Originality Lost (Full Version)

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NaturesWarrior -> Originality Lost (5/29/2012 19:30:49)

I wonder at how you players can play such a bland game. There's absolutely no originality in battle whatsoever. There are probably over 100 different builds for each class yet
all I see and hear about is Strength build, 5 focus, tank. There seems to be no one willing to go a different path and create and even name their own builds. Why is this? Not every build needs max hybrid,
not every build needs max bloodlust, or max reroute or whatever. Maxing a skill out simply limits your possibilities in battle. If you want to max hybrid or bloodlust then thats fine but why does
every single player have to do the same thing? Wheres the creativity and originality in that?



Darkoake445 -> RE: Originality Lost (5/29/2012 19:38:11)

I agree with you for the most part but this isn't a game about creativity, it's a game based around winning. Most people don't care about these things and would rather use a "good" build. I ask however, is that necessarily a bad thing? Isn't the point of playing winning and the fun in a game winning? Winning in itself is fun and people haven't come to this game to express themselves, so they do what's fun.



NaturesWarrior -> RE: Originality Lost (5/29/2012 19:42:39)

Yes the point of this game is winning and winning is fun, but why just be a copycat and face the same builds over and over. Wheres the fun in that? Like i said there are most likely over 100 builds for each class, why narrow
the class down to just 4 or 5?



Darkoake445 -> RE: Originality Lost (5/29/2012 19:44:30)

Well to be quite frank, there are only a couple of actually good builds that can counter many others within each class. Therefore those builds are the most likely to be used and copied.



NaturesWarrior -> RE: Originality Lost (5/29/2012 19:49:00)

No there arent only a couple of good builds. Do you honestly think that everyone takes the time to actually test their skill tree out and be creative? No they just see a build
that seems to be dominating so why not just copy that build? No need to bring originality to the game if all you gotta do to be like everyone else is copy a build. Sound like a bland game yet?



Darkoake445 -> RE: Originality Lost (5/29/2012 19:52:02)

I didn't say that there are only a couple "good" builds but there are only a couple of builds that can counter a ton of other builds. Those are the types of builds that are copied, they have versatility due to one original build creator and then the community sees the massive influx of players to that one type of build. No one said that this was right, I simply stated why.



NaturesWarrior -> RE: Originality Lost (5/29/2012 19:59:22)

Only a couple of builds that can counter a ton of other builds? There are not a ton of other builds, I only see maybe around 4 builds being used each class, not counting bounty hunter because players just use that class
for strength. Sorry if it seems I'm attacking your posts or anything, your the only one who's bothered to post so far, no offense meant.



xGreen Warriorx -> RE: Originality Lost (5/29/2012 20:04:17)

I agree with you NaturesWarrior, all hunters seem to use strength/massacre builds, tac mercs almost always have poison, blood mages for solo use fireball/bludgeon/str and you see the same builds over and over for tech mages and mercs. Thats why I like making my own builds, using only a few ideas from other people who use builds different from the usual ones.

Check out my builds if you want -
http://s1065.photobucket.com/albums/u381/epicdueler/Cyber%20Builds/



Retrosaur -> RE: Originality Lost (5/29/2012 20:52:35)

@natureswarrior
then what's your build?



friend18 -> RE: Originality Lost (5/29/2012 21:56:46)

Actually, you could easily create your own build without copying others and do just fine. All it needs is balance, and you're set. A decent amount of defense is always necessary (min of 30+ after armors and skills). And from there, anybody can create their own builds. What build do you run? I create my own builds and I've done just fine.



Joe10112 -> RE: Originality Lost (5/29/2012 21:59:54)

That's the reason why I even ask myself why I play ED. I mean, all builds are TANK or STR ABUSE or TECH/DEX ABUSE CAST MAGE.

Honestly not sure sometimes why I still play.

But yes, originality is hard to stay with after a while. I created some nice builds IMO, and then a few days later, the whole CH nation starts to realize that my type of build is pretty good (not saying I inspired it, but lots of people realize), and then my build is unoriginal...



ND Mallet -> RE: Originality Lost (5/29/2012 22:18:01)

When people lump things together into such simple categories as Tank, 5-Focus, Strength, Caster, etc. it's a bit hard to draw the lines on where a build stops being one of those and becomes creative. How much defense is tank? How much strength is abuse? What if I have 5-Focus but focus on something other than a bot? How many spells until I'm a Caster? When such vague builds are called uncreative it can be hard to think of something creative. I've used a majority of the builds listed that are considered uncreative...now. But when I used them they were original and unused. When builds evolve over time the original becomes unoriginal. In a year or two, the current uncreative builds may actually be new and creative.

Edit: Now that I think of it, SC used to be unseen in Beta and most of Gamma. In fact, builds using it were considered creative. Yet in Alpha, mages abused SC to the extreme and it was pretty much the main build out there for Mages.



liy010 -> RE: Originality Lost (5/29/2012 22:26:08)

quote:

When people lump things together into such simple categories as Tank, 5-Focus, Strength, Caster, etc. it's a bit hard to draw the lines on where a build stops being one of those and becomes creative. How much defense is tank? How much strength is abuse? What if I have 5-Focus but focus on something other than a bot? How many spells until I'm a Caster? When such vague builds are called uncreative it can be hard to think of something creative. I've used a majority of the builds listed that are considered uncreative...now. But when I used them they were original and unused. When builds evolve over time the original becomes unoriginal. In a year or two, the current uncreative builds may actually be new and creative.


Those are the words of Wisdom right there...

I just love to make alts and try to ruin their Win/Loss Ratio as best as I can but in the process, make lots of random, creative builds.

I have...
Support-STR Merc (Max Blood Commander, Average STR, High HP so I have a strong Primary+Gun+Aux+ High Crit chance)
Health Abuse Merc (This one has like over 200 Health and a Max Heal...Yeah, didn't work so great...)
Super EP Drain Merc (Super STR abuse, Max Atom...Don't ask me why..)
Support Bounty (High Reflex=High Dex= High Multi+ High Aux+ High Crit Chance)
Super Spread Bounty (A lot of EP, Spread out my skills as best as possible...DO NOT EVER TRY THIS, IT SUCKS!)
Assimilate-Heal Loop Mage (Max Assim, Max Reroute, High Heal...Very High Annoying)

So far, Merc is the best Class to play with. I have yet to play BM and TLM though...

Edit: @ND Yeah, they had like over 150 DMG in 1 turn...



Ez_Ease -> RE: Originality Lost (5/29/2012 23:18:20)

I agree there are quite a few builds that can be used, but there are a few things
that you must take into consideration. First is age, if the majority of the players
are young, then what do you think they are going to do. They want to win and will
more than likely copy what is known to work. Second it is easy to label and type
cast when you have not bothered to answer anyones question about your own build.
If you are confident in the variety of builds you have personally created then you could
have just as easily show people the endless possiblity. It is the spark that can burn
down a forest. You could have been that spark that would have ignited a wave of different builds.

In almost everyone of xGreen Warriorx he is always sharing a build some I go okay
that could give me a problem and prepare a plan of action, and while there are many
copy cats there are very few who know how to properly use them, because when you
disrupt their typical progression of attack and fail to realize that they have still other
option. So then it is the aplication of any build that will yeild results.

One thing that I usually say to anyone I lead is dont just bring me your problems,
but also what you might think is the solution and that is what I am pointing out.
Have a great day



JohnMenzies -> RE: Originality Lost (5/29/2012 23:22:18)

@liy010
On my Tech Mage I use that build: Heal Loop Mage Build (Max Assimilation, Max Reroute, High Heal).



Ez_Ease -> RE: Originality Lost (5/29/2012 23:27:20)

Here is a suggestion that could solve the problem of same old build different day syndrome,
Have a chevo for using a different build for a 1000 battles, to low would be to easy and people
would quickly revert back to a build that wins. You would have to also make the reward very significant
that would have people stick it out, and a penalty for giving up. That is just my two cents.
Have a great day, evening, or afternoon to everyone.



PivotalDisorder -> RE: Originality Lost (5/30/2012 0:12:19)

their are bounty hunters who have been doing smoke, strike, strike, massacre for years and haven't got bored purely because it is a fast
and reliable way to win. so yeah I agree theirs too many similar builds, but we are rewarded more for winning than we are for losing so
you've got to expect this. It would be funny to see what happened if you actually earned more for losing :P [besides so many going afk]

@eazy ease: they would just tweak 1 thing in their build and go again, then after the 1000 wins was up,. tweak it back and rinse.



Camoflague MerC -> RE: Originality Lost (5/30/2012 0:34:05)

Only once balanced is achieved will their be more creative builds in ED, i myself have what i believe to be a creative max poison/massacre high EP Cyberbuild, very effecitve vs stat abusers/tanks [8D]. ED should encourage creativity more, adding achievements earned by actually doing somethingina battle would help (eg. Do 45dmg+ with stun grenade in a single battle, or use poison strike 3 times as a CH in a single battle) people would make different builds to get these cheevos, and they might discover a creative build that they like while doing so. cheevos would also encourage alot more diversityin builds, instead of just stat abuse.



PivotalDisorder -> RE: Originality Lost (5/30/2012 0:47:44)

I like the idea of those kind of achievements ^^ as long as the achievements give low amount of points. I was also thinking you could
have them stack, but only pay once, so you would also be able to see what skills a player uses the most.

I know that a certain part of the player base will just class/build change to get them all, then switch back to the no1 class/build in the
game, but their is nothing you can do about those players, I do have no doubt it would also show players the benefits of alternate builds.

some mages have never had anything other than a plasma bolt build, most bounty hunters use a smoke/massacre build mainly because
they are cheap, effective and work at all levels. still, while players were trying to get the achievements we would see many new builds
until it settled down a bit, then it would just be newer players/characters that do it.

also here is my other idea just for the lulz, if this was my game, I would of released an item that kills in one hit, then after a month, ban
everyone that used it for 500 or more wins :) would probably bankrupt the game but at least I would of got rid of all the annoying players



Ez_Ease -> RE: Originality Lost (5/30/2012 3:24:17)

I agree there will always be those who will only want the quickest wins,
and I like your suggestion to the chevo, I am certain that between
all of the smart people who develope and play this game can come
up with a chevo that would encourage different builds.

I like the losing one also, that could be worked in through trying many
builds. The idea of a one shot kill abuse would really eliminate
a lot of players cause winning is all that matters.



sha 2nd mage -> RE: Originality Lost (5/30/2012 5:29:55)

Creative build are restricted cz of the Agility and getting -1,-2,-4 it ur stats makes a lot difference in this format of game and build are been copied with no respect.
and tell u what " No one likes to loose "
Low lvls call u "GG noob" when they win by luck.
I would say that the stats should be hidden while in battle .



PivotalDisorder -> RE: Originality Lost (5/30/2012 6:24:12)

what about if all the top players use a different build, that way their won't be an OP build to copy [:D]



BlueKatz -> RE: Originality Lost (5/30/2012 6:41:13)

Beside TM it seems that every other classes lack the creativity in making a build. That's what happen when they have some "key" skills in their build

I have even built a TM without RR at all, kinda jack of all trade but still work



Stabilis -> RE: Originality Lost (5/30/2012 7:08:17)

I have successfully merged Strength and Support in a Blood Mage build, and it was intended for Juggernaut, but it also performs very nicely in 1v1 and 2v2.

Originality? Yes please.



King Helios -> RE: Originality Lost (5/30/2012 7:14:08)

I have a Tactical without Poison. WWWHHOOOAAA!!!



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