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When A Game Stops Being Fun

 
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1/1/2013 11:28:25   
The Astral Fury
Member

Games, with over thousands of choices and thousands of features there's alot of competition, but theres one main idea that each company wants to have more of then any other and that's making the game fun. Let's face it when a game stops being fun, it's not a game and when this happends people get bored of it and quit. This is what Developers try to do, make their game really fun so people may play it. In this case I believe Epic Duel is the game losing that specfic quality and that needs to be addressed.

Let's organize the data into catagories, shall we?

1. Luck: Every game needs it, yet every player hates it. Before I make my point I totally agree that every pvp game needs a little luck, but it get's a little ridiculos to point where people want to quit. Yes I agree it's helped me win as many people as it helped me lost to them, but if I lose to a player I want to lose knowing I lost because of someones skill not, because they got a few crits and and a block. I mean I can't even play this game for fun anymore, always being worried if I'll be blocked or not, I just want to sit back and relax, but sadly I can't. It get's to a point where it isn't even luck if you get what I mean. Blocks, Crits, Deflec's are so frequant, there's even skills that increase your chance for luck. Yes lucks helped me out, but it just makes the game not fun for anyone.

Releases: I get that the staff can't release bundles of entertainment, but a new NPC, or a new 2v1 boss or even 2-3 missions is a nice weekly thing. How long has it been since a release (More than a month), yes they are working hard on Omega, but there's simply nothing to do, can't they give us something (Even if small) to please us, cause quite frankly I'm bored, I'm a consumer and I want more. I think since this is an online pvp game the staff don't feel obligated to put out a WEEKLY release, but we expetc it. I'm sorry if you think that's crazy, but I want a weekly release is that too much to ask?

- I'll update more if needed, Am I crazy, Do you agree somewhat anything to add.


DISSCUSS AWAY!

< Message edited by The Astral Fury -- 1/1/2013 11:30:16 >
DF AQW  Post #: 1
1/1/2013 11:36:55   
Remorse
Member

Games stop being fun for me when,

Builds that are effortless power spammers dominate, also forcing others to do the same to stand a chance effectively lowering the variety pool to power spammers or tanks.


Then what makes this horrible is Hardly any battles are fun, I dont find it fun losing to a player who attacks extremely high every turn, and despite trying many many things the best I can do to counter it is hope for luck.

The only time I get enjoyment in battles these days is when I play lower level account before players start using enhancements.

Thats why omega should be amazing for me since its solves this issue hopefully.
Epic  Post #: 2
1/1/2013 11:42:46   
The Astral Fury
Member

But it's funny, every time somes complains about balance, enchanments, features etc. People just totally ignore what the person said and just say... "DON'T WORRY EVERYTHING WILL BE FIXED IN OMEGA". They seem to think when Omega will solve every problem in ED will be gone, but I think the oppisite.

< Message edited by The Astral Fury -- 1/1/2013 11:43:10 >


_____________________________

DF AQW  Post #: 3
1/1/2013 11:47:20   
Remorse
Member

To put it very simply.

The game was pretty good, enhancements was released on amours and primaries, Game became average, enhancements released on gun+auxs, Game become horrible balance wise.


Why wouldn't removing the bonus stats enhancements like they plan in omega, fix it?

P.S Please dont make my explain how enhancements has ruined this game, Ive done it so many times its not funny..

< Message edited by Remorse -- 1/1/2013 11:51:01 >
Epic  Post #: 4
1/1/2013 12:09:47   
ND Mallet
Legendary AK!!!


1. So you want to win by luck but not lose by it? Luck is in the game so you can't go into a battle with someone your level and be right 100% of the time when you say "My build is better, I win." The fact that you feel that you're losing battles you should be winning and winning battles you should be losing means it's working. What fun is a battle if you know you already have it won if luck doesn't step in?

2. They often do release weekly unless it's a huge feature revamp where they have to rework old code to make it new. And NPCs are actually one of the longest releases the Devs can work on, depending on what they decide to do with it. If it's just art then they have to spend some time drawing it out in concept sketches, then actually flash it and then they have animate it. If it can fight then they have to spend time coming up with numbers for the stats and skills as well as balance testing to make sure it's reasonable to beat. Then that all comes with bug testing and fixing as well.

3. They say don't worry about balance because right now Omega WILL be turning balance on its head. And until we figure which way is rightside up again then it might be awhile for balance issues to pop up. Plus the majority of balance causing issues will be looked at which include health and getting so many stat points from your weapons.
AQ DF MQ AQW Epic  Post #: 5
1/1/2013 12:27:41   
The Astral Fury
Member

1. I never said I wanted to win by luck and not lose by it. All I'm saying is people don't like it and if they lose they want to lose knowing it was the build that beat then not measily luck, and that pisses people off when they know they could have won because their build is better. That's when a game stops being fun, but luck is too frequent in this game and I'm tired of all these blocks, crits and deflec's when I should have won. Honestly the only luck I want is first strike, either that or reduce the chances of the luck factors by 70% because if you want luck that's fine, but it's too frequent now and you lose many battles because of this. (Even though you win some). So I'm fine with luck, but it's so darn frequent that it starts to get ridiculos.

2. But they don't we haven't had a release in a month, and I dont care about Omega anymore I want a release because it's ridiculos were having to wait this long. And yes SOMETIMES they do WEEKLY releases, but many are delayed too and some just bug fixes a ai style. (Even though there helpful they don't offer any thing new to play).

< Message edited by The Astral Fury -- 1/1/2013 12:29:33 >
DF AQW  Post #: 6
1/1/2013 12:33:50   
DunkThatOreo
Member

Yes luck plays a huge roll in battles and its extremely hard to have fun battling these days but I remember in beta
blocks and crits would happen every other turn but people didn't get mad, they just laughed and had fun. This community is the main
reason this game is boring to the point where you (or atleast me) only log on every 5-10 days. Every single friend I ever had on
this game has left because duels are boring as looking at rocks and because no one can have fun these days. All about that win ratio.
Epic  Post #: 7
1/1/2013 12:40:35   
ND Mallet
Legendary AK!!!


1. I don't know about you but I find battles less fun when I know I'm going to win it. When the underdog wins though, that's what makes it extra fun. More fun than even a fair fight.

2. They can't release anything because the way releases are coded prevents them from releasing parts of anything. They cannot keep the old battle engine and release new missions to occupy us. The battle engine right now is in pieces and they're reassembling it. If they go ahead and roll a release live for us then chances are we'll be stuck with a mission that can't be done until Omega is released anyways. And while we wait we don't even get to battle anyone because the engine is broken. They CANNOT release anything right now.
AQ DF MQ AQW Epic  Post #: 8
1/1/2013 12:46:34   
The Astral Fury
Member

I know, but it'd be nice if they'd release a little war or something.
DF AQW  Post #: 9
1/1/2013 13:28:20   
Stabilis
Member

Fighting results ought to be determined by what action you choose to commit, not by deus ex machinima. The god of EpicDuel (teh holy rng), should mainly give small ranges of deviations in actions, not catastrophes (looking at you block chance and critical chance).

< Message edited by Depressed Void -- 1/1/2013 13:29:13 >
AQ Epic  Post #: 10
1/1/2013 14:32:24   
Xendran
Member

Block needs a massive nerf in terms of individual power.
AQ DF Epic  Post #: 11
1/1/2013 15:03:40   
Mother1
Member

For me a game stops being fun when Like remorse said when you need to rely on luck to win no matter what you do especially because someone is using a brainless strength spamming build that destroy's your defenses. It is even less fun when you beat that person and that person calls you bad names as well.

@ ND Mallet

Sadly some people don't see that as fun when someone they feel shouldn't beat them actually does. A good example is a fully powered varium player losing to a normal non varium. I personally would rather have a challenge then get a punching bag.
Epic  Post #: 12
1/1/2013 15:03:48   
Hun Kingq
Member

They need to put the equations back to what they were before they introduced Shadows Arts(time frame reference) When Dex really did matter because now trying to help players beat Armor Hazard, Admin 11, and Boothe is nearly to basically impossible due to lack of Blocking not saying you should block every turn but at least once or more than once would be nice.

I saw all three get more critical damage than they did in the past.

Deflections they deflect you left and right no matter how high your tech is.

Using Intimidation, Reflex Boost, and Energy shield did not make a difference.

Fix the equations and you will see the difference but leave the equations the same in Omega we will still have the same problems.

Here is the formula for block chance,
From Wiki
[Formula] Block Chance = 8% + (Defender's Dexterity - Attacker's Dexterity) / 2.5

old formula
From ED handbook (This formula shown that the amount of DEX made a difference in blocking Chance)
[Formula] Block Chance = 5% + (Defender's Dexterity - Attacker's Dexterity) / 4

Too added return the stat progression to what it was so it does not take that much points for dex and tech.

< Message edited by Hun Kingq -- 1/1/2013 15:49:18 >
Epic  Post #: 13
1/1/2013 15:26:51   
J.U.S.T.I.C.E.
Member

Omega just seems like its taking up too much time and was released at the wrong moment. If I were the dev's I would have been working on Omega [secretly] and not revealed any info. However, I would have released the frostvyle from last year to keep players occupied. By the time the war was over, 2/3weeks later Omega would be announced and released.
AQW Epic  Post #: 14
1/1/2013 15:49:47   
Mother1
Member

@ justice

So leaving us in the dark would have been better? This would have been unfair to the players especially those who didn't do the missions thinking they had time to do them, or collect the phase cheevo.
Epic  Post #: 15
1/1/2013 19:44:23   
Hard boy
Member

i didnt understand the individual part, could you clarify?
Epic  Post #: 16
1/1/2013 20:07:24   
Lycus
Legendary AdventureGuide!


I am going to have to lock this up I am afraid, since it is going to develop into arguments and flaming the Devs. However I will touch on a few things first:

Balance, we always love to have balance ideas, but right now speaking about it in the current state is not overly helpful and is verging on pointless. ND Mallet got it spot on, with Omega we will be turning balance upside down, there will be a lot of changes not only to weapons, but to other areas of the game that will effect balance a lot. So EVERYTHING will be changed, I know quite a few of you are saying 'will it, will it really?', the answer is 'yes, yes it will'. Enhancements to date have been the biggest player complaint of balance, they are being removed (players who have them compensated as such). Certain things that have restricted us Balance wise before have now been changed to mean we can change things easier to help with balance (more information on that probably to be announced at a later date). We also have changes to the stat system etc. - so in most words everything will change and balance will be turned upside down and jiggled about. So saying it is a minus now is fine, but not helpful, since it will be completely changed very soon.

Luck, a game you can predict everything that happens is an incredibly boring game. Yes, maybe there are changes we can make to make things a bit fairer (as said above a lot of things balance wise are being changed which may also impact this a lot). However at the same time, I am sure a lot of people would agree that with better builds you get better win rates, why is that relevant? Well, if better builds get better win rates, then that means that skill does have a big impact on how many wins you have. The thing is, if you went against an opponent much lower in level than you, you have higher stats, that guy should automatically lose the fight if no luck was involved? Yes skill may play a part, but to win over a large level difference you need a little luck. For anyone who plays Call of Duty, luck plays a massive part in that aswell, if you run out of a building at exactly the right time as an enemy runs past, you get an easy kill with minimal skill, all down to you just being in the right place at the right time. When you do that to someone else you think nothing of it, when someone does it to you, you tend to get very angry an feel like throwing your controller at the TV, especially if it happens a few times!

Luck plays a part of everything, and the thing is the human brain will naturally pick up the times that you are unlucky and hard done by instead of those times you are 'lucky' because you take that for granted. With builds if you have a high dex build with Shadow Arts and you block a few times in a battle you will take it for granted, even if it happens 3 battles in a row without you being blocked. However when you go into the next battle and get blocked twice, and you then loose the battle, that's a completely different story and you notice it and will be angry about it. Despite the fact you have blocked 3 times to 1 ratio wise over the course of those 4 battles. You will always look at it in a negative light, not because your a negative person, but because you are human. Yes, there may be some issues with the current system, but all this also plays a big part.

As for releases, we could not release at all during Omega because to shift anything live it would shift most of the changes made for Omega across too, which would break the game, so it was literally impossible to release over the past few weeks. Yes we did release the Golden ticket etc. but that was simply adding files to the current client, not updating the whole client as an update would require. We could not keep it a secret because we would have no way to release anything and players would just wonder if we were ignoring the game now for a few months.

Saying 'they should have released a little war or something', again, impossible, and even if it is, there is a very large amount of work that have to go into wars, which would take 2 weeks to code and make at minimum for a small war, probably longer, so that would certainly not be an option. I think ND Mallet once again explained the rest very well.

I know it is taking time and trust me, we want to release this as much, if not more than you do. However we will not release it any less than ready and stable, which is why we have had to delay it so long!

< Message edited by Lycus -- 1/2/2013 5:18:50 >
AQ AQW Epic  Post #: 17
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