why all classes have an energy drain expect from bm? (Full Version)

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kosmo -> why all classes have an energy drain expect from bm? (4/5/2013 12:24:44)

i was recently thinking about this, after assimilation buff, tec mages got an even more than decent energy drain, leving bm the only class whitout a moove of that tipe(exepct 4 cores).
i know that a drain could be Op on bm, but they still could replace another good skill 4 it, or maybe u guys could sujest something else to add this skill to bloods whitout making them Op?



axell5 -> RE: why all classes have an energy drain expect from bm? (4/5/2013 13:01:46)

... normal mercs don't have an energy drain nor an energy regain skill



Mother1 -> RE: why all classes have an energy drain expect from bm? (4/5/2013 13:03:46)

@ axell5

Merc has an energy drain move. It is called atom smasher.



axell5 -> RE: why all classes have an energy drain expect from bm? (4/5/2013 13:06:59)

ooops sorry my bad, i missed that



Ranloth -> RE: why all classes have an energy drain expect from bm? (4/5/2013 14:58:18)

Because BMs were and are fine without one. Cores fill in the niche in skill-trees; EP draining cores for BMs, Generator can be EP regen for those without Reroute/SC, etc.



kosmo -> RE: why all classes have an energy drain expect from bm? (4/5/2013 15:29:05)

im not talking about skills that a few classes have ,im talking about a tipe of skill that all classes have.
and im not sayng that bm is up (no way trust me) im just sayng that it looks fair to me that bm have an energy drain SKILL 2 whitout making it Op



Ranloth -> RE: why all classes have an energy drain expect from bm? (4/5/2013 15:32:02)

You completely missed the point. You are talking about EP drain that all but BMs have -> cores fill in the niche by providing an EP drain. What I was saying is that Generator provides Energy too -> fills the niche by providing Energy to those without Reroute/SC.

Cores fill in these gaps. Not every class needs EP drain and if BMs would get one, it'd make the class OP. Even pre-buff Assimilation was bad when BMs were initially released. They are fine with cores as substitution or none if they don't wish to have an EP drain. Besides, if every class shared the same skills but under a different name and art, what'd be the point of changing classes? Variety? Where?



kosmo -> RE: why all classes have an energy drain expect from bm? (4/5/2013 15:59:44)

i did not miss the point, and 4 the last time im not sayng that bm is up.
all class have heal, all class have both a defence and a resistence shield or an hibrid, all class have an energy drain exept from bm. im not sayng that blood mage need a drain, im sayng that it would be cool if they could add a similiar skill in way that it doesnt make it OP.



Ranloth -> RE: why all classes have an energy drain expect from bm? (4/5/2013 16:06:05)

It's impossible without making them OP. I didn't say that BMs are UP but instead, EP drain would make them OP. Pre-buff Assimilation was taken away, have a guess why? DA, BL, Fireball, Str-based EP drain + some EP back for yourself, Bludgeon/Zerker... Too much for Strength. And you're giving them HP + EP control; yes BHs have it too but you have DA + Fireball + Bludgeon + Intimidate which outweighs the benefits of Smoke + CS (Mass is good but too expensive; easy to prevent).

Not every class must have EP drain. Heal is universal skill, that's one. Shields are different for classes and HA isn't really that good since Rage ignores it completely whilst Shields aren't. In the same way, 5 classes but CHs have way to get HP back via skills (excluding Heal), do CHs need one too then? 3 classes have way to get EP back through a skill, do other 3 need 'em as well? No. Cores fix these gaps. If you don't make use out of them, it's your problem.



kosmo -> RE: why all classes have an energy drain expect from bm? (4/5/2013 16:20:33)

ur examples make no sence, all class apart from ch get hp back? are u rlly sayng that a frenzy or a surgical regain can be compaired 2 a blodloost? lol....
insted energy removers in game are almost all the same, yes they have different effects, but there isnt a huge power gap between them.

its just ur opinion that they cant find a way 2 add a drain 2 bm whitout making them OP.




Ranloth -> RE: why all classes have an energy drain expect from bm? (4/5/2013 16:23:38)

It's still HP back. CHs don't have a way apart from Heal. Then make it three classes (TLMs, BHs and BMs) - should we give the other 3 some sort of HP-regaining skill? (Mercs not included since it's an effect on a skill that takes an additional turn to use)

quote:

its just ur opinion that they cant find a way 2 add a drain 2 bm whitout making them OP.

Old Assimilation on BMs says Hi. <.< The one that took 10 EP at max and gave 5 EP back. >.>



kosmo -> RE: why all classes have an energy drain expect from bm? (4/5/2013 16:34:38)

y should we give the others 3 classes a hp regain?, y this came to ur mind ? what this has got whit my discussion? lol....
so old bm was Op 4 assimilate? they got assimilate out 2 put reflex (bm didnt have a defence shield). they took BERZEKER out because it made the class Op



Ranloth -> RE: why all classes have an energy drain expect from bm? (4/5/2013 16:43:50)

quote:

y should we give the others 3 classes a hp regain?, y this came to ur mind ?

Back at you. Why should we give BMs an EP drain? Not all classes need the same skills. There is no such rule as there is for passive Armor + passive HP/EP regen + debuff.

Yeah, Reflex because they didn't have Defence, and? Mercs have HA that is ignored on Rage and no way to debuff Smoke/Malf but be forced to use a Bot. They cannot raise their defence at all and only have one instead of two that all the others have (split is an excuse but it's +6/+5 IIRC, instead of what other classes get through Armors or Shields).
Btw, for your information, BMs had Defence Matrix + Technician, not Reflex + Energy Shield. That change was made after Assimilation was taken away.

What does Berzerker have to do with it? I know why it was taken out.



kosmo -> RE: why all classes have an energy drain expect from bm? (4/5/2013 16:55:14)

ch and tlm had technician, u dont even know what u r talking about blood mage never had defence matrix or technician. lol
merc have no shield because hibrid affects both defence and resistence (obiusly OP)



Ranloth -> RE: why all classes have an energy drain expect from bm? (4/5/2013 17:01:19)

Yeah, seems like you're one of the newer players. Reflex was given in place of Assimilation, that is my bad since I've checked it but BMs had Technician:
quote:

BM - Replace Technician with Energy Shield

Taken from the Release Log located here: http://epicduelwiki.com/w/Release_Log/Delta (EpicDuel Delta Evolution 1.4.1c/d - Friday, January 6th)



kosmo -> RE: why all classes have an energy drain expect from bm? (4/5/2013 17:10:03)

yes i can c u r right, but im still quite sure that bm never had defence matrix



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