ most of my suggestions are usually tweaks to what we already have in place, the balance team do seem to have a
more "outside the box" approach to their changes, and have surprised me a number of times so I don't like suggesting stuff too
often. they do a good job considering their is only 2 of them apparently, and they are unpaid players basically.

Hopefully this new credit change will boost non-vars. combined with a suggestion shop, future robot [which will probably suck]
and other new seasonal/rare items they release. Looking at some of the maths people have posted, I'd still say credit enhancements
should be cheaper.



TurkishIncubus -> RE: we re just talking of the gup (2/4/2012 4:08:55)

IF NON VARIUMS WANT BUFF AGAIN I WILL SAY F... Y.., After i see those weps im like OMFG why i buy varium to get 1-2 stat more :S:S:S:S

Delta Maul gives +26 str-dex , Golden Dragonic Axe gives +25 str-dex

E Megala Blades gives +33 dex-tech, Surgical Slicer gives +27 stat(but it has +1 dmg so 1 dmg = 6 str) it also gives +33

I dont want to mention the Sword and Mutating wep, I think the Gap is absolutely fine.



xxmirxx -> RE: we re just talking of the gup (2/4/2012 4:55:45)

It doesn't matter if we keep getting new weapons without robots were free wins still.



Lycus -> RE: we re just talking of the gup (2/4/2012 5:18:25)

@Mir: We've already explained the Bot situation, both me and Shari, continuing to bring it up will make NO difference what so ever, because as we said, it still takes a lot of time to create bots. When NightWraith and Charfade get the time, then I'm sure one will be made, but by constantly posting the same thing over and over, ignoring the answer you're given, is just ignorant and rude. Once you get an answer just leave it, we've read your message and got the idea, continuing will not help at all. We as staff are telling you things how they are, you can't tell us that the information we are giving you is wrong, because most of what we say is just facts. Whether it seems like we're coming up with excuses, or whatever, what we are saying is giving an inside on what is going on. We've told you how bot implementation works, we've told you that as soon as there's a chance one will be released for Non-Variums. You've got your answer, and that answer is not going to change whether you post once or 100 times. If you want things to go any faster, feel free to make a bot in Flash, animate it, and code it, then suggest it. Apart from that things can't happen faster, because there is so much that needs to be done for Valentines day etc. which aren't distractions, they're the progressions in the story line that many players have been asking for.



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