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Plasma BOlt ot technology has to be nerfed,

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5/19/2013 3:22:08   
cool preston
Member

ARE YOU KIDDING ME???? 71 energy dmg at level 3 with max reroute and 2 cooldown NO WAY NO WAY. THEY NEED TE BE NERFED, This is just ridiculous.
MQ  Post #: 1
5/19/2013 3:28:24   
RageSoul
Member

Another nerf again? Can't we just tune the other builds equal to it?
AQW Epic  Post #: 2
5/19/2013 3:30:32   
cool preston
Member

71 damage for only 17 energy...THAT"S way too overpowered.
MQ  Post #: 3
5/19/2013 3:44:01   
RageSoul
Member

Hmmm , PB's damage wasn't the problem in the first place , it's just that every other stat gives low numbers when invested heavily though .
AQW Epic  Post #: 4
5/19/2013 3:49:12   
NDB
Member

lol 71s not even that strong for a caster mage
Epic  Post #: 5
5/19/2013 4:26:34   
Synner
Member

Supported Plasma bolt nid to be nerfed
Post #: 6
5/19/2013 5:12:40   
Necromantres
Member

while i agree a great damage from a low cost it's a problem...(bunker buster never achieved this damage , neither plasma cannon) why not buff the other classes? buff bunker buster plasma canon, grenades (except the toxic one) double strike maybe? cheap shot etc...

And in my oppinion mages were almost always supposed to be either casters or healer, since you don't ussualy see a mage atacking with his stick instead of casting kind of a fireball or a storm (that's why i can't see blood mages as mages) it's like seeing a bounty hunter casting something from the sky, it doesn't really fit the class purpose.


< Message edited by Necromantres -- 5/19/2013 5:15:54 >
Epic  Post #: 7
5/19/2013 5:15:12   
RageSoul
Member

BTW didn't we had multiple nerfs already ? It's gonna be the same again : a possible and viable build discovered ( or copied ) --> people can't make up solutions first --> people request nerfs --> build becomes crap

EDIT : fixed the ">" in the 2nd arrow
AQW Epic  Post #: 8
5/19/2013 6:09:23   
CHELSEA ROX
Member

I think the problem is not damage, the issue is around 70+ dmg is achieved at lvl 3-4 only(at low energy)
It is really hard to stop a TM from doing plasma bolt as they have reroute and assimilation.
I said hard not immpossible
Also as said earlier bunker buster and plasma cannon hardly reach that dmg
Epic  Post #: 9
5/19/2013 7:39:07   
Sageofpeace
Member

or we could just tech how to play

at this point more nerf is gonna kill the game even further
Post #: 10
5/19/2013 7:53:44   
Ranloth
Banned


 Multiple nerfs =/= you shouldn't nerf it anymore. Example: Infernal Android.

Just put it on 'Tech/4' instead of current 'Tech/3', and nothing else. It already costs 31 EP which is lower than it originally was (at 33 EP) so it's still a bit better than before. With Assimilation, you can still cast it more. It'd be indirect nerf to Assimilation. How so? Who abuses it? Non-Casters who may need Energy to... loop Heal and Malf? Or Casters so they can tank a lot, drain EP + get it for themselves and cast another cheap Bolt? Exactly.
AQ Epic  Post #: 11
5/19/2013 7:55:30   
ValkyrieKnight
Member

I think the real issue is that strength progression is far too low at higher levels of strength while skills that run on technology maintain the same rate per point leaving technology with the advantage at high levels. Do you know it takes around 7 ~ 8 points just to get a point of strength after 60 which is insane compare to skills that run on tech/dex. Technology may not be overpowered, it's just that strength is underpowered. Even skills like massacre have become a joke.

< Message edited by ValkyrieKnight -- 5/19/2013 7:56:33 >
AQW Epic  Post #: 12
5/19/2013 7:55:32   
Xendran
Member

quote:

It'd be indirect nerf to Assimilation. How so? Who abuses it? Non-Casters who may need Energy to... loop Heal and Malf?


This may actually become a thing in the near future.


quote:

I think the real issue is that strength progression is far too low at higher levels of strength while skills that run on technology maintain the same rate per point leaving technology with the advantage at high levels.

Every single progression in this game is too low. You should be getting multiple damage, res, def, hp, ep per point, not one stat for multiple points. It's a system that simply wasn't thought out properly.
They tried something a bit different from other games, and it broke the combat system in a fundamental way, causing the mess that we have today.
Nice try, but it failed. Time to fix it.

< Message edited by Xendran -- 5/19/2013 7:59:35 >
AQ DF Epic  Post #: 13
5/19/2013 7:59:48   
Ranloth
Banned


 Hm? What do you mean, Xen? The Malf + Heal loop? It has quite a potential since you only need EP for 2 skills, rest in DA + Reroute perhaps and Shields just to be on a safe side. I wonder if forgoing Reroute would work, since you get EP constantly from Assimilation. The only flaw would be when they are out of Energy, then you're screwed.
AQ Epic  Post #: 14
5/19/2013 10:26:52   
EpicIsEpic
Member

Please, don't nerf SOMETHING again. Its fine and as for the bunker not doing damage it is beacause it crits 25%
Post #: 15
5/19/2013 11:50:25   
  Exploding Penguin
Moderator


 Nerfing it would make the game more boring. While I admit the build is OP, the devs never should have nerfed everything else so that caster TMs were this strong compared to the other classes. Best way to fix this is to buff all other classes and make the game interesting again rather than mild attacks that rarely hit more than 20 against tanks except for on skills like plasma bolt. Easiest way to fix it (I'm predicting this is what the devs will do) is just to nerf plasma bolt.
Epic  Post #: 16
5/19/2013 13:14:17   
Ranloth
Banned


 Nerfing makes battles longer and the luck impact is spread out throughout the battle. Buffing everything will result in devaluation of defence and HP and possibly cause more problems with OP combos. Devs have said multiple times, even recently, that it's easier to nerf one than buff everything else. Unless you really want more time spent on balance and undoing the changes that were previously OP.
AQ Epic  Post #: 17
5/19/2013 13:26:15   
Xendran
Member

quote:

Buffing everything will result in devaluation of defence and HP


HP is already worthless in a lot of situations.

http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d42/abcboydabc/build4-1_zpsfae617ae.png

This build wrecks in 2v2, and even more if you throw in azrael.
Also, look at that build.
Then at me.
Now back to the build.
Now back to me.
Now remember my playstyle for literally 95% of my ED playtime.

If it's made me go from ALL THE HP to base hp, you know somethings up.
The only ever times i used low HP builds was one ridiculously OP 5 focus hunter that was nearly unbeatable, and when i soloed cyber hunter.

As you can see, focus also got devalued massively. I only have 2 less bot damage than 5 focus. At 4 focus i have the same bot damage as 5 focus.
The problem is that the sweet spot for focus damage is actually 4.33, but ED uses numbers that are too small to handle that.

< Message edited by Xendran -- 5/19/2013 13:36:19 >
AQ DF Epic  Post #: 18
5/19/2013 13:33:34   
Ranloth
Banned
quote:

HP is already worthless in a lot of situations.

My point exactly. We don't want to make it any worse than it is now.
AQ Epic  Post #: 19
5/19/2013 14:43:36   
  Exploding Penguin
Moderator


 Spent some time thinking about it, and I reached this conclusion:

Since all sources of dealing damage were nerfed except for some skills and skill cores, most player's offense is comprised of skills. This could include skills such as plasma bolt, bludgeon, and debuffs. The skills with the best damage-energy cost ratio will yield the best builds when utilized correctly, and this is why caster TMs with level 3-5 plasma bolt are so strong. They need less than 20 energy to deal 30-40 damage, and the cooldown is only 2. Skills like plasma rain, overload, plasma cannon, fireball, stun grenade, and plasma grenade that require skill point investments before really dealing good damage pale in comparison to skills such as bunker, plasma bolt, and level 1 bludgeon.
Epic  Post #: 20
5/19/2013 14:47:34   
Xendran
Member

@Penguin: And if you get really sadistic like me, you can throe 6 on both of your shields to prevent your heal and bolt from ever being put on cooldown or pyro fly'd
AQ DF Epic  Post #: 21
5/19/2013 14:57:58   
  Exploding Penguin
Moderator


 @xendran: Putting one skill point into overload can help a lot to prevent pyro fly, as well as give a last-resort stun on those caster builds without supercharge. Those builds that have supercharge have so many skills that they shouldn't worry about pyro fly. When I made my caster build, I made supercharge, assim, and field medic/technician my top 3 invested skills which just ensured I was protected from concussive shot. This is also a problem because plasma bolt and other skills that need few skill points and little energy cost for massive damage are also safeguarded by concussive shot which is a very good counter in many occasions.
Epic  Post #: 22
5/19/2013 14:59:54   
Xendran
Member

How is a level 1 overload going to help me against a skill that takes from my top 3 skills?
AQ DF Epic  Post #: 23
5/19/2013 15:08:14   
  Exploding Penguin
Moderator


 The level 1 overload helps against pyro fly. In most plasma bolt-only caster builds, it will decrease your chances of getting plasma bolt hit by swarm by around 10%.
Epic  Post #: 24
5/19/2013 15:15:22   
Xendran
Member

....no.
It targets your top 3 skills.
Having a level 1 skill isnt going to do anything when i have 8 assim and double 6 shields.
AQ DF Epic  Post #: 25
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