RE: =ED= December 9th, 2016 - Gifting 2016 Continues (Full Version)

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SouL Prisoner -> RE: =ED= December 9th, 2016 - Gifting 2016 Continues (12/10/2016 0:49:01)

Well since you nerfing Legendary ranks, please don't forgot to nerf the legendary NPC's too. Gonna be even more hard now.



8x -> RE: =ED= December 9th, 2016 - Gifting 2016 Continues (12/10/2016 1:11:55)

Let us all give a round of applause to ED for finally becoming a near-perfect AQW clone. (I understand that this is pretty much the only thing they can do at this point, but I'm not too happy that the win records are about to be completely ruined. Even more than they were already.)



nowras -> RE: =ED= December 9th, 2016 - Gifting 2016 Continues (12/10/2016 5:35:40)

quote:

For clarity, the current plan is to make the actual stats/bonuses given per rank massively reduced, probably by half to more than half on estimate.

For clarity, you're just simply making rank 1 players better than rank 80 players by doing that.
@EP

More than half means the current rank 80 players will receive:
15 Primary Damage
15 Def
15 Resis
20 Gun
20 Aux
20 Bot
5 Energy (It's soo op way stronger than 1 level!!!!!!)
10 Health (Omg 10 health!!!! This can be sooooo game changing omg 10!!!)

While Rank 1 Underdog will receive:
3 Def
4 Str
5 Dex
5 Tech
4 Supp
35% more chance to go first (Aka 100%)
More luck
More skill damage

In order to show you the bigger picture I'll have to convert the 35% chance to support. And the 3 def to stat points as well.
Since the first turn is 1 out of 5 advantages the support gives to the players then this means we will see the required stats to receive a 35% more chance to go first and then convert it to stats following this equation---> (35% x 100) x 2 = Support Points needed for 35% chance to go first.
1/5 x Support points = Stat points that are needed just for the 35% chance ignoring all other support advantages.

This means 1/5 x 70 = 14 stat points.

3 def is clearly just 1 stat points.

So, the rank 1 player receives 14+1+5+4+4+5 stat points = 33 stat points.


With med diminishing returns this means they will get:
4 x 3 + 4 x 2= 20 Primary damage.
8 dex = 20 defense and gun damage.
9 tech = 22 resistance and bot damage.
8 sup = 20 Aux damage.

I chose med diminishing returns because if you ever want to spam one or two stats the rest of the stats will be increased based on low diminishing returns (because they are already low) which means it will give exactly or nearly the same result.
And that's only assuming that 35% is just 1/5 of the 70 support points as the best advantage of support is the first turn but I made it equal to the rest of the advantages and I actually became biased to underdog mode while I was calculating.
Even if I was inaccurate by 50% of my calculations of first turn to stats, rank ones will still be stronger than rank 80. So don't even try to prove me wrong.
By comparing both results we see that rank 1 is now stronger than 80. Thanks for ruining the game logic.




Lord Machaar -> RE: =ED= December 9th, 2016 - Gifting 2016 Continues (12/10/2016 8:00:13)

I told them to remove ranks a couple of years ago but they didn't listen, ED devs do not have the time to balance the game and more specifically legendary ranks. They have been trying to balance the game for the past what, 6 or 7 years? So anyone thinking ED will get balanced within a month, is a dreamer. Wild dreamer actually.

Syfy called them out before the gifting event started. In order to make more players spend more cash, the devs need to give them the impression that the game will sustain in the future. Watch how the game will be forgotten in January.

I guess the devs are taking their best shot at making ED sustain with the bare minimum effort which is making ED an AQW 2.0. Might or might not work, but in eitherways, we can't solely blame the ED devs for it, the new trend is mobile gaming. Guess devs should already start working on a cross-platform "ED-like-game", rather than turning the current ED into an AQW-like, where anything can be achieved by botting NPCs, making past achievements meaningless (2vs2 win ratio for example).



.Lord Ginger. -> RE: =ED= December 9th, 2016 - Gifting 2016 Continues (12/10/2016 8:02:34)

If one player has 30k NPCs, it doesn't mean they bot btw.



Lord Machaar -> RE: =ED= December 9th, 2016 - Gifting 2016 Continues (12/10/2016 8:14:37)

There are indications to either confirm or deny that. (PS: Wins versus Davarril/Black abyss, NPC wins per day...)



shadow.bane -> RE: =ED= December 9th, 2016 - Gifting 2016 Continues (12/10/2016 8:25:39)

Some people are patients some people are not.

On topic :

If they will cut the rank to half as nowras said then underdog mode will be more op than ranks in other words (or numbers) :

Rank 80 :
15 primary damage
15 resistance
15 defense
20 robot damage
20 gun damage
20 aux damage
- 5 energy on cores
10 more point to health medic

Let's say a max rank faces a rank 1 which means will get underdog level 8.

Underdog level 8:
4 strength
5 dextirity
5 technologies
5 support
+ 100000 % to start first

Do some math here and tell me a rank 1 wont get easy win on a max rank...

Now don't tell me am defending high ranks am currently want them to stay as they are lol cause i lost my high rank account now on a new one which is level 20 by the wat, so i will be facing high ranks when i get to 40 so leave it as it is so i take advantage of underdog please.



Noobatron x3000 -> RE: =ED= December 9th, 2016 - Gifting 2016 Continues (12/10/2016 10:07:06)

The npc thing is the thing i'm most exicited about, Shows their following the gaming industry most pvp games are seeing a npc option/campaign option introduced now, Long overdue for ED been an obvious solution to the endless slaughterfest 35+ levels have been facing for the longest time, And low level waiting times.



shadow.bane -> RE: =ED= December 9th, 2016 - Gifting 2016 Continues (12/10/2016 11:15:41)

^ but the only thing is as Lord Machaar stated that we will now see more and more fake 2 vs 2 ratios... and as for a level 40 u will rarely face an npcs it's more like to low levels.



One Winged Angel1357 -> RE: =ED= December 9th, 2016 - Gifting 2016 Continues (12/10/2016 11:48:07)

As critical as I am of ranks I'm just going to put this forward as the update is still under testing until Monday.

Make the cap for gaining benefits for underdog 45 and don't adjust the energy core reduction and healing increase ranks as their benefit to PvP is minimum at best and slightly aids your opponent at the worst



Noobatron x3000 -> RE: =ED= December 9th, 2016 - Gifting 2016 Continues (12/10/2016 12:55:16)

I think they should leave it as is , This week even with gifting we were seeing under 400 players logging in,

This announcement came out, Now the numbers gone to 500-700

People want the rank nerf.... Dont mess with it, ED finally has a future which wont include 100-300 players in January.



One Winged Angel1357 -> RE: =ED= December 9th, 2016 - Gifting 2016 Continues (12/10/2016 13:25:57)

@Noobatron correlation does not equal causation. As we get further into the month of December more schools will be holding finals and more students will be going on break. This means for the whole of the gaming industry user numbers will climb.

Don't see these changes as what is bringing back players because then you are lying to yourself with a very short sighted view on the data. The real test of these changes will come about in February when schools are back in full swing and people will have to make the hard choices of how they want to spend their free time. If EpicDuel is moving in the right direction then server numbers will stay up but if not then server numbers will drop back down to what they were in November



.Lord Ginger. -> RE: =ED= December 9th, 2016 - Gifting 2016 Continues (12/10/2016 13:54:25)

^ True



shadow.bane -> RE: =ED= December 9th, 2016 - Gifting 2016 Continues (12/10/2016 16:32:01)

@owa... keeping the energy efficiency rank and health medic rank wont change a thing cause they are already useless and underdog gain 6 points for that...



One Winged Angel1357 -> RE: =ED= December 9th, 2016 - Gifting 2016 Continues (12/10/2016 16:38:08)

@Shadow.bane did you miss the part of the post where I said don't bother nerfing those and don't count them towards underdog? If so here is the quote

quote:

Make the cap for gaining benefits for underdog 45 and don't adjust the energy core reduction and healing increase ranks


The cap is currently 47 because it counts those two as a level a piece



.Lord Ginger. -> RE: =ED= December 9th, 2016 - Gifting 2016 Continues (12/10/2016 18:39:55)

That would be better. ^ However I feel like we should keep the level underdog(if you really have to) and just remove the other ranks and give the players FAIR compensation seeming y'all want to make ranks and underdog equal in power. If you want to make them equal, then take them out, but keep the level gap underdog....



Mother1 -> RE: =ED= December 9th, 2016 - Gifting 2016 Continues (12/11/2016 1:30:33)

@8X

Way before omega 1 vs 1 had NPC that gave actual 1 vs 1 wins so anyone who has an account from before omega and played against any non boss NPC would have a wreaked 1 vs 1 record.

lets not forget the first infernal war which introduced NPC to the 2 vs 2 pool so anyone who fought in this war unless they managed to not get a NPC opponent would also have a wreaked 2 vs 2 record. Frankly the only mode that never had NPC's in it would be juggernaut.



8x -> RE: =ED= December 9th, 2016 - Gifting 2016 Continues (12/11/2016 2:00:36)

@Mother1
I am fully aware of that. I just got the feeling like they realized their screw up after the first infernal war release and wouldn't do that again. If anyone was upset with their horrible record keeping (1vs1) and their major screw up on 2vs2 win ratios, it would be me. That's why I said I was not happy that win records are about to be completely ruined. Completely ruined as in, they goofed up on the first two, now the third gets a ticket to the fantasy land too.



shadow.bane -> RE: =ED= December 9th, 2016 - Gifting 2016 Continues (12/11/2016 5:37:51)

@Owa sorry i missed the part when u said that so if that happens will be a good thing and a max rank versus rank 1 be like 6 e levels not 8... cool.



Stonehawk -> RE: =ED= December 9th, 2016 - Gifting 2016 Continues (12/11/2016 8:53:28)

1- Legendary ranks:
Dude it's so simple change ranks into non-PvP buffs and remove those senseless underdog, underdog is like turning battles into "I'm lower level but it's the same thing as being the same level because I'm buffed by the game", but even worse than that (unbalanced).

Stats are usually better than flat numbers. Testers, try giving 1 stat for each unlocked rank instead of flat numbers on defense or attack and you'll see what I'm talking about. Stats make skills stronger, chance to block/crit/deflect higher and stuff.

Plus, I'll probably beat 100+ rank even easier after update since I'm only rank 45 and buffs to rank are nerfed but underdog stays the same. Why lvl 40 aren't all the same?

Legendary ranks were first made as a "new kind of leveling up", because people complained that they reached max level and got nothing else to do. Underdog is like walking backwards, making higher ranks look exactly the same or even weaker than the lower ranks (it's like: I'm leveling up, I'm ranking up, I'm using credits and varium to unlock more power, but now I'm same power or even weaker than the lower ranks that didn't have any effort).

Making ranks weaker will make things even worse.
Making ranks cheaper without refunding people that already unlocked them will make things even WORSER!!!

If ranks aren't no more intended to make someone stronger, as it was first intended too (not that I agreed with that) just remove it's PvP BUFFS and that's it!! Also, it was pretty hard to unlock each rank, 15000 credits takes so much time, so ranks should still be useful, even if not affecting PvP directly. And don't forget to refund everyone that unlocked ranks if you guys are making it cheaper!!!

There are some suggestions for refunding the unlocked ranks that became cheaper without making anyone mad for unfair changes favouring only new players:
1- Lock all legendary ranks back, refunding 50% varium price + 50% credits price for each rank that was unlocked, so that they can choose what to unlock again with the refunds.
2- If it's possible to know whether they were unlocked each slot with varium or credits, refunding would be even easier: if price is halved, for example, refund 175 varium or 7500 credits, depending on which one each player used to unlock (seems a lot harder to work).



2- 3000 varium for those who purchased varium for gift event:
My question is: If you bought varium 1 or 2 days before event, there's no 3000 varium bonus? Not everyone waited for the event to begin to buy varium. I mean, I bought it in December 1st, the same day the event begun, but I'm not sure if the event had already started but anyways I think I deserve it because I bought varium for it! Same for those that bought it 1 or 2 days before, or at least when the gifting event was officially announced!

3- NPCs on 2 vs 2 / Juggernaut:
Finally a suggestion of mine was listened! Just hope I can also face NPCs for not so long waiting, even being a lvl 40, or this is going to be pointless since most of the players are lvl 40. Even if there are no lvl 40 NPCs on this update, I think that, if we can have a lvl 37 partner against two lvl 40, we can have a NPC partner too. I prefer a not-so-long wait to have a 37 NPC partner than a very long wait for a low level partner without any equipments (that's what made me give up on 2 vs 2. NPCs might not be as smart as the best players, but they won't be a free win, I'm pretty sure).

4- Skill Cores (to be looked up for next updates):
I had the suggestion to make locked cores removable or skill cores in general unequippable (including the locked ones. Yes, it's about time to unlock them!!!). Why do I want to make locked cores removable? It's simple. Increases variety (in looking therms)! I mean, I have a delta armor but I don't like it's skill core. Armors are only looks, why can't I replace that core I don't like from the armor I like with a better one, to have a better look?

That's all for now, I hope everyone (specially those that are responsible for the updates) read it carefully! Thanks.







Noobatron x3000 -> RE: =ED= December 9th, 2016 - Gifting 2016 Continues (12/11/2016 13:06:36)

@ stonehawk the argument can be reversed also, lower levels , I'm lower ranked so i should always be at a huge disadvantage why should i bother to play actively if at all , I will just leave all you high rank players to wait 20 minutes consistently for a 2v2 match to start



.Lord Ginger. -> RE: =ED= December 9th, 2016 - Gifting 2016 Continues (12/11/2016 15:43:17)

@noob
He also said to take away the PVP advantage of ranks.

Read his full post before responding.



Noobatron x3000 -> RE: =ED= December 9th, 2016 - Gifting 2016 Continues (12/11/2016 19:47:38)

I did read the full post i was picking up on one point he made in it , Which just isnt logical , The argument " they worked hard to gain the ranks , In which case we should allow the game to remain broken for the majority" Isn't a solid argument.

I've long agreed the way to go is making ranks none pvp related but ill settle for this.

Just pointing out the common argument is we invested time to earn the ranks so we're entitled to break balance in the game (is essentially the argument) No matter how you word it at it's core thats what your saying, Is an illogical argument.

Because like it or not, Ranks shaft the casual gamer, And breaks balance for them, And without the casual gamer their is no game.100-300 people logging in to play even less actually pvping for an entire year in a pvp game, Guess there aren't enough hardcore players to sustain the games current pvp system /cough cough

/thread.



.Lord Ginger. -> RE: =ED= December 9th, 2016 - Gifting 2016 Continues (12/11/2016 22:01:26)

@noob this is what stonehawk said if you misread it

quote:

just remove it's PvP BUFFS and that's it!! Also, it was pretty hard to unlock each rank, 15000 credits takes so much time, so ranks should still be useful, even if not affecting PvP directly. And don't forget to refund everyone that unlocked ranks if you guys are making it cheaper!!!



Mr.Pablo Jr. -> RE: =ED= December 9th, 2016 - Gifting 2016 Continues (12/11/2016 22:33:32)

Lol, Wiseman's suggestion for varium purchases finally got implemented, if only for a limited time and years later...



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