TM not as underpowered as u think? (Full Version)

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Delta Hazard -> TM not as underpowered as u think? (12/27/2011 21:26:15)

So many people hav been saying that tlm are op and needs a debuff and I'm a tlm and agree. But wat about tm? My lv6 smoke screen cant beat a lv 1 mages defense matrix(or watever u call that) and its base damage was reduce from 26 to 12 so if tlm are getting a debuff, I think the tm skill should be debuff a little.



ND Mallet -> RE: TM not as underpowered as u think? (12/27/2011 21:35:22)

That's because 1 point of defense is worth more than 1 stat of Dexterity. Shields are supposed to give a great boost against one damage type. Stat buffs are used to undo stat debuffs or increase your own stats. Shields get more defense because they don't give stats to boost any other skills. Smokescreen can affect other skills like Overload and Supercharge while Defense Matrix won't affect anything besides damage.



Epic Pwnser -> RE: TM not as underpowered as u think? (12/27/2011 21:38:01)

Lots of people here would be like: "Are you kidding me?"

But here's a reasoning.
Look at the TM's skill tree.
Look at the TLM's skill tree.
Repeat two times.

1. Who has more passives?
2. What can TM's only do to protect themselves from smoke?
Edit: Aside from assault bot.

In my humble opinion (IMHO), defense matrix is fine the way it is since it only lasts three turns and for the turn it goes away, you can attack TM's without their shield on.
If defense matrix is the only problem, let's talk about the problems of the TLM skill tree...

Plus, there are other way to go around DM, like using an energy weapon for instance, or not always the strength build with delta club thing you guys always use.

Edit: And like ND Mallet said, smoke affects not just defense, but also the TM's block rate, overload/SS damage.



button33 -> RE: TM not as underpowered as u think? (12/27/2011 21:42:57)

There really is no way to balance it out perfectly, but skill trees should all be like this to make it fair.
1 heal
1 energy taker
2 passives
1 ultimate skill( massacure, etc..)
1 debuff skill
2 buffing skills( energy shield, defense matrix, reflex boost etc.)
1 stun skill
1 skill that's ignores defense and has a chance to crit
2 skills that do damage( plasma bolt, bezerker, overload, etc



hardcore59 -> RE: TM not as underpowered as u think? (12/27/2011 22:00:38)

TM's are fine dude half the time they dont even use DM and if they do it's lvl one my BH is lvl 29 and he can break through that easily



Colarndo -> RE: TM not as underpowered as u think? (12/27/2011 23:26:27)

Man i miss the beta days with my level 3 def matrix n technician and high support build:p



RageSoul -> RE: TM not as underpowered as u think? (12/28/2011 0:05:16)

TM ? Needs a debuff ? No way . The only reason why they have that is what ND and Epic have already said . And also , you need proper timing of debuffing a TM since most of them have low Dexterity and will use Dm if you SS them in a wrong timing ( like you get to go first then you debuff him/her ) and actually , they're just fine . Plus , TLMs have Technician , and TMs can't decrease Dexterity while the skill itself has the same progression rate with Malfunction but it's powered by Dexterity instead ... and that counters their Malf greatly while spending only a few EP . So ... do you still think TM is OPed?



od -> RE: TM not as underpowered as u think? (12/28/2011 1:12:26)

quote:

There really is no way to balance it out perfectly, but skill trees should all be like this to make it fair.
1 heal
1 energy taker
2 passives
1 ultimate skill( massacure, etc..)
1 debuff skill
2 buffing skills( energy shield, defense matrix, reflex boost etc.)
1 stun skill
1 skill that's ignores defense and has a chance to crit
2 skills that do damage( plasma bolt, bezerker, overload, etc

Agreed. Although I'd like to tweak it just a bit.
Each class should have 1:
Field medic
Enhanced attack ( ignore defense, bonus dmg, switches elements, etc.)
Stat buff
Stat debuff
Shield (defense/resistance buff)
Ultimate skill
Energy drain
Multi
Primary passive
Secondary passive
Stun skill
Unblockable/undeflectable raw damage skill( Note: skills such as overload or stun grenade are NOT
in this category, since they are stunning skills. Skills such as plasma bolt, toxic grenade, venom strike, plasma cannon are in this category)



wario the great -> RE: TM not as underpowered as u think? (12/28/2011 14:52:39)

so you want to cripple a class that has already been crippled



rej -> RE: TM not as underpowered as u think? (12/28/2011 15:46:33)

People have been saying tm is underpowered?

Clearly they either havn't been paying attention, or havn't been playing recently.
Thanks to their two many regeneration abilities AND the energy drain from the frost slayer/destroyer set, they are anything but weak.



AQWPlayer -> RE: TM not as underpowered as u think? (12/28/2011 15:57:25)

@rej
Reroute is good, but TLMs stole it from us. Assimilation is only a small and BLOCKABLE bonus (smoke counters that easily). Don't forget that the new frost weapons are VARIUM ONLY and that they also take away our energy more than we regenerate ;) (can prevent supercharge or heal)



D.v.D. -> RE: TM not as underpowered as u think? (12/28/2011 16:00:59)

Um.. Most TMs I see in 1 v 1 are var



rej -> RE: TM not as underpowered as u think? (12/28/2011 16:06:56)

quote:

Reroute is good, but TLMs stole it from us. Assimilation is only a small and BLOCKABLE bonus (smoke counters that easily). Don't forget that the new frost weapons are VARIUM ONLY and that they also take away our energy more than we regenerate ;) (can prevent supercharge or heal)

Just because the ability is used by another class does not make it weaker. And of course the frost set is varium only. We couldn't have non vars walking around with power like that.



AQWPlayer -> RE: TM not as underpowered as u think? (12/28/2011 16:18:18)

^
Openly admitting that varium is OP :P



Laces -> RE: TM not as underpowered as u think? (12/28/2011 16:20:13)

^But varium is OP'd. And thats coming from a Founder who still buys varium :3



rej -> RE: TM not as underpowered as u think? (12/28/2011 17:39:16)

@aqw. of course. Who would deny it?



supermasivo -> RE: TM not as underpowered as u think? (12/28/2011 19:01:45)

No, TM is not OP... i changed to a SC/dex build recently and pwns very good to most of str tlms but tlms still very very OP... and the cause is Hybrid Armor+ reroute.
^YEAH, VARIUM MAKES EVERYONE OP lol.



Santa ClawZz -> RE: TM not as underpowered as u think? (12/28/2011 19:05:26)

So I heard Balance Discussions went to a single thread...I might be wrong though.

On Topic: Hi. [:)]



AQWPlayer -> RE: TM not as underpowered as u think? (12/28/2011 19:41:13)

quote:

So I heard Balance Discussions went to a single thread...I might be wrong though.

Indeed you are wrong. (TROLOLOLOLOLOL)
quote:

Off Topic: Hi. [:)]

Corrected a small typo :P



Illuminator -> RE: TM not as underpowered as u think? (12/28/2011 22:36:57)

Please keep all balance related topics in the official balance thread here: http://forums2.battleon.com/f/tm.asp?m=19824626

Locked.



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