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RE: =ED= Balance Discussion Thread

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3/6/2012 1:07:05   
kittycat
Member

You are right on that, but the thing is the chance of blocking a stat debuff should be around 3-5%. It should only happen on average of 1 time per 30 turns.
AQ MQ  Post #: 451
3/6/2012 2:41:57   
Prime Assassin
Banned

 

 malf does nothing let them keep malf. emp is the prob. and plasma armour.
Post #: 452
3/6/2012 3:44:50   
Zeoth
Member

Well I'm finally back and I'm going to start preaching my old theory again.
Just remove PA as I was preaching that in the start of this thread. Give CHs technician back and restore SC to its normal percentages.
I also agree with many of Trans/Voids skill suggestion. Would be very nice to see a few implemented
Post #: 453
3/6/2012 3:48:46   
drinde
Member

Found a very simple solution to power builds:

You can only have 1 STR Enhancement on any piece of equipment.

< Message edited by drinde -- 3/6/2012 3:50:36 >
DF MQ Epic  Post #: 454
3/6/2012 3:51:03   
Zeoth
Member

^
Haha man. Spamming dex and tech could be power builds now. Doesn't seem to matter >_>
Post #: 455
3/6/2012 3:52:52   
drinde
Member

^
Hmm. Make this?

Equipment Enhancing must be sequenced. So, for it to reach +1 TECH, you would have to add +1 STR and +1 DEX.

ENH Rotation Sequence: STR-DEX-TECH-SUPP.
DF MQ Epic  Post #: 456
3/6/2012 3:58:52   
Zeoth
Member

I suppose you could do that but I feel that would push to much towards focus for optimal use of stats. The best issue would be to remove enhancements completely but that won't happen. Oh well I'll think on it
Post #: 457
3/6/2012 6:48:12   
Luna_moonraider
Member

@ drinde

your idea will basically force every1 to use 5 focus builds and we do not want 5 focus build to be the only build usable.

Back to topic:

emp has been oped since idk when it does not have a wep requirement it does not have a stat requirement and it is unblock-able. it is clearly the best energy drain in game. idk y the devs do not wanna nerf it but since emp is the key to beating the annoying casters and many other builds which are energy reliant i do hope they dont nerf emp because without emp caster build and energy reliant builds would take over the game as there is no way of stopping them. well i would say adding another turn on emp cool-down would be a good nerf but i would disagree with the nerfing by adding stat requirement. stat requirement dont affect 5 focus builds so it be useless to put a stat requirement on emp.



_____________________________
AQW Epic  Post #: 458
3/6/2012 8:44:16   
drinde
Member

@Luna

What about the 1st idea?

Also:

Assault/Azrael, Nerf the Nerf Nerf

Right, here is what I suggest:

When someone is smoked. It becomes this:

DEX: 45 + 22 [-30]

And she uses Assault (Change happens):

DEX: 45 + 22 [-30] [+24]

Basically the same thing, but with a difference.

I forgot the significance of this, but will post it in a few days/hours if I remember.

Azrael:

DEX: 45 + 22 [+30]

Heart Attack hits.

DEX: 45 + 22 [+30] [-24]

Assault Reboots:

DEX: 45 + 22 [+30] [-4]

So, whoever uses the BOT Special first, has a disadvantage if the opponent has a "counter" BOT.

Also: Heart Attack should NOT deal DMG as this nerfs AND adds rage simultaneously.
DF MQ Epic  Post #: 459
3/6/2012 8:47:37   
IsaiahtheMage
Member

@drinde Assualt Bot can't debuff the Azrael Bot's special. If it did I would have heard it by now. Besides that is why the Azrael Bot is OP.
AQW Epic  Post #: 460
3/6/2012 8:51:32   
ngshuyi94
Member

^ Its a suggestion, not what is happening in-game.

_____________________________

Seven Stars - Seven Heaven
My Character Webpage! =D
http://epicduel.artix.com/charpage.asp?id=ngshuyi

Epic  Post #: 461
3/6/2012 8:51:44   
drinde
Member

^
Thats my Idea. Both BOTs can debuff each other. Lol.

EDIT: Ngshuyi-jaed.

< Message edited by drinde -- 3/6/2012 8:52:27 >
DF MQ Epic  Post #: 462
3/6/2012 8:53:46   
Ranloth
Banned


 I put idea about Bots having debuff lowered to 60% and useable once per turn. Currently many strategies are destroyed by them or makes skill useless.
Also what would people say about making Bots improve solely by Tech? It could be abused but there'd be diminishing so you cannot abuse it and surely bots shouldn't be restricted to just Focus 4 or 5.
I can provide numbers later though if anyone's interested! :)

@Zeoth
Thanks, I'm trying my best with skills. XD
AQ Epic  Post #: 463
3/6/2012 8:54:31   
Luna_moonraider
Member

@ drinde

your 2nd idea is 100% a no no for me.i do not quite understand your first idea do u mean +1 str on every wep or only 1 wep can have all its enh slot placed into str. well u can set a limit on the stat eg the limit for str/support is 3 enhancements slots only.this can be annoying at times but it limits stat abusing.

@ trans

caster mages will be even more annoying i m not saying they are oped just annoying if u make bots totally improving with just tech. focus is there to limit the abuse of bot so that not all build can abuse bot.

< Message edited by Luna_moonraider -- 3/6/2012 9:02:40 >
AQW Epic  Post #: 464
3/6/2012 9:06:59   
Ranloth
Banned


 Yup I know that, that's why I said numbers later as I can't think of any at school nor think how to make it balanced for all. Penalities would also be there for abusive Tech so it isn't just simple idea. :P
Scratch that, I seen few problems that would be a bit bad with it so idea is a bit off, sorry!

< Message edited by Trans -- 3/6/2012 11:56:42 >
AQ Epic  Post #: 465
3/6/2012 10:15:47   
BlueKatz
Member

I have an idea. We should be able to use Buff/Debuff skill as long as it cooldown. Mean if I use Maf, then I can use Maf when it finishes the cooldown. It won't stack - but just renew.
Skills cost MP so using this won't be game breaking. However some classes and many build have specific timing and the Bots ruined them all. If they nerf by buff/debuff I should be able to completely renew it without waiting AND get nerfed again.

I still play transitional TM style and this Nerf Bots really annoyed me. I could change to SC build but really... why kill the build?
AQ DF AQW Epic  Post #: 466
3/6/2012 11:14:06   
Remorse
Member

^ Agreed I see no harm in that,

But perhaps for the oppoenent's turn that it is renewed they arnt effected for that one turn until it is your turn agian.


Why?

Because the way debuffs work now is the oppoenent can get one attack in uneffected by skills such as intimidate/malf/smoke before they are able to cast it agian.
So if someone was to loop the debuff and use it continulessly it would be a bit unfair to the opponenet say if they were a technology techmage and the opponenet was constantly malfing with no end timing to get an uneffected attack in.

This way if you renew it the oppoenent still get the one uneffected turn and you still get the full 3 turns of debuff renewed.
NOTE: This means if you renew the skill rather it ending on your turn it would end on the oponenets turn as the first turn of effect will be postponed.

Why am I adding this?
Because I can see all the little problems with peoples ideas and posibly why the Devs wont implement it, just trying to help the idea and keep the game fair.
Which includes all the little minor details.

< Message edited by Remorse -- 3/6/2012 11:17:40 >
Epic  Post #: 467
3/6/2012 12:01:56   
Ranloth
Banned


 Void had this suggestion and mentioned it about buffers and nerfers:
Currently buffers take a turn and do nothing while nerfers debuff you + attack at same time. Would perhaps striking with buffers OR smoke to be applied only so no strike, be better?
As currently it's a wasted turn while nerfers get an advantage, on top of it if you debuff a nerfer then that's another turn wasted and even more damage taken. I'd go for nerfers being applied without a Strike and keep buffers how they are. If one attacks while other has to wait then the attack one is not fair as it gives same thing but nerf + damages you.
AQ Epic  Post #: 468
3/6/2012 12:03:29   
IsaiahtheMage
Member

@Trans Exactly.
AQW Epic  Post #: 469
3/6/2012 12:10:27   
Ranloth
Banned


 Hmm.
If Bot's debuff were to be reduced to about 60%; a lot of people will agree on lowering it and 60% seems fine, nerfers did not attack just like buffers but apply the effect, this could make some buffers a lot more useful. But also if you attack someone with buffer on (Dex/Tech buffer) and use Smoke, you technically debuff them and get even higher increase in Rage which is quite the advantage as you still striked which dealt damage.
I'm gonna put it on my list 2 pages back as that'll be my main suggestion post. :3
AQ Epic  Post #: 470
3/6/2012 12:14:45   
ND Mallet
Legendary AK!!!


 I suggest making the % debuffed improve with focus levels in increments of 15% each focus tier. So 5 focus will have the full 80% but 0 focus will have 5% debuffed. And before you say anything at all Remorse follow this train of logic. A 5 focus build has at least 45 in all stats. The highest base stat is around 23. The lowest is around 19. This means a 5 focus str build will have to invest around 90 points. The highest str boost you can get from enhancements and item stats together is 70 but it requires rare gear that few people have access to even today(very few Founders with Bunnyzookas are around still). So that's only 24-29 damage. Then you invest points into health(90 health, the average 5 focus build health) and you've spent over 110 stats. There are only 22 stats left to spend after getting 5 focus and health. SC got nerfed recently so less energy back so you will need to invest more into energy. TLMs have less incentive to use a Str build because they no longer have Smokescreen to improve their accuracy and damage. For both those classes, they will need to invest into energy/dex or have to deal with low leveled Malf usage/blocking. But what strength build has only 90 health? Not a very good one especially considering the items used for the 70 strength boost barely touch dex or resistance or support. They will suffer from deflections, blocks, criticals and just as crappy defense as other strength builds. Also, what would you rather fight, a str build with one focus that removes 20% of your shield while having 28+ damage ranges or a really crappy 5 focus strength build that removes 80% of your shield while only having 24-29 damage?
AQ DF MQ AQW Epic  Post #: 471
3/6/2012 12:20:00   
Ranloth
Banned


 ND, I like your idea as it seems like an interesting one but 80% has to change - number itself is too high no matter how you look at it and number of Focus 5 builds is also high so reducing it to 60% max is best.
And scaling is quite okay actually, but with 60% I'd say no debuff at Focus 0 (0% simply), Focus 1 - 15%, Focus 2 - 30%, Focus 3 - 40%, Focus 4 - 50%, Focus 5 - 60%.
It goes by 15% to encourage less stat abuse but more balanced stats so the increase is high early on. And at Focus 3 it's just 10% more which is a bit of a difference but not too big between Focus 4 and 5 as they are very close. It's still, debuff, strong and strategical so the more balanced stats the more use you have for the bot! :D
That's for Azrael and Assault Bot, as they both have 80%.
AQ Epic  Post #: 472
3/6/2012 13:09:09   
IsaiahtheMage
Member

@ND Mallet Then that would encourage everyone to use 5 focus builds. I don't wanna see everyone using the same type of builds that would be boring.
AQW Epic  Post #: 473
3/6/2012 13:46:22   
TurkishIncubus
Member

CH was OP and now balance team nerfed the only class that can beat it(TLM).

At beginning we all know TLM would lose one of Reroute-Hybrid- Smoke, and smoke gone.

Now CH should lose Plasma Armor-Static-Field medic, since field medic is not an option.Plasma armor should be removed.

1st of all there shouldnt be a Resist armor at all, because Dex Tanking is too power full with combined healloop due to high amount of blocking.

+ they also got EMP and Multi shot + shadow arts(3rd passive)

The logical action would be buffing Shadow arts this will both buff CH(after plasma armor removed) and BH. Just add 10% def/res ignore at Max Shadow arts , Shadow arts has to got a non luck related option (remove increasing stun %, nobody uses it) and add %def/res ignore.
Epic  Post #: 474
3/6/2012 13:50:29   
Stabilis
Member

^

We NEED a poll to count the percentage of players who wish no more of PA. My vote is for removing it.
AQ Epic  Post #: 475
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