Allowing discussions of suggestions. (Full Version)

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goldslayer1 -> Allowing discussions of suggestions. (7/12/2011 15:36:51)

this is post number 2 of the old one that was never adressed by a forum admin.

quote:

hi, theres are some issues in the Epic Duel GD where we cant discuss about suggestions in the GD because they are labeled as "suggestions" however we can suggest these suggestions in the suggestion forums. but we cant discuss about it there.
so in the GD suggestions aren't allowed. but in the suggestions forums, discussions aren't allowed.
so how are we suppose to discuss about our suggestions?
can a forum admin/moderator PLEASE review and CHANGE this rule about not discussin suggestions in the GD since they are discussions about suggestions?

found here


quote:

My lock is not definite, by all means, just for the moment until an Admin, or Circe herself decide to re-open it.

its been to weeks and the post has not ben re-opened nor has any forum admin added anything to it.

this issue needs to be addressed as more discussions are being locked and neglected.



The Forgotten -> RE: Allowing discussions of suggestions. (7/12/2011 15:47:12)

An answer has already been established by Circe:

quote:

Ok. Time for some uncomfortable truths.

This is a new day, guys. I'm sorry it's been such a rocky transition, I really am, but now it's time to look at the situation in front of you and just accept that it isn't going to change. The days of Titan and Nightwraith haunting the forums to chat or respond to suggestions are over. They're crazy busy with all the ED work plus some additional projects getting tossed around here and there - they just don't have time for it. That's why you're here - because while I'm not saying that AE is perfect and I'm perfect and everything about us is perfect, we do have an entire staff dedicated to doing nothing but managing the community. We don't split our time, we don't serve two masters. When you say "I'm mad about the balance" we don't have any reason to say "yes but" because we don't work on the games. This gives us the freedom to say "I know, right? Let's see what we have here..."

ED Suggestions isn't the same as it was on the old forum. You're right, you can't discuss suggestions, but you can post them. And you can post a follow-up based on your discussions in PM and you can include a note in the follow-up that says "after discussing this at length with Angel's Holocaust, I've decided that we should..." to incorporate all your changes and give credit where it's due. PM gives you the freedom to have REAL discussions, not the polite ones that are carefully monitored by creepy, prying moderator eyes that will yell at you for saying h-e-double hockey sticks in public. This gives you the opportunity to have real exchanges that solve real problems before you present them to Cinderella who, by the way, is looking at everything in Suggestions. She's like Santa Claus - making a list, not seeing you when you're sleeping.

My point is you're all right. There are restrictions and limitations that hamper your abilities. But it's not like I said "deal with it." We've encouraged you to discuss and collaborate, just in a different way than you're used to. Sure it will take some adjustment and I'm not saying it's perfect, but it's something.

Eukara Vox's statement indicated that further discussion was possible if the forum admins decided there was merit to the suggestion. As 2 weeks have passed since then, it appears that there is no interest from the forum administration to further pursue the suggestion.



Angels Holocaust -> RE: Allowing discussions of suggestions. (7/12/2011 15:47:34)

Goldslayer1 does have a point, the majority of posts are usually in the general discussion and if we were to merge the suggestions and general discussions thread it would help benefit the forums.



5rr5 -> RE: Allowing discussions of suggestions. (7/12/2011 16:02:28)

You should acutally be able to discuss suggestions because suggestion is a part of discussion.



Mr. Black OP -> RE: Allowing discussions of suggestions. (7/12/2011 16:04:02)

would it be possible to open a new a new section in the ED forums? like Suggestion Discussion and only threads discussing about Suggestions would be allowed?



xxmirxx -> RE: Allowing discussions of suggestions. (7/12/2011 16:10:12)

We need place were we can freedom discuss membership but of course we will need make suggestion. And whole idea about pm someone to talk about suggestion doesn't work maybe it does for others AE games but not ED section.



ND Mallet -> RE: Allowing discussions of suggestions. (7/12/2011 16:17:21)

The problem here is that many suggestions for ED don't need discussed. What is there to discuss about a weapon? You don't decide the cost or stats. That's up to the Devs to do following the current demands of players. If there is any reason at all to talk about a suggestion then it would be a small thing like how it looks. If anything, the current Suggestion Section needs more threads for suggesting. We don't have an NPC suggestion thread or an area thread either, If I remember right.



MrBones -> RE: Allowing discussions of suggestions. (7/12/2011 16:21:52)

Supported



xxmirxx -> RE: Allowing discussions of suggestions. (7/12/2011 16:25:17)

we don't mean little stuff like that. Like I said membership, varium price, faction increase size, choosing your own 2vs2 parnters like 2vs1 boss fights Or even founders paying for buff or what ever but not about weapons. Theres nothing to talk about because its dev's have finally say.



Fay Beeee -> RE: Allowing discussions of suggestions. (7/12/2011 16:53:36)

Then why not start a post in the GD with a title of

THINKING of suggesting?
Then inside state what it is you want to suggest. Ask players if they have any suggestion to improve it?

May be able to do that?



Xendran -> RE: Allowing discussions of suggestions. (7/12/2011 16:53:57)

I posted something like this and had multiple moderators approve of it and it still got shot down.



goldslayer1 -> RE: Allowing discussions of suggestions. (7/12/2011 17:03:59)

quote:

Eukara Vox's statement indicated that further discussion was possible if the forum admins decided there was merit to the suggestion. As 2 weeks have passed since then, it appears that there is no interest from the forum administration to further pursue the suggestion.

if the admins will have to have some interests in this.
WHY? because its constructive and and it will actually help the forum. this way AKs and mods dont have to bother about locking threads because they see them as suggestions when we really are only asking for feedback on it.



xxmirxx -> RE: Allowing discussions of suggestions. (7/12/2011 17:14:40)

by the way I ask cindy and ashri to support us. As you can see there all talk about support us but no action. This what goldslayer having problem with the staff aren't here to support us or act like they when don't.My point and golds is how will dev's know how good are idea is if we do pm style. because are suggestion can change to improve ED by people out put. If we had this there will be less flaming.



*Nova* -> RE: Allowing discussions of suggestions. (7/12/2011 17:24:13)

I don't see why we can't have discussions in suggestions thread. As you know, no one really has a backup to that rule, they just follow it obediently. Since they are AKs or mods, it is their jobs to follow the rules without question. Sometimes, there are flaws in a rule but I think you need to talk to the staff who made them, AKs and mods just follow them like forumites should too.

But don't get me wrong, I do believe that we should be allowed to discuss in suggestions and suggest in discussion. One is really useless without the other.



Wraith -> RE: Allowing discussions of suggestions. (7/12/2011 18:12:08)

I totally agree.

The ED players have had ENOUGH, yes, ENOUGH of being treated as pot of golds for the AE staff.

We have the most promos, and the most expensive ones. We post suggestions to improve situations, then get cut down by AE mods who don't like losing Epicduel's moneybase.

Circe has posted that Suggestions can be posted in GD, so why can't ED Sugg be posted in GD? Sounds like segregation. Its not that I'm trolling/flaming whatever, I just don't like being looked down on by AE, and being forced to pay high prices. ED's quality is decreasing, yet you force us to pay higher prices than any other game. ED has no storyline, no lootable items, no farming quests, unlike DF. Look at DF: 20/25$ USD for DA, permanent upgrade. In ED, $20 (2500 Varium) is used on 1 weapon or 1 high-end rare armor. On DF< you can spend $65 for 4 exclusive, superpowerful items, and 40000 Coins. In ED, $65 gets you 11750 Varium, starter pack (useless), Delta Weapons (level 34, unlike DmK which levels with you), and the current promo, which will become outdated in the future.

To summarize my post, simply allow player's ideas to be posted in GD, and let us discuss how to fix the game. Moderators don't care, they get free Varium which they simply abuse to become the best and dominate everyone. They don't pay a cent. Just do some work that anyone in the forums would be willing to do for free. As players, we know what the game needs! Let us discuss how to improve the game! Look at it this way: Is a handful of true hardcore players that decrease by the second better than a large group of player that pay less? I think not.

Thank you for reading the entire way through the post.

~LS



Chosen 0ne -> RE: Allowing discussions of suggestions. (7/12/2011 18:45:50)

it's important guys, this NEEDS to happen, at least fix the suggestion board that we have, just make it like aq's. This si why these forums suck and the old edf doesnt!!!!!!!!!

We also arnt as creative with avatars or sigs in this forum.

@ND Mallet
We could create a sub forum board for weapons.



The UnleaShedWolfZ -> RE: Allowing discussions of suggestions. (7/12/2011 19:12:12)

I 100% Agree Cz When Someone Suggest Something In The Suggestions Sections No One May Read It Or SEE It..

Only a Bunch Of Guys That Like To Share Ideas Of Creating Weps For The ED Game.

So In The G.D , All The Peeps Could Chat Or "Discuss" About It , Or Rate The Wep Let's Say.. But Since It's Not Allowed.. <"Face Palm">

Edit : > Anyway , If This Doesn't Work.. How About Makin Our Own Forums For ED ? "Idk How But It's an Idea Tho"

Edit : > Guys Guys Guys.. Now I Get It.. Anyone Thought That : How About The Mods Or Devs Are Workin With a Company For This Forums.. I Mean I See Home - Login - Profile : Up > Wedding Account :P "Advertising.."
So They Can't Make It The Way We Want.. ? =)



king julian -> RE: Allowing discussions of suggestions. (7/12/2011 19:45:24)

yeah this happened to me yesturday i had a good bot disscusion going in the GD and it got locked cause i was also suggesting and disscusing way to much.



xxmirxx -> RE: Allowing discussions of suggestions. (7/12/2011 19:46:04)

Good idea we do pay most in ED at least let us make are section different all to get there.



Eukara Vox -> RE: Allowing discussions of suggestions. (7/12/2011 20:04:05)

quote:

Ok. Time for some uncomfortable truths.

This is a new day, guys. I'm sorry it's been such a rocky transition, I really am, but now it's time to look at the situation in front of you and just accept that it isn't going to change. The days of Titan and Nightwraith haunting the forums to chat or respond to suggestions are over. They're crazy busy with all the ED work plus some additional projects getting tossed around here and there - they just don't have time for it. That's why you're here - because while I'm not saying that AE is perfect and I'm perfect and everything about us is perfect, we do have an entire staff dedicated to doing nothing but managing the community. We don't split our time, we don't serve two masters. When you say "I'm mad about the balance" we don't have any reason to say "yes but" because we don't work on the games. This gives us the freedom to say "I know, right? Let's see what we have here..."

ED Suggestions isn't the same as it was on the old forum. You're right, you can't discuss suggestions, but you can post them. And you can post a follow-up based on your discussions in PM and you can include a note in the follow-up that says "after discussing this at length with Angel's Holocaust, I've decided that we should..." to incorporate all your changes and give credit where it's due. PM gives you the freedom to have REAL discussions, not the polite ones that are carefully monitored by creepy, prying moderator eyes that will yell at you for saying h-e-double hockey sticks in public. This gives you the opportunity to have real exchanges that solve real problems before you present them to Cinderella who, by the way, is looking at everything in Suggestions. She's like Santa Claus - making a list, not seeing you when you're sleeping.

My point is you're all right. There are restrictions and limitations that hamper your abilities. But it's not like I said "deal with it." We've encouraged you to discuss and collaborate, just in a different way than you're used to. Sure it will take some adjustment and I'm not saying it's perfect, but it's something.

~Circe


If Circe would like to add anything, I am sure she will. This topic is locked until then. Please do not reopen this topic, as it has been looked at (with the previous thread) and commented on by admin. If they have something to add, change, etc, I am sure the ED forums will have that announcement.



Circe -> RE: Allowing discussions of suggestions. (7/13/2011 18:40:59)

Unlocking this for one specific purpose. If you're bad, I'll lock it again.

quote:

Circe has posted that Suggestions can be posted in GD, so why can't ED Sugg be posted in GD? Sounds like segregation.


LS, you're missing one rather crucial point. In DF, only the game devs can post suggestions threads. They're going to post threads in the DF GD requesting very specific suggestions and the players can reply to it. Yes the thread can have discussion as well as suggestions, but that's the only thread soliciting suggestions at the time. That means that if a player posts their own suggestion, it's going to get removed.

If that's something you would be interested in, by all means, pursue it with Cinderella. But I wanted to be very clear that this isn't going to be a free for all in DF. It's far more regimented than ED Suggestions currently is set up.



Chosen 0ne -> RE: Allowing discussions of suggestions. (7/13/2011 20:00:45)

^ so if we want to fix our board, and yes i mean fix, because its broken, all we have to do is ask cinderella politely??

This isnt a sarcastic post if it sounds like it.



Circe -> RE: Allowing discussions of suggestions. (7/13/2011 20:32:49)

You misunderstand, slightly. I'm not going to just give in to demands without considering the circumstances or the overall context. But there are alternatives that we can (and should) explore if you're interested.

I'm going to be gone for a few weeks for work. When I come back, I'll take a look at this thread (and any others) and talk to my admins and Cinderella to see what we can do.



Hun Kingq -> RE: Allowing discussions of suggestions. (7/16/2011 23:25:36)

Suggestions should be able to be posted in Generl dicussion so we can dicussion suggetions or ideas, Thes two posts was deleted today because instead of moved to the suggestion forum becuase they contained discussions and players came up with Good Suggestions.

" Ideas for the Cyber Hunter"
" Try this ED"

Reason:Belongs in ED Suggestions.

These contained excellent suggestions/ideas and maybe that is the real reason why they got deleted.

Micro-managing and censorship at its best.



Stray Cat -> RE: Allowing discussions of suggestions. (7/17/2011 2:06:13)

ED Suggestions is a reply-only board, so expecting a discussion thread to be moved there rather than having the poster redirected to an existing thread isn't really reasonable. Additionally, with misplaced threads, it's policy to delete them and redirect the posters. What happened to those threads wasn't out of the norm at all. As for why suggestions aren't currently allowed to be discussed, and what the future holds for such threads, please see Eukara's post quoting Circe here, as well as Circe's follow-up. Feel free to further contribute, but, before doing so, please read over what has already been discussed to make sure that any points you bring up aren't redundant.



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