aryc0110
Member
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Dragon Master:
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Pretty sure there is no set way. Again, subjective. And no, I didn't interpret it as ''telling me how to play''.
Once again, this is not "how you have to play it". This is the bar the challenges are balanced around. The design philosophy. What you're able to do and how you're able to do it, at a baseline.
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What does this even mean, lol? Is this something you personally came up with as a strawman?
I'll address this in PMs, as discussing where a lot of DF players go might actually breach forum rules.
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That is purely objective - it just doesn't. If 5 potions and Pierogi weren't a thing that you can replenish after basically every AARGH or whatever challenge fight, then grinding for the weapon would've been worth it. It does something that other non-weapon items are doing better and basically for free as well. However, I am certain the Quadstaff got secretly nerfed because I could swear that weapon had MP regen as well. Still no reason for me (personally) to grind Warlic's Gift when BoA and the aforementioned items exist.
Don't see how they are ''crutches'' (if such a term even exists in a game such as DF), they are simply tools that you can acquire for free. Not using them is just making your life harder for the sake of challenge. Neither productive nor fun in my book.
By the nature of the debate we're having over bringing extra potions and pierogi at all this is subjective. Blade of Awe has half of Warlic's Gift's mana regen, which makes it fantastic if you need both your health and mana back in slight amounts, but not great when the sustain it provides isn't enough to keep your skills going. You say that food is "basically free" when you're spending as many as 3 DMs per fight, though likely 2 because you can get Pierogi for gold if you stop by while getting your extra potions. With how many medals you need for the AARGH gear that's probably going to cost you around 50 DMs if you're using it as frequently as it sounds like you are. That's 50 whole waves in a war with DMs you could be spending on upgrading gear. Unless of course you get them all from their original sources, in which case I envy your tolerance for tedium. What makes my life harder is going to Ruby or the Sunken Fortress every time I want to attempt a challenge.
You say it's not productive or fun, I say that the point of the Inn is to become more skilled at the game and doing so without a safety net so tried and tested that I'm basically guaranteed a victory in every fight I enter is the only way to develop any real skill or have any fun with a fight at all. At a certain point the average fight becomes similar to grinding trash mobs for Unlucky Doom Essences, with the only exception being that you hit more buttons.
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All (except calendar and rare) classes, depending on which I want to play at that time.
Pyro,enTropy,Kathool,sometimes Ancient Exosuit, Ascendant, Technomancer... etc.
Pyromancer and Technomancer are pretty good classes to pick for A.A.R.G.H. as they have solid burst and are generally very good classes for the Inn. Chaosweaver and Doomknight are usually the standard picks for AARGH farming, but it sounds like you just play it to have fun and not to grind it anyway so that doesn't really matter. I like doing A.A.R.G.H. this way too, for the record, and I'm not really a fan of just farming fights because it becomes really boring really fast. Ascendant is kinda iffy, as the class has been largely considered the worst of the Atealans, but it's still pretty solid if you know what you're doing, though it probably answers where that food and those potions are going considering it's a class whose strict rotations don't allow for good multi-hits and it has some questionable defensive options and a massive 5-turn setup time. EnTropy runs into a rather unique issue of a good amount of fights in A.A.R.G.H. resisting the Darkness element, so it's probably not the best to be throwing in at randomized challenges, but against specific challenges it's a beast and rather on-par with Ascendant's damage output. Do watch out for those mana costs, though. Kathool is really strong, but also very simple, like playing a class from early AQW with four skills that don't really interact very much. A lot, and I do mean a lot of people find it very, very boring. The playstyle wouldn't be so bad to me personally if the animations were anywhere near the modern standard, but the most important button you press has a slowly increasing PNG of Kathool with a fading in-and-out black screen. However, if you find it fun, power to you! It'll get you through almost any challenge at a walking pace. Ancient Exosuit, however, is a crawl and I really cannot recommend you stop using it for A.A.R.G.H. more if you want fights to be done in a timely manner like you seem to.
Since you added "etc...", time for a lightning round of highlights!
Dragonlord: Please do not use PDL on A.A.R.G.H., the setup time is literally 51 turns, go watch paint dry instead. Go ahead and use RDL if you can get it to work, though! Sounds like fun!
Ranger: A really, very, super solid class. Remember to keep your DEX and STR about equal while using it, its passive gives you a +15% damage boost if you do and the skills are Melee/Pierce locked anyway so you'll be doing nearly no damage unless you do.
Paladin: Oh God please no I have things to do at some point in the next decade
Necromancer: A really, super solid Inn class if played properly. Tanky and with a bit of burst to boot. It'd be good for "fun A.A.R.G.H." but I'm not too terribly familiar with the class myself, just the reviews, so I don't know how it'd do for grinding it.
Deathknight: Just wait for the update like the rest of us, please...
Dragonslayer: If you want to reset on every fight until you run into the dragon challenges? Go for it! Otherwise, this is literally worse than Base Warrior. I've tested both.
Soulweaver, with the Baltael's Aventail artifact: Really solid, runs into Kathool Adept's boring rotation problem, but it has some variety in that the optimal way to play is not to mash the attack button until one of your relevant skills is up again.
Master Soulweaver: Please play Baltael's Soulweaver instead.
The Entire Seasonal Roster: Evolved Pumpkin Lord is the only worthwhile class to play on this entire list, and even then it's not terribly great unless you can stun your enemies. Don't bring any of these into A.A.R.G.H.
The Chickencows: Base Chickencow is actually the best of these because you can use Mad Chickencow Attack over and over again and slot different on-hit weapon specials and, if played smart, beat a lot more challenges than you should realistically be able to, while the others just don't have enough usable skills to make up for it, with ACCL just being flat-out bad. A.A.R.G.H. farming? No. A.A.R.G.H. for fun? Go for it.
Doomknight: This is one of the big boys! Whittling down your opponent a little while your Inner Darkness charges up, clicking favor when it's about to be ready, and unleashing a terrifyingly powerful nuke will dust the majority of the old A.A.R.G.H. roster.
Chaosweaver: Is it really a surprise that this is the most recommended class? The thing hits like a truck, and as long as you can trial and error an order of skills for the fights you come across and are well-geared you can deal with the majority of them in less than 8 turns.
GPS: Don't use this class anywhere. Ever. I speak from experience.
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Okay let's assume I misjudged the Emperor. He is easy indeed, and that is what makes him boring. He simply has a lot of HP and does a typical ''set-you-up-for-a-nuke-that-you-can-easily-defend'' attack rotation. He's not fun in anyway and should be simply absent from AARGH. His only point in the game is to grind Unraveler Wings, as far as I remember.
Not every fight is going to be interesting in A.A.R.G.H. as they were pretty much all of the challenges, save for a few notable exceptions like some currently ongoing boards and Pride, who is specifically excluded because she can become unwinnable with enough Superior Superiority. Also, Sea Chicken Emperor drops Sea Chicken's Conquest, the best Wind weapon in the entire game and the best weapon to equip when using a class' innate heal.
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Let's pretend I exaggerated. Well, 0.5 hour at minimum. Sinnocence is just Legion Crawler+. There is absolutely nothing fun about him. If you take something which is 70% on the defensive side (e.g. Necromancer) and without even 5 potions, and you have decent WIS (base ~60), the fight is already over. It simply takes an unnecessarily long amount of time to finish him. For a single Timewarped Medal.
And no, I specifically mean endurance fights. Don't know (or care) about Illumina, rewards from those challenges are some of the weakest in the Inn, while some of the strongest come from Inn 2016-17.
I actually have a lot of fun with Sinnocence, he's one of my favorite early challenges because he's a different kind of endurance fight, where you can see yourself becoming more effective as time goes on and you can use class tools like stuns to kill him faster. I'd done the fight thirteen times on release with different classes. In A.A.R.G.H. however, he's just a relog. The solution to endurance fights in A.A.R.G.H., by the way, is exactly that. If you don't want to fight them you have to relog. Though that might make getting your extra potions and food a little annoying and less cost-effective.
Illumina is in A.A.R.G.H., so she's relevant to the discussion even if you haven't done the Conduit. Although, the highest base-stat trinket is from that board, so I recommend doing Crystal and Stone for the Ricterild trinket if nothing else.
I disagree with the notion that the strongest rewards come from 2016-17. The best Inn necklace, ring, damaging weapon, and overall cape came in 2018, the best overall weapon and healing cape in 2019, and the best helmet in 2020.
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To be quite honest, I haven't played Guardian a lot since the revamp, but as far as I know, nothing significant about it became changed. I would interpret it as a class made ''to-cater-to-those-AQ-players-in-DF''. Verly's intentions might have been good and I don't doubt him, but the final product that results is just nothing special for anything that the game offers. Maybe, let's say, bounty hunting. And yes, those training requrements need to go. That's just silly (came from such a period of time in DF's history too, anyway). If a player never played DF and there's no war to go with, he'd have to play Endless Togs for 50 waves.
The class was absolutely changed a bunch. Guardian rage weakness seeks, Guardian Dragon has an effect based on the enemy's HP, the heal and mana regen are more significant, its overall damage is buffed, and it has a passive that imbues your basic attack so that it's a good idea to use it inbetween abilities. It's much better than it was, it's just not very potent by today's standards. It's also much less of a lure for AQC players as it ties in more heavily with DF lore for Guardians now.
Dratomos:
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But as for this, I have to agree with @dragon_master. This take is so odd. Why shouldn't players use every available resource they have? Dishonorable? Like what? Who actually cares how another player defeates the fight if they are using options the game offers? These challenges are supposed to be fun, not a contest which player can defeat them with the most difficulty. What's next? Using DM items is dishonorable tactics, well-fed dragon?
Dishonorable is very likely not the right word, but they're pretty heavily frowned upon and there have been calls for an increased timer on Hardtack and Seaweed's stuffed debuff. Potions are usually seen as better because they at least require a turn to use.
Some available resources are contested as to whether or not they should be available in the first place. Hardtack and Seaweed are on this list, much lower than guests or now-fixed weapon specials.
To give an example: it was generally a pretty frowned upon tactic to use Vanilla Ice Katana, Frozen Claymore, or the Hamster weapons' specials before they were changed and it was a constant topic of discussion as to how powerful they actually were. Instakill skill procs were a contested topic as well, being essentially a way to go into a fight and hit the same button, relog, and repeat until you got the 1% chance to just outright kill your opponent. Guests are much the same way, and Verly himself views them as something to make the game easier for less skilled players and had them banned from PanEX because of the problems they caused. A lot of people want to see them outright banned from the Inn in general, and I'm among them because I don't really like the idea of slapping some RNG and bugs into a fight in order to beat it more easily. Guests are poorly balanced, they're supposed to make the fight just as difficult with or without them, that's why they add +60% damage to your enemy's damage, but they don't do that and can be used to cheese enemies and ignore their mechanics entirely.
To both: I don't think I've stated my actual opinions on extra potions and food clearly enough, and haven't stressed enough that I've been talking about community opinion and how the game is designed, not necessarily to be played, but to be able to be played, and that under these conditions regen weapons for both mana and health actually end up being really useful. I don't necessarily think that these need to be nerfed, I think they make for a decent safety net (crutch) for less skilled players and that's fine by me, I just won't be using them unless I absolutely have to. Despite the game not being designed around their use they don't fundamentally break it so hard that I want them outright removed, although I'd be fine with the stuffed debuff being adjusted. They're no Hamstorm, no instakill, no guests making fights trivial and irrelevant with the right bug or RNG, and they have some use even for players of decent skill level, such as bringing them into Inevitable Equilibrium or Pandora's Extreme fight.
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