Rage: Devastation (Full Version)

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Stabilis -> Rage: Devastation (11/2/2012 17:14:52)

One thing with rage bothers me, as I understand it to be an imbalance. When rage is used, some Defense or Resistance is ignored, and Plasma, Mineral, or Hybrid Armor is ignored. It is logical that rage would do this to pierce, as it is an attack... but what about if the target had Reroute, Bloodlust, Deadly Aim, Shadow Arts, or Adrenaline? No effect. This is the imbalance that bothers me. Rage will single out 3 passive skills for potentially enhanced damage. Yet, these other classes without these 3 passive skills can take full advantage of the situation; ie: Tech Mage (Reroute/Deadly Aim), Bounty Hunter (Bloodlust/Shadow Arts), and Blood Mage (Bloodlust/Deadly Aim).This suggestion is to balance the effect of rage on all players fairly equally.

The result is devastation. Devastated players have their passive skills disabled. Devastation lasts for pre-rage-attack to post-turn. This means, that if rage is used, the target is affected before they are attacked, and until it is the next turn of the player that used rage. If you need more information, read these quote blocks:

quote:

Example to show devastation effect:

Player A (Bounty Hunter) vs Player B (Mercenary)

Player A uses raged Smokescreen (Player B's Hybrid Armor and Adrenaline is deactivated, [Hyrbid Armor is not being calculated!] [Adrenaline is not being calculated!] then takes 30 damage, Player A gains 7 health)... end of turn

Player B uses raged Berzerker (Player A's Bloodlust and Shadow Arts is deactivated, then takes 40 damage)... end of turn

(Player B's Hybrid Armor and Adrenaline is reactivated) Player A uses Strike (Player B takes 28 damage, no health gained)... end of turn

(Player A's Bloodlust and Shadow Arts is reactivated) Player B uses Atom Smasher (Player B is blocked)... end of turn


quote:

Duration example:

1V1 Example:

Player A (Blood Mage) vs Player B (Cyber Hunter)

Player A uses raged Sidearm on Player B (Player B's Plasma Armor and Shadow Arts is deactivated, then takes 40 damage, Player A gains 10 health)... end of turn

Player B uses Static Charge (Player A takes 25 damage)... end of turn

(Player B's Plasma Armor and Shadow Arts is reactivated) Player A uses Energy Shield... end of turn


quote:

Duration example:

2V2 Example:

Player A (Tech Mage) and Player B (Tactical Mercenary) vs Player C (Mercenary) and Player D (Cyber Hunter)

Player A uses raged Sidearm (Player D's Plasma Armor and Shadow Arts is deactivated, then takes 40 damage)... end of turn

Player C uses raged Artillery (Player A's Reroute and Deadly Aim is deactivated, Player B's Hybrid Armor and Adrenaline is deactivated, Player A takes 40 damage, no energy gained, Player B takes 45 damage, no energy gained)... end of turn

Player B uses Field Medic (Player B gains 50 health)... end of turn

Player D uses Massacre (Player B is pwned to death)... end of turn

(Player D's Plasma Armor and Shadow Arts is reactivated) Player A uses Robot Strike (Player D takes 25 damage)... end of turn

(Player A's and Player B's passive skills are reactivated)...


TL;DR = rage is balanced on all players on all passive skills equally.



Mother1 -> RE: Rage: Devastation (11/2/2012 17:39:29)

Not supported in this case. Rage is suppose to ignore defenses so it only makes sense that it does ignore defensive passives. Also bloodlust is suppose to work with all attacks and reroute is suppose work against all attacks taken. For them them to shut down these passives just because the defensive passives get shut off (since rage is suppose to ignore defenses and defensive buffs) would case problems and doesn't sound logical in the least.

Also if what you are talking about was put into the game while it would in your words balance rage with passives, it would hurt players in other ways. Some of these passives working with rage can make or break a duel and with that you are saying it would hurt other players.

For example a caster TM need 7 energy to use a plasma bolt or to heal and his opponent rages. Normally he would get that energy from reroute but with what you are saying it would shut off, and that same mage is in trouble.

The same could be said for a blood mage who rages with his sidearm but only comes up short just because his passive shut down during his rage.




Stabilis -> RE: Rage: Devastation (11/2/2012 18:02:47)

quote:

Rage is suppose to ignore defenses so it only makes sense that it does ignore defensive passives. Also bloodlust is suppose to work with all attacks and reroute is suppose work against all attacks taken.


Yes, rage is meant to hit extra damage, but that is no excuse to off-balance 3 passive skills from 5 other passive skills. Why not just say, ignore 50% of Defense or Resistance and not affect any passive skills? Well, rage does, and it affects Hybrid, Mineral, and Plasma Armor. Also true, Bloodlust is meant to drain health from all damage given, and Reroute is meant to drain energy from all damage taken. Hybrid Armor is meant to reduce damage from all damage taken, while Plasma and Mineral Armor are simply variations of Hybrid Armor. It is totally a viable argument to say that rage discriminates against 3 passive skills in it's goal of ignoring Defense or Resistance.

quote:

For example a caster TM need 7 energy to use a plasma bolt or to heal and his opponent rages. Normally he would get that energy from reroute but with what you are saying it would shut off, and that same mage is in trouble.


At the same time, however, that mage is only disabled in 1 turn like all other passive skills. Energy is not to be relied on, because health is meant to be relied on. 0 energy is not a defeat, but 0 health is. Since the mage did not prepare the 7 energy for this battle to use Field Medic, that is their tactical failure. Anyhow, maybe this same mage was battling either a counter-build or an overpowered attacker... the possibilities are extendable.

quote:

The same could be said for a blood mage who rages with his sidearm but only comes up short just because his passive shut down during his rage.


But, he knows his Deadly Aim is disabled. He could have completely, legitimately used Strike (no cooldown therefore always available) and won, or used Field Medic (universal) until the next turn. Anyhow, this seems to be a tactfully placed devastation, and is totally legitimate as a counter. Bloodlust and Deadly Aim are both offensive passive skills, so although he disadvantages during an attack, he in no way disadvantages from being attacked, unlike a Tactical Mercenary for example. You see, the effects are different but universally accepted.



Mother1 -> RE: Rage: Devastation (11/2/2012 18:14:15)

Deadly aim would power up your attack, so if it were shut off it would be almost the same if not the same as striking (I would have to test this with my tech mage since like blood mage they have deadly aim) but at the same time with bloodlust shut down with the attack and they gain no health that little bit of health they would normally gain could also make or break.

Also with rage normally it ignores 45% of defenses not 50% (the fun facts stat this) and in all honestly if it had to work with all or none I would rather it do the first you suggest (ignores defenses but not the passives) rather then shut down all passives during rage. Shutting all of them down would hurt those other classes more since that would wreak plans that work with passives, and cause loses because they didn't get the health/energy/damage/block (with shadow arts) needed to win.

making rage work the other way would wreak balance more then help it.




Stabilis -> RE: Rage: Devastation (11/2/2012 18:42:03)

I know it is 45%, 50% was a proposal if passive skills were not affected.



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