What has EpicDuel really become?


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3/13/2013 23:50:16

Rider_of_Rohan
Member

Hello everybody,

We’ve all experienced quite a lot with the implementation of Omega. STR/Supp Mercs, Mass Cyber Hunters, Azrael Mages, etc. With this massive influx of these so-called “overpowered” builds, the devs released a series of crippling nerfs that have essentially sucked much of the fun out of the game, leaving behind a bunch of 5 focus BHs and BMs.
Here’s what I consider overpowered: A build that is able to maintain both a high win ratio and get quick kills(i.e. 2-3 rounds). A perfect example of this is the original STR Merc build. They had the ability to two-turn you if not blocked, and they maintained a relatively high win ratio as evidenced by the leaderboards. The devs saw this and nerfed the Mercenary class into the ground. Huge nerfs to requirements for Hybrid Armor and damage for Double Strike and Zerker has now rendered this class unused and mostly forgotten, its glory days long past.

These buffs alone left the Mercenary class in a relatively good spot. True, many of the options for mercs had been reduced, but it wasn’t crippled yet. Then came the STR scaling nerfs. For a class that is highly dependent on STR, the scaling nerf hit it hard, and the end of days came for the Merc class.
This is just an example of what I like to call “non-friendly implementation”. What I mean by this phrase is any sort of change that restricts options in the name of decreasing power. By hurting the STR stat as a whole, having higher defenses was more efficient, which led to 5-focus and extended battles, which led to an increase in power and popularity for Bloodlust classes, as they are favored by longer battles. Essentially, offense in terms of STR and Support just isn’t worth it any more. Instead, we are forced to find offensive damage through our robots, deadly aim, plasma, bludgeon, etc.

Omega was supposed to bring about an increased variety in viable builds. However, all it has really done is extended the length of battles and made luck a MUCH larger factor in these battles. Is this really the bright future of Omega, where battles last for 10+ turns, with crits and deflects and blocks flying everywhere? Has the game really come down to luck-based 5-focus smackdowns?

What do you guys think?

Post #: 1

3/14/2013 0:00:25

TRizZzCENTRINO
Member

whose to blame? if the players would just play fair then this wouldn't happen, but noo they just had to find a way to abuse a certain stat, if players lack self control then the game would not advance much further.

quote:

all it has really done is extended the length of battles and made luck a MUCH larger factor in these battles. Is this really the bright future of Omega, where battles last for 10+ turns, with crits and deflects and blocks flying everywhere? Has the game really come down to luck-based 5-focus smackdowns?

so what are you saying? before you said that the overpowered builds make the battles last 2-3 rounds and now you are not happy that the battles last longer? without luck factors those build which requires no luck to win the battles would dominate, at the start of omega i hardly ever blocked a strength abuser mercenary because the battle was simply too short for any luck factors to kick in.

AQW

Epic

Post #: 2

3/14/2013 0:24:23

Mother1
Member

Oh please you really think the majority of players care about diversity? The masses mostly care about one thing winning, and if there is something that is vastly OP that they can exploit guess what? The masses will do just that. Then People will complain about it, the staff nerfs it, and then it is the same thing all over again. I haven't been here as long as some of the older players but that is how it is.

Epic

Post #: 3

3/14/2013 0:31:20

Stabilis
Member

EpicDuel caters to hardcore COMPETITIVE players surprisingly so try not to be surprised by me saying this but "if you cannot match up to players living in a world where people 'pull the rug from your feet', just get out of the house".

It is not and never will be the players' fault for how they can abuse the resources before them.

EpicDuel has to change it's outlook completely if you fellow players do not admire the environment you play in. That means from hardcore-competitive to strategic-competitive or strategic-cooperative.

Epic

Post #: 4

3/14/2013 1:45:12

TRizZzCENTRINO
Member

quote:

It is not and never will be the players' fault for how they can abuse the resources before them.

then why change the balance or tey to nerf classes/stats at all? why have 6 classes instead of 2 powerful classes? i guess everyone can just become a support abuser and leave it all to who starts first and gets the most crit.

quote:

EpicDuel caters to hardcore COMPETITIVE players surprisingly so try not to be surprised by me saying this but "if you cannot match up to players living in a world where people 'pull the rug from your feet', just get out of the house".

It is not and never will be the players' fault for how they can abuse the resources before them.

EpicDuel has to change it's outlook completely if you fellow players do not admire the environment you play in. That means from hardcore-competitive to strategic-competitive or strategic-cooperative.

if the devs think like you then the game would probably be even worser than now, they just have to expect players to either become that specific class or use that specific build, otherwise the players just have to suffer.

AQW

Epic

Post #: 5

3/14/2013 1:55:42

Wootz
Member

Soul & Heart stealing love. Just like my girlfriend. :l

AQW

Epic

Post #: 6

3/14/2013 2:27:20

kittycat
Member

It has been a wreck of Overpowered Azrael gear and scarcity of stats makes life in ED unable to be more creative. Deadly overpowered combos can be formed with Azrael's Will.

As what Mother1 said, creativity is no longer shared, but rather finding the build kills all is what everyone intends to do, then the cycle of nerfing comes in, and blah blah what a repeat. I've had 7 consecutive losses, due to extreme luck and brute force builds.

< Message edited by kittycat -- 3/14/2013 2:33:23 >

Post #: 7

3/14/2013 6:13:05

comicalbike
Member

i am just waiting to see how the game goes now
i have bought varium in the past but is it worth buying now the answer is no as in the past we could buy varium and we would get credits as well they have taken that away as well so just to buy variun with no credits its not worth it any more
i am trying to like the game but at the moment i am sorry i cant i dont blame the stat abusers its just a fault with the game and if it could be fixed they would have done it long ago
at least they are trying to fix it i hope they can
as with the stat abusers i would like a system that any stats above 75 on tech dex strength or support they lose 10 off health for each 5 over it or something like that
that includes all the stats added together
we will never stop the stat abusers so the game should be altered so they cant do it as its just human nature
all we want in this is a good value such as 10,000 and 50,000 credits that would be fairer but who knows i am just a player that's all and it is there game
i will try to like the game again but it very hard at the moment as the fun has gone now and good luck and thank you to the epic duel team for all the fun i have had in the past
and if i have upset anyone in the past i am sorry i always say what i think and it sometimes gets me into trouble but hey thats life

Epic

Post #: 8

3/14/2013 6:36:54

Silver Sky Magician
Member

The cynicism here is stifling.

Really, the lack of build diversity has always been an illusion. Many of the new builds that seemed viable recently were also viable way back in Delta and Gamma. The 'lack of diversity' was a self-restriction on builds that were proven to be successful, a consequence of the uncreative constituting the majority of EpicDuel players. Needless to say, many of the builds that do not seem viable today are in fact still usable; it is simply that people tend to follow trends and dominant builds.

It's not a structural issue. It's a social one.

Post #: 9

3/14/2013 6:39:08

Q...Q
Member

Cry babies, thats why.
I never seen a game with so much nerfs or game changes things in a year.

Epic

Post #: 10

3/14/2013 10:40:08

ThePriest
Member

For me, omega become too much free-to-play.
So it does not feel like this is no longer a game that appeals to me.
Balance in the actual fighting, between free and paid players is a good idea.
But right now you get too little when paying.
But have paid so will keep an eye on the development of epicduel.
So maybe come back if they change settings etc..
Existing what players who pay get out of paying.
To go from paying $ 50 a month at least.
Then reduce benefits so much in omega.
Feels like a big joke.

But who knows maybe epicduel shocks me.
And makes me happy so I will be back.
For gold yeti please it was a joke.
Pay for a robot is usually really good.
Then pay and compete in order to get a robot.
Please, it should have been the best robot anyway with unique skills.

I will not stop epicduel. will play on the weekend.
Will certainly make it around 2 months.
And it's still the same goals for epicduel.
That they do not increase the benefits to pay for a game.
I say goodbye.
Because I got tired total of all the free players who whine.
Epicduel has made mass changes on epicduel.
For you to be even equal to us.
But still wants you so that everything will be 100% evenly between pay and free players.
What's the point to pay.

Anyway thanks epicduel for 4 years of a good and fun game experience.
You will always be one of the top games on my list of web games.
I pray that you change your mind.
But why listen to a priest? lol

God bless you new epicduel.
And rip the old epicduel.

Post #: 11

3/14/2013 10:50:03

Stabilis
Member

Trizzcentrino,

If the developers thought like me (not sure why this is a topic), we would have 36 (6 * 6) skills per class by now. I would not wish on the game to be limited by a single schematic. Why do you think the last time I played was last month?

Epic

Post #: 12

3/14/2013 13:53:52

Master Smasher
Member

I agree, you can't really blame people for abusing a single stat, if it works and is the best option, why not go with it? it's what STR hunters and 5 focus builds do, players would always want the best option for a battle, and even if it does defy strategy, it's the unfortunate truth with I deeply hate. Yes, the staff wanted build diversity but they didn't get the fundamentals rights. Adding, crits, blocks and deflection ruined strategy, adding levels was unfortunately gave the player advantages, especially in lower levels (even though I really do not care about levels and so do others). Making weapons that are OP, such as that azreal gun which forces people to strike which I find way too over powered, and making this a pay-to-win game was also a bad move for forming this game into strategy

Epic	Post #: 13

3/14/2013 13:57:57

Warmaker04
Member

:D Say that to people which want mercs always keep creative builds, but they cant cuz of BHs and BMs hehe... actually 123 HP and 30 def 30 res str BM is actually the copy of old gamma build.

AQW

Epic

Post #: 14

3/14/2013 14:06:00

Master Smasher
Member

face the facts, almost no class can make creative builds that aren't a copy of these OP builds we see

Epic	Post #: 15

3/14/2013 14:09:49

Thylek Shran
Member

quote:

whose to blame? if the players would just play fair then this wouldn't happen, but noo they just had to find a way to abuse a certain stat, if players lack self control then the game would not advance much further.

Trizz, you describe something that is just not possible in a pvp game like ED.
Its all about owing the opponents to get wins and not about fairness. Fairness = loose.
If the game would be about fairness, there wont be OPed promo items, cores and other
things that give huge advantages. As good example the TaM class offers very OPed
build possibilities since the class was released and did not got nerfed enough.
But other classes like TM got nerfed constantly even that they only was OPed in early
Alpha due Super Charge. I cant remember a time where TMs was the strongest class
since then.

But I remember that in Beta BHs owned 1vs1 while in Beta and Gamma str and
support mercs ruled also. In Delta we experienced OPed new classes for a very
long time. First extremely OPed TaMs, then heal looping CHs, and then offensive
and later balanced 5 focus BMs. The heal and atom looping TaMs remain until now.
Yesterday I experienced some very OPed 5 focus BH sword builds with low str.
Everything is about defensive builds now since str got nerfed that heavily.

quote:

For me, omega become too much free-to-play.
So it does not feel like this is no longer a game that appeals to me.
Balance in the actual fighting, between free and paid players is a good idea.
But right now you get too little when paying.

Alot varium only items got removed but its definetly not an increase in
free-to-play. Just play 1vs1 and you will experience more than 50%
pay-to-win players with Azrael weapons. Things got changed but the old
pay-to-win pattern still is there. I think it was a mistake to make all items
accessable by credits because paying customers should get other benefits
than OPed items.

< Message edited by Thylek Shran -- 3/14/2013 14:35:37 >

_____________________________

v.35.3 (2016-01-23) ~ beam.to/shran

Epic

Post #: 16

3/14/2013 14:17:53

Master Smasher
Member

<snip> Do not quote post directly above you. ~Scakk

I strongly agree, builds are suppose to be obstacles to find the best way to own, this game isn't about pure strategy, there's also stat management and build making

< Message edited by Scakk -- 3/14/2013 16:47:04 >

Epic	Post #: 17

3/14/2013 16:40:01

TRizZzCENTRINO
Member

too bad that we do not live in a perfect world, people take wins in ED too seriously, if they lose they start name calling and that, if the definition of fun for them is pressing the same skills in the same order each fight then i have nothing to say.

AQW

Epic

Post #: 18

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