RE: Has Epic Duel Reached its Peak? (Full Version)

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Mother1 -> RE: Has Epic Duel Reached its Peak? (8/19/2013 9:31:29)

@ Jeryll

Just because NPC are useless to you and a bunch of other people (People who use them for easy wins) Doesn't mean they are useless to all. If they was the cause the staff would have never limited them to 100 wins per day and they would still be unlimited.

What does that move tell you? Answer people were using NPC to the point where they had to limit it due to it harming the game.

Also guess what would happen if NPC came back for wins. that same problem would come back again as more people would be padding up the win records with NPC wins causing more lag in the game. It didn't hurt before cause NPC were limited to 5 per NPC within level range per hour, however bring them back for a few people at the expense of new players having a decent source of NPC grinding for credits isn't right either.



Chosen 0ne -> RE: Has Epic Duel Reached its Peak? (8/19/2013 10:11:24)

No mother, botters are what made NPC's limited to 100 wins a day.



Mother1 -> RE: Has Epic Duel Reached its Peak? (8/19/2013 10:25:04)

@ Chosen

Even if this is true you know what that means? It still means people still had a use for them. Cause if what everyone is saying is true and NPC served no purpose to the masses why bother making bot builds to grind them? You don't get rewards for losing, in fact botting NPC made more sense back when losing to NPC rewarded credits and EXP then now because you must win against NPC in order to gain rewards from them.



Chosen 0ne -> RE: Has Epic Duel Reached its Peak? (8/19/2013 10:36:20)

Mother, I would tell you why that doesn't make any sense, but I don't want us to get warnings for talking about hackers.
In light of the subject, epic duel has lost something that made it fun to play. I'm still trying to figure out what that is. But something seems missing.



Shajun Ki -> RE: Has Epic Duel Reached its Peak? (8/19/2013 14:51:21)

^I think the reason you feel something is "missing" from the game is because you were from the golden era of Epic Duel, Beta/gamma. Now things have changed, probably most of your friends have left too so now you feel
like there is a hole in epic duel that can't be filled no matter what the dev's do. I hope that makes sense, just came back from the first day of school and I'm pretty tired...



The Incredible Hulk -> RE: Has Epic Duel Reached its Peak? (8/19/2013 16:15:55)

quote:

probably most of your friends have left too so now you feel
like there is a hole in epic duel that can't be filled no matter what the dev's do


Very true; The friends I have been hanging around for almost 2 years all quit. Why? Enhancements; that's why. Anyone who I try to talk in ED don't like to talk + the game is boring now. Nothing pushes me to play the game anymore; the only thing that pushed me to play is when xXxZ0R0xXx and Deathknightofdread was around. Good friends.....
Toooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo Many people left this game; going downhill for ED which I know they are happy about.



Shajun Ki -> RE: Has Epic Duel Reached its Peak? (8/19/2013 17:34:44)

From the videos I've seen on youtube, it wasn't really the game itself that was so fun during those times. It was the community, everyone had a place in Epic Duel. Now no one talks or tries to organize "parties" or tournaments with their friends.
I feel the staff haven't really encouraged these newer players to interact with each other and find some friends to duel with. Now it's just kind of level up as quick as you can and get all the new gear and battle battle battle. I have a friend from Beta,that's why
I kind of know what Beta was like.



Dual Thrusters -> RE: Has Epic Duel Reached its Peak? (8/19/2013 17:48:27)

Clicky



goldslayer1 -> RE: Has Epic Duel Reached its Peak? (8/19/2013 18:03:17)

i think ED Peaked in gamma. and started going downhill (slowly, up until omega, then it land rocketed down)

you can make a case for delta 6-8 months in when TLM was nerfed, and CHed had been toned down.
but the game has lost its enjoyment for many people. and many have left.

just take a look at the LBs.

back in gamma you had to do 800 wins minimum for a daily, and now you can get it from just 400.

it just shows that there are less players and less competition in the game unlike before.

logged in on a monday afternoon and barely 700 players are on.

if this was gamma, there would be atleast 1500 players by the afternoon.



Buffy A. Summers -> RE: Has Epic Duel Reached its Peak? (8/19/2013 18:43:41)

Archhlord Raistlin ~ Makes Some Excellent And Valid Points Here:

quote:

As a veteran player, I can definitely blame omega...
1. All the varium spent over the years has been poorly compensated in-game.
2. Why buy any gear now unless changing your look, or you want some special core?
3. Battles are totally manipulated to appease low level and non-varium players with
impossible luck factors built in. Battle matchups are totally manipulated to keep
the war interesting and in combination with the battle engine "adjustments", takes
the enjoyment right out of the game....predetermined wins and losses.
4. They add some nice war features, e.g turrets and shields, but make them pretty weak
for the cost, and so expensive that most players cannot afford to have any fun using them.
5. They ruined multi, which is a core skill for 2v2...pfft they ignore 2v2 anyway.
6. Since making cyber imputent, they have done nothing for that class in a year or two.
7. Build choices are limited and there is little sacrifice between power and defense.
8. Balance to the dev's means any noob can win 50% of the time regardless...and when they
reach level 30, they will make sure that comes at the expense of veterans.

So yeah, I can definitely sympathize with many of my friends who have given up on this game.
Years of support and investment in time and money comes down to a game that has turned into
more of a coin toss than anything else, thanks to the dev's "fairness and hard work".

Honestly, it feels like the patients are running the asylum...



Mother1 -> RE: Has Epic Duel Reached its Peak? (8/19/2013 19:09:29)

@ Buffy

While I can agree with some of these points, the whole reason did this was the following

1 give F2P equal footing to P2P
2 bring in new players
3 Keep new players



goldslayer1 -> RE: Has Epic Duel Reached its Peak? (8/19/2013 19:17:08)

quote:

@ Buffy

While I can agree with some of these points, the whole reason did this was the following

1 give F2P equal footing to P2P
2 bring in new players
3 Keep new players

except they went about it in a terrible way. just goes to prove that they lack a game designer.

F2P should only have had equal footing in terms of power.
but there is no reason why i should have to see F2P players using quality gear such as frostbite claws.

let F2P have the same power, but did they really have to kill it for varium players by giving Varium quality art for credits?
F2P should have its own set of items thats has lower grade quality (in terms of art) compared to varium.

now you can see a varium player and a free player, and they can look identical. and IMO just wasn't the way to go.

EDIT: the same goes for mutating gear.
F2P shouldn't have mutating gear. it should have stayed a varium perk.



Mother1 -> RE: Has Epic Duel Reached its Peak? (8/19/2013 19:21:40)

@ goldslayer1

They don't have access to all the art. Any rare promo item as well as phase promo's are out of F2P's reach power and art. Also the robots that went rare? All P2P right there. They will never have access to that art either.



goldslayer1 -> RE: Has Epic Duel Reached its Peak? (8/19/2013 19:24:22)

quote:

@ goldslayer1

They don't have access to all the art. Any rare promo item as well as phase promo's are out of F2P's reach power and art. Also the robots that went rare? All P2P right there. They will never have access to that art either.

im talking about ingame shop stuff that has options (pretty much all of it) for credits and varium.



Chosen 0ne -> RE: Has Epic Duel Reached its Peak? (8/19/2013 19:46:32)

quote:

^I think the reason you feel something is "missing" from the game is because you were from the golden era of Epic Duel, Beta/gamma. Now things have changed, probably most of your friends have left too so now you feel
like there is a hole in epic duel that can't be filled no matter what the dev's do. I hope that makes sense, just came back from the first day of school and I'm pretty tired...


Very sad and very true. FAR to many of my friends have left Epic Duel. I really do feel alone sometimes now. I've got 100 buddy slots and maybe 7 of them still play. It's sad to watch all of your friends leave due to whats changing in the game.

quote:

From the videos I've seen on youtube, it wasn't really the game itself that was so fun during those times. It was the community, everyone had a place in Epic Duel. Now no one talks or tries to organize "parties" or tournaments with their friends.
I feel the staff haven't really encouraged these newer players to interact with each other and find some friends to duel with. Now it's just kind of level up as quick as you can and get all the new gear and battle battle battle. I have a friend from Beta,that's why
I kind of know what Beta was like.


Not only that my friend but it was also the old EDF that brought everyone much closer. (EDF = Epic Duel Forums) Back in beta epic duel has its own forums separate from here. The community was at its highest in terms of closeness and positivity and the like. We were a family back then, with all the cool signatures and avatars it was a dream come true. It was way better than what we have here. I wouldn't even call us a community here anymore. The forum merge was without a doubt the saddest thing that I've experienced in ED. The forums were almost better than the game back then. I'm serious.

quote:

logged in on a monday afternoon and barely 700 players are on.


I've logged on on Sunday afternoons and theres 500 people online. Where is everyone? Church? I don't think so lol.

quote:

but there is no reason why i should have to see F2P players using quality gear such as frostbite claws.


Absolutely agreed 100%.


Something I think needs to be said:

The devs and AK's here think the game can be improved through positive feedback. We've all tried to do this and we're all positive. But it's obvious that this isn't working. Something needs to be changed. The definition of insanity as defined by Einstein is as follows: “Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.”

As a sidenote, Titan should start making videos again.

The community and the devs need to change the way we're doing things.

I think Shadeze's quote, "Evolve or Die" is very prevalent at current times. If things aren't changed quickly here, Epic Duel is going to plummet. And thats just the way it is. SO with that being said;

EVOLVE OR DIE



Teufel Hunden -> RE: Has Epic Duel Reached its Peak? (8/19/2013 20:14:01)

Epicduel Reached its peak in gamma, no doubt about that... Delta was dull and non eventful except for the infernal war. That war was amusing and was fun, probably due to the fact that it actually

pulled everyone in by the cheevos, teamwork, and everything included. Ever since then they have been trying to compensate for the dropping of excitement as well as "trying to bring new players

in." They left all of us long time supporters, who have paid our fair share for the game, high and dry while trying to make room and an easier transition for the new people. But, in the end it made

more people leave, including myself. I am now retired from this game and dont see myself coming back... But, if i do end up doing so i am going to come back when they are in need of mods so i

can help make this game better and try to use the suggestions we have been making for a long time now implemented to make i more enjoyable again and a better game-play experience. If you

want more players to come and check out the game then do advertising, make an in-depth tutorial so they can be better accustomed more quickly... And if you want more players then don't screw

over those who paid for the game for years and then leave them with a little compensation that will help in no way whatsoever... This is absolutely ridiculous and now that i have left i am glad

because i see it from a different point of view now and i see where things are going wrong and how only a set few things actually are decent in the game. Things need to change, just as those

before me have said, Evolve Or Die. Please heed our call for change or else i am sad to say i believe epicduel will crash and burn just like the other games and things of this sort that chose to stay

the way they were and got overlooked and thrown away. I wish you all luck in your future endeavors.

~Da Bomb Expert



Buffy A. Summers -> RE: Has Epic Duel Reached its Peak? (8/19/2013 20:53:35)

Mother1 Wrote:

quote:

@ Buffy

While I can agree with some of these points, the whole reason did this was the following

1 give F2P equal footing to P2P
2 bring in new players
3 Keep new players


LOL

Wait... So Why Spend Any Money On The Game? If Everything Can Be Purchased With Credits?

And What About All Those Like Myself Who Helped Support It During Prior Stages?

Now Players Can Be On Equal Ground, By Simply Farming Credits For Weeks To Have The Same Gear, Stats And Cores... For Free (A Lot Of Time And Effort To Earn Credits, But Still).

So Where Is My Varium Value In The Now And From Before?

Also, Keeping And Adding New Players At The Cost Of Already Established Players (Customers) LEAVING, Makes No (Business) Sense.

My Point That Has Been Overlooked Is That Most New Players Have HORRIBLE Battle Records.

Why Would A New Player Want To Keep Coming Back If They Are Losing 50%+ Of Their Battles?

That's Not Any Fun. And This Game Is Supposed To Be Fun.

~ Buffy




goldslayer1 -> RE: Has Epic Duel Reached its Peak? (8/19/2013 21:02:00)

quote:

Why Would A New Player Want To Keep Coming Back If They Are Losing 50%+ Of Their Battles?

That's Not Any Fun. And This Game Is Supposed To Be Fun.

i have to agree with this.
this is why i heavily disliked the NPC wins removal.
it removed the PVE aspect of the game while giving the player a sense of progression with their character.
it made players feel accomplished to have a positive win ratio, and when they feel accomplished, they are happy with the game.

believe me no player is happy having a 40% or 30% win ratio. (I've seen 9% in juggernaut)

NPCs were also a great way to escape the balance issues, but still feeling a sense of progression with their character.



Dual Thrusters -> RE: Has Epic Duel Reached its Peak? (8/19/2013 21:05:09)

I agree with NPC wins coming back. Who cares if someone wants to waste their time repeating the same moves on an AI?



Chosen 0ne -> RE: Has Epic Duel Reached its Peak? (8/19/2013 21:07:16)

quote:

Why Would A New Player Want To Keep Coming Back If They Are Losing 50%+ Of Their Battles?

That's Not Any Fun. And This Game Is Supposed To Be Fun.


This game is supposed to be fun. That's something I haven't thought of for a long time. I remember when I played Epic Duel for fun. Wow.

Wow......

I don't play epic duel for fun anymore. I play it because I have one last thread of hope. But that hope is slowly dieing.

This game is supposed to be fun.

Back in Beta I had a horrible ratio. I would've quit but NPC's were there for me.

Players don't have that option anymore.

Things arn't fixable now.

Npc's are what made me play for fun. They need to come back. 15 wins an hour like before.



Mother1 -> RE: Has Epic Duel Reached its Peak? (8/19/2013 21:08:42)

@goldslayer1

I know you had to go through this as well as myself, but ever try getting good gear without destroying your record if you are a new player? When I was non varium back then I didn't have full gear until level 28 since I didn't have a good source of credit farming. It was almost impossible for many players to keep up since they would

1 level up making their gear worthless
2 Destroy their battle records trying

Something had to give and now these players have unlimted NPC to grind on for the credits they need to keep their gear up to date. Wanting NPC to reward wins again at the expense of new players records just because some people want to pad their records isn't fair to newer players.

15 wins for 555 credits per hour isn't a lot to upgrade your gear if you are past level a certain point, and just because some people can manage without doing this doesn't mean all can.



goldslayer1 -> RE: Has Epic Duel Reached its Peak? (8/19/2013 21:28:26)

quote:

@goldslayer1

I know you had to go through this as well as myself, but ever try getting good gear without destroying your record if you are a new player? When I was non varium back then I didn't have full gear until level 28 since I didn't have a good source of credit farming. It was almost impossible for many players to keep up since they would

ohh boohooo
try getting a positive record being non varium, when the rest of the game is fully geared non vars or founder players with frostbane and ACP.
what i do remember was me farming for about 24 straight hours on the day ED merged with AE, and got to lvl 26 in the first day.
however i was not aware of NPCs at that time, so i did not do NPCs back then. had i done NPCs during that first day, i would have probably on the very first solo champ from the ED/AE merge, i know i was in LB and behind by like 80 wins.

the point is, this ordeal could be much better for the new players to get items, they dont feel obsolete, they dont get crap records thus wont lower their morale, and ED has better chances of retaining players.

not to mention it was a stupid business move to alienate a large part of the player base by removing NPCs.
just take a look at how many people have quit because of NPC related reasons.

ill name a couple off the top of my head that are on the all time LBs.
my former faction mates Deathnightmare, and Angels Holocaust (i was in legit at 1 point)
you can probably add bunjira to that list aswell.



Chosen 0ne -> RE: Has Epic Duel Reached its Peak? (8/19/2013 21:34:18)

quote:

try getting a positive record being non varium, when the rest of the game is fully geared non vars or founder players with frostbane and ACP.


Life sucked back then. A lot of newer players don't know how much easier they have it lol.

But NPC's is why i'm still here. I'm positive i would've quit if I couldnt have gotten my win record up to par again.



goldslayer1 -> RE: Has Epic Duel Reached its Peak? (8/19/2013 21:39:09)

seeing how nearly all of the solo all timers (comical is the only that might see on often, but not like he used to) have all stopped playing, it just shows how big of an issue ED has.
all of its veterans players are leaving, including its all timers. (usually if you're an all timer, your less likely to quit, but this is not the case here)



Mother1 -> RE: Has Epic Duel Reached its Peak? (8/19/2013 21:40:48)

@ Goldslayer1

Ouch that was harsh big time with the not caring line.

But the staff saw this problem, and that is how they dealt with it. Making NPC unlimited so players could have that luxury of being fully powered up before going into battle. Wanting lower levels to battle at anything but their best just because you who been through it already want to keep getting NPC wins IMO is very selfish.

Also Comicalbiker still does play. I see him every so often in the game.



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