RE: =AQW= Auto-Play Feature Idea: Feedback Wanted


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5/29/2018 4:29:41

Valtorous
Member

@RKC

I could say the same for players who can't stand the grind, if you don't want to grind then don't grind. If you weren't gonna farm the items before "Auto-farming" was implemented then how can you say you are better then those you describe? With "Auto-farming", actual farming is pointless... gameplay is pointless, why even have new farmable items if they can just be auto-farmed??? Might as well as just sell the items in a shop. New accounts will be maxed out within the month, only now it is "legit", do you think that is healthy? Of course it will be fair to everyone, let's make everything fair to everyone. Might as well as re-release rares, another "solution".

The "solution" they propose is the exact problem they face. Auto-farming is auto-farming, AE endorsing it won't change the fact that it is the same. A game is meant to be played, having something else do it for you is not playing it. I understand the frustration of grinding SDKA, AFDL, NSoD, I've farmed the items, but if AE thinks that this should be a thing, then the direction the devs are going is the problem. Instead of quality content, innovative mechanics, gratifying quests and rewards, we get this... something that will make gameplay even more stale then it already is. Sure you will save time, get your items and show them off, but there is no effort given or meaning in what you "earned", just superficial gratification.

Just my thoughts as a hard-core farmer.

AQW	Post #: 26

5/29/2018 5:12:30

Foulman
Member

quote:

Before you say I don't grind, My god I grind for my items and its the worse thing ever in this game. I double dare you to farm for the armor of awe set now. No one is farming it so good luck.

The sad thing is, Armour of Awe (deal 250,000,000 damage) isn't even the worst quest chain in the game right now. It's outclassed by BLoD, NSoD, SDKA, VHL, AFDL and even items with little to no storyline/endgame significance - the Plague Knight sets and Heptagonal Chest are some of the most ridiculous ones.

AQW is not fun. Button mashing with clearly unbalanced classes against the same excessive HP sponges is not interesting at all. Armour of Awe takes a minimum of 200 hours assuming you have VHL and some damage boosters; VHL itself takes 1000 hours, AFDL is anywhere from 1000 to eternity, SDKA takes just as long, BLoD is around 500+ hours, while NSoD takes at least 7000 hours.

1 complete run through of a GTA game takes about 40 hours; the items I listed take at least 13,000 hours to get legitimately. Would you rather sit behind a screen for 13,000 hours with no voice-acting, mundane music, disgustingly bad sound effects, no freedom, widely varied art quality and no real gameplay, or replay every single GTA game ever made while getting on with your real life?

AQW

Epic

Post #: 27

5/29/2018 7:54:52

RKC
Member

@Valtorous

You make it sound like AQW has an awesome gameplay mechanic. You make it sound that it outclasses WOW and other triple A MMO's. I play TERA and its a grinned of an MMO but you know what I dont feel like Im grinding In AQW and its worst in that game. As I said if you want to farm manually, by all means do it, but I have my fair share of grindy gears that I farmed and its time to stop this bravado of who grinned the super awesome mega super hard core super braggy brags 1000000000000 hours gameplay button mashing hero of all heroes gear.

If AQW doesnt change how we farm materials for gear then please just let AE do what they want then.

< Message edited by RKC -- 5/29/2018 8:00:10 >

Epic

Post #: 28

5/29/2018 9:09:07

thulsa doom
Member

quote:

Instead of quality content, innovative mechanics, gratifying quests and rewards, we get this... something that will make gameplay even more stale then it already is

This sums it up nicely.
Unfortunately I've spent way too much money on this game... I suppose I could be considered a Whale. They say that money talks... well if this game-killing, lazy rewarding idea ever gets implemented I will never spend another cent on this game. In fact, I will delete my account.
This is not just hyperbole. I mean it. IMHO this will be the end of AQW. I'm not surprised that many players Like the idea of 'Auto Farming' (guess that's the polite euphemism we are supposed to use) since most people like to get something for nothing -- but the novelty will soon wear off because there is no personal achievement gained.
This will lead to fewer and fewer people even bothering to log in.
Hey AQW Staff instead of capitulating to Cheaters why not try to make the game less grindy and more Fun? I'm not going to regurgitate all of the ideas that have been floated in these Forums over the years -- besides, it's your Job to be innovative enough to attract us players; so why don't you just surprise us with with a little Creativity.... Before it's too late.

AQW

Post #: 29

5/29/2018 9:23:51

Metakirby
Constructive & Helpful!

quote:

I double dare you to farm for the armor of awe set now. No one is farming it so good luck.

If you go to Artix, there's still people regularly farming Ultra Blood Titan (who got nerfed a while back and is very easy to solo with your average soloing class of choice), Ultra Akriloth, Carnax (Carnax being farmed for Void Auras by most people, probably) and sometimes Alteon as well. Sure, you may need to go out of your way to find people, or own VHL to kill the Mutated Void Dragon, but it's not impossible to do. It's by far a much more manageable grind than the more recent, powercreep inflated ones.

quote:

Armour of Awe takes a minimum of 200 hours assuming you have VHL and some damage boosters; VHL itself takes 1000 hours, AFDL is anywhere from 1000 to eternity, SDKA takes just as long, BLoD is around 500+ hours, while NSoD takes at least 7000 hours.

I'm very curious where you get those numbers from, probably just guesses based on your own opinions, but you are quite far from the truth.

At lvl 85 with VHL and a 15% damage boost, you can take down 100k hp in ~30 seconds on average, this is important to note when estimating how long AoA will take.
For every 100k hp a boss has, we need to divide that by 2, to figure how many minutes each boss takes to solo, afterwards, multiplying that with the expected amount of kills for each boss, respectively.

Ultra Akriloth: (6.24/2)*225=702 minutes

Ultra Alteon (Assuming a 50% drop rate): (2.01/2)*300≈301,5 minutes

Carnax (Assuming a 50% drop rate): (0,97/2)*200=97 minutes

Ultra Blood Titan: (3,84/2)*225=432 minutes

Mutated Void Dragon: (4,14/2)*150=310,5 minutes

702+302+97+432+311=1844 Minutes, or approximately 30-31 hours.

Even if we add up all the waiting for respawn times and take into consideration that you will probably take a little bit extra time to kill the Mutated Void Dragon, due not being able to go all out with all your skills, you are looking at approximately 4 more hours on top, at maximum. And even in the case of being lower leveled, let's say 65, you will likely not surpass 50 hours with this set up and all of that is assuming you farm alone, on every boss, throughout the whole thing. If you can find people to farm with, that time will decrease significantly. Even if we add the Helm of Awe to the mix, you are looking at a grind similar to the Armor (Raxore doesn't have his counterattack anymore, so he's automatically way less of a pain), which would in most cases would not even add up to 100 hours.

VHL, even with somewhat sloppy farming, should not be more than 200 hours in total, which in hindsight, is still quite a lot, but not as dreadful as you make it out to be. Last time I looked at it, I came to the conclusion that VHL would take probably 100+ hours, at a good pace.

AFDL, I got in 4 days of, more or less, 24/7 grinding (granted, it was under some special circumstances, and I got Uni 35 within my first 4 turn ins), but I still think that it's very manageable for someone who is willing to put in the time for AFDL, to complete 1 Willpower Extraction per day without spending the whole day doing nothing else but that. With that rate, and assuming Uni 35 is not what's stopping you (which it likely will be), you are looking at less than 100 hours in the best cases, and in the worst cases... I don't think I need to explain the worst case. AFDL will always be influenced by RNG to an aggravating extent, so it's hard to pinpoint any average completion time, but 1000 hours is way too high to set as a low estimate.

BLoD is about on par/slightly longer than AoA, in my opinion, it's just a different form of farming, which is less reliant on other people to accomplish the task much faster. Room hopping is your best friend when farming BLoD.

While NSoD (with the non mem quest at least), is the single longest grind in the game, easily surpassing all previously mentioned items combined, 7k hours is still WAY too high estimate, unless you somehow only get 2 Void Auras on every single turn in, in that case, it may be true. NSoD is not something that you should consider as a non mem (unless you have SDKA from a previous membership), if you value your spare time. At an average rate, you are looking at about 5+ Void Auras per hour, assuming you farm alone with something like VHL + damage boosts, which adds up to 1500, or less hours for all 7500 Void Auras. Once the Void Auras are done, you have what amounts to a little less than AoA, which after all you have been through with the Void Auras, that should feel like nothing. Is NSoD still unreasonable for non members? Yes, definitely, a lot of people can't even stand simple* things such as AoA, no way in hell even 1% of the community will even dare to try this challenge.

*simple in comparison to some of the other items mentioned, such as VHL, AFDL and NSoD.

Tens to hundreds of hours is still a lot to some people, I totally get that, but AQW is just following the trope of MMOs having content (even if that content is mundane and repetitive) to make you keep playing for hours on end. However, you can choose whether you want to partake in this or not, no one is forcing you to farm for BLoD, AoA, VHL, AFDL and what have you. Farming some items can feel satisfying, making progress is satisfying, but if you cannot find a way to entertain yourself while grinding for your desired items, then it will certainly feel very boring and bland. That could even open up another discussion on whether or not AQW is actually doing it's job as a game, if outside methods are needed to get entertainment out of it.

People play for different reasons though, there's probably a lot of people who couldn't care less about all the endgame. It's still important to take into account both side's view points, I can see the appeal, even I am against it in the first place, I have had some times when I was just fed up with a certain grind and I just wanted to get it done ASAP (like spending 128 turn ins to get the Void Spartan Armor) and at those points, I would be more into the idea of simply letting the game play itself to get the thing I wanted, even if it is just to bank it after I get it. I don't think it would improve the game, but perhaps it would not even affect me, or perhaps it's even a good thing if AQW is going to me played on mobile devices by a majority of people. There's still a lot of other things I would like to see before this though, even something that I don't find that important, namely bank previews, I would rather have than this, if I was to choose.

< Message edited by Metakirby -- 5/29/2018 9:30:32 >

AQW	Post #: 30

5/29/2018 11:36:36

Shadowhunt
Member

I'm just going to throw this out there: you guys are making assumptions about what this system will do and allow and basing your opinions on that. Those assumptions may not be accurate, should such a system even be implemented. There are also a lot of ways this could be implemented. It doesn't necessarily have to be a program that's playing the game for you. There are other systems for passive farming that could be implemented. Idle systems like AQ Dragons have, or raid systems where you choose to send out a "team" that can go gather small things for you, or simply lore-based passive gains while logged out as the hero continues to defend places even when you're not the one controlling them... there are a lot of ways this can be implemented. Don't go jumping to the conclusion that this system will be one that just lets you click a button and come back a few days later with endgame items.

AQW

Post #: 31

5/29/2018 11:47:08

stuart
Member

@ shadowhunt,

It would be nice to think that it would not be the game destroyer that some of us are thinking it will be, but then again it has been thrown out to a vote system on twitter without clarifying what the staff are planning what else can we do but voice our concerns?

As usual we have had no concrete, game staff input here on the forums.

AQW

Post #: 32

5/29/2018 12:19:35

Valtorous
Member

@RKC

From what context do you infer that I praise AQW for "awesome gameplay mechanics"? The game is a 2D game with 4 buttons involved... lol. But hard work should mean something in games as it does in real life. Do you think the L100 boost that WoW has to level heroes in an instant is healthy? I certainly don't, you never learn how to actually play the game.

There are no bragging rights in AQW, except for rare owners, because AE never addressed the problems. The only bragging rights I see going around is "I got this legit" LUL.

This is about principle, what principles do AE want to uphold? They say they want to fix problems, reinvigorate the player-base, bring fun back into the game, so is auto-farming that solution? No matter what degree of auto-farming it is, I don't think so. Either it will have little to no impact or it will make farming obsolete. Look at recent quest development, AFDL and VHL 1.0 (yeah 5% droprate Roent, remember that?). Those horrendous RNG quests were made to shut down auto-farming, which punished legit farmers instead. So how will questing change when auto-farming is actually implemented in-game?

AQW	Post #: 33

5/29/2018 13:38:49

Aura Knight
Banned

The consideration to add an auto-farm feature is an insult to anyone who has ever put in the effort to obtain anything in this game on their own. Yes, we don't know what this yet unconfirmed feature will be like in game, but it sounds to me like AQW is giving up on making the changes we constantly ask for and went with this half baked idea which only caters to the people who likely don't do their own farming to begin with. Instead of considering such a feature, what needs to happen is for certain quests to be reverted to their original state so as to reduce the difficulty of farming. Spawn rates on all maps could use an increase as could drop rates. Some monster health is too high which makes it annoying for farm them. There have been so many reasonable ideas on how this game could improve and I don't ever think auto farming was one. If this is the solution they came up with, I want my 10 years back. But, perhaps I'm overreacting here. There may be some ways it could be beneficial. But if it's a system that has you log in one day, set up something and come back a week later to a new endgame item on your character, that's going to be a problem. It saddens me that this is even being considered. Why not make farming easier instead of suggesting a way to farm while not actually farming? One of the biggest flaws in the game is that it is too grindy for no reason other than to probably keep folks logged in. Eventually players will be annoyed enough to not want to play the game at all and I've been close to that point. We need more details about this because as has been mentioned here, the poll was too simple and without explanations we may have voted for the wrong thing.

AQW

Post #: 34

5/29/2018 14:17:31

Mr.Rie
Member

Person 1: Aqw is dying guys! Our game are getting less played! Quick, give us some idea.
Person 2: Hmm...Why not make the game play itself?
Person 1: GENIUS!!

On a serious note, i completely agree with @Valtorous and @Aura Knight Farming has been always been an AQW niche and it is the only current thing that keeps Aqw alive nowadays. If you remove it, then whats the point in playing Aqw anymore? The game already feels dead now because of overwhelming amount of botters "playing" the game. So Why would you making it "dead'er" by implementing something like auto farming? Why dont they fix the main problem first? Instead they came out with this so now everyone can bot legally yay!

Why not focus more about quest design or gameplay that can make farming more interesting instead of the stupid RnG droprate or kill this monster a million times. I miss the old gen1 and 2 Miltonius item where farming is actually fun. No Rng bullcrap, no kill this monster stupid amount of times. And people actually interact with each other when farming together because back then, botting is not that popular. That is what makes farming FUN. If they implement this, everyone will auto farm, everyone will be "afk" while their character mindlessly attack monsters. The game will felt empty because nobody is "playing", there will be no interaction with players anymore. There will be no FUN or sense of achievement at all in farming. And whats the point in that?

< Message edited by Mr.Rie -- 5/29/2018 14:18:55 >

AQW	Post #: 35

5/29/2018 15:11:30

savor
Member

This is both interesting and terrifying. As a player of aqw for nearly 10 years now, yes farming is the main core of this game. When bots was introduced it wasn't really popular until the hardcore items showed up. Like jugg, blod, and reputation quests. Some players were forced to go botting since they got tired of button smashing for hours.Personally, i kinda like this idea of adding an auto feature in aqw, but instead of an auto play why not implement an auto skill system. Wherein you don't have so smash buttons 1-5 on your keyboard killing monsters over and over again for the next few hours to get the required items for a quest to get a specific item. Imagine aqw if it has this kind of system. You get the quest manually, kill the required monster (with auto skill) once done turn in the quest manually and repeat. That way its not gonna be full auto there will still be human interaction you still see your character screen, you can still interact with players while doing auto skill.

AQW

Post #: 36

5/29/2018 18:16:06

Alina
Battleon Sorceress

Hello all,

I appreciate the time you all are taking to share your thoughts! Here is some additional information to help guide the discussion and feedback:

1. We have talked about this idea, or some form of an auto-play feature on and off for years now. Our idea of "auto-play" is not "open a program to let the game play for you while you walk away and do something else away from your keyboard."
2. This is not a thing we are 100% committed to doing, or doing in a given timeframe, but it IS absolutely worth exploring in discussions with you, the community.
3. If done right, there is real potential to help a number of players better enjoy the game.

4. It is important that we look at how people are playing games now -- ours and others -- as we look towards the future of AQWorlds - both in its web form and in future versions on other platforms.
5. So many of our players are young. Many are ten or younger when they start playing. That was true in 2008 and is still true today. Younger kids these days grow up in a gaming universe that is fundamentally different. Games in general are easier to start playing, and hold your hand much more early on.
6. What we don't want is for people to get frustrated and leave. The fix for that is buried deep within the game's structure and design - both of the larger game and its regular updates.
7. We need to be making games that are fun for you, our players, and that you're able to play, and to progress in, at a rate that feels good to you.

8. Any kind of "auto-play" feature we would consider would also need to be paired with the better botting detection and disruption.
9. Were we to go forward with an "auto-play" feature, it would need to be very carefully designed out, and include some basic limitations. For example, I would not want end-game farming items to be an option for this type of feature.
10. The fact that there is such a strong move for some type of "auto-play" feature says a lot about the reality of our game as it stands, what our players want, and what we need to keep in mind. We need that knowledge to help shape our plans (in whatever form they take) as we go forward.

As ShadowHunt mentioned, there are many ways something like this could be implemented. Some ideas that we've floated are including an idle-game inside AQW, looking at a system like AQ Classic's estates, adding minions that could go farm gold, rep, xp for limited amounts of time while you do other things... there is an almost infinite universe of ideas. We want to get your thoughts on what you want to see -- or not see -- as we explore the idea internally.

Again, thank you all for your time, passion, and feedback. Have a great night, and Battle On!

< Message edited by Alina -- 5/30/2018 13:24:20 >

AQW

Post #: 37

5/29/2018 19:58:16

Aura Knight
Banned

quote:

1. We have talked about this idea, or some form of an auto-play feature on and off for years now. Our idea of "auto-play" is not "open a program to let the game play for you while you walk away and do something else away from your keyboard."

It's nice to know that it won't be like that, but if it isn't, should it be called auto-play at all? If the intent is to just reduce the player interaction with their character by a little bit, I'm afraid it will not do much to increase enjoyment of the game. The problem with AQW is that it is a game which seems to be forcing players to stay logged in longer than they'd like to get rewards. I can understand putting in some effort for the items which are considered endgame but for average things it often becomes a nuisance. This is why I'd rather see changes to quest designs than how we play the game.

quote:

2. This is not a thing we are 100% committed to doing, or doing in a given timeframe, but it IS absolutely worth exploring in discussions with you, the community.

I find it odd that of all things that could possibly make AQW better, the one you're considering is a feature that can be seen as an insult to anyone who plays how we agreed to. An auto-play feature should be a last resort if anything. I have been playing this game since the alpha days and it hasn't had much change either in quest design, combat, sounds, anything that would make me enjoy playing. Would it not be best to focus on those details first and then worry about whether or not to allow auto-play features? What are we expected to find so appealing about a game that now fails to be fun every week. The few rare exceptions don't make up for months of boring releases.

quote:

3. If done right, there is real potential to help a number of players better enjoy the game.

Unlikely that this will help players enjoy the game. How can it if it reduces interaction between players and their game characters? Sure you say this won't be a set up a program and leave to then return to some nice rewards thing but I have difficulty believing this. I'm probably going to sound confrontational but I'm sure there has been times where communication between players and staff lead to one side being upset at the other. While it's not bad to make promises, false assurances will only hurt the faith we players once had in AE staff. On the other hand, I do hope you're right. AQW has been seeing a decline and if this suggested feature does make the game more enjoyable, maybe it wouldn't be so bad. We'll have to see how it all turns out.

quote:

4. It is important that we look at how people are playing games now -- ours and others -- as we look towards the future of AQWorlds - both in its web form and in future versions on other platforms.

It's a nice thing to consider but the unfortunate truth is that people are not playing the game. At least not as much as they once did. To see the current number of players only in the mid-2000s is quite sad. You could look towards mobile gaming but I don't think that will change things too drastically. The remaining players are likely sticking around for nostalgia and while there may be exceptions to this and there could be players who do enjoy the game I don't know how much longer they'd wish to stick around. AQW now pales in comparison to its earlier days and unless something is done the misconception that the game is dead may actually become an accepted truth. And when comparing AQW to other popular games, I doubt it can compete well enough. I would expand on this more if I were an avid gamer but I'm not.

quote:

5. So many of our players are young. Many are ten or younger when they start playing. That was true in 2008 and is still true today. Younger kids these days grow up in a gaming universe that is fundamentally different. Games in general are easier to start playing, and hold your hand much more early on.

It is because some players are young that changes to quest design need to happen. It is unhealthy for anyone to be staring at a screen for hours at a time just to get a single item. I'm sure there's times where AQW players sacrificed sleep to get certain drops and that is just wrong. It's no wonder some people think it's fair to say "forget the rules" and play by using other programs. I don't wish to get into this too much because I understand it's not something the forums allow but for the sake of this response, I'll say it anyway. The way AQW is as a game lead to the rise of bots plaguing it. If the incentive to bot is removed it might make AQW a much better game than it currently is. AQW is a very simplistic game that makes failed attempts to be challenging by adding things like rng to quests. This is something to consider removing or using less of.

quote:

6. What we don't want is for people to get frustrated and leave. The fix for that is buried deep within the game's structure and design - both of the larger game and its regular updates.

The best way to prevent players leaving is to increase communication between players and staff. A single person responding to everyone's issues on Twitter is not good enough. I often feel bad for you Alina since you need to deal with sometimes rude individuals and pretend they don't bother you. There needs to be a better way to provide feedback each week that doesn't involve tweeting at someone. People leave for varying reasons but the one that could be corrected is that the game isn't fun anymore. Throughout the years AQW should have been given feedback by ordinary players and I think it's about time those suggestions are taken into consideration. Not only would it improve the relationship between AQW staff and players but it would hopefully repair the sorry state the game is in now. Of course, having an idea on how to fix something isn't as easy as actually correcting the issue. But the longer nothing is done, the fewer players AQW will have and at that point, would it be worth trying to fix the damage?

quote:

7. We need to be making games that are fun for you, our players, and that you're able to play, and to progress in, at a rate that feels good to you.

This is a nice goal to have. And I hope you succeed in making this dream a reality. There was a time AQW was very fun and there's nothing wrong in thinking it can be enjoyable again. All depends on what is done from now on. Listen to the feedback and try to act on things more would be my advice to you.

quote:

8. Any kind of "auto-play" feature we would consider would also need to be paired with the better botting detection and disruption.

Sounds good. Hope it works as you'd like it to.

quote:

9. Were we to go forward with an "auto-play" feature, it would need to be very carefully designed out, and include some basic limitations. For example, I would not want end-game farming items to be an option for this type of feature.

Alright, but therein lies the issue. What would be the point in using an auto-play feature for anything other than the nuisance that is endgame farming? Farming for gold, xp, class points and rep is fairly easy. Could take a little while for certain things but still easy. But when it comes to endgame, oh man that is often such a pain. There's little sense of satisfaction when an endgame farm is finished. Yeah we get a new item but was it really worth all the days spent farming? Sometimes it isn't. If I had a simpler way to farm void auras or for AFDL that I knew wouldn't get me in trouble, I'd want that. This is odd to say because I'm somewhat opposed to having an auto-play feature. Perhaps I don't really know what I want.

quote:

10. The fact that there is such a strong move for some type of "auto-play" feature says a lot about the reality of our game as it stands, what our players want, and what we need to keep in mind. We need that knowledge to help shape our plans (in whatever form they take) as we go forward.

Players don't wish to waste their time on a game that doesn't often deserve their attention. It's no wonder so many voted in favor of this feature on twitter. But what about those who voted against it? Do their opinions not matter? I know this feature might not happen and it could just be optional if it is implemented but what if it causes the remaining legit players to give up on the game entirely? I really wish twitter wasn't the only means of letting you know what the players want. This is why we need a better medium for interaction between players and staff.

quote:

As Brittney mentioned, there are many ways something like this could be implemented. Some ideas that we've floated are including an idle-game inside AQW, looking at a system like AQ Classic's estates, adding minions that could go farm gold, rep, xp for limited amounts of time while you do other things... there is an almost infinite universe of ideas. We want to get your thoughts on what you want to see -- or not see -- as we explore the idea internally.

AQ's army feature is a nice concept to consider for AQW too. We have houses in AQW and perhaps more could be done. And if armies are added, wars could be finished quicker too. You'd even get some bonus gold, xp, and maybe even reputation when doing this. If AQW could have such a feature it would be a step in the right direction. Though farming for such things isn't complex, a means of reducing the time spent logged in wouldn't be so bad.

Well that just about wraps up my likely very long response. If anything I wrote could be considered offensive, I assure you that is not the intent.

AQW

Post #: 38

5/30/2018 2:02:22

megakyle777
Member

Gonna weigh in here for a bit.

quote:

As Brittney mentioned, there are many ways something like this could be implemented. Some ideas that we've floated are including an idle-game inside AQW, looking at a system like AQ Classic's estates, adding minions that could go farm gold, rep, xp for limited amounts of time while you do other things... there is an almost infinite universe of ideas. We want to get your thoughts on what you want to see -- or not see -- as we explore the idea internally.

Honestly, thinking on it, a system that combines AQ classic, a BIT of farming so as to avoid complaints, and the minion thing, where you buy a house, turn it into a estate by farming, hire minions and send them out to do stuff while you manage your house would possibly be the best way to do it. Plus, for those who were against making end game item farms, the solution is easy: make a estate as a next tier version of already existing hard to farm houses. For example, you can earn a Third Tier Nulgath Estate that allows you to hire Nulgath minions to farm base and advanced reagents as well as the base gold and rep and whatnot. You'd still need to earn them to get to that point so it's not too bad. Could be done for Doomkight or Dage houses too, or really any big farm. Earn some of the items, turn it in for a estate, make it easier for the rest. In essence it'd be no different from when some farms have shortcuts like how NSoD has a Seppy Armor shortcut.

Plus, there's a lot more you could do with this system then a mere auto farm. You can send in armies to fight in wars like in AQ, you can expand it into some kind of Kingdom Managing Mini/Sidegame, you could tie it into guilds, you can have solo options for those who want their own piece of land to compete with guilds, you can have Kingdom wars or alliances ETC.

< Message edited by megakyle777 -- 5/30/2018 2:05:57 >

DF	Post #: 39

5/30/2018 9:44:04

stuart
Member

@ Alina,

Thank you for taking the time to explain on the forums. Not all of us are twitter users and strangely enough rely on the forums for our game info.

An idea like the house functions in Adventure Quest is a great idea as the house/war events have been proven to be a big hit in that game, but now I am a little bit confused. I checked the link that Megakyle777 has in his original post and there you state that you wanted peoples opinion on the idea to "farm, level up, gain gold/rep/class points". Now I could see how an AQ house type introduction could be made to work for the items you mentioned except for the "farm" part. How could that part be included in a change like this?

In that post you also state that you want to try and stop people using third party programs as you cannot guarantee their safety when using such programs. The house system in AQ is mainly a Z token item where people invest a lot of real life money to be efficient. Do you really think that the people we see using the third party programs previously mentioned are going to stop using them and invest actual cash to acheive the same results? I personally do not see this happening.

Edit, Just thought about it and to do something for the basics of xp/gold/rep/class points could be done in a way like the pirate trobble game from Captain Rhubarb....Maybe....

< Message edited by stuart -- 5/30/2018 12:03:57 >

AQW

Post #: 40

5/31/2018 21:24:13

mutzy88
Member

Maybe you could implement a pet that requires something like Gold, Acs or something else to activate auto-farm for a certain amount of time every 24 hours.

My Thoughts on this:
Some sort of currency or something for the pet to use up for the auto-farm feature
4-6 Hours of Auto-Farm time every 24 hours
------
All i can think of, May edit in the future.

AQW	Post #: 41

6/1/2018 1:52:18

Rayimika
Banned

I'm just starting, but as I'm seeing it, the game isn't complex enough to justify some macro functionality built-in. Maybe one could /join sewers, press a button and send his player character hunting for rats while offline to turn in in some crafting quest into furs for sale later on - that would be fun, sure, but by no means necessary.

AQW

Post #: 42

6/1/2018 5:44:49

Poly
Member

quote:

Alina:

3. If done right, there is real potential to help a number of players better enjoy the game.

Creating a bot means there will be very few legit players playing the game, people won't even be playing (well, it's not like AQ have much legit players anyways to begin with.)

If majority of users bot, it means the game has terrible gameplay/mechanics. Create a bot to solve the issue? A little bit silly. Why not just eliminate the desire to bot altogether and make things a bit less ridiculous? Ie. Don't make monsters with 500k with a 1% drop.

But it seems AQW is hesitant to do this. Creating a legal bot is better than nothing I suppose. And since AQ isn't going to make the game less ridiculous or take any suggestions (i.e. no one's suggestion is ever taken into consideration, see forums), please do create a legal bot. It's not like most people play the game anyways, and I (and other players) wouldn't mind saving our time farming for fifty hours ever other release, ridiculous.

quote:

Alina:
6. What we don't want is for people to get frustrated and leave. The fix for that is buried deep within the game's structure and design - both of the larger game and its regular updates.

And the above reasons is why people get frustrated and leave. (On the plus side, almost everything released these days are legend or AC only, isn't that great?

). It's not rocket science.

< Message edited by Poly -- 6/1/2018 5:53:20 >

Post #: 43

6/1/2018 8:25:05

Foulman
Member

quote:

If majority of users bot, it means the game has terrible gameplay/mechanics. Create a bot to solve the issue? A little bit silly. Why not just eliminate the desire to bot altogether and make things a bit less ridiculous? Ie. Don't make monsters with 500k with a 1% drop.

If that were the case, I wouldn't feel such a powerful urge to bot. AE's gone well beyond the old 500,000 hp bosses with 1% drops. It's more of a "kill this boss and these minions X amounts of times for a 0.5% chance to get a certain item." After getting said item after 200 turn ins, you then find out that you need to do that 30 more times. Oh, and after you complete that second quest, you only have a 1% chance of getting the actual item from that third quest.

There's a very fine line between "hardcore" and a botting incentive. Living Blademaster was "hardcore." Void Spartan, VHL, AFDL, NSOD, SDKA, AoA and BLoD are not hardcore. They aren't even proper bragging rights.

AQW

Epic

Post #: 44

6/1/2018 9:11:35

Edme MacHeath
Member

Killing binky for a 2% drop for a chance at 3 1% drops is essentially impossible. You essentially have to kill binky thousands of times just on average to get those items. The same with thanatos helm and armor, its phoenix blade for a chance at a .01% or whatever meaning you need to kill red dragon 10,000 times for the armor and another 10,000 for the helm because 1%x.01%=.001%

Those two paragon pets were the stupidest decisions ever made. Nobody wants to kill binky 15,000 times or kill Red Dragon 20,000 times and that would be averages and it could be so much worse because its RNG.

RNG doesn't do anyone any good when it gets that stupidly ridiculous. You might as well add legendary tags to those items and/or their own badges.

I don't believe autoplay would fix anything. We still would have stupidly low drop rates and farms that take dozens of hours.
To be quite honest most of the factions are doable already and it would help if more were expanded upon rather than given an autoplay feature. Alor of the small unimportant factions like pet tamer are just so niche and small that they almost don't exist
I also believe terrarium could use more factions added to it. Which would help members. Another thing is to remove the replacement monsters in places like arcangrove which hurt farming that faction

As for gold, I'm entirely confused. They weren't okay with us having extinction to farm gold but they are okay with the idea of auto playing gold? How does that even make sense. They keep nerfing gold farming and suddenly they wanna make it automatic?!

Level up farming is definitely a chore. Especially at high levels. But oddly enough with how high the levels are I almost feel it's justified. It would be nice if doing quests or something else besides just killing mobs over and over was viable to level up.

Class leveling up is considerable easy. It doesn't take more than 10-15 minutes with a boost to rank up most classes.

This entire autoplay just seems like a huge waste of a feature. It honestly wouldn't improve anything except leveling.
Reputation factions need to expanded upon anyways, class points are fine and gold autoplay is such an insult after removing extinction.

Moving forward I believe dailies and RNG are probably something that needs a relook, perhaps not necessarily action, but the way things are now is just silly. It forces more effort than needs be. Why should I spend a potential 2 hours on a 1% drop? I don't think RNG needs to be removed entirely but it needs to be looked at again.

Also people have to wait 60 days to get Cysero's armor and hammer assuming they are member. otherwise its 180 days which is wrong... 30-60 days is already enough for daily items. Other things like getting 90 moglin meals to get 3 moglin pets is 90 days always regardless of being member or not.

It honestly sucks when you combine RNG and dailies with hard farms. Uni 19 is essentially a .3% drop. Non member voucher is even less, it takes at least 4 days and probably way more to get 4 barium. Who is honestly making these decisions?

The endgame of AQW is just spamming your keyboard for hours. It is almost like the game is designed to be played on a bot. This needs to change.

< Message edited by Edme MacHeath -- 6/1/2018 9:34:56 >

AQ	Post #: 45

6/4/2018 18:51:26

Poly
Member

quote:

Foulman:

If that were the case, I wouldn't feel such a powerful urge to bot. AE's gone well beyond the old 500,000 hp bosses with 1% drops. It's more of a "kill this boss and these minions X amounts of times for a 0.5% chance to get a certain item." After getting said item after 200 turn ins, you then find out that you need to do that 30 more times. Oh, and after you complete that second quest, you only have a 1% chance of getting the actual item from that third quest.

An example of this that just recently occurred, Enchanted Frozen Claymore. Izotz used to drop Ice Shards according to the Wiki, but now it requires a quest and the 'Ice Crystal' drop for the quest is not even 100%, seems to be ~20%.

What AQ wants you to do (because bringing the quest window to the boss is not intended for the game; thus, "rule breaking"), is to defeat a boss with 140k+ HP with a ~20% drop rate to finish the quest, run back all the way to the first screen to turn in the quest, run back all the way to the boss to redo the quest x 50 times.

The genius who decided to change it and not just leave it as Izotz dropping the Ice Shards is beyond me. "We are making things better, why are people quitting?!" they say...

AE Team Employee: "I have an idea! Let's create a bot (and spend even less time on updates and new items) and fix this problem! *High five*!"

quote:

Edme:
The endgame of AQW is just spamming your keyboard for ~~hours~~ days. It is almost like the game is designed to be played on a bot. This needs to change.

This.

< Message edited by Poly -- 6/4/2018 19:37:57 >

Post #: 46

6/8/2018 21:23:46

dragontackle
Member

Sure im all for it. As someone whos spent over 400 or 500 hours farming back in my prime, i think this idea would be fine.

AQW

Post #: 47

6/9/2018 2:30:31

Appocolypse
Member

The zero-tolerance policy on botting should have remained and been enforced harder, this literally all boils down to people simply being too lazy to play the game as was intended. If somebody does not have the "time" (and I use that in a loose sense, because even 1 hour of farming daily yields results) to farm the "endgame items" then it is their problem and they should deal with it accordingly. Everyone wants the goods but nobody wants to work for it. People seem to forget that Endgame items are made for people in the Endgame, and who are willing to put the effort into getting them, if someone want to play casually then that is their choice and there is no reason to make AQW even easier than it already is.

The root of the problem is poorly implemented designs (questing, RNG, interface mechanics) fixing these and implementing them in the future would improve the game hugely

The fact that this is even a discussion speaks volumes to not only the teams ability, but to a large portion of the playerbase' selfishness. The idea of an Autoplay mechanic is frankly insulting to anybody who is actually willing to put time and effort into playing the game

AQW	Post #: 48

6/9/2018 12:46:28

Keeper of the Owls
Member

Botting is a result of stale and tedious gameplay mechanics. Fix/improve the mechanics and you won't need botting.

AQW

Post #: 49

6/9/2018 13:57:46

Ninjaty
Member

@above: There will always be people who will cheat to advance their own positions, no matter how well designed the experience may be. This holds true both in games and in real life, and has been a pretty consistent concept throughout all of human history, so I doubt it will end any time soon.

Unless the game comes with a button that completes all quests and gets you all items in the game, you can count on the fact that there is someone out there working to implement said button themselves.

Post #: 50

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