RE: =AQ= The War Between Shadows 5


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RE: =AQ= The War Between Shadows 5 - Shadowfall II

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9/28/2021 23:50:35

Sapphire
Member

spoiler:

Do you want a cheesy bugged overpowered this works versus almost everything with MP strategy or something else?

Anyway, the heart monster was cake with Necromancer . But it had me thinking . It had a backlash effect. It makes me wonder if one of the war rewards or even the new MC set that's supposed to be tied to this storyline might have backlash...Hrm... Thoughts!! Questions!!

< Message edited by SapphireCatalyst2021 -- 9/28/2021 23:53:51 >

Post #: 26

9/29/2021 3:21:21

RobynJoanne
Member

Honestly, on my first try, I just coasted through with Panic. On my second try, I used PCO once, and then just beat it with Necromancer's absurdly powerful spells while keeping myself safe with Rend Mana's eleshield, which works absurdly well due to the Heart's mana regen meaning I could cast it over and over again and since reducing its mana prevents its nukes. On my third try, I used Paladin, which was really easy. I just used Paladin Armaments with Searing Radiance toggled. Daimyo and Fairy Godmother kept me healthy, and I just beat the Heart to death by repeatedly clicking the attack button. I even ended up finishing the fight with full HP/MP bars. That involved the least cheese and required absolutely zero effort, but I doubt this fight requires Paladin to be done since Cray has said so himself.

So, I was going through the Forums to find a way to do this fight "legitimately" without Paladin or cheese strats. I basically wanted to reduce energy and darkness resists as much as possible. I decided to go with Predator of the Night and Conglomerate Frankenshield. I also found Darkheart Mirror, which is absolutely perfect but unfortunately rare and costs Z-tokens (If anyone has it, please try it out and give me a reply! I'm grasping at straws here). I then used Murderator Gauntlet. So, what happened after all my effort? I almost got one-shotted (27 HP left after the first turn). I tried again with a subtractive darkness misc to bring both energy and darkness to <20%. I lost two-thirds of my health on my first turn. I'm guessing using low resistances is an inherently faulty route considering my results.

Post #: 27

9/29/2021 9:31:11

Lorekeeper
And Pun-isher

Damage reduction, Barriers, DoT and mana denial were the main ways in which I beat it without Paladin in testing. Paladin wasn't a hard requirement, but it did make the first attack much harder to bounce back from.

Seeing it hit live, though, I'm making a note to suggest a cooldown on seeking spells like that in the future.

In the mean time, a useful tip: Seeking attacks can prove easier to deal with by using a healing misc than a damage reduction one - You can bait an attack into the lower element of the two, then equip a misc that heals half of incoming damage for that. Irt and Werepyre were one of my mainstays against Light/Darkness seeking enemies because of that.

Post #: 28

9/29/2021 10:53:06

J9408
Member

I defeated it without paladin. It is possible.

I used Dreadlord of Nulgath(backlash mode on), PCO, Mana Trap, and darkness and energy Neko armor.

There was some gambling though, you have to switch Toamoth resistance to darkness and wait for the dracolich to attack first.

< Message edited by J9408 -- 9/29/2021 11:26:32 >

Post #: 29

9/29/2021 11:44:18

RobynJoanne
Member

Thanks, Cray for the help as always. It's always great to learn directly from you a boss's mechanics and the intended way to beat them. I did think of those effects and used them myself on all my runs. However, I considered damage reduction and barriers rather cheesy because of their unsustainable resource use without certain items, and I know of very few mana denial items. Silk Screamer Staff and Warlic's Oblivion Orb provide Mind Lock. Archmage Research's Dissipate Mana attacks MP. Necromancer's Rend Mana also works, but that uses PCO, which breaks everything. Is there anything, in particular, I'm missing?

Is there any reason a healing misc would perform better than an equivalent damage reduction misc?

Post #: 30

9/29/2021 12:21:51

BlitzAegis
Member

@RobynJoanne, unless you use a dual element resistance misc which tends to have a slightly weaker resistance than single resistance misc, it would be better to use Irt to heal 50% of the backlash damage you received from attacking using Light element.

Post #: 31

9/29/2021 13:01:24

Lorekeeper
And Pun-isher

No resource loops were involved in testing, so I couldn't sustain the barriers. I had to use them at their lowest cost save for at the very start of the fight. Healing miscs aren't inherently better than reductive ones outside of specific strategies, so I was imprecise in my prior post, but Darkness does have a recent-ish gold-costing one in the Eclipsed Dragon Amulet.

Post #: 32

9/29/2021 13:42:27

RobynJoanne
Member

@J9408
Right, but I'm trying to do it without something like PCO, which breaks boss mechanics. If we're not intended to beat Heart of Tiamoth with darkness damage, I'd like to avoid doing so.

@BlitzAegis
I'm not really having trouble with backlash. I'm having trouble with surviving both its energy and darkness attacks without relying on Paladin or overpowered damage reduction and barrier skills. Also, isn't the backlash damage in darkness? Paladin gets around that, but I'm also trying to avoid using Paladin.

I realize I'm probably placing too many restrictions on myself at this point. I was finally able to do it by using Space Gauntlet's Eleshield and Mana Trap, which is probably pushing it, but that was a lucky run where the Heart never resurrected its minion. In a less fortunate run, I was able to win with a couple of HP potions. Baiting attacks in the weaker element as Cray recommended really worked, and Mana Trap was the MVP. My damage output was minuscule compared to the backlash damage of Mana Trap.

Edit*
@Cray
Thanks for the help! I'm sure this would have been much easier if I used the Dragonlord shields. Is there a gold-costing darkness misc that heals? I only know of Shattered Horizon, which costs Z-tokens, and Haunted Dragon Amulet, which is for wind.

< Message edited by RobynJoanne -- 9/29/2021 13:54:12 >

Post #: 33

9/29/2021 17:14:25

Lorekeeper
And Pun-isher

Eclipsed Dragon Amulet is the Darkness variant from Obsidian Roots.

Post #: 34

9/29/2021 17:28:32

RobynJoanne
Member

@Cray
Is that a relatively recent addition? Obsidian Roots didn't have a misc item when it came out. I just checked Korriban Gaming's video on it.

Post #: 35

9/29/2021 17:39:21

OG Ranger
Member

quote:

Seeing it hit live, though, I'm making a note to suggest a cooldown on seeking spells like that in the future.

I like the monster the way it is. I know many others do as well. If multiple people find monsters of this level challenging you could fall back on the "challenge monster" option. The original is the challenge and suggestions like cooldowns could be the "normal" monster.

AQ	Post #: 36

9/29/2021 18:24:11

Aura Knight
Member

That fight wasn't too bad. Remember, you have 5 ally assist uses per day and this is an undead target. The thing which caught me off guard was taking random energy damage when I expected darkness.

I'm sure there's a way without using that but I chose the way of least thinking.

AQW

Post #: 37

9/29/2021 18:39:06

RobynJoanne
Member

The fight probably doesn't need a nerf. It's very doable with Paladin, and there are multiple ways to beat it even without Paladin. I realize my many posts may come across as complaints about the difficulty, but I've beaten the Heart over six times with at least some different items each time.

If anything, the fact that it's a 75% fight with no reward means that it'll probably be forgotten as is, which would be a true shame. I seriously hope this interesting fight will get a more prominent showing, perhaps at the end of the war, so future players will also experience it. Otherwise, I believe most will just skip this fight to get the war rewards instead.

Post #: 38

9/29/2021 18:45:32

J9408
Member

I am surprised that this is not the final boss. Because it most definitely feels like one.

Post #: 39

9/29/2021 18:57:40

skullmiser
Member

I am sad that the Twilight set counts as shadow armor, and makes the dragon use void damage. That's my go-to for darkness.

I blew through all the paladin quests after I saw this thread... Artix was a jerk! I was level 5 paladin, but suddenly I'm not allowed to quest until I did some knight junk. Oh well.

AQW

Epic

Post #: 40

9/29/2021 19:14:16

Sapphire
Member

There is an eclipsed version of the dragon amulet? Since when? I bought the shattered horizon, which I'm guessing does the same...and in fact, I am beginning to wonder if that's actually what Cray is referring to? It's z token. If not, again, there's an eclipsed version of the dragon amulet?

Post #: 41

9/29/2021 23:12:53

Biokirkby
Member

I redid the quest for the eclipsed dragonlord set, out of curiosity. There was no misc

AQW

Post #: 42

9/30/2021 12:17:52

OG Ranger
Member

Thank you staff for a fun war, a good boss in between, a nice story, and good functions items. Looking forward to future releases.

@Cray This is the third questline that I've liked in AQ. Usually, I'm neutral. Looking forward to reading more stuff.

< Message edited by OG Ranger -- 9/30/2021 12:23:32 >

AQ	Post #: 43

9/30/2021 12:34:04

Lorekeeper
And Pun-isher

This is going to be a really weird and awkward egg on face moment if I'm just remembering wrong. Going to do some digging, my apologies in advance if I was in error.

Post #: 44

9/30/2021 12:42:22

PD
Member

War's over!

spoiler:

Sword gives you dark elemental empower for each hit you land. At level 150, it's 3.1% per every hit. Should complement well with multi-hit armors and other strategies that boost dark damage.

For the shield, it looks like we've finally got a suitable replacement for Cutting Edge Guard! Every time you dodge, you deal harm damage. You can click the shield and spend 15% melee to boost your counter damage. The more you dodge, the more damage you'll deal.

< Message edited by PD -- 9/30/2021 12:48:15 >

Post #: 45

9/30/2021 14:02:18

OverLordOfDeath
Member

I wonder where this questline will be placed after it leaves limbo.

Post #: 46

9/30/2021 14:57:54

Lv 1000
Member

Info for the sword: Titan's Mournblade / Tiamoth's Vengeance

Post #: 47

9/30/2021 15:07:54

RobynJoanne
Member

Can we get a reward for the Heart of Tiamoth? I feel like many new players will never experience the fight just because they'll be rushing to get the war rewards instead, especially since the shield is so good. It'd be a true shame if such a great boss got forgotten.

Speaking of the shield, wow is this good. Thank you for this gift to all dodge builds. It's truly magnificent.

Post #: 48

9/30/2021 18:41:05

Lorekeeper
And Pun-isher

The quest line already has a hub at Warlic's quests, although Land of Returning Evil is presently missing a button. That should be fixed soon.

Edit: The War Between Shadows hub has been updated with Land of Returning Evil and Shadowfall II.

< Message edited by Cray -- 9/30/2021 19:48:51 >

Post #: 49

9/30/2021 19:56:04

PD
Member

Thanks Cray!

spoiler:

So seeing the end of this war, it looks like the finale is yet to come. The Mysterious Stranger looks like he's going to go in for his gambit. I'm guessing next time is the saga finale, and then we'll have some wrap-up/epilogue episode?

Post #: 50

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