RE: Is MQ Dying II+How Can We Improve It?


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11/22/2010 20:16:48

ZamuelNow
Constructive

quote:

I'd like to point out that SCMM's are the last true consistant SC only perk left in the game, besides star ship houses.

quote:

The problem with this is that it significantly reduces the incentive to upgrade at all.

These are valid points on the other end of the spectrum. The issue is less of hate of the SCMMs themselves but rather crossing our fingers and doing a mystic shaman dance in the hopes that fewer SCMMs means more content. Braddock Steele's SC only story chain isn't finished, the whole Armada concept is apparently on the back burner somewhere, and a lot of stuff for NSCs and SCs alike could stand to be done with GEARS. The argument is that getting this stuff done helps everyone while SCMMs only help the people who were there that month.

It's arguably a fine line. Helping one group shouldn't require undermining another. However, something has to be done. Hopefully a hiatus will jumpstart the rest of the game and will allow the SCMMs a chance to come back cooler than ever. It would be nice if Ghost, Tomix, or any of the other DF animation staff could stick their head in and help out for at least a week or so.

Post #: 576

11/22/2010 20:51:25

Knoodlesguy
Member

well, as i stated earlier, and your right ZamuelNow, limiting the SCMM and hoping it would help won't do anything really. I remember when we had a minor weekly release, a major weekly release, and any holiday releases weren't postponed until the coming friday, if the holiday was on tuesday, then that release was right there. Most of that has been cut and reduced, but i don't think it was due to the SCMM, after all, it's only one mech a month. My theory, like it or not, is that with the massive onslaught of new AE games, their productivity was cut into fractions. But they can't slow other games to benifit mechquest, so this is the worst case scenario, since if this was the case, there wouldn't be much to do about it.
I have a hard time believing that all these releases on major release Friday becoming minor releases and minor release Wednesday being removed is because of one mech a month. they've been making cut scenes and new promo mechs for weeks also, that has probably damaged their free time to make releases. Also, i believe their rush to fill the galaxy with planets while leaving so many other planets half finished has some play in this to. Im still waiting for Lagos to be colonized by Arthuria, or was that war just to kill time? And Necryptos has two npcs, they way Han Velsing and Dimitry spoke, there's a whole town of terrified villagers.

< Message edited by Knoodlesguy -- 11/22/2010 20:54:59 >

AQW

Post #: 577

11/22/2010 20:57:40

Morphling13
Member

quote:

It's arguably a fine line. Helping one group shouldn't require undermining another.

I agree.

I think my suggestion of nsc mecha each month that upgrade into a scmm if you are
a sc or become one later in a frakenmecha like fashion(I need to make up a term for that)
will not hurt sc the way less scmm would. It will however encourage nsc players not to quit
and later upgrade to sc. It is safe to assume most people do not upgrade to sc the first day
they play. Therefore when they are nsc and have level gaps with no mecha, they have two
options. They could say well I have no good mecha for the next several level so I will upgrade.
Or they could say well I have no good mecha for the next several level and I cannot not
upgrade right now so I will play some other game. They then do not return.

I am not saying my idea will solve all problems, but I think it is a good first step to get more
long term players and customers.

MQ	Post #: 578

11/22/2010 21:44:22

forumlogin
Member

@Morphling
I'm taking NaturallyMaria's stance on that. :/
Thing is, unwrapped/wrapped or weaker/stronger, people probably won't care as long as they have some version.
I also don't see how it helps anything. We're still churning out more rares each month, the only difference is that NSCs can now access some rares.

quote:

well, as i stated earlier, and your right ZamuelNow, limiting the SCMM and hoping it would help won't do anything really. I remember when we had a minor weekly release, a major weekly release, and any holiday releases weren't postponed until the coming friday, if the holiday was on tuesday, then that release was right there. Most of that has been cut and reduced, but i don't think it was due to the SCMM, after all, it's only one mech a month. My theory, like it or not, is that with the massive onslaught of new AE games, their productivity was cut into fractions. But they can't slow other games to benifit mechquest, so this is the worst case scenario, since if this was the case, there wouldn't be much to do about it.
I have a hard time believing that all these releases on major release Friday becoming minor releases and minor release Wednesday being removed is because of one mech a month. they've been making cut scenes and new promo mechs for weeks also, that has probably damaged their free time to make releases. Also, i believe their rush to fill the galaxy with planets while leaving so many other planets half finished has some play in this to. Im still waiting for Lagos to be colonized by Arthuria, or was that war just to kill time? And Necryptos has two npcs, they way Han Velsing and Dimitry spoke, there's a whole town of terrified villagers.

Are you sure about the first part? Korin has said the SCMMs do take a ton of work to code--the time needed to complete an SCMM may be turned to more lasting enterprises. It is true that it's one of the few SC perks, though. >_>
SCs don't get much in this game. I think it'd be best, however, if they got something permanent. Not to mention Braddock Steele's quest chain still needs updates.

Post #: 579

11/22/2010 22:19:10

ZamuelNow
Constructive

quote:

Are you sure about the first part? Korin has said the SCMMs do take a ton of work to code

Yeah, this was going through my head. There's two things to note here. First, some SCMMs more or less require entirely new concepts to the game while I doubt the same can be said of some of the AQW classes. Second, there's simple issues of manpower. Even if AQW classes do require more work, it wouldn't surprise me if AQW's team is 3 times as big as MQ's. I have no clue on the exact numbers but it's a known fact that it is large.

Post #: 580

11/23/2010 0:10:07

Knoodlesguy
Member

@ZamuelNow
exactly, the releases began shrinking around the time many new games were being made, but that can't be helped. I was playing this game near the time it was first made, and in the first year, there was a huge amount of progress, i have the 1st anniversary volt thorn to prove it. In the first year, a huge amount of mechs were made, the houses were, they were working on new concepts then and got great results. Do you really think releasing 12 mechs a year can hinder the team that much, and the new concepts your talking about, i fail to see that much in the new SCMM. In some of nemesis's attacks, there really is no effect, an basically, the last few SCMM have been creative, yet by theory, basic. New concepts, i see them in the Chronos Mech, not an SCMM, i see new concepts in the Dark lord mechula, requiring a vampire uniform. I see new concepts in alot of non SCMMs, yet none of them seem to be the pointed out as the culprit.

AQW

Post #: 581

11/23/2010 0:53:32

Shocka
Member

The reasons Mechquest is failing:
SCMM- meh, get lame after a while
Holidays reused- Stop re-releasing old content and make new one!
Lack of difficulty- nothing hard, nothing new
Lack of interesting story- nothing immersing, right now we are just chillin and beating releases after releases
Overall, nothing fun...try and add a Live PvP=Endless Hours of Fun battling unique players which different mechs and new challenges. ENDLESS- won't get bored. Spend some time on this live feature. 20 second turns. Regular credit wins. Maybe some ranks. No shops. We don't really need more weapons.

AQW

Epic

Post #: 582

11/23/2010 7:52:08

Morphling13
Member

@forumlogin

quote:

I'm taking NaturallyMaria's stance on that. :/
Thing is, unwrapped/wrapped or weaker/stronger, people probably won't care as long as they have some version.
I also don't see how it helps anything. We're still churning out more rares each month, the only difference is that NSCs can now access some rares.

I know it will do nothing for less rare more nonrare problem. But the
nsc will always a mecha option for what ever level that are close to, it
will fix the nsc mecha gap without taking a whole lot of time from other
stuff. It also is not more rares it is the same 1 rare each month.

Also if the root problem with the releases is lack of staff because of
so many new games, then if the games start doing good business then
they may hire more people.

< Message edited by Morphling13 -- 11/23/2010 7:55:47 >

MQ	Post #: 583

11/23/2010 12:24:38

Knoodlesguy
Member

Exactly! Just a Morphling13 stated. Thats why releasing to many free player benefits won't help the situation. Between the dragon gaurd special offers, the hero mart items with special offers, and starcaptain and novagem offers, they should start making a little more money, especially with the new chronos mech. The staff's been divided into so many games, and a new one is jus being released. I'm not against a NSCMM, but it has to be extremely weaker or without various abilities such as buffs, that way people will still upgrade, or they will be content with their current power and in a rebellious sense, choose to stay free. I did that for years til i was upgraded as a Christmas gift.

AQW

Post #: 584

11/23/2010 13:15:43

EinhanderX01
Member

quote:

SCMM- meh, get lame after a while

That's because the latest all are pretty balanced; some to the point of being overbalanced, and they have nothing that made previous SCMMs OP; which was overspecialization. Seriously, when have we had sequel mechs to the Reaper (DoT Centric), the BC (Part Destruction/Disabling Centered), or even the Psychic-Wing (Perma-Specials)? We were lucky to get an above average sequel to the Aegis, in the form of the AC, but most of the mechs released after are all weaker to middling variations of the Strider.

quote:

Holidays reused- Stop re-releasing old content and make new one!

Re-releasing old Holidays for replay aren't bad. It does provide access to otherwise Rare content and allows for a variety of Rare choices to choose from. The issue is that lately, with the MQ Staff being understaffed and overworked, releases in general have shrunk to a minimum, with is noticable with the small Mogloween Release, which didn't even focus on a bit more of Mortis' storyline. Granted, it still had some nice things in it, but the quality doesn't make up for the quantity. And this Thanksgiving release didn't even have a single weapon update; being a complete redo of last year's.

quote:

Lack of difficulty- nothing hard, nothing new

It's a combination of lack of "smart" enemies, like the Trog and Lava Monsters, and the occasional tough enemy, like the Jawseph. If more of the enemies did have pre-programmed attack orders; and several variations of each, to start a round with, it wouldn't be so bad. Of course, this is worse for SCs in general, but it can't be helped.

Post #: 585

11/23/2010 14:02:12

CHAIML
Member

quote:

Holidays reused- Stop re-releasing old content and make new one!

That would be my number 1 complaint as well.

Post #: 586

11/23/2010 16:03:49

Knoodlesguy
Member

i really don't have that much to complain about reusing old holiday stuff, if they would rebalance most of it a little. Like the frankenmech, it has been used since the first Halloween and has been given new specials and rebalancings each time, making it a stable mech for all players, and the new rockin werewolf mechs that are rebalanced remakes of the old ones with higher lv.s, i love that deal. i can only complain about the thanksgiving content really. If they would buff the old weapons up to new standards, and maybe throw a little new in, that would solve alot, in my opinion.

AQW

Post #: 587

11/23/2010 16:08:03

stealthwings
Helpful

They already are at todays standards. Besides some, which weren't very good when they were first released.

The Mecha fryer and the baster though, are still just as good as they were last year.

Post #: 588

11/23/2010 20:03:36

forumlogin
Member

quote:

The reasons Mechquest is failing:
SCMM- meh, get lame after a while
Holidays reused- Stop re-releasing old content and make new one!
Lack of difficulty- nothing hard, nothing new
Lack of interesting story- nothing immersing, right now we are just chillin and beating releases after releases
Overall, nothing fun...try and add a Live PvP=Endless Hours of Fun battling unique players which different mechs and new challenges. ENDLESS- won't get bored. Spend some time on this live feature. 20 second turns. Regular credit wins. Maybe some ranks. No shops. We don't really need more weapons.

1. Making bimonthlies may be able to fix that, but it's arguable. 1 thing I'd like to mention: during the release of the Reaper (or Aegis, don't really remember), it was delayed due to the fact 2+ new mecha were also being made--I can remember the 4oJ and the Arthurian War rewards. Chances are, these extra 12 mechs do take off a lot of time that could be spent on other matters.
2. I'd like new, but I don't think we need so much difficulty. :/
I hear a lot about how Necryptos was an apparent improvement--what I remember, however, was the massive amount of threads that popped up about the Mechskeeto and the like. Harder does not necessarily equal better, IMO.
3. True. :P

quote:

I know it will do nothing for less rare more nonrare problem. But the
nsc will always a mecha option for what ever level that are close to, it
will fix the nsc mecha gap without taking a whole lot of time from other
stuff. It also is not more rares it is the same 1 rare each month.

Also if the root problem with the releases is lack of staff because of
so many new games, then if the games start doing good business then
they may hire more people.

1. Again, still not sure how much incentive it'd provide for update. For example, I'm satisfied with my NSC Pirate Raider--I don't feel the need to get actual shoulder specs by paying $20. Likewise, I doubt people would feel the need to upgrade even with a weaker SCMM version--if it's good enough, why bother with upgrades?
2. Which equals 1 more rare to add to the ever-growing list each month.
3. And the underlying question is: Will this increase business? I don't think so.

Post #: 589

11/23/2010 20:30:30

DRAGONHUNT
Member

From your quote of what Fexy said on the last line. I think AE doesn't really care about MQ, but it is weird how DF has MQ sounds.

AE, PLEASE LISTEN TO THESE PEOPLE!!!!!!!!!!!

Please refrain from using font size over 3. Any larger and it is considered spam. For more information, please read the =AE= Comprehensive Forum Rules > Posting Behavior > Do Not Spam. ~Clyde

< Message edited by Clyde -- 11/23/2010 21:03:52 >

Epic

Post #: 590

11/23/2010 20:40:45

NaturallyMaria
Ebil Empress

Honestly, I really don't think an ever-growing list of rares is problem from a business standpoint. There's 1000+ MQ players on at any given time, and what, maybe 30-50 regular forum posters at most? The vast majority of players probably aren't even aware of a whole history of rares. What matters is the variety that's available RIGHT NOW.

MQ	Post #: 591

11/23/2010 21:15:30

The Game
Pegasus Overlord

I still maintain that the SCMM concept needs an overhaul, at least in regards to mindset and intention. Because, honestly, if losing the SCMM perk works to decrease incentive for upgrading, something is seriously wrong with MQ. One isolated concept should not have that much bearing on the holistic quality of MQ, and I believe this is the problem. When last I played, the incentive to upgrade was isolated to the SCMMs and simply better equipment as a whole. While this in and of itself is not the issue, the dichotomy in power between SC and NSC equipment is apparent on paper, but largely absent in practice. Since most enemies can be overcome through NSC equipment, the value of SC equipment is then minimized. There might be more worthy enemies in today's MQ then when I played not too long ago, but even then, why should I bother with better equipment? Even if SC equipment would allow me to defeat an enemy I couldn't defeat as a NSC, what is the point, really? Is there a storyline payoff that is worth the SC equipment? Aside from the Arthurian vs. Pirate saga, I am not confident in MQ's ability to make me care the way AQ and DF makes me care for the stories. And it's a real shame, because MQ was my favorite out of the AE games. For some reason, the novelty of smashing mechs, for me, made grinding for levels more bearable.

[Edit]: I probably overstated the issue of SC equipment. I don't think SC equipment is the issue. NG equipment would probably be a better section of equipment to ponder.

< Message edited by The Game -- 11/23/2010 22:50:03 >

AQ	Post #: 592

11/24/2010 0:02:21

EinhanderX01
Member

Honestly, there isn't much to upgrade to SC besides better equipment, free travel which also doubles a free "House" (the Starship), and the uniquely designed SCMMs.

SC-Only missions are far and few, and are mostly restricted to just adding extra kills to a War meter, and SCs lost the perk of being able to Preview Planets before the rest of the players. Necryptos was a rushed release (and it still is; when you consider that there was zero preamble and still zero introduction to it; unlike Lagos), and Yokai also was a rather straightforward release.

Honestly, SCMMs wouldn't have had to be as special as they're considered currently, nor would have been needed every month, if there was at least some other SC-Only content. For example, had Necryptos been allowed a Preview, the Staff could have used both the input and the time to help setup a proper Intro, and give some extra SC-Only rewards (one or even 2 mechs; like the Lagos Preview) in lieu of an SCMM for a month or two (and would've allowed time to properly plan out the next SCMM). Same goes for Yokai. While it had an Intro, allowing SCs to preview it would've provided some additional feedback so that it better flows, and would allow more setup and background of the Resistance group instead of just going with what text explanation we got (in addition to a new mech or two).

Another example would be some dedication to SC-Only sidestory plots involving Braddock and his missions to try and help break up the ShS command structure or the ShS control over key areas by destroying or disabling bases, battle tough ShS Commanders (also serving as a nice level-specific challenge every few missions), or retaking lost territory. Rewards would range from nice SC-only equipment of both Solunian or ShS design to a full mech (or even a solid Build-A-Mech).

Post #: 593

11/24/2010 8:13:09

Pyronix15
Member

Ok, I just have to say, can we please simplify and shorten our posts? I understand were all articulate enough to write strongly worded arguments. but its hard to pay attention to every post when there all half a page long with such tiny text bunched up. Simple words, simple points, preferably bullet points for effectiveness. =P

A while back, I heard someone (an AK I think) suggest an idea that instead of SCMM mechs, we could get a set of weapons.

I think this is perfect what the problem entails.

SCMM's are boring when all the right parts come with them, and the problem before them was that most of the best equipment was NG only.

So, once a month we get maybe 2-5 weapons out of a shop, that scale 1-45, the weapons have the general theme about them (healing, stun locks, ect.)

Less work for the staff, more playtime for players looking to customize, and SC's still retain there last strategic advantage over NCS's.

Win-Win-Win, yes?

Post #: 594

11/24/2010 8:33:38

BILF BELF
Member

SCMM are a perk that I don't think should be changed. I am a SC, meaning I "bought" into the game. Thus the SCMM is my reward for supporting MQ with my actual $$. A Weapon set in stead of a monthly Mecha? They better be epic weapons to replace a Mecha each month. I don't think that is a good solution to the supposed SCMM problem. The staff still managed to make SCMM mechas while being short on people power these last two times, albeit I found them lacking a bit but not because the MQ team is understaffed, maybe they just were not that inspired or rushed when the created the last 2 SCMM. I am still not convinced that the SCMM is the biggest problem with MQ. I believe its about getting back to the story line and providing rich content for the players to enjoy. MQ is behind most other AE games in regards to its story.

_____________________________

When the demon is at your door,
In the morning it won't be there no more...
Any major dude will tell you.

Post #: 595

11/24/2010 10:35:41

stealthwings
Helpful

@Pyronix
1. That is an excellent idea in MY opinion. I would love that to happen
2. Most players will only buy weapons if they fit the theme of an available mecha. Most players would probably prefer SCMM. Also, looks are what get the upgrades, not as many people would upgrade for some weapons which don't fit the theme of any mecha.
3. Inventory space?

I would love it though, since I like to customize, and don't really care about looks.

Post #: 596

11/24/2010 12:01:03

ZamuelNow
Constructive

quote:

Thus the SCMM is my reward for supporting MQ with my actual $$.

The Game made a valid point that there's something fundamentally wrong if SCMMs are the only thing to look forward to with a SC upgrade. And that's not meant to be a jab at you or anything BILF, just something to ponder and brainstorm.

Post #: 597

11/24/2010 12:42:26

BILF BELF
Member

@ZamuelNow Sniff*Sniff, my brain is burning from storming!!! Aaggh!!

Well I could have been clearer. They are not the only thing to upgrade for, far from it but I do think it is a big part of the reason people upgrade to SC. When I first started playing that was the first thing that made me want to upgrade. That big button that reads Monthly Rares caught my eye, plus that dang blimp. Then I started looking at the SC only weapons and SC only quests, free travel, etc. The whole deal made sense to me to upgrade (plus the Dragonguard gear is also a good incentive) and the $$ helps MQ and AE. I agree with somethings @The Game wrote. I still do not think the SCMM or SC only gear etc. is the whole of MQ problems or makes for a lack of incentive to upgrade but it seems lots of folks want to blame it on that. SC weapons/gear are better than NSC by a decent margin. I always believed upgrading helped the overall cause of the game (in the real world). I am sorta new to the game as to some of you whom have been playing for years and know what it was like in the beginning before SCMM, and many of the changes made to the game that are here at this time. Maybe I am just spoiled and used to the way MQ is now and don't get all the bother with SCMM and what not. I will keep pondering Zamuel.... btw, I am for Bi-Monthly SC mechas but to eliminate them entirely would be bad IMO.

< Message edited by BILF BELF -- 11/24/2010 13:03:25 >

Post #: 598

11/24/2010 13:32:41

Ryu Viranesh
Member

BILF, they're clearly not the only thing in the game that needs to be looked at, but at the same time they're not exempt from being considered one of the many problems with Mechquest at the time. It's not even that the mecha themselves are a considerable problem, though I do wish they'd go back to the specialization style if they're going to keep using them as those at least filled necessary niches in the game and stuck to the theme of their names, but I digress. The real problem is that they're a large part of the reason to upgrade to SC at the moment; a single piece of equipment being one of the deciding factors to spend your money on an upgrade that's supposed to give you so much more just doesn't seem right. Yet, the extremely low amount of SC-only quests, storyline, and the loss of the Planetary previews have made it so. Compared with the other bonuses of upgrading to SC: The equipment and the Starship, the unique, specially designed SCMM seem pretty appealing now don't they. Like Ein, I do believe that they need to focus on other areas of SC content, and reducing the SCMM to bimonthly may just give them a little more time to do so, although I'm not too optimistic that it'll be that easy.

There remain other problems with the game as a whole that need fixing before the SC issues can even really begin to be looked at in detail, namely the Storyline, since in my eyes that's currently the largest issue in Mechquest. Putting continuity and such aside, I have to say that I find a lot of the stories from AEs sister games (AQ and DF) to grip me and pull me in a lot more than MQs has in a long time. I think that it definitely could be better than either of those if it's handled carefully and is well thought out, since there's a lot of potential that remains untapped in the mecha genre of this game. That's not even all that can be tapped, but it would definitely help; if the story had characterization, emotional depth and fused these two with a solid, mostly serious plot, I think most would be surprised how many people it would bring in. Since good storyline really does have a great effect on whether or not others will play a game, just take a look at AQ and DF. If they can manage to make such a change here, then they could start to focus on the more mechanical issues of the game such as the issue of incentive for Star Capaincy and the balancing of the game's equipment.

I know that a lot of this has likely all been said before, but that doesn't make it any less important an issue because unless it's looked at and given the care that it needs...I'm actually worried for Mechquest. Since if the game continues on as it's going I'm not sure whether it will really be able to continue attracting people and maintain a steady playerbase. It's been a long time since I've posted on here, and already many of the faces that I was familiar with in MQ GD have vanished; I don't want that to keep happening if it can be avoided, and I'm sure that it can be. Although it all really comes down to the issue of the staff implementing fixes for the problems and having the manpower to do so, I do hope that they'll at least take a look at this thread and consider what we've all been saying, since I know that they want this game to be the best that it can be as well. Is there really any reason that we can't put our heads together and figure out how to give MechQuest the attention it desperately needs so that it can become a game that we can all be proud of, both the staff who build it, and those of us who play it.

-Ryu

< Message edited by Ryu Viranesh -- 11/24/2010 13:51:27 >

Post #: 599

11/24/2010 14:00:23

BILF BELF
Member

Oh I totally agree that the story needs to continue and be the focus and that the SC issues can wait for now. I know they are working on it (the story) as best they can and I have faith that it will be worth the wait when it is finally released. While the lack of SC only quests never really bothered me I agree with what you are saying @Ryu. It would bring a bigger incentive to upgrade if more SC only quests were offered etc.. (In DF upgrading does seem to open a lot more quests/items when compared with MQ.) Planetary Previews were before my time. Its sounds interesting though. A lot of great ideas have been written on this thread and I do think it helps the staff to read what we have to say, good or bad.

Post #: 600

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