Scaled no-drop weapons (Full Version)

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Ranloth -> Scaled no-drop weapons (1/4/2014 11:55:55)

After having a look at Silver Sky Magician's thread the other day, and numerous complaints from players about players being underequipped when joining 2v2, I've had an idea - which is almost the same as AQ's no-drops system - which involves a Basic Set of weapons, given out to everyone (+ sellable) for free.

Every player would start with full Set of items - Primary, Gun, Aux, and Armor.*

How this would work is, these items upgrade automatically, based on your level. You never pay for the upgrade, but they scale, depending on your level. There will be a penalty for it, equal to, from -3 to -5 levels. In other words, if you're a Level 30 player, your no-drop set will have Power Level (PLvl) of 25-27 (depends on the penalty given).
The point of it, is to stop players from being underequipped. Yes, you shouldn't give out your password, but it shouldn't cripple other players either - at least not to such extent. Furthermore, different players make different decisions, and sell one item for another.

The penalty is in place to prevent rendering other weapons useless. Having a full set of items + close to your level, is better than having nothing and crippling everyone else. Of course, if you have enough Credits, you could upgrade these items to your level, but they wouldn't scale no more unless the PLvl difference is bigger than the penalty - i.e. assuming penalty is -5 PLvls & Level 30 player upgraded his weapons to PLvl 25 with Credits, and then levels up to Level 31, his no-drop weapons WILL upgrade for free.
Of course, the upgrade wouldn't be cheap either! If you really wanted to upgrade your no-drop weapons, you'd have to pay from Level 1 up to your level - to prevent abuse, and paying only 3 or 5 levels worth of upgrades; rendering buying new weapons useless. (thanks to axell5)

You could always sell these items, and get them back from Junker - free of charge! The only exception is Basic Armor, which is unsellable under the current system - so it'd remain this way. In addition, every player could be forced to have all items equipped, before joining PvP - just like you need Primary right now!
Lastly, these items would NOT count towards your inventory slots - especially if you were forced to have each item equipped to join PvP. Not everyone have enough slots to be forced to keep their no-drop weapons, and they shouldn't be penalized for it - especially when it costs Varium to expand your slots!

Tl;dr:
  • Full set of weapons for every single player.
  • Scales to your level + penalty for scaling.
  • Upgrades automatically, for free.
  • Prevents players from starting matches underequipped, regardless of their circumstances.
  • Partially deals with 2v2 imbalance, caused by players not having any items (or trolling).

    * Primary would be Physical for Mercs/TLMs, as well as BHs/CHs. For BMs/TMs, it'd be Energy. Gun would be the opposite of your Primary weapon. Auxillary would be Physical for everyone.



    • axell5 -> RE: Scaled no-drop weapons (1/4/2014 12:02:11)

    i like this, but i think if should be -5 levels of your current AND if you want to upgrade it to your level, it would cost you the same to upgrade a normal item from lvl 0-1 to your current so people dont stay with only that gear and buy nothing



    Ranloth -> RE: Scaled no-drop weapons (1/4/2014 12:03:35)

    Hm, you have a fair point there. Didn't think about that - easily abuseable. Will add to the post. XD



    axell5 -> RE: Scaled no-drop weapons (1/4/2014 12:09:30)

    and well other than that... i think it's fine [:D] and glad i could help [:)]



    martinsen5 -> RE: Scaled no-drop weapons (1/4/2014 14:56:03)

    What's the difference though, between having an under-equipped partner (who can only strike), and a fully equipped player with extremely weak weapons? A level 25 gun won't be of much help against a level 30, will it? Or maybe it would, I don't know :S

    I like your suggestion though, I've seen complaints regarding this matter so this could probably solve it.



    GearzHeadz -> RE: Scaled no-drop weapons (1/4/2014 14:57:56)

    Well, a deflect is better then a block. Plus they'd be helpful on rage. And also mainly just the stat points that come with the weapons can give a big boost.



    Ranloth -> RE: Scaled no-drop weapons (1/4/2014 15:04:18)

    It's better to have a Level 30 player with full set of Level 25 items (but Bot), rather than severly underequipped, with perhaps Level 30 Primary and upgraded Armor. It does have quite a large impact - yes, you get less damage and stats, but it adds up to much more than one Level 30 weapon. Let's not forget they have skills to use

    The only benefit from this is, the player will always be fully equipped - no matter what level. No-drop's purpose is to give you something to use, and you could upgrade it to your level or get another weapon. It's a fail-proof suggestion, which partially solves some imbalance in 2v2, and helps those who have been hacked, or simply made few bad decisions. ^^

    For a player who is fully equipped already, this would make no difference - at all!



    CN2025 -> RE: Scaled no-drop weapons (1/4/2014 15:09:55)

    true this would help alot on hacked players this should help them get on track abit and after they get enough credits they can get a proper set



    martinsen5 -> RE: Scaled no-drop weapons (1/4/2014 15:22:51)

    Ah yeah, I completely forgot about stats [;)] I guess you're right, it would be much better in comparision.



    Ranloth -> RE: Scaled no-drop weapons (1/4/2014 15:23:12)

    And stand a better chance against NPCs, which can also pack quite a punch if you're underequipped. :p



    toopygoo -> RE: Scaled no-drop weapons (1/4/2014 17:38:29)

    supported :)



    Jacobfarrow1 -> RE: Scaled no-drop weapons (1/6/2014 12:21:02)

    Supported.

    I've been doing 1v1 and 2v2 matches for missions, and I've seen Mercs without an Aux (Perhaps they think their Bunker Buster is an Aux?) and Mages/Hunters without Sidearms. Same thing the other way, but the one I've said is most common for me.

    A suggestion: Make the No-Drop gear sell-price the same as it would be if they were a basic item without stats/damage (Either one, or both. Your choice). i.e. Aux's price would be of the lowest priced Aux, like the Bazooka, at the level of the player... But without the extra money they would have got from stat upgrades.
    Example: Level 25 Nodrop Aux with Maxed Damage: 250 [Base Price of Bazooka] + 187.5n (n = Each 10 points of damage) = 3250 Credits.


    Another suggestion: Make the no-drop items only sellable once, or only buyable every time interval (Like a week). Another way would be to make them sellable only after a time interval, like a month.


    Hope my suggestions help, and I fully support this idea. It would benefit new players, hacked ones, and others greatly.



    s0u1ja b0y -> RE: Scaled no-drop weapons (1/30/2014 23:49:52)

    The penalty really isn't needed. You need more of a stat points penalty. The only difference between a lvl 20 and lvl 25 weapon is damage. The stats really are key not damage. 17 support why use aux? Skill points greater than damage so with way you have it, it could easily be abused to get free aux with same skill points as your lvl



    Ranloth -> RE: Scaled no-drop weapons (1/31/2014 6:41:34)

    If the penalty isn't needed, then neither is the suggestion. You get free items that upgrade with your level, at a penalty. If you want items equal to your level, upgrade your own.
    You cannot get the best for free. Why should you even use these scaled weapons in the first place? It's only a prerequisite to join PvP, and at least having some gear if you got hacked or made mistakes - it's better than fully upgraded Primary only.
    If you don't fall under any of the above, you have absolutely no reason to touch these weapons in the first place.



    s0u1ja b0y -> RE: Scaled no-drop weapons (1/31/2014 7:21:12)

    A 3 to 5 lvl penalty on weapons doesn't do anything. My current aux is only upgraded with points not damage. Lvl 20 and lvl 25 weapons have same amount of points. This can be exploited by casters since they already do no damage. The penalty really isn't a penalty



    Ranloth -> RE: Scaled no-drop weapons (1/31/2014 7:32:09)

    The penalty would be damage and stats. L20 -> 25 has a difference of +13 stats, +1 Armor, and quite some damage.

    You can't base the entire suggestion off one Caster example. Amount of stats will make a difference, especially for a Caster who's abusing. What's the point of my suggestion if some next BH will upgrade all damage and ditch stats? They care about damage after all, not defenses.
    Why are Lvl 35's losing against Lvl 40's? It's only 5 levels difference, in terms of weapon stats, and their builds may make little difference. Only advantage they have is +20 stats from level ups. But their weapons should be able to overcome 5 levels gap, which is merely +20 stats, despite their weapons being weaker.

    If the argument against the suggestion is one specific build "abusing it", then don't bother. Why do players upgrade weapons, even Casters, if that level difference isn't really a difference? It does make a difference, in terms of Caster's damage output on skills, as well as their defenses. Lower weapon offense means, once they are out of EP, rage will be even more difficult to gain, because lesser amount of damage is being defended from.

    When one build causes trouble for an entire suggestion, something tells me a player either doesn't know how to play, or doesn't even play the game. For a Caster, every point counts when it comes to abusing their beloved stat, because they purely rely on skills' offense.



    s0u1ja b0y -> RE: Scaled no-drop weapons (1/31/2014 15:56:54)

    I never said I did or didn't support. I'm just pointing out flaws in your idea. There are more examples than caster tm. No support tms can abuse this as well.
    if you buy a weapon and upgrade it STATS only the stats are equal( like lvl 20 and 25 just for an example). If you could upgrade them like suggested, you could just put points into stats and leave damage with a penalty. So if you're a caster or no support tm, you get full benefits of AUX( this is what is really exploitable) without spending many credits. I've played since alpha btw.



    Ranloth -> RE: Scaled no-drop weapons (1/31/2014 16:04:20)

    Well, I apologise for the last comment, but no charpage under the avvy nor don't know your in-game name even, so one can only assume. I've been around since the merge, and napped the Founder promo at that time too.

    Nevertheless, the only flaw is one build you speak of. We can't really blame it on the suggestion, but how the build (balance) works in this case. Although, at the same time, even though they may abuse it, so could everyone else - their advantage would be equal to everyone else's, just perhaps stats are beneficial for one build more than for the other - and likewise with the damage.

    Also, there's a bit you may have missed out about upgrading "no-drop weapons", which is having to pay from Lvl 1 to upgrade it to your level. So, assuming you're L25, you'd have to upgrade all the stats from L1 to L25. It'd be difficult to enforce upgrading damage and stats at a given ratio, because not everyone would be able to afford it and it may not be beneficial for them - but this is the only solution I can see right now, for the issue you mention.



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