Captain's Charge (Full Version)

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frogbones2 -> Captain's Charge (10/27/2019 14:44:05)

Way OP. -40% defense/res for three turns? -40 strength and support for two turns? It's literally an instant win 90% of the time. Devs screwed up big time with this core. SMH.

.Lord Ginger. -> RE: Captain's Charge (10/27/2019 19:58:57)

It's a really cool core by design.

Is it OP? It is now because the health was changed from 25% to 45%, nothing different from any other OP core coming from a promotion. Only difference now is waiting for nerfs that I've usually helped push for.

frogbones2 -> RE: Captain's Charge (10/28/2019 10:32:58)

So you admit it's OP. Great. Any insight why the devs release OP gear that costs real money? It's pathetic. Who's on the balance team? Because they need to be demoted....ugh I hate greedy people.

x ts -> RE: Captain's Charge (10/29/2019 0:32:09)


Is it OP? It is now because the health was changed from 25% to 45%

I'm intrigued, how does a change in health requirement make it OP? From what I've seen in my matches and with the way the current meta works, 25% condition is the same as saying heal and maybe survive or die using the core and not actually benefit from it.


Way OP. -40% defense/res for three turns? -40 strength and support for two turns? It's literally an instant win 90% of the time. Devs screwed up big time with this core.

From what I can see, this core is specifically targeting more aminstream builds like STR builds, Support builds and Of course tank builds all at once, so instead of nerfing the foundation which is stat points multipliers to the ground any further, they just made a core to deal with it. the best counter for this is to just Brute force it with high stat build, because tbh a str build with 130 str isn't going to be fazed as badly as a focus build with infernal bot in the oven.

.Lord Ginger. -> RE: Captain's Charge (10/29/2019 15:07:34)

"How does a change in health requirement make it OP?"

Imagine if you could use it at 100% health instead of the current 45%. Then it would be even more broken than it already is.

Armagedon2018 -> RE: Captain's Charge (10/29/2019 22:38:41)

which is your suggestion about captain charge?

.Lord Ginger. -> RE: Captain's Charge (10/30/2019 0:27:40)

Nerf the effects a tad and make it useful at a bit lower HP to activate maybe...

This core absolutely shreds focus builds defense/resistance (which is a big part of focus builds, but with the core now defense/resistance with an automatic low HP makes it tough to survive without either blood lust, cyber shark or luck, and even with them because you do low damage.

I like the core, it got very useful with the HP increase which is really nice, I think the effect needs maybe a small nerf, maybe just down to 35% defense ignore and -35 to supp/str for starters?

frogbones2 -> RE: Captain's Charge (10/30/2019 11:13:54)

A -5% "nerf" would change nothing. It needs to last only two turns, activate at 25% health, and be reduced by at least 10%. Have you even played a level 40 str BM with Captain's Charge and Omega Wolf primary? What a joke!

NDB -> RE: Captain's Charge (10/30/2019 13:00:08)

^That would be way too harsh. To me, the 45% health is fine because it gives builds with lower health (<=1,000) a chance at using it. 40% would be as low as I would go if it were to be lowered. That said, I think a 5% overall nerf to the effects would be a good start as .Lord Ginger. suggested.

The problem with Captain's Charge is that it does too many things at once, especially for Bloodlust classes that use it, and that makes it extremely hard for the opponent to counter. It
  • does 100% damage
  • is unblockable
  • is Rage-able
  • costs 0 energy (makes it impossible for you to counter by draining the opponent)
  • and applies all of those effects for 3 turns to which there are currently no good shields/buffs that can effectively counter.

    If one or a few of these aspects were removed or nerfed, that would be an alternative way to balance it. Something along the lines of giving it an energy cost and/or perhaps lowering the damage to 85% would be reasonable. Although I'm not a fan of giving armor cores energy costs (or making things 85% damage for that matter), I feel like this of all cores needs it just so there's a more strategic way to avoid getting the opponent to use it besides getting out a calculator and dancing around the 45% health mark. It would also make it less useful for Bloodlust strength builds in particular which rely on the damage it does and typically have poor energy control. I say this from a Focus CH standpoint but it'd be true for other non-Bloodlust focus/tank builds that, relative to other builds, still rely on energy control to win. If I could temporarily drain the opponent before they can use it, it would give me chance to turn the battle around. It can be hard for focus builds to avoid the 45% if they need to attack to gain health with Cyber Shark/Surgical/Frenzy/Super Charge.

    Otherwise/in addition, I think that if there was at least one shield/buff out there that a focus or tank build could use to counter it, that'd definitely help. Infernal Surge is still a joke to me; if it was buffed to be on a similar level as Captain's Charge, that'd be a big gamechanger. If Armored Roots was buffed to 50% and also had a zero energy cost, it could also be a reasonable counter. Similarly, Hardened Armor could be significantly buffed. Speaking of which, in my opinion, CH's Nanotech Shield needs a buff. Armagedon might not agree, but it does, not just for the sake of PvP but also because all of the CH legendary bosses are simply unbeatable under the current balance... Legendary NW mission is about to be back, so good luck with that.

  • Armagedon2018 -> RE: Captain's Charge (10/30/2019 20:41:57)

    Like says Machaon, you must avoid that your opponent use the captainīcharge (CC) Its full strategic, checking the health of your opponent, keeping energy,etc , but if you only attack without a plan, then obviously you will lose easily. I use it with ch f5, it works perfectly against strengh build with CC. Maybe a 5% overall nerf to the effect would be enough. I do not say that I agree or disagree because the core is avoidable. It will depend on the rest of the testers.

    About nanotech armor, like I already said you , before we release the new skills, we nerfed it a bit because it was too strong. Probably, the same thing was going to happen when ch got damage reduction in shadow arts. We want avoid that. Also, we do not make changes taking into account the npcs (bosses and jugg mode). I have seen a post that living weirdo was able to kill legendary charfade with ch and bm, but with a different build (dex build ch) that I had not see before.

    Effectively, armored roots, hardened armor even infernal fortitude could be bufffed in some way. That is something I have been checking this week. I believe that those cores could be useful against bosses if were reusable.

    .Lord Ginger. -> RE: Captain's Charge (11/1/2019 13:18:28)

    1) Being respectful goes a long way when wanting things to be changed.

    2) Making reasonable suggestions can help things get done faster.

    3) I'm sure many of the people you get beat by would beat you even if they didn't have the armor core.

    Edit: Notice how 0 of the top 5 of LB when I'm posting this are using the armor.

    x ts -> RE: Captain's Charge (11/1/2019 14:18:31)

    First of all, the nerf dropped and the balance is welcomed and still at least usable at 45% health. Hopefully, my lvl 37 bh can still somewhat survive the passive skill tank onslaught.

    Off topic (kinda):
    My only peeve is what it took to make this happen. From what I've seen, the issue was raised via forum threads, by 2 people; this thread being the one that gained some discussion. Then we get a balance update. I just don't understand how an issue raised by a few individuals is representative enough to change pvp for the rest of population. If this was the case, then does that mean whenever a pvp update drops, and someone doesn't like it, they can post a relatable concern about the issue to gain some discussion and then expect a nerf in the following weeks? I usually don't look into balance updates, but whenever I do, I see the situation I just described... (This was somewhat the reason why I went on hiatus back when delta dropped; nerfs were coming out every week after a few folks raised an issue) I'm sorry if this is coming off as a rant, but is there something that I'm not seeing that makes this okay?

    HOWEVER, I would like once again express my gratitude to the balance team for their work. You guys not only enjoy the praise of those that welcome the change, but you also have to deal with the heat from those who don't. Your work is appreciated and I look forward to your efforts in the future.

    Armagedon2018 -> RE: Captain's Charge (11/8/2019 20:29:35)

    Captain's charge was nerfed. In my view, it does not need more nerf. Another point what I would like to discuss is that defensive active cores in armor like armored roots and hardener armor were reusable? Someone alredy mentioned before. What are your thoughts?

    .Lord Ginger. -> RE: Captain's Charge (11/10/2019 13:06:39)

    Maybe those cores are good for bosses.

    The game isn't defensive at all anymore, making/buffing defensive cores hardly does anything unless you want to make them borderline broken and can't be taken away by Azrael's.

    I don't think the cores will do anything (in PvP), especially since people care about quick wins and being defensive is basically a loss with how much damage other cores do now.

    Armagedon2018 -> RE: Captain's Charge (11/11/2019 11:19:24)

    Just to counter those core. It would be taken away by Azraels's.

    .Lord Ginger. -> RE: Captain's Charge (11/11/2019 12:41:12)

    Then there's no point

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