RE: =AQ= Stat and Training Overhaul (Full Version)

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Lord Markov -> RE: =AQ= Stat and Training Overhaul (4/2/2022 12:08:04)

Just wanted to raise an minor graphical issue resulting from the trainer update. The background art for the estate item version of the Combat Practice Trainer has changed from the house-specific one to the generic Battleon one. Not a huge issue per se but if staff have the time at some point to change it back, it would be nice [:)]




Guardswordian -> RE: =AQ= Stat and Training Overhaul (4/3/2022 5:03:32)

I want a minor clarification on the STR. So the description on the Stat Trainers is as follows:
+ Melee attack damage
+ Bonus weapon damage
+ small initiative bonus

The part I'm concerned about is the Bonus weapon damage. Does this applies to all weapons, like ranged and magic?
Would maxing out STR and DEX and using ranged weapons bring give me similar damage to maxing out just STR and using a melee weapon?




sunblaze -> RE: =AQ= Stat and Training Overhaul (4/3/2022 5:36:02)

Yes that is what is it.

The small bonus damage is I think 2,5% and applies to all weaponattacks.
No matter the actual type.




Spendin -> RE: =AQ= Stat and Training Overhaul (4/5/2022 4:03:18)

Just logged back in to the game for the first time in a while and OH MY GOD! I LOOOOVE this update!




Sapphire -> RE: =AQ= Stat and Training Overhaul (4/5/2022 15:49:08)

IDK why, but it seems like it was stuck in my head I/we thought we would see approx 1 more week from the original stat updates that were deemed emergency as to when we would see some more updates. (was this said someplace or no? IDK) That may have been misguided but because its stuck there for some odd reason, I will just ask:


What's the latest news, ETA's etc on this? Thank you.




sunblaze -> RE: =AQ= Stat and Training Overhaul (4/5/2022 23:38:52)

Well considering that an idea is to add those perks every 50 points AND player feedback needs to be revied AND 2 weeks is a rather short amount of time to get that viable feedback,
I would say 1-2 months is a much more reasonable timeframe to expect more serious changes then just hotfixes for obvious bugs.


A roadmap not nessesarily with dates, but what we can expext in a final change would however be a neat gift. [:)]




Sapphire -> RE: =AQ= Stat and Training Overhaul (4/8/2022 15:14:54)

New Updated Proposal From Me

TOTAL PROPOSAL

BLOCKING
-Universal Blocking from Dex Removed.
-Melee Blocking -> Strength/8+Luk/40
-Ranged Blocking-> Dexterity/8+Luk/40
-Magic Blocking-> Intelligence/8+Luk/40


~This means mainstat provides blocking to said mainstat only, and hybridizing decisions give you more blocking to that mainstat. Hybrids already will lack weapon-type specialization, and the counter to this is higher defense. That's the trade-off. You would still have lower blocking to 1 mainstat (the one you didn't train), but you could still train all 3 if you wanted



BTH
- Melee/Ranged/Magic all have Mainstat/10+Luk/20 for BTH
- Pets and Guests CHarisma/10+Luk/20 for BTH
- Charisma Weapons- CHAR/10+Luk/20 for BTH


~Since Mainstat gains blocking, it will have a lowered role in overall BTH slightly. Luck needs a greater role on BTH since it takes on a lower roll in blocking. This makes luck the slightly offensive leaning secondary, but with some minor defensive help. This means that you have two END builds. Pure Build (Mainstat/END/LUCK) retains max BTH, has max blocking to 1 mainstat, but counters lack of overall blocking with more HP's. That's the trade-off. . The other END builds will LOSE BTH, and thus, OFFENSE. You will instead, choose to become a Tank hybrid (2 mainstats, END) or an higher BTH, higher blocking hybrid (2 mainstats, Luck) but in both cases, you have some better overall blocking but not universal. Training END instead of luck means less BTH. That's the trade-off.

DAMAGE
- Ranged stat damage is reduced to equal overall damage as mages use magic weapons. I will explain at the bottom, in the Ranger Niche.
-Melee/Magic remains as-is
-Charisma weapons-remains as-is
-Melee damage remains as proposed by staff


~The reason for the decreased damage with Ranged is INT/DEX hybrids will out-perform everyone if Ranged damage is left as-is, and then there's little downside to this build.

EXTRAS
- All weapon attacks gain +STR/160 to damage (very roughly a 2.5% Melee damage boost)
- Initiative is now based on LUK + DEX/2 + STR/2 + INT/2
- +END/50 status resistance.- All END players get this.



~These are currently there and should remain.

NEW END-BASED EXTRAS
The following Extras are based on what mainstat you trained WITH END.
- If you trained STR+END, the player gains +X% as a damage reducer. <--Warriors are more "hardy"
- If you trained INT + END, the player gains +X% to HP healing. <-- Mages utilize magical things
- If you trained DEX + END, the player gains +X% Universal blocking. <-- Rangers fight from a distance, and can see attacks coming better.
"X%" is a quantifiable Melee % power number to make all effects equal.


~This provides for flavor based on build, but also revitalizes training END.


RANGER NICHE

I believe somewhere, somehow staff needs to gives initiative a *mostly* Ranger thing. I think they intend this, and this is great. I would like to point out that the proposal assumes this.


- Revisited from above-> Ranged stat damage is reduced to equal overall damage as mages use with magic weapons.
- Rangers will become "Skill-Casters", where they will rely on

A. The creation of the "Ranger Quick Casts" set of skills.
a. Damage increase Imbues
b. Status Affect Imbues
Examples- Terror skill, Sneak skill, etc all those skills from Warrior's Tower, but designed for Rangers with lower SP costs and DEXT-based inflict.

B. Ranger Quick Cast Skills meant for Ranged Users Gain an SP-Cost discount , an amount staff thinks is best, to enable skill-casting far more often. This will be designed to make up for damage lost compared to warriors/mages, and if done right, will catch them up.
a. This means they can attach status w/o damage penalties as they're using SP to pay for it.
b. Stackable usage. Imbue terror and imbue a damage element locked add on all in one, if you want to.
c. Status effect inflict can be coded as DEXT major, always.
d. Just as a standard 653 MP was designed for Mages, these designed for Ranger will have vastly lower SP costs to enable a mathematical standard usage for a number of turns over a proposed model, just like with warriors and mages.

C. Staff creates several new quick cast imbue ideas that only work with Ranged weapons, or by making them DEX major inflict based, would only be beneficial using with DEXT trained players.. They can still make universal stuff, but this would be a new direction just like spells are meant for Mages mostly.

D. Attach initiative to all 100 Proc Bows

VALUE OF THIS APPROACH FOR RANGERS

~ INT/DEX Hybrids could attempt some of these things, but spell slots are not infinite and the trade off is spell slot decisions. This hybrid likely will not go straight spells or straight Ranger quick casts.

~ This means nothing drastic as far as going through and redesigning old stuff. Just some edits to bows that are not hugely plentiful compared to other types. This is a build-out from scratch with an all-new aesthetic, so it eases the workload on staff.

~ In addition, most mechanics already exist, so no new learnings or buggy unforeseen stuff. Just a newly designed standard for Ranger damage that incorporates roughly 75% Melee + Quick Cast Imbue system that ranges from huge damage increases, hypercrits, multiple statuses, ele locked imbues, and anything else they can create.




I truly believe this is the niche that works for all, and creates real balance.




Zork Knight -> RE: =AQ= Stat and Training Overhaul (4/15/2022 23:58:44)

Considering we are assumed to have a 15% dodge rate regardless of build, what if we added level to the MRM formula in a way such that just by being level 150 you get the sufficient blocking to reach the assumed value?

Level/4 would add the same amount of blocking DEX/10+LUK/20 add, which are what you currently need to reach the assumed 15% dodge rate.




Sphinx Jevoha -> RE: =AQ= Stat and Training Overhaul (4/18/2022 11:56:41)



Endurance (END) is still the most useless stat in the entire game. Simply giving a tiny resist chance against some one-in-a-blue-moon status inflict isn't going to make it comparable.

Most of the status effects inflicted by mobs are burns or poisons, which already deal tiny damage because they are usually of the same element as the mob itself, and you're wearing the same armor element.

A simple solution?


Make END reduce incoming damage. At 250 END, 25% less incoming damage. Now that's far more useful.




Primate Murder -> RE: =AQ= Stat and Training Overhaul (4/18/2022 22:34:13)

@ Sphinx

That simply doubles down on the same thing End already does (increase your survivability), but without the additional benefit of converting it into damage via Essence Orb. I don't think it really solves anything.

To be frank, Endurance, mathematically, is already overpowered. I don't think the stat needs buffing so much as it needs items that use it. At this point, End is the single most underutilized stat when it comes to equipment - outside of Backlash, it has, what, four or five items that rely on it?




Wingman -> RE: =AQ= Stat and Training Overhaul (5/14/2022 5:21:54)

quote:


Removal of all required battles for Training and Untraining.


I think for immersion you should need to train w/ the trainers at least a few times before you're given the option to skip the fights & go right to the number-punching.




tommybot -> RE: =AQ= Stat and Training Overhaul (5/20/2022 23:41:54)

I agree wingman

FIRST Post since hiatus...

happy to be back and thank you OG daren estate for the Z-token boost!




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