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RE: =DF= Design Notes February 9, 2016 - Jaania's Thorns

 
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2/10/2016 0:46:25   
Womba
Member

Out of the frying pan and into the oven, huh?
DF AQW  Post #: 26
2/10/2016 0:59:32   
Akiron
Member
 

Oh, I like what I'm reading here!

So this is where Akriloth and the Great Fire War started from. I'm confused, since I always thought the earliest mention of him was always regarding Galanoth and the loss of his parents. Man, now I really want to see him and Dragsvard again. I wonder how he feels about the Rose taking out dragons, since he always hated them (the World Destroyer being the only exception because the Hero proved their worth to him).

Also regarding the Fire War, Konnan hasn't been seen yet. As a former pyromancer, wielder of the Fire Orb, and badass weaponsmith, he might be having his own troubles with the Rose. Plus, Jaania knows about his existence since he was helping out during the Elemental Dissonance, and she may also know about his connection/ training under Xan and helping out the Professor/Warlic's human side. By the Avatars, I seriously wonder what he's up to.

By the way, didn't Elryn already specify something about Akanthus during the last quest with Su'lenka? He said that Akanthus "lies to everyone" and that "his true plans are kept close to himself" or something like that. I don't know, until something else comes up, I'm keeping faraway from that guy. He is totally bad news.
Post #: 27
2/10/2016 1:38:44   
docblade
Member

I didn't like it, but i got the feeling that we need to fight them in the future. In moments like that, i miss the times we can beat up enemies just because "they're the bad guys". Its hard to throw people some daggers in the face when you understand their motivation (Disclaimer: This person NEVER made this experience in RL...yet)

EDIT: For some reason, i want to know the translation of the runes you see on the hammers. Maybe its something we won't expect ever (like "Jaaina rocks!" or "Cysero waz here" or "If you can read that, i hit you in the face" or even "Well, y'know...magic isn't THAT bad")

< Message edited by docblade -- 2/10/2016 1:47:09 >
DF MQ  Post #: 28
2/10/2016 1:54:50   
megakyle777
Member

Above: Great, now you got me thinking how hilarious it would be if the Rose Blacksmith was secretly writing "I like magic" in runes on all of their armor, weapons and fortresses.
DF  Post #: 29
2/10/2016 6:30:44   
ShadowMoon
Member

roses symbol symbolizes youth, vitality, love, beauty and the fruitfulness of nature.
rose thorns on the other hand symbolize pain, the bad that comes with the good & the wickedness of man.
AQ DF MQ AQW Epic  Post #: 30
2/10/2016 6:41:42   
Azan
Member

That looks awesome! Can't wait to discover more about them.

When you described the obsidian city, I've got to admit there, I was starting to believe for a moment that it was the Lovecraftian Forbidden City. :P

< Message edited by Azan -- 2/10/2016 6:42:38 >
Post #: 31
2/10/2016 7:29:45   
Rlogg
Member

Awesome backstory and akilroth came from maar
Now really want to see the runed city

< Message edited by Rlogg -- 2/10/2016 7:30:46 >
AQ DF MQ AQW  Post #: 32
2/10/2016 7:42:54   
Sharkslayer
Member

Hmm... nice story. I'm not interested in "Jaania's Thorns", Akriloth is still more interesting (for me).
AQW  Post #: 33
2/10/2016 8:25:02   
Zork Knight
Member

Ohhh, so that's where Akriloth came from, in DF.

And we'll finally be going into the capital! CIVILIZATION!
AQ DF MQ AQW  Post #: 34
2/10/2016 11:15:27   
LyRein
Member

@Mordred

TBH If Xan's whole body was ignited he'd be no different than an average guy on fire
Post #: 35
2/10/2016 14:43:15   
solomi123
Member

TBF, if Xan's whole body wasn't ignited I have no idea how anything below his head could have lasted a thousand years without decaying.
DF AQW Epic  Post #: 36
2/10/2016 15:21:01   
Frost Moglin
Member

Pelekoa sounds like fear said in a dialect of Finnish, and I can barely take this seriously because of that. After Oikea Hetki from AQ and some of the elf NPCs from book 3, I have to assume that is on purpose, even thought it probably is not named that because of that.
AQ DF MQ  Post #: 37
2/10/2016 15:23:25   
LyRein
Member

@solomi123

I'm going to use what everyone else has used on me whenever I tried to give magical stuff logical explanations

It's Fantasy!

but yes, that you must ask Xan himself

EDIT

Why would being on fire forever be any better than decaying forever?
Post #: 38
2/10/2016 15:28:21   
Dark Lord Urmi
Member

I hope we as the hero will finally confront her. i want to hear her try to justify her horrible actions....right before i feed her her teeth
AQ DF AQW  Post #: 39
2/10/2016 15:42:59   
LyRein
Member

In my honest opinion, Jaania has a very weak backstory

"My town was destroyed, after several decades trapped in Ice I see a demon causing death and destruction on Lore"

There are a lot of people who end up like Jaania in our world and their stories are similar however many more factors go into play like culture, religion, media, rumors, general opinion etc not just personal impact.

This is the only reason I want to defeat her tbh
Post #: 40
2/10/2016 15:45:21   
Dark Lord Urmi
Member

^ exactly, she was a student when she was frozen now suddenly she knows exactly how she is going to save the world? she couldn't even save herself WE did that and guess what she froze US for it...ugh.
AQ DF AQW  Post #: 41
2/10/2016 15:59:13   
Dwelling Dragonlord

ArchKnight AQ / OOC / L&L


Do you know what I do with thorns?

I cut them off.
AQ DF AQW  Post #: 42
2/10/2016 16:05:16   
Jorath
Advocator of Wills


These Thorns wouldn't be quite as easy to immediately remove. You're looking at Jaania's personal "shields".
AQ DF MQ  Post #: 43
2/10/2016 16:11:20   
Dark Lord Urmi
Member

Doomknight will laugh at them. if thats not canon enough soulweaver with its artifact XD
AQ DF AQW  Post #: 44
2/10/2016 17:02:21   
David the Wanderer
Legendary AK!


In defence of Jaania, her backstory is a bit more complex. She was trapped in Magic Ice (TM) during a duel between her two best friends, the last thing she saw being one of these friends catching fire and screaming in agony. When she finally breaks free of her prison, she finds out that said friend, who was a well-mannered and shy boy, has become a clinically crazy flaming skeleton who has murdered thousands and laughs at the agony of others, while the other friend has turned into a demon tyrant who has destroyed a world and is now trying to destroy her world too.

Plus, we don't really know what happened in the five years she was frozen. I seriously doubt she had everything planned the moment she frozen Warlic, Xan and the Hero. Sure, she had the vague idea of "magic is too dangerous and must be stopped", but it's unlikely she had already decided to create the Rose and find a way to eliminate magic from the world. In any case, Jaania is definitely a variation from the usual "destroy/conquer the world" villain, since her goal is definitely more of a "good intentions, awful execution". I mean, on paper, Jaania IS right: magic has caused LOTS of problems, and the fact the Rose has so much support is the proof. The fact the Rose has so much support is the proof people (in-game) AGREE with Jaania. But the way the Rose goes around making a "safer world" is wrong, because it infringes the freedom and right to choose of other sentient beings. In fact, Jaania is the first (or one of very few) DF villains who can make players hesitate; with Sepulchure and Wargoth, it was clear they were 100% Evil, no doubt about that, and they had to be stopped. The Rose, however, poses the question of what to do: they have made some places safer (Sandsea, Amityvale), and, again, magic IS dangerous, so even after we defeat them (I mean, we WILL win, because of narrative laws, we know that), there will be resentment, and there will be the question of "what to do NOW? Do we really want to undo everything done by Jaania and the Rose, even the good things? Is there something that can, that SHOULD, be salvaged?"

Jaania is not Sepulchure, that's true, but you know what? It's better that way. You can only have so many Dark Overpowered Overlords of Evil and Death before they get before it gets stale and boring. I much prefer an adversary that stimulates me mentally than another brawl with a powerful fighter. Nothing against beating up enemies, mind you, but it's refreshing to be challenged in other ways, from time to time.

And to all those saying Jaania is stupid because she thinks she has the solution to the world's problems... We all do that. We all (or at the very least, most people) believe that if everybody else did as they say, the world would be perfect. And in case you don't, well, you most likely don't have the answer either, so who are you to judge? Are you really accusing Jaania of trying to make the world a better place? Is her way of doing it questionable, at the very least? Of course, but the intent behind her actions is the same behind the actions of the Hero: she wants to save people, to keep people safe, and so she acts. Questions her methods, question her ideology, question everything about her, but do not accuse a character of being "shallow" for trying to do something.

quote:

Many that live deserve death. And some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then do not be too eager to deal out death in judgement.


_____________________________

DF AQW  Post #: 45
2/10/2016 17:11:59   
Zork Knight
Member

Sure, they're Jaania's shields.

And we've defeated plenty of powerful foes in the past. If they're going to be stronger than us, they better have a very good reason beyond "plot".
AQ DF MQ AQW  Post #: 46
2/10/2016 17:25:06   
LyRein
Member

@David the Wanderer

What does Seppy have to do with Jaania?
I was just adding my opinion on her reasons to start the Rose

Also have you noticed every big moment in Lore's history starts because of three friends (spanning all games)?

Alteon, Lynaria, Valen
Warlic, Jaania, Alexander
Hero, Robina/Victoria, Drakath < okay this one not so much
Post #: 47
2/10/2016 17:25:52   
Wolfofdoom3
Member

Nobody in the Rose except Akanthus and Jaania should be stronger then us.
Post #: 48
2/10/2016 20:10:28   
Baron Dante
Member

quote:

Pelekoa sounds like fear said in a dialect of Finnish, and I can barely take this seriously because of that. After Oikea Hetki from AQ and some of the elf NPCs from book 3, I have to assume that is on purpose, even thought it probably is not named that because of that.

Hah.
I feel like that's not the case, since that'd hinge on somebody knowing about dialects. (Also, the earlier notions about it being related to something different)
I dunno, seeing your own language used as names in a game feels so weird, especially when it's often wrong D:
AQ DF MQ AQW Epic  Post #: 49
2/10/2016 20:51:27   
ShadowMoon
Member

quote:

I mean, on paper, Jaania IS right: magic has caused LOTS of problems, and the fact the Rose has so much support is the proof.

no, magic did not cause those problems. if a serial killer go's running around shoving metal sporks down peoples throats, do you blame the spork? no, you do not.
the people who are on the rose's side don't necessarily agree with their ideology and are just looking for a better form of sense of security. the main problem with the rose is that their messing around with nature itself, ruining the culture of beings who are magical by nature, entrapping said beings, and all around taking things to far. it doesn't help that its being led by a girl who doesn't even understand what shes doing and how much harm it will have. then we got her underlings who obviously are using her & plan to usurp her once shes severed their purpose like akanthus
quote:

Akanthus: She can't hear you. She hasn't heard anyone in a while, actually. She talked too much and I tired of it.
Leon: You are a monster. You are everything the Rose is and more.
*Akanthus laughs.*
Leon: ...
Akanthus: You have no idea how accurate that statement is. She is my toy to prove my point. Besides, she is useless now... well at least to you.


AQ DF MQ AQW Epic  Post #: 50
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