Cursing, gone too dependent? (Full Version)

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King FrostLich -> Cursing, gone too dependent? (9/13/2011 8:28:15)

I'm retired right now for ED if any of you haven't noticed until late October or the first week of November that I'll come back so I've come to discuss some things about these delta weapons before I go back and do my studies.

As you may all know, the Delta weapons are the most devastating weapons in this game and people are buying it so they can get these rares until Delta ends. However, I've noticed something about it which is quite VERY annoying when used in combat. Every time I faceoff with a tact merc wielding the delta mace, I automatically get annoyed for 2 reasons:

1.) The build(high strength or support)
2.) The Delta weapon itself.

The only thing why the Delta weapon is always used is because players often depend on its effect which is called cursing that shrinks players and lowers 20 support. Now I remember when I faced that merc, I came to an almost unfair loss until I luckily crit him and beat him but what did REALLY get my attention was that mace. No matter how much dex I had comapred to his, my dex was clearly higher and of course I blocked alot but more than 1/2 of the match I was clearly shrunk like he kept using the mace endlessly or should I say strike,strike,strike,rage strike,strike,strike,strike,heal,strike etc. Although I won, I didn't like how the battle went because he deflected my gun 3 times which was quite annoying and how I got shrunk, well I blocked it but still got shrunk and people with Delta weapons always use it for shrink spamming.

Do you think that cursing should work only when doing a direct hit and not including blocks? I've lost 2 matches and only won 1, about a month ago because some guy spammed his delta mace and shrunk me endlessly even though I blocked alot and in the end, I get critted because my support was lowered because of the 'curse' effect.



rajkumar -> RE: Cursing, gone too dependent? (9/13/2011 8:44:16)

quote:

The only thing why the Delta weapon is always used is because players often depend on its effect which is called cursing that shrinks players and lowers 20 support. Now I remember when I faced that merc, I came to an almost unfair loss until I luckily crit him and beat him but what did REALLY get my attention was that mace.
I didn't support this statement its because this delta weapon speciality is to curse. Why we will use money to buy a simple weapon when we can get more powerful weapon.



King FrostLich -> RE: Cursing, gone too dependent? (9/13/2011 8:46:19)

You didn't read the last part of the statement. Of course I'd support its curse effect but not as in literally spamming it that it can even shrink you even if blocked.



drinde -> RE: Cursing, gone too dependent? (9/13/2011 8:46:39)

LoL, I though this thread was about players swearing.

Anywho, I think that Shrinks should be once per battle, or at least not work when blocked, as King Frost said.



rajkumar -> RE: Cursing, gone too dependent? (9/13/2011 8:51:45)

King you didn't get i only quoted few lines that i want to explain. And i know your feeling about getting shrink 3-4 time in a single match.I also had same problem when fighting a delta weapon player. But its just the speciality of the weapon.



King FrostLich -> RE: Cursing, gone too dependent? (9/13/2011 8:54:43)

The power of the delta weapon does not matter to me. Even if that thing reaches +37 base damage, I wouldn't mind that but its effect of cursing is the one that matters. Imagine I blocked his strike but got shrunk and when I regrew back, I blocked his strike but shrunk me again even though I won that match.



MirageD -> RE: Cursing, gone too dependent? (9/13/2011 8:59:30)

i wouldn't mind seeing curse not take effect if the strike is blocked....but i'd also like to see that same thing apply to smoke, poison and malfunction



drinde -> RE: Cursing, gone too dependent? (9/13/2011 9:03:05)

@^
What about Poison Grenade then? People would complain that it's OP.



rajkumar -> RE: Cursing, gone too dependent? (9/13/2011 9:09:33)

There is nothing in ed that is overpowered. All class and skill is balanced. Take poison grenade as an example its just do 3+13+13+13 damage. That's not much damage for a skill. If you heal you will get more hp then the damage done by poison grenade.



8x -> RE: Cursing, gone too dependent? (9/13/2011 9:14:41)

I usually buy all promo weapons as soon as possible, but I won't buy delta weapons until the end of delta (I don't like the stats and the look). I don't think its worth buying them now.



TurkishIncubus -> RE: Cursing, gone too dependent? (9/13/2011 9:39:41)

Im not using Delta Maul for its curse effect :/ , its totally extra and curse is all same for all classes , Delta Staff and Delta Claws also has curse effect there is not an unfair advantage between classes.

Also curse is only for strike so if some one uses Delta weps to spam curse(which is only -20 supp) its a bad strategy :/



Reki -> RE: Cursing, gone too dependent? (9/13/2011 9:55:48)

The Delta Weapons are the strongest physical weapons in game and have a nice look, curse is just a minor bonus and nothing more....and only a 13% chance.



IsaiahtheMage -> RE: Cursing, gone too dependent? (9/13/2011 10:48:13)

@Drine LOL! I was thinking the same thing. Anyhow I disagree. The Delta Weapons are fine.



Elf Priest JZaanu -> RE: Cursing, gone too dependent? (9/13/2011 11:05:12)

I do agree if you block the attack, the curse effect should be blocked too, yet it is not much different then being smoked, mal, or intimidated, those attacks can be blocked but the effects are the same.

I do hope that these types of specialties have a cap percentage. I think 13% is too high.



Sparticus -> RE: Cursing, gone too dependent? (9/13/2011 11:19:00)

While I agree that if the attack is blocked the effect should also be blocked I do not agree that it is the same as a skill attack being blocked and still having its effect activate.

Weapon skills like Curse are free, happen every time the weapon is used as a strike attack and use no energy in the process. Even though the activation % is low, if the weapon can be used repeatedly the likelihood of it activating goes up. Skills like smokescreen, malfunction and intimidate use energy and are less likely to be spammed. They all have cooldowns for a good reason, their effects are strong enough that they unevenly effect the outcome of the match. Weapon skills have no cooldowns and thus have an unfair advantage in that regard.

To be fair, weapon skills should be blockable when the attack itself is blocked.



Omni -> RE: Cursing, gone too dependent? (9/13/2011 11:32:15)

Well if we use the following formula's let's see in the numbers how much you gain from the 20 Support nerf.

quote:

Chance to Critical Strike = 4% + (Support Advantage / 7)%

Based on your opponent losing 20 support you gain about 3% chance more to crit your opponent and them 3% less to crit you assuming your support levels were even.

quote:


Chance to deflect = 10%+(Support Advantage / 3)%

Based on your opponent losing 20 Support you gain about 7% chance to deflect your opponent and they will have 7% less chance to deflect your gun/aux.

quote:

Rage Increase= 100% + (Support Advantage / 3)%

Your rage increase also increase by every three support so you gain 7% to your rage increases and your opponent loses 7% to theirs.

All in all you have a passive strike effect that occurs 13% of the time you use strike and grants you a 3% crit, 7% Deflect, and 7% rage increase, buff and nerfs your opponents crit chance by 3%, their Deflect chance by 7%, and slows their rage gaining by 7%, and this lasts for 4( IIRC) turns. It's not a large bonus, but it can certainly come in handy, thus if players are willing to take the risk of being blocked and ignoring the use of other skills to try and inflict this I see it as much more strategic than useful for mindless spamming.



Sparticus -> RE: Cursing, gone too dependent? (9/13/2011 11:45:49)

TY for the math; indeed having a 14% higher chance to rage first is substantial and a higher potential to crit and do 50% more damage is substantial and if you add this fact to the fact that the most common abuse build to use this tactic is a STR spam build you certainly have the potential for abuse. Taken alone, out of context, all the benefits seem minor but you can't take things out of context. Add them all together with the build that uses this most often for abuse and you understand the players concern.



Fay Beeee -> RE: Cursing, gone too dependent? (9/13/2011 12:01:33)

Well sorry guys but taking into account that I am a player and I have the Delta Claws (which I use) I LOVE the feature.

I think it is fun.
Yes I have shrunk people.

I have also BEEN shrunk, loads of times.

The best one for me is a double shrink.

Its fun guys. So try and enjoy it without 'picking it to bits'. This is only a game. A good one admittedly but a game still.

And by the way. It does not happen for me or to me all the time.



MirageD -> RE: Cursing, gone too dependent? (9/13/2011 12:15:41)

i have to disagree....that just because the effect doesn't cost energy...it should or shouldn't be blockable or similar skills shouldn't be blockable....there are other energy costing skills that are blockable



Luna_moonraider -> RE: Cursing, gone too dependent? (9/13/2011 12:26:18)

i wonder if u can be double cursed in 2v2. eg i have delta weps i curse a person, then my partner also has delta weps would he be able to curse the person while the person is in curse and make the support debuff to be -40 instead of -20. i just wonder hmmmm. but i think that curse effects should no be blockable as the % of getting a curse is just what 13% that sooo little.



MirageD -> RE: Cursing, gone too dependent? (9/13/2011 12:50:16)

i do agree with fay....i think it is a fun skill...and adds humor to the game [:D]



PumKing -> RE: Cursing, gone too dependent? (9/13/2011 13:52:19)

Since the curse effect is free, I would not be bothered in the slightest if it only activated from a connected hit.



Elf Priest JZaanu -> RE: Cursing, gone too dependent? (9/13/2011 14:10:29)

My only issue with it is that if it is 13% today, what will be 14% tomorrow. Though these specialty moves are fun, they should have very minor effect on pvp play. More or less, they should be a novelty; the stun guns are a very good example. Imagine if those had a 13% chance to stun.

~JZaanu



PivotalDisorder -> RE: Cursing, gone too dependent? (9/13/2011 15:46:13)

im confused, wasnt the effect a 5% chance when they released?

also I'd be surprised if shrinking people is a legitimate tactic employed by anyone, rather its a bonus for something they would already do.



redxtra -> RE: Cursing, gone too dependent? (9/13/2011 17:18:43)

no its always been 13% for curse
5% for stun gun and...
wasnt it + 5% crit for celtic cleaver



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