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RE: =ED= Official Mercenary Balance Discussion Thread

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7/25/2014 14:09:31   
Ranloth
Banned


 They already have enough offensive skills. Strength-based skills are blockable, but they are also powerful to compensate for it. Plenty of unblockable too. They don't need more Strength power, especially when combined with Blood Commander for very high damage, high HP return, and unblockable at that.

Adrenaline just needs a small buff, such as reducing the incoming damage for one turn, for the person affected by the Adrenaline Rush. Or perhaps increasing their damage for the next turn by x% (on top of rage boost AND it'd stack if you had full rage bar). It scales with Support already, which makes it even more powerful, even though it has an EP cost. Comparing it to a Bot that's designed for 2v2 won't cut. Also, the Bot will cost 2K Varium once it's back or $50 for the time being. Bot standards aren't the same as skill standards.
AQ Epic  Post #: 26
7/25/2014 14:16:02   
GearzHeadz
Member

Maybe make it apply able like mark of blood, where the next hit you do gives you an extra X % if rage?
DF AQW Epic  Post #: 27
7/25/2014 14:29:07   
Ranloth
Banned


 That also works. Although, it'd be better if it was just fixed increase in damage for next attack (lower) than just on rage (higher), purely because rage is... broken, and the potential abuse that'd come with abusing Rush with Adrenaline. It's better to be safe than sorry, right? :p
AQ Epic  Post #: 28
7/27/2014 2:02:40   
rebels009
Member

Nerfing the hybrid is okay but static smash needs to increase it's potential of hitting the opponent if it blocked the opponent once it is game over done you lose.
Epic  Post #: 29
7/27/2014 3:12:57   
Mother1
Member

@ Rebels009

Static smash has the highest energy recovery from an energy drain/gainer and it works with field and blood commander too boot. With a good strength buff it can give back even more than battery backup near the cap or close to it.

So it being blockable is more than fair cause if you look at all the unblockable energy drainer/gainers they pale in comparison to static smash.
Epic  Post #: 30
7/27/2014 20:33:01   
Stonehawk
Member

@Mother1

So you think it's fair being blocked without filling rage? It means instant loss most of the time. Cybers might get low energy against high defense, but they fill rage 'cause of it. Every other class can guarantee energy recovering. I think it should at least do 10% weapon damage, which means it would fill rage in case of blocks or high defenses and not harm too much.
AQ DF MQ AQW Epic  Post #: 31
7/27/2014 20:41:18   
Mother1
Member

@ stonehawk

Actually I do. Why because look at all the other energy drainer/gainers in the game. None of them can even compare to static smash's energy recovery while draining. the fact that it is blockable compensates for such a high energy drain/gain. Plus even when blocked you still get a small amount of energy while draining a small amount so depending on the situation it can be helpful even when blocked.
Epic  Post #: 32
7/27/2014 22:11:39   
Stonehawk
Member

Compare these 2 classes and check "fairness":

Tech Mage:

Assimilation = -200 energy from opponent and +100 energy recover (unblockable effect, depends on str) AND damage (blockable)
Battery = 350 energy

Mercenary:
Static Smash = -300 energy from opponent and +210 (75%) energy recover (BLOCKABLE EFFECT) AND NO damage.
(with blood commander: UP TO -400 energy from opponent and +300 energy recover (BLOCKABLE, OK?))

Now think about it, considering tech mages have dex-based moves, if they get higher dex, they are probably going to block it.
If not blocked, they can use assimilation then battery.

Check this example: Mercenary VS dex mage. (Merc first)

____________________Mercenary__|_____Tech mage:
static smash:__________+270 _____|______ -360 (can be easily blocked, doesn't fill rage)
assimilation:___________-200______|______+100 (does a little damage, fills rage)
gun:___________________X_______|________X (just attacking, lol)
battery:________________ 0_______|______+350

TOTAL:_______________+70_______|______+110
(static is blockable, doesn't affect rage. Assimilation's effect can't be blocked, but damage can, filling a lot of rage if blocked oh highly defended, battery is unaffected)

Who gets the advantage? Is static smash that good? I still think it should do a very small % of damage.

OH! Forgot to mention that battery you can choose to use on your partner. Mercenary only gets for himself (if not blocked.....)





< Message edited by Stonehawk -- 7/27/2014 22:25:28 >
AQ DF MQ AQW Epic  Post #: 33
7/28/2014 2:06:26   
Noobatron x3000
Member

^ The merc skill tree beats the tech mage hands down in anything but energy control - low cost shield defending both defences and a wide variety of offensive options with a strength buff and a strength debuff.

The mages offensive options are almost entirely energy , with 2 weak shields compared to hybrid when u consider the mana cost the 2 turns it takes. and batterie may be a big influx of mana but almost any emp in the game can make it worthless and 100 mana from assim doesn't really help.
Post #: 34
7/28/2014 15:40:19   
Plasmastorm
Member

Every other class does not have a class specific energy regain(assuming mages can use battery instead of assimilation[2 energy regain skills OP]. anyhow, why doesn't merc have an energy regain skill that is only useable class specific weapon? I think it would be good to have a non class specific weapon energy regain skill.
Post #: 35
7/28/2014 16:13:11   
ffeeeee
Member

^

If they were to implement a skill with a non-class specific weapon only one skill in the mercenary skill tree would have a class specific weapon. This skill if you didn't know would be maul. This would lead to mercenary's using mostly swords and less people using clubs, so that they could use a higher damage doing weapon with more stats. I think it would be best to keep static smash as is.
Post #: 36
7/28/2014 16:44:25   
dfo99
Member
 
quote:

battery:________________ 0_______|______+350


static smash use 1 turn and assim/battery 2
Post #: 37
7/29/2014 14:54:58   
Stonehawk
Member

quote:

with 2 weak shields compared to hybrid when u consider the mana cost the 2 turns it takes.


one of those "weak shields" is a defensive skill that improves with a defensive stat. Technician improves with dexterity, just so you know. Tech gives not only defense, but a boost in some skills. Hybrid is only defense, making people rage faster.

quote:

static smash use 1 turn and assim/battery 2


Try fighting a lvl 38 dex mage with a mercenary and you will se how humiliating it is to be blocked all the time you try to get energy while they can use battery everytime (high enough defenses to wait all those 5 turns) and assimilation in case they don't block.
AQ DF MQ AQW Epic  Post #: 38
7/29/2014 14:59:07   
Stonehawk
Member

Dexterity to block your static smash and attacks, strong technician to deflect your attacks, battery to keep using dex-based strong skills, assimilation to get the energy you get if they don't block static smash. Now talk about fairness? Technician should be improved with SUPPORT, just like all skills that gives extra stats.
Also, I don't think merc should have 40% of blockable skills. The only 2 strong unblockable merc's skills are strengthened with tech, making them hardly get energy back. So I think they just aren't make to beat any dex build at all.

< Message edited by Stonehawk -- 7/29/2014 15:08:13 >
AQ DF MQ AQW Epic  Post #: 39
7/30/2014 9:36:25   
The berserker killer
Member

 

 Whatttt I'm not merc but cmon guys, you cant nerf Hybrid. What I would say to do is make static smash deal at least 60% weapon damage like Parasite used to do but make the effect unblockable. I can't support giving it 85% damage because you guys take the most energy at a single given moment, especially when you have bloodcommander on. However the effect has to be unblockable with this.
AQ DF Epic  Post #: 40
7/30/2014 14:59:02   
Stonehawk
Member

quote:

What I would say to do is make static smash deal at least 60% weapon damage like Parasite used to do but make the effect unblockable. I can't support giving it 85% damage because you guys take the most energy at a single given moment, especially when you have bloodcommander on. However the effect has to be unblockable with this.


If it damages, it has to be blockable. If it doesn't damage, I think it's fair enough to be unblockable, since all other skills in the game give lots of rage when they're blocked, EXCEPT static smash. That's the point, we waste turns trying to get energy against high dex builds.
AQ DF MQ AQW Epic  Post #: 41
7/30/2014 16:05:37   
Mother1
Member

Static smash is blockable due to

1 the way it works
2 the high conversation rate.

On the first one Static smash works with percents based off the primary damage where as Assimilation works off of flat numbers. If damage was completely negated like it used to be Assimiation wouldn't connect if blocked. However since assimiation works as long as damage is done due to the numbers being flat with the drain the effect is unblockable. However to balance this the amount of strength needed to work this is extremely high and the drain is weak to compensate this.

However Static smash works off of percent damage, so when you get blocked it works off of that block damage percent which results in such a low drain if blocked. As long as the drain works with percents and is blockable that will be the result everytime. However, unlike Assimilation to compensate for it being blockable the drain rate is high.

It is a system of checks and balances for these moves.

Look at all the unblockable energy drainers/gainers (This doesn't include battery backup or static charge because these aren't drainers) Every unblockable energy drainer/gainer has either a very low return rate (Static grenade and Assimilation) or is dependant on an outside factors (Energy parasite)

Where as Static Smash trumps all of these in terms of drain and converstion. So the fair check on this was to make it blockable.

Not to mention this was also done for diversity among skill no matter how unfair people may think it.

< Message edited by Mother1 -- 7/30/2014 16:07:22 >
Epic  Post #: 42
8/1/2014 11:30:13   
kosmo
Member
 

 merc is probably still the most effective class in win rate.
ur problem is that ur using a tank build wich is pratically inaviable untill rank +30.

i suggest u to go for the classic str/dex build (maul obiusly)
Epic  Post #: 43
8/4/2014 0:46:15   
Gold Shock
Member

quote:

ur problem is that ur using a tank build wich is pratically inaviable untill rank +30.


I have to agree on the inviable part. The way the game functions now has put a small handicap on mercs.

If you wish to succeed in this class, you must be cunning and ambitious. Winning now a days requires intellect, and the capability to complete quick choices 15 seconds. I always try too stick too a specific genre of a build depending on the Flavor of The Week Build. These builds are loose ideas, but work with what I have in hand.

My Luck Bunker Build
Lucky Bunker
875 hp
670 mp
23 +0
57+ 33
78+33
64+13

My Uber HP build
High HP
1712 hp
620 mp
35+13
49+33
45+33
30

My Support Build
Support
1150 hp
620 mp
23
45 +33
52 +33
67+13 80


My Tech Build
Techi
720 mp
45
49
63
45

< Message edited by Gold Shock -- 8/4/2014 0:51:11 >
AQ DF MQ AQW Epic  Post #: 44
8/4/2014 9:47:44   
lionblades
Member

I notice a lot of tank mercs rely heavily on static smash...one block and its over
AQW  Post #: 45
8/4/2014 11:21:43   
Gold Shock
Member

quote:

I notice a lot of tank mercs rely heavily on static smash...one block and its over


Mercenary is in no, way, shape, or form, the best class. What I like about it is it's safety ( talking about tank builds in general) and the build itself that makes it safe. Unlike BM(4&5 focus str builds) TM(Dex) or even CH (strength) is that I don't only rely on my damage and if I hit or not. With a good Tank build I can get blocked, deflected and critical-ed and still win.

A build I have had success with and still use (Me being rank 5) counters Mercenary STR, any cyber build, Bh massacere + Poison, TM dexterity is SS Tank Weakness = Blood Mage

< Message edited by Gold Shock -- 8/4/2014 11:28:10 >
AQ DF MQ AQW Epic  Post #: 46
8/4/2014 14:10:50   
lionblades
Member

I think str is best choice:
Str merc
Str cyber (sword not blades)
Str BM

They dont rely as heavily on energy to win

I went Str BC merc and its wayy strong. The only other classes that can compete against me are other str abusers like str cyber and bm.
Plus ranks make it more broken
AQW  Post #: 47
8/20/2014 16:07:43   
kittycat
Member

Strength Mercs abuse Blood Commander quite a bit. Once hit, they receive 40+ Strength with little support invested, and then receives at least 20% Lifesteal back. Intimidate is worthless against it since it merely reduces the Strength bonus, but not the lifesteal bonus as well. Only Azrael equipments can stop it, making it an OP move by default. If Blood Commander can base its lifesteal based on net bonus (after taking in Intimidate), that would be nice, but only for BM.


< Message edited by kittycat -- 8/20/2014 16:11:58 >
AQ MQ  Post #: 48
8/20/2014 17:15:55   
Mother1
Member

@ kittycat

Actually the life gain on blood commander is 60% of damage dealt not 20%.
Epic  Post #: 49
8/20/2014 18:15:22   
kittycat
Member

I'm pretty sure the Lifesteal is equivalent to 60% of the Strength boost. If its 60% Lifesteal, then a 200+ damage hit should have at least 120+ HP in return from that one hit.
AQ MQ  Post #: 50
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