RE: =ED= Compensation - January 24, 2013 (Full Version)

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button33 -> RE: =ED= Compensation - January 24, 2013 (1/25/2013 15:19:43)

It is pleasant that the devs are giving us compensation, even though we were not entitled to it. However, there are areas of concern regarding this.

However, Im concerned about the price of skill cores. Currently, a weapons takes 1700 varium to enhance to its max, and for compensation, we will be getting 510 Varium back. However, by the looks of skill cores, it takes over 510 varium to buy both an active and a passive skill core. Basically, we are paying more varium to get a weapon back to the power that it once had. So basically, were paying twice to upgrade the weapon. I think this is a place of concern.

I think that there needs to be a compromise somewhere. We shouldnt get all of our varium back, and yet, 30% refund doesnt seem to cover the costs of upgrade the weapon again.

A solution should be that on every weapon that we have purchased 8 or more slots on, we should get a free skill core, and perhaps a 25% refund. This would help cover the costs of reupgrading a weapon that we already upgraded, because I don't think its fair that we should pay twice to upgrade the same weapon.



Mother1 -> RE: =ED= Compensation - January 24, 2013 (1/25/2013 15:49:22)

@ button33

They already said in previous design notes that the prices for things would be going up for the sole purpose that they are making just about everything that was varium have a credit price. If they left things the same it would be another nerf to varium, and if they keep on nerfing varium no one will buy it.

I mean why should anyone buy a currency if it would be easier just to farm credits for something that would be dirt cheap? They will already be taking a hit because enhancements are going and varium won't be giving power anymore for the sake of non variums more the varium players. Do you think it is wise that they take yet another hit buy making thing cheaper especially when there will be unlimited NPC farming?



button33 -> RE: =ED= Compensation - January 24, 2013 (1/25/2013 16:05:55)

@Mother 1

Im talking about varium.

You see, you currently paid 1700 variums for 10 slots. However, at the beginning at Omega, these 10 slots will be gone, you will revieve 510 varium, and you will have to buy two new cores in order to upgrade your weapon. Suppose each core cost 600 varium. You now have to spend 1200 varium to upgrade a weapons that you already upgraded. In this sense, if it takes more varium to upgrade the cores than the amount we recieve back, were paying twice to upgrade our weapon.

I think we should recieve enough varium back to help offset the costs of the new cores.



caser5 -> RE: =ED= Compensation - January 24, 2013 (1/25/2013 16:12:41)

I have only used credits for enhancements so therefore I am screwed;Why? I only will get the basic achievement which most likely 80% of all players will get (worthless), even though I spent 40k-ish on credits. I spent around 40,000 on them and will get back around 4000 that appears to be INSUFFICIENT to buy even 1 skill core. So after all I put around +15 on my gear and will get back enough credits to get .4 of an active skill core on ONE item or 4/5 of a passive skill core on ONE item. Of course these prices are subject to change.
I was afraid they would use an achievement as a crutch great. It'd be great if it was around 30-40% for CREDITS too, the massive reduction in compensation between currency really shows the developer's priorities.

Ugh, great. I'd be delighted if it was 30-40% for credits, satisfied at 25% but 10% that's just a waste of credits for anyone who enhanced using them. Especially considering I started enhancing towards the END of this version of Epicduel and it appears that is going to be nothing much more than a waste in a week.



DunkThatOreo -> RE: =ED= Compensation - January 24, 2013 (1/25/2013 16:25:15)

I honestly don't care for these skill cores the game could do without them in my opinion but I guess its a nice addition to
the omega update. As long as these cores keep the game relatively fair I guess I'll play again. Meh I hope updating weapons
doesn't require hours of farming for credits :/



Drianx -> RE: =ED= Compensation - January 24, 2013 (1/25/2013 16:25:37)

quote:

You can put cores on a weapon with credits. You can farm credits indefinitely from NPC's.

Really, for me the compensation is disappointing, because a feature that I spent cash on was taken away from me without my consent and I am forced to accept an imposed amount [EDIT] that is below my personal expectations.

In the light of this disappointment, I only expect Omega phase of EpicDuel to embrace a different form of pay-to-win. You can write that on a paper now, hang it to your bedroom wall with text against the wall and I'll tell you when to flip it for a read again.[:D] They can't just stop milking the cow right now only because [insert any silly lullaby reason here]; it still looks healthy.

Therefore I doubt the best cores will not be varium-only or exclusive 10k pack promos.



Mother1 -> RE: =ED= Compensation - January 24, 2013 (1/25/2013 16:29:09)

@ button33

How do you even know how much the cores will cost? They never put anything set in stone. For all we know even with the increases in prices we may still have enough for what we need. Nothing has been set in stone with the cost of cores or the costs to equip them.

@ caser

Did you not read the design notes? If you enhanced knowing the that enhancements were going in omega shame on you. I could say the same for anyone who decided to do this even after the staff posted this in the design notes.



the final hour -> RE: =ED= Compensation - January 24, 2013 (1/25/2013 16:31:15)

quote:

Therefore I doubt the best cores will not be varium-only or exclusive 10k pack promos.


i said something along theese lines before im pretty sure its right . sadly because they cnt win eitha way if they dont do it that way theyll make no money , if they continue to do it this way theyre player base will continue to be one of the smallest ive ever seen on a MMROPG.

their stuck between a rock and a hard place



caser5 -> RE: =ED= Compensation - January 24, 2013 (1/25/2013 16:33:14)

I got em 'bout November before scouring over the designnotes, sorry i didn't do research before buying enhancements.



Drianx -> RE: =ED= Compensation - January 24, 2013 (1/25/2013 16:38:10)

quote:

If you enhanced knowing the that enhancements were going in omega shame on you.

This is actually a very interesting debate.

You know what I would have done, to attract varium purchases?

I would have said in December, after Omega announcement "Anyone who enhances an item from now until Omega launches, will receive a 100% varium refund".

I wonder if anyone disagrees it would have been a great money-making move that would have made players happy as well.

But they kept everyone holding their breath only to burst the bubble afterwards.

Quite strategic.



Red Metal2k -> RE: =ED= Compensation - January 24, 2013 (1/25/2013 16:40:36)

@nexus...
Your response to all this completely bewilders me. How can you say be happy we got anything. Where you are from money does money grow on trees do you buy things have them taken away and thank that person if so wow we live in completely different worlds. The fact that there is so much complaining and what everyone seems to overlook is *You bought varium, You bough enhancements, now this is being taken away* say you bought a TV then where you bought the TV they took it back and gave you 30% of what you payed will you say thank you and bash anyone who opposes?



Lycan. -> RE: =ED= Compensation - January 24, 2013 (1/25/2013 16:45:47)

@Latin Lover
quote:

1700 to fully enhance divided by 30. is 566. so think if u fully enhanced things... multiply ur number of enhanced items by 566

Actually no. If you times it by 0.30 it's 510



Nexus... -> RE: =ED= Compensation - January 24, 2013 (1/25/2013 17:11:53)

quote:

@nexus...
Your response to all this completely bewilders me. How can you say be happy we got anything. Where you are from money does money grow on trees do you buy things have them taken away and thank that person if so wow we live in completely different worlds. The fact that there is so much complaining and what everyone seems to overlook is *You bought varium, You bough enhancements, now this is being taken away* say you bought a TV then where you bought the TV they took it back and gave you 30% of what you payed will you say thank you and bash anyone who opposes?


Read the terms of service. Both of you. We don't own our characters, we don't own any item in our inventory, they are not ours, and they can take them away if they so please, and we wouldn't be able to do anything about it. All I am saying, is that 30% is a whole lot better than no compensation at all, which could have definitely happened. Where I come from, no, money does not grow on tree's. Where I come from, we wouldn't get any compensation...none. zip. zero. nada. What would you have liked? 100% refund on all enhancement purchases dating back to the beginning of time? Thats extremely unrealistic. Look, I wish we got all our money back, but think about it this way. We paid for an advantage, and we got that advantage. Now that said advantage is going away, we are getting a partial refund...which is great, because they could have given us none and said "you paid for an advantage, and you got it." This is still a testing phase (I don't know how, but it is), things are subject to change, and the developers never (ever) said that enhancements would NOT be removed in the future. Be grateful for what you get, and be grateful you get anything at all.


quote:

Really, for me the compensation is disappointing, because a feature that I spent cash on was taken away from me without my consent and I am forced to accept an imposed amount [EDIT] that is below my personal expectations.

In the light of this disappointment, I only expect Omega phase of EpicDuel to embrace a different form of pay-to-win. You can write that on a paper now, hang it to your bedroom wall with text against the wall and I'll tell you when to flip it for a read again. They can't just stop milking the cow right now only because [insert any silly lullaby reason here]; it still looks healthy.

Therefore I doubt the best cores will not be varium-only or exclusive 10k pack promos.


They make balance changes all the time, and people pay "real money" to change classes. Does this mean every time they change a class, they should refund the money you spent to change? Nope, you don't get anything when they make balance changes. This is still a testing phase, whether you like it or not things are going to change, and if its not up to your "personal expectation" then I guess you are just going to have to deal with it...or just not play. I would just be grateful you are getting anything, because really, as I mentioned above, and according to the terms, they could have just as easily turned a naked eye, and issued no compensation at all.


Prophet
P.S You know what was wayyyy worse than this? The Juggernaut release.



Drianx -> RE: =ED= Compensation - January 24, 2013 (1/25/2013 17:17:29)

quote:

Read the terms of service. Both of you. We don't own our characters, we don't own any item in our inventory, they are not ours, and they can take them away if they so please, and we wouldn't be able to do anything about it.


Read about the court trials of people against Facebook and other online entertainment companies that messed with their virtual currency bought with real money.

What you're saying is the worst form of communism: "We owe everything to motherland, and we should be happy if it lets us draw breath and it doesn't crush us like bugs and gets all our varium".



Nexus... -> RE: =ED= Compensation - January 24, 2013 (1/25/2013 17:17:57)

Link me ;)



Ranloth -> RE: =ED= Compensation - January 24, 2013 (1/25/2013 17:19:55)

quote:

Read about the court trials of people against Facebook and other online entertainment companies that messed with their virtual currency bought with real money.

Still, read T&C. They were written so you cannot have your court trial since what ED has done was lawful. ;) They aren't breaking any laws since you agreed to these T&C. ;)



ThePriest -> RE: =ED= Compensation - January 24, 2013 (1/25/2013 17:21:08)

quote:

Nexus...


You who are so good at explaining things.
Can explain what is happening on a forum?
Maybe I've missed the whole point of a forum.



caser5 -> RE: =ED= Compensation - January 24, 2013 (1/25/2013 17:23:52)

quote:

Still, read T&C. They were written so you cannot have your court trial since what ED has done was lawful. ;) They aren't breaking any laws since you agreed to these T&C. ;)


Evil Fine Print! (Really probably better for them to have that included)



One Winged Angel1357 -> RE: =ED= Compensation - January 24, 2013 (1/25/2013 17:24:12)

Trans
"I read and understand the T&C" biggest lie on the internet Gamestop proved this as they have a rightful claim on a couple thousand souls as people did not read the T&C



Ranloth -> RE: =ED= Compensation - January 24, 2013 (1/25/2013 17:33:27)

@OWA
They really do get very handy. I, myself, didn't read them when I registered but did sometime after it just to see what they include. It's handy when you plan on spending money on a game because you know your rights.



Drianx -> RE: =ED= Compensation - January 24, 2013 (1/25/2013 17:37:17)

@Trans
Disclaimers are a lie.

You know what many illegal filesharing websites were doing?

They posted a disclaimer saying "This site is not for piracy. If you are looking for pirated media, leave at once. Clicking NEXT and proving otherwise will give me the right to sue you and ask for a million dollars".

Guess what? If a legit musician
- entered,
- clicked NEXT,
- found his own music pirated,
- alert authorities

Then he should have paid the website a million dollars for breaking the disclaimer!



Red Metal2k -> RE: =ED= Compensation - January 24, 2013 (1/25/2013 17:58:49)

Quote where in the T&C the part where it says they are allowed to take our money to a point where if we bought something and if they so please take it away and not be obligated to compensate anything at all. I have gone over this and failed to see that part please enlighten me.



Nexus... -> RE: =ED= Compensation - January 24, 2013 (1/25/2013 18:08:25)

quote:

Nothing in this Agreement places a duty on Company to ever reimburse any player by providing experience credit for any experience lost for any reason. Company will never reimburse or be obligated to reimburse players for any experience loss in a monetary manner, such as but not limited to monetary reimbursement or monetary credit.


quote:

18. DISCLAIMER AND ACKNOWLEDGEMENT REGARDING GAME DATA.
You hereby acknowledge that by using the Site or the Services that you do not acquire any property rights whatsoever in the Site, Services, Game Data (as defined below), or any status within the Site and Services. To play Company games requires the creation and retention of electronic files, including without limitation player characters, accounts, in-game currency, statistics, user profiles, weapons, armor, quests, loot, etc. ("Game Data"), which are stored by Company. While keeping Game Data safe is a priority of Company, note that Company shall not have any liability for the loss of any Game Data for any reason whatsoever. Company reserves the right, in its sole and absolute discretion, to modify or delete any information, including without limitation Game Data and any other information accumulated, stored or uploaded on into any Company game.


Consider yourself enlightened.


Prophet



One Winged Angel1357 -> RE: =ED= Compensation - January 24, 2013 (1/25/2013 18:10:24)

I hate how they used an absolute there

Pretty much this shouldn't be happening because the T&C said we will never get something like this



Ranloth -> RE: =ED= Compensation - January 24, 2013 (1/25/2013 18:20:46)

ED almost breaks a promise of not buffing a rare items. Players remind them of it & rares aren't buffed.
ED breaks Terms and Conditions and refunds some of the Varium and Credits back. Players want more.

Moral of the story? You tell them not to break one but break the another because you demand something. Demanind will not give it to you. Fact you get some back is already something yet you deserve nothing because T&C. Greedyness everywhere.



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