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RE: Gears games: requiring urgent balancing

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7/29/2012 4:43:16   
Glais
Member

@Selutu:Actually. Had been referring to the normal AWHMs which is where confusion may have stemmed from.

Anyhow, anyone know where the CHM pedia entries are? Weren't under "Corrupted" and outside that I have no idea where to look.

They really need a buff though. Or TerriFi, etc. need a nerf. Hmmmmm....

< Message edited by glaisaurus_x -- 7/29/2012 5:21:30 >
DF MQ  Post #: 201
7/29/2012 7:51:48   
Hoggs Bison
Member

@Gamemastersam

The purpose of pure power is to steamroll everything (and farm).
What's the fun in using an OP offense build when you can make your enemy's death slow and painful with a nice little EP sapping build, or nerfing/healing builds...

@Stealthwings

Mostly just the Trader's Caravan weapons, EDSP's boost is just...amazing.
MQ  Post #: 202
7/29/2012 8:28:26   
Megadragonknight
Member

Pure offense is most of the time a good offense against lots of opponents, but some opponents especially maria series needs defensive to keep dodging its super OP attacks especially when maria is raging due to the overwhelmed power i had damaged her which i was so super annoyed.
Post #: 203
7/29/2012 8:53:40   
Hoggs Bison
Member

^

OP damage is weak against well put together defense builds.

OP builds can be:

Sapped dry of their EP

Get nerfed to death

Useless against healers

Obliterated by DoT builds.

What i'm saying is, pure damage just sucks.
MQ  Post #: 204
7/29/2012 8:58:22   
ScytheOfShadows
Member

@Hoggs Bison Pure Defence solves your problem - provided you don't get crushed by their sheer damage before you can setup your defences.
DF MQ AQW  Post #: 205
7/29/2012 9:02:10   
Hoggs Bison
Member

^

Nerfing builds can easily crush pure offense builds, sheer damage becomes damage, and without any GOOD specials, the damage becomes useless, and the opponent can never win.
MQ  Post #: 206
7/29/2012 9:24:23   
ScytheOfShadows
Member

Anyhow... it's already been shown that pure damage will do no good. And for cripe's sake, even AWB's damage is by no means impressive. I think my Valkyrie Prime is on par with it and heck, the Valkyrie Prime is seen as a DEFENSIVE mecha.

But sadly, I think the problem is not with the AHMs, it's with the GGHMs. They replaced the ARH and AMR's Shoulders with crap, and give AWB some wicked BtH nerfing Shoulders to make their mecha both "damaging" and with something to fall back on.

If we were to scrap the idea of being forced to pilot GG mecha, then what can we do to be able to identify ourselves from various Houses? Be allowed to use any mecha but must have some House-related item equipped as a penalty?

< Message edited by zccheng97 -- 7/29/2012 9:27:31 >
DF MQ AQW  Post #: 207
7/29/2012 9:55:24   
Alex Wolfblade
Member

Yeah, after using the AWB for a while I've noticed... this thing sucks. My Platinum Falcon-P which is supposed to be a weaker version of the Falcon outplays it by FAR with Falcon Smack and the sheer amount of times my shoulders overcharge and do an extra critical shot on top of 90~ damage. I feel ripped off, the Adv. house mechs need a buff.
Post #: 208
7/29/2012 10:13:15   
Selutu
Constructive


 @stealthwings
The Passive +10 Defense was the only decent thing from last year, but the actual special in no ways fits in with a MR mecha. Also RH is the only one that buffs its Defense (via Mana Shield), MR has never been a Defense buffer.
DF MQ AQW  Post #: 209
7/29/2012 10:18:34   
ScytheOfShadows
Member

@Alex Woldblade Your comparison has little logic attached to it.

1. The AWB are weak compared to most mecha in game. Since their creation in 2008 or so they have no received much of a revamp except for the higher levelled 35 and 40 versions.

2. The Falcon is admittedly borderline, if not already, overpowered with its recent buff.

3. The Falcon is supposed to be a defensive mecha.

4. The AWB is supposed to be a damage/tank mecha.
DF MQ AQW  Post #: 210
7/29/2012 11:31:17   
Thiefboy109
Legendary AK!!!


 Would it be that big of cheating if everyone in RH made alts in Wolfblade and just ejected every battle? Because if that's actually possible it should probably be fixed.

@Alex Wolfblade
Actually the two falcons are equal in power with the same specials. Both also received a buff when the permanent version was released. So Wolfblade deserves a little more credit. It's not good, but it's a mecha that many will end up using sometime in their MQ life.
AQ DF MQ AQW  Post #: 211
7/29/2012 12:46:46   
stealthwings
Helpful


 I would rather +10 defense to what the ARH has, I haven't used it once besides to test it.

Though WB got +10 boost, did they not? I would rather that to either.
DF MQ  Post #: 212
7/29/2012 12:48:07   
blues
Legendary AdventureGuide!


 Don´t forget that the AHM´s were the TOP Mechas the time they were released. They were my first real big project some years ago. Since then MQ evolved a lot and specials got introduced we never thought they were even possible.
The GGAHM´s got something complementary last time. This year they will get something completely different and the "new" series of the HM´s will be completely different to everything currently ingame.
We found a way to make the GG´s real fair, hopefully vivi finds a way to code it. But I´m sure that not everybody will be pleased with this solution. I´m really curious who will win in the end when it´s more fair than ever before, maybe we will see the same result as the years before, maybe not.
Post #: 213
7/29/2012 13:05:06   
Sqwall
Member

^I REALLY hope the RH retains their Mana Shield and it's overall lean the advanced versions have.After all Mana Shield is like the signature thing RH has and plus i like it SOOOOOO much...It's possibly my most favorite piece of equipment/special in the entire game and it's been like that for years.
Blues please keep at least that much in the new RH...oooooor make it even better? :D
AQ DF MQ  Post #: 214
7/29/2012 13:07:28   
Glais
Member

@Blues:Just curious, how do you feel on the GGHMs balance with each other? Besides that, this new solution sounds like it could potentially be good. Wondering exactly what it is that could make some people not like it though.
DF MQ  Post #: 215
7/29/2012 13:18:12   
stealthwings
Helpful


 @Sqwall
I wouldn't be worried. "This year they will get something completely different and the "new" series of the HMs will be completely different to everything currently ingame." means that we should probably be happy. My money is on something better. Though I would definitely like to keep a reflection shield, "different to everything currently ingame" sounds good too.

@Blues
Are we to expect a redo of the situation with the AHMs? They redefine gameplay completely, and are the best thing there, until eventually more stuff gets on their level?
Or are you somehow expecting to bring in something totally new without making it completely amazing? Because I don't think that that has been done in MQ yet. With the exception of DWA, which brought a bunch of new stuff, but wasn't completely amazing like some of the more recent new stuff. It did pave the way for awesome stuff though, the eagle and ARH both had reflection, though N/BoTs haven't really been amazing, they were too similar to regular nerfs/buffs, and are thus bound by the same balance as them. Besides IN/BoTs, but even them the caps just redefine into just infinite buffs of the cap which are smaller until enough turns.
DF MQ  Post #: 216
7/29/2012 13:46:20   
Gamemastersam
Member

quote:

What's the fun in using an OP offense build when you can make your enemy's death slow and painful with a nice little EP sapping build,


the point is a quick and easy (and less sadistic) win. i dont wanna spend 10 minutes on 1 enemy.

quote:

Yeah, after using the AWB for a while I've noticed... this thing sucks. My Platinum Falcon-P which is supposed to be a weaker version of the Falcon outplays it by FAR with Falcon Smack


The Falcon (being one of the strongest mecha in the game and mabye THE strongest def build) would exterminate all HMs in a row mabye without healing. thats a really bad comparrison

quote:

OP damage is weak against well put together defense builds.


what is with you and def builds? they cant walk on water.

I beat maria 183 with dharmy all defaults. A defensive build is not something that can easily beat a offensive build. i cant see why you think def would always win.

< Message edited by Gamemastersam -- 7/29/2012 14:02:45 >
DF MQ  Post #: 217
7/29/2012 13:54:34   
EinhanderX01
Member

Ejecting against opponents should just be outright not-counted. Or have a turn requirement of 6-10 skips; in which the enemy will have finished you off by then anyway.
Post #: 218
7/29/2012 13:56:32   
stealthwings
Helpful


 It isn't about which would win in a fight. It is about which would help more in a fight against a competent enemy. Falcon+Cloverblade loses to Piotr. ARH+Cloverblade does not.

And it depends on which is using strategy as to which wins in falcon vs AHM. If I controlled an ARH and the AI controlled a falcon, I would beat it. If I controlled a falcon and the AI controlled an ARH, I would beat it as well.

@Einhander
I think that losing should just not be counted. Otherwise, skipping until you die is perfectly possible.

< Message edited by stealthwings -- 7/29/2012 13:58:26 >
DF MQ  Post #: 219
7/29/2012 16:07:32   
Alex Wolfblade
Member

quote:

The Falcon (being one of the strongest mecha in the game and mabye THE strongest def build) would exterminate all HMs in a row mabye without healing. thats a really bad comparrison


I don't even care about builds >.> I just wanted to try the AWB 'cause it looked cool, and somehow I managed to take an AWB (before I had it) to the bossfight at White castle and DESTROYED it, (I think it was during the GG a few years ago) so I had very high hopes for it.
EDIT: Screw AHM, I just destroyed an Xtreme enemy with my Falcon, and the thing scales with my level, if I didn't have a girlfriend I'd marry it.

< Message edited by Alex Wolfblade -- 7/29/2012 16:55:19 >
Post #: 220
7/29/2012 17:58:29   
Gamemastersam
Member

quote:

EDIT: Screw AHM, I just destroyed an Xtreme enemy with my Falcon,


The AWB can do that too you know.
DF MQ  Post #: 221
7/29/2012 18:14:03   
Glais
Member

Most things can nowadays.
DF MQ  Post #: 222
7/29/2012 20:21:27   
Selutu
Constructive
quote:

I would rather +10 defense to what the ARH has, I haven't used it once besides to test it.

Yes, that is quite true, but then you look at the actual special of it... What exactly is the point of the special if you can't get hit? Nothing. Also a 1.25x DoT is barely any help... The only thing that works with it is the other 1.25x DoT from the other shoulder and the 1x HP DoT from the FA...

@EinhanderX01
But both last year and the year before they were.
DF MQ AQW  Post #: 223
7/29/2012 20:44:41   
Gamemastersam
Member

@^ He was sayhing that it should not be counted. And i agree. If someone really wanted to win the GG then they should PROVE their superiority over WB and beat us with their own mecha. not through a design flaw. i wouldnt taunt anyone for ejecting, but that doesnt mean i agree with it.
DF MQ  Post #: 224
7/29/2012 20:50:00   
Glais
Member

I agree as well. It's just way too cheap. You're not fighting a real person anyways, so why should an AI fight count as a victory for any house?

< Message edited by glaisaurus_x -- 7/29/2012 21:00:50 >
DF MQ  Post #: 225
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