Ranks and Balance (Full Version)

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Front45 -> Ranks and Balance (11/28/2016 6:43:34)

Let's talk about Ranks and Balance here. why we play Epic Duel? 1. because we wanna be strongest and won all battles? 2. or get fun, make interesting battles. what for we play? ask ourself this question. in Design Notes i read that expect 7500 experience, there will be 3x lower 2500 experience to get higher rank. we do not want to be op. example ionut 100 is 300+ and his win rate against low rank and low level players is near 90%. that means he win 9 battles of 10. how is that right? why we need Ranks? why we need Legendary stats? we do not need them, delete please. even I am 20 Rank and if meet 37-38 level player, often i win. but i am not satisfied, i don't like this situation. i don't wanna 100% win or 100% lose battles. i do not want be 10x or 100x times stronger than my opponent, it is not right. why we keep Legendary Mode? no need. Ranks always hurt Balance, because someone is 1 rank someone 100 rank and battles often are Unfair, there is no fair. i do not like easy wins and easy loses. i wanna fight, i wanna play, i wanna get fun. 1 vs 1 is Dead for me already long time


Mrs. Lazarus ~ Epic Duel player since 2011
Thanks all for respond



shadow.bane -> RE: Ranks and Balance (11/28/2016 13:23:33)

ranks can be overcome with a simple word "skills" if u have none u will nag all day long and lose all your battles if u have a little bit of it u will win a bit if a lot then u win a lot... simple answer "quit EpicDuel since u started in 2011 and still can't understand ranks and how game mechanics works"



Stonehawk -> RE: Ranks and Balance (11/28/2016 14:37:37)

Ranks can not be removed. It was too expensive to unlock them!
Level cap CAN'T be lowered. If we are lvl 40, it can't return to 35. It would be unfair for those that took so much time to level up.
Solution to improve balance and avoid higher ranks to be stronger? Make ranks improve something else. If you are higher ranked, it means you have more game experience, more time playing. No need to make them stronger in PvP.

What can ranks do, for example?
- Increase the credits won for each battle
- Increase battle skills against NPC (it already does increase damage/defense in this case, so this one can be kept)
- Decrease price for rearranging stats or retraining
- Open exclusive shops for high-ranked people armory
- Increase rating


Or anything else that doesn't affect battles directly. By doing this, underdog for rank difference won't be needed. Only for lvl difference.

But there's a problem. How about all credits/varium we used by unlocking rank slots?



Front45 -> RE: Ranks and Balance (11/28/2016 14:51:54)

i do not agree. nowadays is such situation: you can have ton of variums, but it does not give you wins. but if you are high rank, you can win a lot of battles. Ranks almost give you free wins because look >> gun + 40, auxiliary +40 , robot +40, primary +40. defense and resistance both +30. even Rank 60 is fully upgraded.

what is solution can anyone explain me? 1 vs 1 just is dead, there are only playing high rank players. underdog mode no works. what can i do? yes, i am changed to 2 vs 2 battles but i wanna play 1 vs 1



Stonehawk -> RE: Ranks and Balance (11/28/2016 16:44:16)

quote:

Or anything else that doesn't affect battles directly. By doing this, underdog for rank difference won't be needed. Only for lvl difference.


Did you read it before not agreeing? I said ranks should not be removed (if you're rank 100, you fought for it so it will stay as it is) but I never said someone will have +40 gun +40 robot and stuff. Just change ranks to improve other stuff that doesn't affect PvP. You understand now?



shadow.bane -> RE: Ranks and Balance (11/28/2016 17:59:52)

quote:

what is solution can anyone explain me?


The solution is easy "Brains"



kaiseryeux21 -> RE: Ranks and Balance (11/28/2016 20:45:53)

quote:

The solution is easy "Brains"


couldn't agree more. That is the primary reason why i keep on coming into this game despite playing it for more than 6 years already.
this is one of the few games that really needs strategy in order to win. I am now rank 30 and despite the experience i had, i still loose to some rank 2 or 3 players
who have better strategy than me. Yes ranks do gave some advantage (stats wise) but it doesn't GUARANTEE you a win.
I just hope devs would listen to right players with right motives and intentions into this game because clearly, others just want to ruin the game we loved since 2009.




Xendran -> RE: Ranks and Balance (11/28/2016 21:02:45)

Shadow.bane and kaiseryeux21: Do you want the game to live, or do you want it to stay the way it is?
Just because you two are fine with the system does not mean that the majority of people are.
Just because the system can occasionally be countered by giving you a skewed matchup of a great low rank player vs a terrible high rank player does not make it acceptable.
Does it not seem counterproductive to advocate for a system that damages the game and makes people not want to play it?



kaiseryeux21 -> RE: Ranks and Balance (11/29/2016 3:46:56)

Xendran: when was the last time you played this game? As for me, just a couple of minutes ago.
I'll explain it to you in a very simple manner.

I am currently rank 30 & been playing this game for more than 6 years already.
Yes i have been winning alot due to my build as a BH (if your smart enough, you would know what my build is). But do i have 100% win rate? NO.
I have been loosing to some low rank players due to their BUILD is a perfect counter to my build. Ofcourse you know you can't win every single battle. If that's the case, then we have nothing to talk here. Did Ranks save me from loosing to rank 1 players? NO. Did ranks give me better stats? YES. Did ranks gives me a guarantee to win versus low rank players. NO. so on and so forth.

What im trying to say here is that alot of players blame their looses to ranks where infact, it's them who definitely don't have the strategy to win even in winnable situations. It's a matter of maturity & strategy. I'm not saying that Ranks are fine. Actually, they are not in this current situation of ED. But Ranks are the incentive of the players to continue to play this game. It does need some tweaks and i leave it to the devs with the help of some of the best players in this game.

as far as i can remember, i even have a post way back in 2013 or 2014 about "the agony of being level 38". Yes, i too undergone through that stage but i overcome it by continue to learn this game & i eventually beat high rank players with the right build and strategy.

Let's not put some drama into this. If you want to be the best in this game, continue to Play it.

thats my 2 cents.




Front45 -> RE: Ranks and Balance (11/29/2016 7:50:54)

kaiseryeux21
man just imagine situation: you are rank 1 and battling fully upgraded player Rank 60+. how that feel? i know main is build, not ranks. but focus 5 almost winning high ranks. this is I'm against for

if you see player example hunter kill12, you know you are loser, because he is 10x stronger than you. it's worst feeling. that's why people are gone. they do not wanna unfair battles

i support delete ranks. because of ranks there is no balance in the game 1 vs 1, always will be such situation. someone always will be 1 Rank, someone always will be 60+ and battles always will be unbalanced !

also i know. you can advice me botting and make stronger, but i do not want waste my time. i do not want be 60 Rank and someone 1 Rank, because after that i will win so easy. i wanna 50%-50% chance battles. not 90%-10%

OK. past we did not know about ranks anything. now already long time Ranks is here. we saw that, we felt that and we don't like it ! because if there are ranks, there is no balance



Ojas -> RE: Ranks and Balance (11/29/2016 11:36:50)

I agree, higher ranks always dominate, this is the reason I quit 1v1 and decided to play 2v2. I'm a rank 10 Pro Player and always lose to even nooby builds who are higher rank. but Dominate lower and equal ranks.
'



santonik -> RE: Ranks and Balance (11/29/2016 14:43:27)

High ranks players is not them natural class/build weakness. Ranks give very high benefit. Ranks destroy MOST counter natural build/s.


Low rank players is Much easyly to beat than high rank players.



Stonehawk -> RE: Ranks and Balance (11/29/2016 15:15:17)

I said:

quote:

I said ranks should not be removed (if you're rank 100, you fought for it so it will stay as it is) but I never said someone will have +40 gun +40 robot and stuff. Just change ranks to improve other stuff thatdoesn't affect PvP. You understand now?


Front45 said:
quote:

i support delete ranks. because of ranks there is no balance in the game 1 vs 1, always will be such situation. someone always will be 1 Rank, someone always will be 60+ and battles always will be unbalanced !


Will you give us the varium and credits spent on ranks back? Do you think game will be better if max level cap is DECREASED instead of increased, which means you will reach the TOP and there's nothing left to climb up? Come on......!

I better leave this topic and I have to agree with this solution:

quote:

The solution is easy "Brains"



Front45 -> RE: Ranks and Balance (11/29/2016 15:24:21)

Stonehawk
yes of course yes. there will not be broken battles. people will not complain about balance. there will be more fun. everything will change to good. i am 21 Rank now and i am not interesting how many credits i spent, because Ranks hurt balance. Are there Ranks? forget Balanced game anymore



Mother1 -> RE: Ranks and Balance (11/29/2016 16:25:09)

@ Front45

Oh but there will be complaints because in the past when the cap was just 35 (which first came out during the infernal war back in delta) People complained about being bored due to not being able to climb any higher in levels, which was the main reason why the staff added level 36, then 4 more levels and ranks. To get rid of the boreness these players were feeling and to make a near endless grind to so players won't ask for more levels.

Remove the ranks and levels and it will back to this all over again. Not to mention as stonehawk mentioned anyone who paid for ranks, or the boosts to get said ranks will not be happy either because said change will make those players hard work go down the drain which is another reason why players also quit.

However changing the ranks to something that doesn't give power instead of outright removing them will not only preserve said players hard work, but will also make it so everyone who is complaining about unfair rank match ups vanish as well. Because if ranks give no power towards PVP battles but rather comsestic perks, and other perks such as increased drops, increased sellback by X amount, decreased cost to items by X percent then it won't matter if a rank 500 faces a rank 1 because there will be no power gap between these players.

quote:

The solution is easy "Brains"


This is also true seeing as many of us can say that playing smart and having the right build can overcome level/rank advantage, and speaking for myself there have been many times where I have won against higher level /ranked players both with and without the underdog mode.



kaiseryeux21 -> RE: Ranks and Balance (11/29/2016 18:56:28)

@Font45, as much as i appreciate your sympathy over low level and low rank players, i cannot agree to all of your posts. You cannot speak for the whole community. as players have different perspective in playing. Some wants to win everytime, others just simply enjoyed this game. Some doesn't enjoy beating the same players again and again, while for others, winning is everything.

Don't get me wrong, im not a bully. I also don't enjoy making low ranks as my punching bag. ( as i myself also once become a punching bag way back when enhancements was still here). I know the feeling, and i don't like the feeling. But i made those experiences as my motivation to be better in this game. Yes i agree, ranks isn't perfect. it might even be worst for some. But let's not blame all for ranks. It's still the players who are controlling the outcome of the battle ( with few exceptions from luck & other factors). I am now rank 30, and every time i face a rank 1, i still have the same mindset as facing rank 50 or up.

You'll be fine my friend, it's just a game.



Front45 -> RE: Ranks and Balance (11/29/2016 20:01:04)

Hey everyone. i wanna say to all good bye. this is my last day be with you on forums2.battleon.com and be in Epic Duel. i was trying to find my justice, but they Disabled my account forever. Thanks for everyone to be with me, to be my friend, to fight with or against me since 2012. it's okay. tomorrow will start just another day without play Epic Duel. thanks everyone for read, for pay attention. sorry for long topics, sorry for boring. just i was trying to be better game, but... miss you all. i am crying now but its ok guys. bye bane, bye machaar, bye teufel, bye mother1 and etc. sorry people for everything

Remember Epic Duel is big family, and all of yours are family members, each other

kaiseryeux21
for me already ended this game. they disabled my account



shadow.bane -> RE: Ranks and Balance (11/29/2016 21:36:52)

simply u ain't a good player mrs.lazarus, we worked hard to get to those rank maybe it's time for u to climb too and stop nagging about it, cause the more u nag the more time u lose to climb ur way to higher ranks, i know u are not understanding me cause i explain many times to u how things works and u just keep saying same things over and over again like u have a blanked mind... in other words you ain't a good player.
and xandran as kaiseryeux21 when was last time u played ED ? we worked hard to reach high ranks and paid 1485000 credits to unlock them all and some paid varium refund us ? nah give us back the time we spent to be high ranks ? also nah

and as devs said : RANKS WILL REMAIN end of this subject stop nagging front and go play ED



Xendran -> RE: Ranks and Balance (11/30/2016 13:52:21)

I mean to be fair, it really isn't my problem if the game stays dead due to broken progression. Last time i played was a few months ago, but I have no interest in playing EpicDuel even if they fix the issues.
Just offering advice on what is most realistic for the game. There are ways to motivate people to be better without alienating all your new players and causing massive churn.
Its not some personal issue that I have, trying to get changes made to benefit me. Like you note, I don't play this game so I have no personal stake either way.

Also, again, it's not about removing the system, but removing the pvp influence from them.
You can go ahead calling people bad players all day, i'm not sure exactly what you hope to achieve.



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