Requiremnts are being abused! (Full Version)

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Remorse -> Requiremnts are being abused! (11/9/2011 8:53:24)

Personally I think requiremnts are the worst kind of balance adjustment.
They are slowly ruining the game in the long run..
Just you wait soon their will be nothing left but focus builds all because of the pointless requiremnts.

Requiremnts are often used in this game as a last resort or as a asurance that they are trying to fix balance but guess what, it's making it worse.

More to the point when have requirments ever fixed it's intended problem??
Can anyone think of a time when requirments have actully solved or eased the problem they were made to fix??
I know I cannot, past events show that requiremnts didnt stop str BH and requiremnts didnt stop TLMs and that they will continue to FAIL except for the fact of making an anoyance an restricting creativity.



WHY OH WHY DO THEY CONTINUE TO PLACE REQUIREMNTS ON TLMS.
I am almost feeling sorry for the class, soon everyone of their skills will have requirments almost pratically forcing them to SPAM enhacements which the devs often assure us arnt always needed.
WHY I simply dont understand how requirements can help make TLMs balanced when it is not just one thing that makes them oped.
Thier str Build is not the only thing taking advantage of their skill tree, every build is.

It's their skill tree that is the probelm and adding pointless requiremnts will do almost nothing except ruin the future of this game this i can assure you.
You know what the way the balance has been approached towards TLMs has made me want to defend them.


I actully understand why now the TLMs are mad they must being think wow I would much rather 1 proper change then a million anyoing requiremnts and I dont balme them.

If it were me I would Remove all requiremnts and attack the problems within balance head on rather then attacking it braudly.
EG. switch hyrbid for Defence matrx but as a compromise remove all their requiremnts and make frenzy a sword/club skill.

Why is it that builds are forced to become balanced? I know that the thing I often enjoyed about the game was making wacking spamming builds an creative builds.
If spamming is becoming a problem fix the problem not the whole art.
eg. spamming support led to oped heals so support improving heal was removed (brillaint way of solving the problem rather then trying to forse us to be balanced follow this example)

If spamming strength becomes a problem look at why it is that it is such a probelm.
Pherhaps its the combination of first shot stuns? in which case add a warm up to maul.
Pherhaps it is the frquent rages strength abusers obatin in which case lower rage build up for str spammers.

These are just little example of what should be done when encountering problems not destrying creativity.

What do you guys think?
Do you think requiremnts are pointless? if not why not?
Also do you think that they are abusing requiremnts if not why not discuss.

Here is the reasoning of another froum member called razackie which I completely agree with.
quote:

Fact is, the requirements are little more than an annoyance for players packed with Varium, buying every weapon and armour and enhancing it so that they can still have a 5 focus build and have over 100 of whichever stat they like. Sure, non-variums can buy enhancements too, but spending 100k+ credits just to get 1 weapons fully enhanced seems like too much of an ask, only completely dedicated non-varium players can afford such an insane price. Once they've managed to get those 100k credits after at least 1000 2v2s or double the amount of 1v1s, I'm sure they'd have lost interest. Basically, the stat inflation issue is contributing more to the requirements than anything else, not the skill trees in my opinion. However, not much can be done to sort that or the balance between Variums and non-Variums, besides perhaps lowering the price of Credit enhancements.

Creativity is probably the most enjoyable aspect of the game, and I doubt the game will withhold any of that creative aspect if it continues down this path. Requirements ARE necessary, otherwise it would just lead to excessive spam of Strength / Support... Perhaps they need to be tweaked as to actually hinder these spam builds more rather than just force people into using 5 Focus builds and just compensate by amassing enhancements. I suppose from a business point of view, it will make money on the short term, but on the long term the balance issues will break the game entirely and make it more difficult to fix.

Perhaps bots could be used for the sole purpose of debuffs. Perhaps debuffs could lower focus if it makes the stat go below 45 instead of having a fixed value of focus (for example if strength was at 60 (including enhancements) and the rest were at 45, if an intimidate of 16 was applied, the focus would be reduced to 4 instead of 5). Perhaps the values for Agility could be changed to encourage creativity instead of a completely linear path to spam of support / strength and/or 5 focus, that would lead to a game that requires a lot more strategy and thought as it used to, rather than just on gear and amount of points one can put into strength whilst having moderate defenses.

As it stands, the game isn't completely devoid of creativity, I can do well enough using a support / dex hybrid build with 139 hp as a BH. My non-varium level 32 BH has a 64.5% win ratio in 2v2 and it is improving, I can still win in 1v1 against Variums if I concentrate on what I'm doing and plan my moves and study strategies, but if the game continues down the path as it is it, it will be a completely linear game with no space for high level non-Variums or in fact, no space for any class besides Tactical Mercs and what Shaniqua once said, 'Evolve or die' will apply more than ever.

The devs need to do something about this otherwise the game will continue to go downhill until it hits a brick wall.




Hatsuka -> RE: Requiremnts are being abused! (11/9/2011 10:03:23)

Wow, It's All Right
Requirements are pointless for sure... cause its not the requirement that made them OPed, thats their skill "OPed" tree.




Remorse -> RE: Requiremnts are being abused! (11/9/2011 10:06:31)

^ TY,

Unless that was sarcasim??




Hatsuka -> RE: Requiremnts are being abused! (11/9/2011 10:13:29)

^ Np. Lol Sarcasm --"




Chosen 0ne -> RE: Requiremnts are being abused! (11/9/2011 10:27:00)

Requirements dont do anything. Tlm's can get up to +50 in enhances lol.




Hatsuka -> RE: Requiremnts are being abused! (11/9/2011 10:30:48)

@ Chosen : True, Cause most of TLMs now a day just a varium waster, so they cud get over and over Enchance




Remorse -> RE: Requiremnts are being abused! (11/9/2011 10:46:55)

Plus just as a side note,

I just sore a five focus str abuser, this goes to show what all builds will be like with requirments maybe the devs should face the fact they cant stop spamming it and actuly fix the probelrms that follow with it.




IsaiahtheMage -> RE: Requiremnts are being abused! (11/9/2011 11:02:48)

I agree. Requirements destroy creativity and limits us all to spamming builds and 5 focus. I may use 5 focus. But what other choice do I have?




dracule1984 -> RE: Requiremnts are being abused! (11/9/2011 13:07:06)

Its not new.. When there were Mercs people had problems .. So what happened ..?? They removed 10% defense ignore from artillery strike ..Yes their was a 10% defense ignore on that skill..

Now they have problems with our TLM.. The result our defense matrix got from 13 to 12.. they still had problems with us .. So now our frenzy is just a club only skill..

It seems they still have problems with us Mercs.. so now our frenzy is getting a nerf .. thank you.. not only that they will also make our SS a support improve skill..

Guess what they just dug theirnown graves.. now the old fashion support build will come back.. SS + Physical Aux Pumped up by high support.. if they survive mutli ..

What do we get .. another cry baby forum begging to nerf us

what i say . .. Mercs will always rule no matter what you do ;)




Remorse -> RE: Requiremnts are being abused! (11/9/2011 13:27:40)

^ I kinda agree with that.

excpet for the fact it shouldnt be like that at all.




Drianx -> RE: Requiremnts are being abused! (11/9/2011 14:19:55)

I agree.

What's even more stupid is that for example Cyber Hunter, who already was a weak class, has inherited the Supp requirement for Shadow Arts from Bounty Hunter. That requirement was implemented as the second nerf attempt on strength Bounties.

But why should CH be penalised by this requirement, when it was meant for BH only at that time? It is a stupid mystery.

Adding more requirements is a bad idea, since skills are now shared among classes.

So putting a requirement on Smoke to affect TLMs will also affect BHs.




Smackie El Frog -> RE: Requiremnts are being abused! (11/9/2011 14:45:37)

Well why should any one class be so special to not inherit the new requirement on a skill?




Sipping Cider -> RE: Requiremnts are being abused! (11/9/2011 14:54:49)

I agree that requirements are just a nuisance. And although switching out hybrid armor with defense matrix would balance the build out, I think that it would be better to fix the real problem in my eyes.


Hybrid Armor is not a level 1 ability. Obviously, hybrid armor is one of the best, if not the best, skill in the game. You dont have to spend energy on it, you dont have to take a turn to activate it, and it can be defense or resistance, all as a level 1 skill. Toxic grenade, a level 10 skill, does around 40 damage for 33 energy. For 0 energy, hybrid armor saves you about that much health in three strikes.



Moving Hybrid Armor to a level 10 ability on both mercenaries and tactical mercenaries would help balance the low level competition and possibly even high level.




Drianx -> RE: Requiremnts are being abused! (11/9/2011 15:07:02)

@Smackie: Common sense, wake up, read again what I wrote.

If you still don't get it:

The requirement on Shadow Arts was brought BEFORE Cyber Hunters even existed. It was implemented to restrict Strength+Smoke+Massacre builds on Bounty Hunters.

Why would the poor CHs inherit this requirement that actually was a nerf for str smoke BHs, when CH was never overpowered?




Smackie El Frog -> RE: Requiremnts are being abused! (11/9/2011 15:18:57)

Me wake up? xD funny.

"The requirement on Shadow Arts was brought BEFORE Cyber Hunters even existed."
So why would they change what the skill is for some new class? All skills that are shared should be the same I think. Even if one class had that requirement attached for a specific reason such as the the high str+smoke+mass, they both take that hit. Fair is fair.

Don't you see whats happening though? Every skill is going to have requirements whether you want them too or not. So just smile and grit your teeth and take them like a duelist and work it into your build.




I am Primal -> RE: Requiremnts are being abused! (11/9/2011 15:32:00)

requirements are useless they don't do any balance what so ever.




Wootz -> RE: Requiremnts are being abused! (11/9/2011 15:39:01)

@Smackie El Frog - Drianx

Y'know Froggeh, Drianx is right. Shadow Arts is miserable to CHs and limits them to have 42 Support atleast, personally I don't even use Shadow Arts.

quote:

"The requirement on Shadow Arts was brought BEFORE Cyber Hunters even existed."
So why would they change what the skill is for some new class? All skills that are shared should be the same I think. Even if one class had that requirement attached for a specific reason such as the the high str+smoke+mass, they both take that hit. Fair is fair.


Shadow Arts isn't fair towards Cyber Hunters, as it would only provide some luck to High Dex builds. And still, it isn't worth spending stats and skill points on it. Its worth on BH since you Smoke Screen your opponent and then you get an aditional boost to your block rate.
And from what I've heard, theres a new skill in making for all of the evolved classes, so, my guess is that for Cyber Hunters it'll replace Shadow Arts.




Stabilis -> RE: Requiremnts are being abused! (11/9/2011 17:39:58)

In my opinion, the game would work AS GREAT AS IT COULD BE NOW without skill requirements, weapon STAT requirements, agility, encumberance, related barriers and obstacles - etcetera. Instead what the team could do is NERF items and skill EFFECTIVENESS. If they chose this path, they would have a lot LESS to scrap with.




rej -> RE: Requiremnts are being abused! (11/9/2011 18:41:36)

quote:

Requirements dont do anything. Tlm's can get up to +50 in enhances lol.


50? Heh, try 63-65.

Yes, the requirements have been out of hand for months. I mean, 42 for a maxed out ability? Really? Youve got to wonder what the ba;ance team is thinking when they come up with/approve of things like this.




ND Mallet -> RE: Requiremnts are being abused! (11/9/2011 19:01:15)

Here's a thought. Maybe requirements were made to prevent lower levels from abusing skills like Bunker Buster, Plasma Bolt, Massacre, Venom Strike, Artillery, etc. instead of being used to balance high levels where people are capable of acquiring more stats than any of the requirements for all the areas a requirement could cover at a time(5 focus). Oh wait, I forgot they were supposed to prevent abuse at low levels.




DunkThatOreo -> RE: Requiremnts are being abused! (11/9/2011 19:13:05)

hm if there were no requirements strength bounty would be the top dog forever :) which I don't mind :3




Arath -> RE: Requiremnts are being abused! (11/9/2011 19:29:10)

One problem to this game is that it lacks variety. Each player,having 4 stat points each level up,will have difficulty affecting their build.
At one point or a level, everyone's build and stat will be about the same.
I believe the stat effectiveness system needs to be abolished and have other ways to balance the game.




Deimos... -> RE: Requiremnts are being abused! (11/9/2011 19:34:36)

I agree. Lets say you want to use this cool staff.... OH WAIT 50 TECH REQ <.<

Requirements just force you to do a build, if dex req, then dex build, or 5 focus, etc.

So yeah I don't buy weapons with SUPER HIGH REQ! Also for bh, your either str or 5 focus! Support bh got killed lol. Heal nerf.

GET RID OF REQUIREMENTS ON ARMORS !!!! THEN WE CAN GO BACK TO THE OLD DAYS WITH FUN BUILDS! ID START TO RETRAIN 400 TIMES A DAY AGAIN! WHY IS THIS GAME SO *edited so i dont get banned*
anyways i <3 ed but i wish it was fun, not just 5 focus, get kills, win daily 1v1, get bio armor.... IS BIO ARMOR EVEN AVAILABLE OR IS IT GONE FOREVER..?

It better still be here e.e

sigh. x_x




Sipping Cider -> RE: Requiremnts are being abused! (11/9/2011 21:23:08)

Hmmmm, I just got an idea. Lets say things do end up with everyone having 5 focus builds so stats are pretty much the same. True, less creativity would be around for creating builds, which is half the fun of the game. However, battles might be more interesting.


Battles would not be determined by who has the better build (since the builds would be relatively the same), but by what skills are used. More like a chess game, which is fun. When you first start the game as a level 1, it is pretty fun just with your three starting skills and battles are won from what skills you use. This would change the later levels to be like that. The only problem I see is the fun build creating process would not exist and luck would also be a big decider of battles.




AQWPlayer -> RE: Requiremnts are being abused! (11/9/2011 21:47:06)

@Sunguardian
I see a game devoid of any level 29+ non varium of whatever class.




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