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RE: =ED= August 20th, 2013 - Patch Notes - 1.5.27

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8/21/2013 23:34:47   
Dual Thrusters
Member

@midnight

Some 2v2 if you control your partner :/
MQ AQW Epic  Post #: 26
8/21/2013 23:44:32   
Archlord Raistlin
Member
 

 I have to say I like hearing from Mecha during this conversation, wish more threads were like this...

If the problem originates from the engine placing 3 level 35 players into a match and painting itself into a corner
because it can't find an appropriate fourth, then investigate giving the engine some flexibility to kick someone
out of the search in favor of 2 players of like level. Yes, I know this does not solve the world's problems, but
I think most 2v2 players would appreciate a 29+35 versus 30+35 matchup instead of a virtually hopeless
29+35 versus 35+35 match. Maybe this is a way to narrow the level gap below 6...

If that idea is too complex to work out, or adds signiificant wait time, an NPC might be a better option than
filling in with a 29. The only problem with NPC's is that their style becomes predictable after awhile, at least
that's what I recall from the infernal war.

Maybe it's as simple as some adjustment stopped working and Rabble can figure it out. It did seem like there
was 2-3 days of better matchups earlier in the week.

Post #: 27
8/21/2013 23:51:34   
Bionic Bear
Helpful!


 Instead of the silly mechachilid style NPCs, there could be a special group of NPCs that would be used specifically for 2v2 matches. They would feature common real player builds but be controlled by the game engine.
Post #: 28
8/22/2013 0:07:52   
Buffy A. Summers
Member

Regarding The NPCs, Obviously They Would Need To Be Vastly Improved And More Powerful Then What We Saw In The Infernal War.

And I Like Midnight Assassin's Idea Of Having Some Limited Control Over The A.I. Partner, In Certain Situations Like Being Under 60% Of Your Total Health, For An Example.

Or Perhaps Only To Use Heal Or A One Time Special Ability, Like An NPC Core.

There Are A Lot Of Interesting Options To Consider, All Of Which Could Make 2vs2 A Much More Balanced And FUN Battle Option.

While Also Solving Many Of The Long Standing Issues 2vs2 Players Have Had To Endure.

~ Buffy

AQW Epic  Post #: 29
8/22/2013 3:26:27   
kosmo
Member
 

 controlled npc are a great idea.
Epic  Post #: 30
8/22/2013 8:09:42   
midnight assassin
Member

@Dual
Read again. I said the target but not control the npc completely. It will be better than getting partnered with 5 lvls lower than you.
MQ AQW Epic  Post #: 31
8/22/2013 11:01:54   
zion
Member

At this point, the mode would be better if it was 1 human + 1 controlled npc per side... maybe real 2v2 just can't work with the currently tiny player base.
AQ DF MQ AQW Epic  Post #: 32
8/22/2013 17:20:14   
Dual Thrusters
Member

@midnight

So you select the NPC's target every turn? ._.

NPC in 2v2 may not have the conjunction to work with your skills. I'd rather have a level 30 partner than George Lowe with this type of AI.
MQ AQW Epic  Post #: 33
8/22/2013 18:43:23   
midnight assassin
Member

@Dual
I said there will be a check box rather than selecting an npc per turn. This is a temporary solution as well. I believe someone suggested here that your npc partner will be based on the top builds per class but I can see a better improvement here rather than getting partnered with a lvl 30 or a lower leveled partner. I placed my suggestions in someone's shoe rather than being a win only mindset. I want to challenge the devs about creating a poll about getting partnered with an AI. If the majority agreed then the devs can start slowly but effectively and I'm expecting this additional check box or maybe radio(that round thing).

[] up []down []random
[]defense[]assault[]general

Of course dont expect any George Lowe with this type since it will be based on the top builds of each class so expect a glass cannon or a tank or an all around build AI.

-edit
btw additional legion and exile npcs a hunter, mage and a merc.

< Message edited by midnight assassin -- 8/22/2013 18:46:16 >
MQ AQW Epic  Post #: 34
8/22/2013 19:14:23   
Mother1
Member

@ Midnight assassin

People wouldn't even be suggesting adding NPC to two vs two period if they weren't thinking about winning. Think about it. If people played only for fun and not winning do you think we would have all the complaint threads talking about something being unfair, or something is unbalanced? No The main reason we see complaint threads about battle modes or items used for battle most of the time is because of said unfairness or unbalanced item causes people to lose.

Why do you think level 30-33 players have been suggesting they cut the gap by 2 or 3 at all levels? Because they keep getting hammered by higher levels and stand little to no chance of WINNING!

I don't want to go off subject too much but that is what it is mostly about which is winning.

Epic  Post #: 35
8/22/2013 19:32:10   
midnight assassin
Member

@Mother
Its because I guess base on some of my experience from lower levels most of the time there is a 5 lvl advantage in the opposing side in 2v2. Rather than enjoying the game itself there is a very high possibility on players quitting somewhere near the high lvls because of this advantage. I'm not saying that win only mindset is wrong but what's the point of winning due to luck anyway? These guys are having problems walking through the road of blood and there's a possibility they are thinking that buying varium will be their only salvation but in the end it will be a death trap since the only purpose of varium is to save time. That's why I'm with buffy about returning the npc but with limited control as a temporary solution on this current issue. Also I can agree to level gap cutting but still it puzzles me if the population of ed players can really handle 2v2 since battle matching can take long enough unless you are willing to expand this idea.
MQ AQW Epic  Post #: 36
8/22/2013 19:38:58   
Predator9657
Member

^
A lot of enjoyment comes from winning.

< Message edited by Predator9657 -- 8/22/2013 19:39:08 >
Epic  Post #: 37
8/22/2013 19:41:08   
midnight assassin
Member

^Wins with extreme advantage is not worthy in my opinion

< Message edited by midnight assassin -- 8/22/2013 19:42:33 >
MQ AQW Epic  Post #: 38
8/22/2013 19:49:52   
Dual Thrusters
Member

So let's see our options:

- fair matches, but long waiting time
- unfair matches, but short waiting time
- wacked up matches with NPCs, but an instant game
- take out the Legion Vs Exile match-ups and go back to normal fights

Jeez that's messed up



< Message edited by Dual Thrusters -- 8/22/2013 19:54:44 >
MQ AQW Epic  Post #: 39
8/22/2013 19:54:53   
midnight assassin
Member

^Would you mind giving your own solutions/opinions rather than getting pissed?

< Message edited by midnight assassin -- 8/22/2013 19:55:24 >
MQ AQW Epic  Post #: 40
8/22/2013 20:00:46   
Dual Thrusters
Member

I already have. I suggested going back to the first idea.

Plus all i did was put everyone's ideas into one convenient post. Please read those instead of my smilies.
MQ AQW Epic  Post #: 41
8/22/2013 20:04:23   
midnight assassin
Member

^One more thing can we all just calm down?
MQ AQW Epic  Post #: 42
8/22/2013 20:05:00   
Mother1
Member

@ Midnight

I would give some of my own, but no matter what solution I come up with there will be backlash.

first one close the level gap.

Pro's

better chances for fair fights
Lower levels (especially level 30-32) get a break and a chance to enjoy leveling up

Cons

less players to play against. At most levels it won't hurt but for those close to the level cap they will feel this the most due to their being not only a smaller playing pool, but an even smaller level range to chose from

next one I heard remove the legion vs exile filter

Pro's

Matches go back to the way they were before the filter was added and a much bigger player pool will come out of it making these unfair matches happen a lot less.

Cons

The side that has the least people (which from what we saw was legion) Will be at a disadvantage and many will cry foul since their only shot of a fair fight was taken.

third solution

NPC added

Pro's

fair fights level wise
Wait time will be decreased
NPC never disconnect so that fear is gone

Con's

a possible death sentence if you get 2 players vs one with a NPC
NPC's even with their AI's can't replace a human brain and won't be able to sync with it's human counterpart as well as 2 humans can
Epic  Post #: 43
8/22/2013 20:17:44   
Bionic Bear
Helpful!


 I think that it could be made that NPCs would only be put as one player and one NPC against another team of the same sort. Either that, or it could be two players against two NPCs.
Post #: 44
8/22/2013 20:18:12   
Shajun Ki
Member

Adding an NPC to 2v2 would infuriate players. 2v2 is a team effort, you can't strategize with an NPC now can you?
Post #: 45
8/22/2013 20:25:19   
Bionic Bear
Helpful!


 Personally I thought that it was fun in the infernal war when we got to fight with and against mechachilids. If people didn't mind fighting with Slayer and Charfade against the dragonoid bosses, I don't think most players would mind so long as there was never one player with NPC against two players.
Post #: 46
8/22/2013 20:26:29   
Mother1
Member

@ Bionic bear

If they did the later people would eat that up like it was done in the infernal war.

The following would be done

1 go to an empty server to maximize your chance of getting NPC as opponents
2 press the 2 vs 2 button
3 get a set of NPC as opponents and a possible NPC partner due to their being little to no people on the server.
4 hello padded 2 vs 2 record.
Epic  Post #: 47
8/22/2013 20:29:27   
Bionic Bear
Helpful!


 What about this idea here: if you got into a battle with an NPC, you would get double xp and credits but the battle would not count for your 2v2 record?
Post #: 48
8/22/2013 20:30:39   
TRizZzCENTRINO
Member

@above nope then this would make credit farming easier
MQ AQW Epic  Post #: 49
8/22/2013 20:32:58   
Bionic Bear
Helpful!


 If not double, it could either be normal amount or half amount of credits. Smply something to increase the credit loss amount of the losers and decrease the credit win amount of the winners.

< Message edited by Bionic Bear -- 8/22/2013 20:42:10 >
Post #: 50
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